Brady or Manning?

[Paul Bunyan's Axe]

I was starting on this with the MVP thread earlier, so I figured it'll be worth it's own discussion. All time, who is the better QB, Brady or Manning? They're arguably both top 5 of all time, and their rivalry throughout their NFL careers has been a very fun one, but when it comes down to it, who would you consider the better QB, Tom Brady or Peyton Manning?

For me, it's Tom Brady. Both are top 5 in my opinion, but I think Brady would either be 1 or 2 (With Montana) and Manning would either be 3 or 4 (Elway). Whatever order that goes in, but I think that it would be like that.

The reason I would have Brady over Manning is for most of two different reasons. 1. Post season success- Tom Brady has won 3 Super Bowls, and been to five. Manning has been to two, and won one (this will be a different discussion after February 2nd). Peyton Manning is currently 11-11 in the playoffs. He's also tied with Brett Favre for the most losses in the playoffs for a starting QB. Brady though, is 18-8 in the playoffs, which is the most wins by any starting QB in the playoffs, and is right next Montana for win percentage. To me, this favors Brady a lot over Manning because Peyton is just not as good of a playoff QB as he is a regular season QB.

The 2nd reason is the talent that surrounds them. Peyton Manning has played with numerous hall of famers, and a lot of talent. Marvin Harrison is a future Hall of Famer, Reggie Wayne is a future Hall of Famer, Edgerain James won't likely be in the Hall of Fame, but he was definitely great when he was with Manning. Jeff Saturday is a Hall of Famer, Dallas Clark isn't but he was definitely another big talent. Peyton has clearly had more talent around him on offense than Tom Brady has. Brady made average receivers into great receivers his whole career. Deion Branch, Troy Brown, Brandon Lloyd, and pretty much every receiver in this year's team. So many young receivers, but Brady still carried them to a 12 win season. Kembrell Thompkins, who dropped SO many wide open passes, Brady was still able to make him look great. Danny Amendola is definitely nothing special even when he is healthy, but he looked good under Brady. The only receivers on that team this year that could be good without him, maybe Jullian Eddleman, and Gronkowski would when he's healthy.

Another thing, and this doesn't necessarily impact who the better QB is, but how about how Peyton Manning uses his slot receiver? Manning with his slot receiver is reckless. He pretty much leads them into getting killed by getting them the ball in the worst spot possible. He came close to ending Austin Collie's whole career by leading him into things like that, which is why he had so many concussions when playing with him. Then Welker this year, he had, like three concussions himself. Peyton Manning basically makes it look like that's the slot receiver's job, to be hung out to dry and take hits like that. When Welker was playing for Brady, the only injury I remember him getting was the torn ACL, and that was because of poor turf management in the Texans stadium. Once again, nothing that impacts who is the better Quarterback, but something not a lot of people realize.

And an unrelated question, why exactly don't people like Tom Brady? I mean, I'm not personally a fan of him, but I don't understand why so many people dislike him. A couple weeks ago there was a players poll, and he was voted the most hated QB in the NFL. Why? Honestly, he's a modest guy. I can't recall anything arrogant he ever says to the media. Is it because he's a good looking guy, has a super model wife, and people are just jealous? Or is it because he complains to the refs for calls? Because there are a lot of people throughout sports who complain for calls. Michael Jordan complained for calls his entire career. Doesn't matter if it's a different sport, it's the same thing. So if that's the reason people don't like him, I would say they're probably hypocrites. And then the only other thing I could think of is Spygate. For one, Tom Brady would have no impact of Spygate. And also, I think people overestimate the significance Spygate ever had for the Patriots. For one, they definitely weren't the only ones doing it, they just happened to be the ones who got caught, just like bounty gate. Not saying that makes it right, but still.

Even Bill Cowher says that Spygate isn't why the Patriots beat the Steelers. I think a lot of people who bash the Patriots for spy gate, don't really even understand what spy gate does. Yes, it made an impact on the game, but is it responsible for the Patriots success throughout the last decade? I really don't think so. And once again, there were other teams doing it.

But I'm going way too off topic here. The thread is supposed to be about the better Quarterback between Brady and Manning, so I'll put the focus back on that. Who do you think is the better Quarterback?

 

[Cena's Little Helper]

They're tied. If I had no knowledge of American football and just looked at the statistics, I'd without a doubt consider Peyton Manning the better of the two quarterbacks. I consider them tied because of each QB's strengths and weaknesses. Against Brady are the facts that he hasn't won a Superbowl since Spygate and that Belichick still got a 10-6 record out of the Patriots when Tom Brady went down early in the season. For Brady are the facts that he still got to 2 Superbowls post-Spygate and took his team to the AFC Championship this year even without Welker, Hernandez, and Gronk.

