Best technical wrestling feud

[Da Truth]

CM Punk & Daniel Bryan have put on the best technical/mat wrestling matches wrestling this year in my opinion in the WWE. This really should be the feud of the year. Since I've been watching wrestling for years, it got me to thinking: what is/was the best wrestling feud??? I started thinking about great technical wrestling feuds Regal-Steamboat, Curt Henning-Bret Hart, Dean Malenko-Eddie Guerrero, Ric Flair-Barry Windham to name a few, but the best technical wrestling series in the WWE I can think of is Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit. The Punk-Bryan feud reminds me a lot of Angel-Benoit as far as over all wrestling skills. IMO I think Angle & Benoit had a better series; not to discredit anything Punk & Bryan has done thus far. The matches were so intense, it was like watching how to video of how to wrestle.The best two matches were Royal Rumble 2003 & the cage match on Raw in 2001. My question: which is the better technial wrestling feud Angle-Benoit or Punk-Bryan??? If there is one better than those, which is it and why???

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Angle/Benoit was hurt by Angle not really telling a story in the ring and just kind of trading holds, then countering finishers.

The best feud that revolved around guys who exchanged a lot of basic holds earlier on and moved into multiple suplex variations and counters later on (I refuse to call it technical because I don't know how to do every move so I don't know if it is or isn't) would be probably Malenko/any cruiserweight wrestler.

In WCW, and really, at any point in history, I can't think of a single guy who pulled off the "technician" gimmick better. He got over because he knew how to do a lot of moves. Had 0 personality. When has that ever happened before? That's how flippin good he was.

Here's my favorite Malenko/cruiser guy moment. It's Starrcade 1996 I wanna say. Ultimo Dragon has won 9 belts, beating everyone. They're in Nashville so the crowd is all "WHOO YEA MERKA" and all that good southern stuff. Like most crusier matches and Malenko matches, the crowd is fairly quiet early on. They start trading holds and counters, crowd gets more and more into it. At one point, they do the flipping tombstone counter spot like Orton/Taker at Mania, only they counter it like 3 times with Malenko hitting a jumping spike tombstone. The crowd POPS, Malenko shows emotion and does the "it's over" motion and covers 1..2...kickout. It was awesome.

I say that match and that "feud" because it wasn't a feud or match based on ANYTHING other than people's admiration for Malenko. Ultimo had Sonny Ohno but people didn't hate Ultimo, they respected him. They hated Ohno. They cheered for Malenko because they thought "he's our guy, he knows his shit, he can beat this guy" and Malenko nearly beat him with counters. I don't even remember who won, I just remember as a kid being behind him because "he knows all the moves". Hennig, Hart, DB, Steamboat, etc, these guys all got over partially because of their ability, but they also had personality (some more than others). Malenko and his feuds, and especially against Ultimo, got over on his perceived technical ability. Obviously, the whole "USA vs foreigner" thing was going too, but people got behind him because of his technical skill, not because of any deep seeded hatred.

Malenko/Jericho was good too. They had a battle royal to decide who would face Jericho. Jericho had been running his mouth and being a real good chickenshit heel. Malenko was dressed like Cyclope, won the battle royal, unmasked, place popped. Good times.

 

[safeco1999]

Anyone with Bret Hart had good 'technical' feuds, including Mr. Perfect and Owen, and even Hakushi... yes, Hakushi.

A match just has to feature great chemistry between the wrestlers and that usually has the makings for awesome matches. We've seen excellent examples of this with recent Wrestlemania main event matches.

 

[HBsam31]

One of the Angle/Benoit matches I remember the most was the one from I believe Wrestlemania 17. They exchanged holds at the beginning of the match and the crowd gave them a standing ovation after every hold and counter hold. I had never heard a crowd respect a technical exchange like that before. Punk and Bryan has given me everything I wanted out of a technical feud. Honestly I am very torn on this one. Bret and Owen is another one on my list of technical favorites. If I was sat down and forced to pick one I would have to go with Bret and Owen. Their match at Mania 10 was every bit of perfect and even ended with a reversal into a victory roll. I could probably change my mind on this ten times over, but right now its Bret/Owen for me.

 

[ProWrestlingFan]

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit

Two of the greatest technical wrestlers. They had the best match on the card everytime they faced each other.

The Steel Cage match in 2001

The Ultimate Submission match at Backlash 2001

The 3 Stages of Hell match at Judgement Day 2001

Their match at Unforgiven 2002

And my favorite was Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit for the WWE Championship at Royal Rumble 2003. One of the best Wrestling matches in Pro-Wrestling history.

 

[Y2Flax]

Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit

Two of the greatest technical wrestlers. They had the best match on the card everytime they faced each other.

The Steel Cage match in 2001

The Ultimate Submission match at Backlash 2001

The 3 Stages of Hell match at Judgement Day 2001

Their match at Unforgiven 2002

And my favorite was Kurt Angle vs Chris Benoit for the WWE Championship at Royal Rumble 2003. One of the best Wrestling matches in Pro-Wrestling history.

Fully agreed. Before Punk/Bryan, I hadn't been that interested in seeing what two technical guys could do besides Bret/Owen. Looking back these guys could have been another Flair/Steamboat if there were still territories.

I also agree on all those matches listed, plus WM17 as I believe it was their first 1-on-1. Their 2001 feud was great before Benoit took time off. An Ironman Match could have happened. Also say RR03 was incredible as I was there live, and after witnessing one of the worst matches of all time (HHH/Steiner) it was followed by one of the best of all time (Angle/Benoit).

I see where someone said it was more about trading holds than storytelling, while I agree, it is what the OP asked. If we are talking just storytelling, something like Benoit/Booker or Eddie/Rey might be best. Just technical goes to Angle/Benoit only because Punk/Bryan is still in the midst of the feud.

Also don't forget HBK/Angle. Real good technical feud.

Best technical wrestling AND storytelling feud goes to Bret/Owen.

 

[Cereal Killer]

Angle and Benoit.

They are better wrestlers
They put on better matches
They were put in a better storyline

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Angle and Benoit.

They are better wrestlers
They put on better matches
They were put in a better storyline

Angle is insanely overrated. He has no legit finisher now so no one buys his false finishes until at least 5 ankle lock counters and 3 angle slams. He doesn't really tell a story unless someone else is doing it. He just does some quick wristlock and amateur exchanges, some suplex chains, then his finishing stretch which, as I said, is pretty ineffective until you've seen at least 3 angle slams and 5 ankle lock counters.

Angle gets a free pass as a "great wrestler" because of his gold medals. Those don't mean shit to me in pro wrestling. Kobe Bryant would probably be a pretty horrible actor even if it was in a basketball movie. Some of his stuff might look good, but that'd be it.

Angle does all the moves and has the look and carries himself the way the IWC likes technical guys to look and act. However, if you actually watch his matches and think, you realize he's just doing moves. He has a progression from "smaller" moves to "bigger" moves. However, there is rarely a story or much reason to them.

Angle also had/has inconsistent selling. I'm not saying Angle is a bad wrestler, he's awesome, but the IWC overrates the shit out of him because winning a gold medal in amateur wrestling someone makes you a master storyteller.


Benoit though, fucking awesome.

 

[Da Truth]

Angle is insanely overrated. He has no legit finisher now so no one buys his false finishes until at least 5 ankle lock counters and 3 angle slams. He doesn't really tell a story unless someone else is doing it. He just does some quick wristlock and amateur exchanges, some suplex chains, then his finishing stretch which, as I said, is pretty ineffective until you've seen at least 3 angle slams and 5 ankle lock counters.

Angle gets a free pass as a "great wrestler" because of his gold medals. Those don't mean shit to me in pro wrestling. Kobe Bryant would probably be a pretty horrible actor even if it was in a basketball movie. Some of his stuff might look good, but that'd be it.

Angle does all the moves and has the look and carries himself the way the IWC likes technical guys to look and act. However, if you actually watch his matches and think, you realize he's just doing moves. He has a progression from "smaller" moves to "bigger" moves. However, there is rarely a story or much reason to them.

Angle also had/has inconsistent selling. I'm not saying Angle is a bad wrestler, he's awesome, but the IWC overrates the shit out of him because winning a gold medal in amateur wrestling someone makes you a master storyteller.