On the flip side, for Manning are the facts that he just broke the TD single-season record in the twilight of his career and that the Colts had an abysmal season without him (however, I still believe that the team threw the season in order to secure Luck). Against Manning are the facts that, even with his stats, his post-season record leaves much to be desired and also that his very mediocre brother becomes a superstar in the post-season (this is detrimental to Peyton since it shows that he doesn't have the same mental intangibles as his brother).

On a side note, this should without a doubt prove that Belichick is one of the 3 greatest coaches of all time and every coach associated with Manning should never be considered for enshrinement in the HOF (ESPECIALLY Tony Dungy).

 

[Akhilleus]

I'm assuming you are asking which is better between the two rather than asking which one is the best of all time, because neither are in my consideration for the best of all time. Yes Peyton Manning does hold the two big season passing records, but in this modern era pass heavy league those records will be broken in a few years. Brady however, if he does win one more Super Bowl then it could definitely be argued that he's the greatest of all time. It already is now. None the less Joe Montana, Terry Bradshaw, and John Elway are all past the two of them at the very least, and I could probably name a couple more that I would put before both of them at this point for different reasons. Maybe that isn't fair though, because they do have a long list of accomplishments.

Anyway between the two of them it's a close call. Like Cena's Little Helper said it's sort of a tie, but to me they are equal just in different ways. Peyton Manning may go down as one of the best regular season QBs of all time, in my mind he is like a modern day Dan Marino. Yet to me his postseason record has tarnished that. Of course he has the chance to end that in two weeks when he plays in his third Super Bowl, and if he wins then I definitely won't be able to say that anymore. I will admit that if he defeats the Seattle Seahawks I will definitely drop whatever gripes I have against him. He's not playing Rex Grossman and the Bears, but instead an incredibly talented team. He already went through Brady, and if he can go through Wilson and the Seattle D then I give the man credit. If he doesn't though I will continue to consider him as one of the greatest ever. He is definitely Top 7 I would say, but to be up there with the guys like Montanta and Elway he needs to win one more.

Brady to me is more well rounded than Manning. He not only has had some incredibly impressive regular seasons, but has already won three Super Bowl rings against tough teams, and is a two time Super Bowl MVP. If he wins four there is no doubt that his name belongs with the others that have accomplished that same thing. But if he doesn't do that, than I would put him somewhere with Manning in the Top 7 of All Time. Brady has performed well in the postseason and in the regular season, while Manning is more successful in the regular season only. Brady though to me is more of an underdog. He was a 6th round draft pick, and Manning was drafted first overall. Manning was expected to be good, and Brady took the league by storm. That means something to me.

Brady has also, like you've said, played most of his career without big named players around him. While Peyton Manning has played with the likes of Pierre Garcon, and Reggie Wayne, and all of his guys from his Denver squad this year, Brady's teammates besides Welker were all sort of made better by him. He makes something out of nothing, a skill that few Quarterbacks in the league have and Peyton Manning to me is not one of them. The QBs in the league that can make something out of nothing are Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers most definitely, Ben Roethlisberger, and I suppose one could say Drew Brees. Manning to me is not one of them because he has always been surrounded by well known talent, while the others have to go the extra mile just to make things work. The others who have players that really don't seem like they'd be able to do what they do (Slow 30 times, sizes, late round pick, etc.)

Tom Brady is also a much better decision maker. He has thrown way less interceptions than Manning, and is only a year younger. Brady has thrown 134 interceptions in 193 games. While Manning has thrown 219 interceptions in 240 games. Manning however in my opinion has a much better arm, and well let's just face it his commercials are hilarious. To me Tom Brady comes across as a tad better, and he's whopped Manning as far as their head to head record against each other goes. But after this 2013 season it's hard to argue that Manning doesn't deserve to be considered the greatest ever on account of him throwing more yards and touchdowns than any other QB has done in the history of the NFL.

Like I said if Manning beats Seattle then he deserves to be up there in maybe the Top 3 of all time, and is probably even better than Brady contigent on whether or not Brady wins that fourth Super Bowl before retiring. If he doesn't however, and he once again chokes in the clutch time of Super Bowl XLVIII, then not only does he not make it that high on my valueless list, but Tom Brady will be better than him. They are though both great in their own ways, and if there was ever a combination of the two then it would likely have to be built in a factory because I don't think it is humanely possible.