Benoit though, fucking awesome.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but to say Angle is overrated is kinda out there. I've been watching wrestling since the early 80's and I haven't seen anyone like Angle except maybe Backlund and even he didn't have the all around game Angle has. Is he the best storyteller in the ring, no; but he not the worst by a long shot either. I don't have to be a person's fan to give him his due and he's one of the greats. He may not be your cup of tea. I do agree with what u said earlier, I loved Dean Malenko; if his mic skills were better he would've probably gotten a bigger push from both major organizations

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but to say Angle is overrated is kinda out there. I've been watching wrestling since the early 80's and I haven't seen anyone like Angle except maybe Backlund and even he didn't have the all around game Angle has. Is he the best storyteller in the ring, no; but he not the worst by a long shot either. I don't have to be a person's fan to give him his due and he's one of the greats. He may not be your cup of tea. I do agree with what u said earlier, I loved Dean Malenko; if his mic skills were better he would've probably gotten a bigger push from both major organizations

I used to love Angle when I was 15, then I started thinking more during matches and he was basically just throwing moves out most of the time. Angle does a great job with the gimmick of the super superior wrestler.

When I say Angle is overrated, I mean that everyone in the IWC acts like he's some sort of in ring god and then points to his gold medals. He's very good, but not decidedly better than other guys. I'd put Punk as a better in ring performer because Punk's in ring storytelling and selling is so much better.

Angle's moves are great. On a superficial level, strickly moves, crispness, flow, etc (all the things the IWC loves) he's great. On a deeper level of storytelling, selling, ring psychology, he's mediocre. Anyone who can't get the crowd to pop on a finisher has issues with storytelling.

 

[Headman]

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but to say Angle is overrated is kinda out there. I've been watching wrestling since the early 80's and I haven't seen anyone like Angle except maybe Backlund and even he didn't have the all around game Angle has. Is he the best storyteller in the ring, no; but he not the worst by a long shot either. I don't have to be a person's fan to give him his due and he's one of the greats. He may not be your cup of tea. I do agree with what u said earlier, I loved Dean Malenko; if his mic skills were better he would've probably gotten a bigger push from both major organizations

It's only out there because you're so used to hearing how amazing he is. Not to mention you're probably only looking at the polish on his holds and counters, which look great. But he's right. Angle really never told a story in his matches. Brock Lesnar as sloppy and out of shape as he was made sure to let us know he wanted to rip Cena's arm out of it's socket. After it looked like Cena was hurt legit, what did Lesnar do? He worked that part of the body. The F-5 became an after thought, because the match was about Cena's arm looking like it was actually broken. He even threw in what looked like cheap shots, so we believed Lesnar was really going into business for himself to make the "poster boy" look bad. And the overall story of the match was Lesnar's total physical domination ultimately being no match for Cena's fighting spirit. After the match the crowd was behind Cena and the internet was buzzing about the "Unprofessional asshole Brock Lesnar" which is exactly the character he's playing. He and Cena told that story perfectly. With Angle it was always a beautiful display of suplexes, holds and counters, but I can't remember anything as emotionally involving or logical as the match I described before outside of maybe his matches with HBK who is a master story teller. So in a way I agree. Angle is a hell of a wrestler, but as a pro-wrestler he's overrated.

 

[LascoX]

The first to come to my mind when I saw the title of the thread was Benoit vr's Angle as they had some great matches. Reflecting on the topic though brings other great teamings together. I love watching Punk and Bryan every time they step in the ring , to me their matches are always the highlight of current WWE programing. I would have to also note Bret Hart vr's Shawn Michels and their 1 hour iron man match as one of the greatest displays of story telling in the ring ever and their feud was ledgendary. Another one of my favorite single technical matches was the Owen Hart tribute match between Bret and Chris Benoit as the two Stampede alumni pulled out the stops and delivered a truely sound match and gave a fitting tribute to Owen. Of course the feud between Bret and Owen truely rocked as the brothers took an old school , sell it as real approach to it that really drove it home as two of the most technically grounded wrestlers sold it night after night. Curt Henning and Bret Hart were always great in the ring together as well.
Getting back to the question at hand though of which is better between just Angle/Benoit and Bryan /Punk I am going to give a slight edge to Punk/Bryan as it is still on-going and has been going for years so the chemistry between the two is just a little better then what Angle and Beniot had.