 

[Trill Co$by]

Peyton Manning by the simple fact that he doesn't wine and complain when his team loses. Every time he loses, he simply lets the media know that he and his team made mistakes that they should've capitalized on whereas Tom Brady and Bill Belishit always have some kind of excuse as to why they're being screwed over. Plus, aside from the SuperBowl rings, the stats are all in Peyton's corner.

 

[Slyfox696]

the stats are all in Peyton's corner.

Do you think playing with Edgerrin James, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, and Dallas Clark might have had something to do with that?

 

[Trill Co$by]

Do you think playing with Edgerrin James, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, and Dallas Clark might have had something to do with that?

You're just as bad as Belishit and Brady. It's not like Brady hasn't had help on his side of the ball as well. He's had guys like Gronkowski, Hernandez, Moss, Troy Brown, Wes Welker, Danny Amendola, etc. on his team for years and still manages to make excuses. The only difference is that Peyton Manning is simply the best QB in the league today and knows how to find the right receiver when he needs to.

 

[Slyfox696]

You're just as bad as Belishit and Brady.

I'm always fascinated by those who think facts are excuses...

It's not like Brady hasn't had help on his side of the ball as well.

He's had guys like Gronkowski

Often injured.

Hernandez

For three years

Moss

A 30+ year old receiver coming off three down years.

Troy Brown

Wes Welker

A slot receiver who now plays with Peyton.

Danny Amendola

You are REALLY grasping at straws when you reference a first year player who was injured most of the year.

on his team for years

Only Troy Brown had any longevity with the Patriots and Brady. Everyone else played three full years or less (with the exception of Welker who plays for the Broncos now).

and still manages to make excuses.

Excuses for what?

Go look at Brady's year in 2007 when he actually did have offensive talent around him. You'll notice his stats are basically the same as Peyton's.

The only difference is that Peyton Manning is simply the best QB in the league today and knows how to find the right receiver when he needs to.

No, there are two differences...one, Manning has had much better offensive weapons around him and two, Brady still has the Super Bowls.

 

[Akhilleus]

Peyton Manning by the simple fact that he doesn't wine and complain when his team loses. Every time he loses, he simply lets the media know that he and his team made mistakes that they should've capitalized on whereas Tom Brady and Bill Belishit always have some kind of excuse as to why they're being screwed over. Plus, aside from the SuperBowl rings, the stats are all in Peyton's corner.

You're right, Peyton Manning certainly does have a lot of class...

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Maybe the reason Peyton Manning doesn't whine after his losses are the fact that when they lose more often than not it's because he threw an interception in clutch time.

I don't often see Brady and Belichick in the media complaining. Now Eli Manning is someone I've seen specifically. Remember last year I think it was in the Tampa game when he threw a little temper tantrum because on the knee Tampa sent their guys and hit Manning which they are allowed to do? Someone else is just recently Ben Roethlisberger. He hasn't in the past, but just these last couple of years with the Haley situation, Roethlisberger has been more outspoken when it came to games.

I'm sure what you're mostly referring to with Brady and Belichick is just after the AFC Championship game where Belichick was a little upset about the hit on Talib. Which I mean, although it was legal I can understand from his point of view why he would have been mad. I know Brady's wife made some comments after their Super Bowl loss in 2011, but that wasn't Brady.

In fact this was one of the first things Brady said in his post game interview after Sunday's loss

"They are a good football team. They did really well today. We just didn't make enough plays. Certainly early, we didn't get third downs to go down the field and score points or move the ball. We got in a hole. It was just too tough to dig our way out."

Doesn't sound like he's whining or making excuses to me, in fact, he's been pretty respectful about it. I know he did say that he doesn't have any reason to watch the Super Bowl, but not only were those comments probably taken out of context like they always are, but can you blame him? After a tough loss like that I don't know if I would want to watch the Super Bowl either.

I know that in my original post in this thread I was leaning more towards Brady as being the better player, and I know that I'm defending him here in this post as well. But I actually like Peyton Manning slightly better than Tom Brady. I don't root for either of them, in fact often times I'm rooting against them just because of how sick I am of seeing them win, but if I had to pick one I would say I like Peyton Manning just slightly better. With that said I still think right now Tom Brady has had the better career. Manning can change that by winning this game, but if he doesn't I think Brady still has the better career.

 

[Paul Bunyan's Axe]

Because Troy Brown and Danny Amendola have been elite receivers, lol. Also, brady made moss when he was in new england. If he would have went somewhere else, he would have been done. Remind me, what did he do after the pats traded him? Nothing. He went around a couple teams and it was clear he was done.