 

[CrissSpades]

Perfect-Hart was kind of underrated to me. That was some really good matches. However, I'm going to go with Angle-Benoit. Their matches are the best matches in Pro wrestling history. Most notably, the WWE Championship match at Royal Rumble 2003.

 

[Da Truth]

Alright TWJC & Headman, you guys have valid points, but as I said earlier Kurt Angle is not a God awful Storyteller in the ring. He's not the best. You guys are used to watching the kurt angle of TNA & his last couple years of WWE run. Angle have had edge of your seat moments, feel good moment, etc. in the ring. Here's a few Lesnar-Angle Iron man Match, Mysterio-Angle, Undertaker NoWay Out 06, Orton One Night Stand 2, Austin, take your pick... Yes his psychology is lacking, but not to the point here his matches doesn't make since. You've never seen him hurt someone's arm and he starts working on the person's neck. LOL...everyone has their opinion.

 

[Headman]

Alright TWJC & Headman, you guys have valid points, but as I said earlier Kurt Angle is not a God awful Storyteller in the ring. He's not the best. You guys are used to watching the kurt angle of TNA & his last couple years of WWE run. Angle have had edge of your seat moments, feel good moment, etc. in the ring. Here's a few Lesnar-Angle Iron man Match, Mysterio-Angle, Undertaker NoWay Out 06, Orton One Night Stand 2, Austin, take your pick... Yes his psychology is lacking, but not to the point here his matches doesn't make since. You've never seen him hurt someone's arm and he starts working on the person's neck. LOL...everyone has their opinion.

I don't think either of us called angle awful. But when you start having your name thrown around in the "Best of all time" category with no checks or balances because the community is in lockstep, a higher level of scrutiny is required. Angle really did benefit from his reputation. That doesn't mean he was garbage, but the guy had real flaws that the online communities tend to overlook. I'm glad TWJC pointed this out.

And for these reasons among others I laugh at the idea of Benoit/Angle being the best technical feud with Steamboat / Flair and other great feuds on the table.

 

[IT Factor]

If you want highly technical matches, anything WCW cruiserweight division 1995 onward to about 1998. Dean Malenko, Chris Jericho, Eddy Guerrero, Chavo Guerrero. Anything involving those guys was freakin' insane. I especially liked the feud with Malenko & Jericho in WCW. Those matches were untouchable and couldn't be duplicated again today if anyone tried.

As for who's better between Bryan/Punk or Angle/Benoit, I'd have to give the edge to Angle/Benoit. Both were in their primes and had great series of matches. Maybe if WWE continued the Bryan/Punk feud, it could be as good. When you see some of the things Angle & Benoit were doing, it was great.

 

[TheHorndogSays]

I'm going to throw out one that seems to have gone under the radar on this thread. TNA's Christopher Daniels/AJ styles feud. In my opinion this was the feud that started to put TNA on a lot of people's radar. While I am a fan of the Punk/Bryan feud, while it was "teased" several times over the past few years, the average fan simply did not care about it until they inserted AJ into the mix. As far as Benoit/Angle, it was good but in my opinion the "technical" aspect of it was hurt by the fact that a majority of their matches took place in gimmick matches (cage, submission, 3 stages of hell) while Styles/Daniels had mostly pure one on one matches and won numerous match of the year honors for their matches also bringing in a good amount of new fans to the TNA product solely because of their match quality.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Some technical matches I have liked, aside from the current Punk-Bryan one, are:-

Kurt Angle v HBK
Kurt Angle v Chris Benoit
Chris Benoit v Chris Jericho
Chris Benoit v Dean Malenko
Ricky Steamboat v Randy Savage


But my favourite would be the Shawn Michaels v Chris Jericho feud.

I loved their first meeting, at Wrestlemania XIX, and IMO it was match of the year.

I also loved their feud in 2008, and found their storyline to be the most enjoyable storyline for many years. You see, it isn't just that they had great wrestling matches, but both are maestros on the mike, and both are showman, so the entire feud was intriguing, not just the matches, but the promos as well. Throw into that the awesome segment at "Summerslam" '08, where Jericho slugged Shawn's wife accidentally (the only in-ring segment I felt had any place ever being at a PPV, and aided by great acting by HBK's wife), and you have the consummate feud. Sure, some things could have been done better, but the feud itself was interesting both in the ring and behind the mike, and that is what this feud had over others IMO.

 

[HBKperfect23]

Flair/Steamboat set the stage for in ring showdowns. Never was done as well before and hasnt been done as well since.

Angle/Benoit would be the new age technical feud. As for todays style, I think these guys easily have the best technical feud.

Honorable mention would be HBK/Bret. Remember these guys went through the tag division, mid cards, and main events together. These guys changed wrestling in the 90s.

 

[theBec2101]

You have to go with Bret vs Bulldog. That Summer Slam was one of the best. I also have to say that is right up there with one of my all time greatest matches. It had a great storyline to it. The wrestling was even greater. I just love the finish, who would have thought a sunset flip reversal would have ended it. Summer Slam ‘92 wrestling’s' good ole days.

 

[FlairFan2003]

Part of what makes the feud exciting is the charisma of the particiapnts and how they play off each other. Someone posted about Dean Malenko wondering how he ever got over with so little personality, actually turning his lack of charisma into a gimmick, it was pretty cool, but who really reminicses about classic Dean Malenko matches ? I truly enjoyed Van Hammer's match vs Brett Hart on Nitro, the ratings at the time were horrible though, you'd have though Brett was wrestling a box of crayons the way people tuned out in droves. It wasnt because Hart wasnt popular or couldnt wrestle, it was because he had no feud, no story, no set up with VH who himself was a mid carder on his best day (it wanst like Brett was having a random match vs Sting or Flair for instance).

Finding a long feud or match series at the top teir that matches Flair-Steamboat is pretty tough, although HBK-Hart is right up there. Angle pulled good matches out of almost everyone he wrestled, I didnt think the storyline vs Benoit was special but the matches were good. Benoit could perform in the ring but in TV and on the mic he really lacked perosnality, great showmanship and athletic ability in the ring, but he clearly didnt have the intagibles other top guys have. Some people criticize Hart for not having the charisma and showmanship of guys like HBK & Flair, fact is Hart had way more ability to connect with an audience OUTSIDE the ring than Benoit. Frankly, of all Angle's big moments in WWE, his run vs Benoit is not that high.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

So the question is the best feud based off of the actual technical wrestling aspect of it?

So many to choose from.

Steamboat/Flair is still tops for me. They set a high bar in this category. My favourite is still the best of 3 falls match where Steamboat breaks out the chicken wing for the win at about the 54th minute.

Benoit/Booker T TV title series - A great concept that WCW had done to perfection before with Nikita Koloff/Magnum TA. The wrestling was outstanding in this, and it's a little overlooked nowadays

Hart/Michaels (before the ugliness) - For probably a good 6 years, HBK and the Hitman had a quiet competition in the WWF as they were rising up through the ranks. The two were constantly in the ring with each other, and putting on some great matches the entire time

Hart/Perfect - These two just had amazing ring chemistry, and anytime they were in the ring with each other, it was just about who was better. No underlying pro wrestlingliness about their encounters, just two guys putting on amazing matches to show everyone else that they were the best at this. Side note... Perfect probably did more than anyone to help show that Hart could be a top singles guy. He would turn down scheduled wins against Hart because he thought their time limit draw was a better story, went out of his way to allow Hart to showcase all he could do, and even made Hart one of the very few he ever allowed to kick out of the PerfectPlex.

Midnight Express/Fantastics - One that's almost completely forgotten unless you're talking to a bunch of old timers, these two put on a tremendous series for the US Tag titles back in the 80's. At a time when champions in the top promotions held their gold for months, if not years... these two would trade the titles back and forth regularily as a way of showing how evenly matched they were, and that every time they fought would be something special. They never disappointed either.