Well yeah of course, that is what wrestling is all about. You really shouldn't be watching the shit once you graduate college or get out of high school.
Well, personally I don't think anything is wrong with that. If somebody else doesn't like it or thinks its immature because they don't understand the business, then Fuck 'em.
I can take that approach.
However you evidently are embarrassed when mainstream America scoffs what you like and do take it personally. Hence, that is why you approve of wrestling being marketed as a sport over a TV Action/Drama. Based on our past conversations, you even want to clean up the caliber of fan that comes to the shows, and have gone as far as suggested that people dress up in suits, shirts, and ties to come to the shows.
Now, if that isn't "elitist" I don't know what is. And all of that is because you can't stand the image that pro wrestling currently has. Therefore, you seek to "Japanize" wrestling in order and make it more "sport" in order for non-fans to get a better understanding of the business and appreciate the technicalities that go into it.
Marketing it as a sport in the United States will only get you ridiculed even more. Marketing it as an Action/Drama Entertainment sitcom has a far better chance of gaining respect (and why that is even important to you, is beyond me .... other than it hurts your ego when people turn their nose up at you, and you are overly concerned with how you are viewed, along with the category of fan you are lumped into) .... because at least you are being honest with the public about what it is that you are doing, as opposed to trying to get the public to buy into it as a "sport".
And that is why you are so infatuated with the PG Era. Because it has watered everything down so much, all the way to Dullsville. If it much more focused on in-ring time, as opposed to actually developing characters and storylines to draw fans into the matches, and actually make them want to purchase the PPV's or tickets to House Shows.
The IWC is just a tool, I doubt being on a computer makes you any more important, no matter the hours you put in it.
As I told others, the IWC are the community leaders, so to speak. They do have an influence on other casual fans, because they are better educated to the business, and can talk fluently (persuading them) about the nature and state of the business. However, their actual influence is highly debated.
Obviously, though, it is somewhat of a concern to Vince, because if it wasn't, he wouldn't be concerned with the spoilers hitting the net of his long-term plans.
I didn't approve of Mark Henry and Mae Young having a hand, but I didn't really care enough to cry about it.
Actually, you have done more than your fair share of crying about the segment. Again, I am on record with stating that I loved the storyline, but hated the outcome. I thought the outcome was lame, however the public was never more interested in Henry as during that time period as Sexual Chocolate.
I've been talking about the way Cena has been booked since NWO 2008. Not to mention my hate for DX.
Haven't seen you say anything about Cena's booking. What is it that bothers you about it?
As far as DX, it looks like you and I agree on something. I despise this version of DX, and I think the group itself needs to die. Trying to do what they do in a PG environment is absolutely pointless and counter-productive.
This is a lie. It is also just mindless trolling and baiting. If you're going to ask me a question, ask it, don't throw around unfunny insults that aren't witty or humorous.
It absolutely is 100% the truth. Not at this forum, but elsewhere. Feel free to elaborate on how you Rep Trolled people and actually went to the lengths of PM'ing your friends to get them together to do the same like a little Kindergarten class.
I don't like the way Cena is booked
I hate DX
Right. So you already said.
I don't like the way Orton is booked
Okay. Now we're getting somewhere.
I think Brian Gerwitz is a moron
Really didn't think you had it in you. I suppose only when put on the spot does this kind of stuff come out of your mouth. Because this is the first time I am hearing any of this. I guess you simply have to be pressed and pressed hard to get you to say something even remotely critical of WWE. Maybe you can enlighten us in future conversations on here as to why, and elaborate a little.
There is more to it then that. But again, this is what us Share Holders shouldn't be talking about according to you. And actually I agree, I rather talk about why I like the company, then the business side. But to be clear it is kind of amusing when people say, "If WWE didn't have a brilliant business model, great merchandise, and expansion they would be out of business". I mean really that is dumb.
Can't say I have heard anyone say that.
I don't despise Attitude Era this is another lie. I don't think 99 was a good year, but I liked 98 and loved 2000.
That is not a lie. I do grant you that you have said that you enjoyed 2000 over the other Attitude Era years. However, to be frank, you have never been able to elaborate as to why.
However, I can tell you why. It's because you despise Vince Russo because he primarily gets credit for the Attitude Era over Vince McMahon, and because you are a Vince McMahon mark. Russo left the company by that point, so that is why you claim Chris Kreski in 2000 was so wonderful.
Tell me something. How long was Chris Kreski with the company, tell us about the rest of his tenure, and what do you like about his booking style over Vince Russo's when Russo was in WWE?
99 was horrendous, garbage, never really cared about the sex outside of Henry/Young, it did have toilet humor, and the useless violence was guys beating up on females.
And to my point about the Elitism. As far as "guys beating up on females", this really is a touchy issue for you as I have seen for the past several years.
Why is it that you have a problem with a staged scene of men beating up women in wrestling, but don't have a problem with it happening on TV sitcoms?
In 2000 when Kreski and McMahon cleaned up the mess the company was great, probably the best it has ever been.
Ah, yes. The great mysterious Chris Kreski. Again, please tell us how long Kreski was with WWE, and what his accomplishments were ... and why you feel he was better than Russo.
Now you're arguing with yourself. Your whole gimmick with this thread, was guys liking the product because of the product, not because of the business it does for WWE. I've explained I liked the product and couldn't careless how the business is doing.
You've never explained any further than "WWE is awesome" or "John Cena is awesome!!!" on what specifically you find enjoyable about the product. That is the problem. Your posts are actually quite empty, and I possibly blame the forum moderators elsewhere for not harping enough on people explaining themselves, and rather simply spamming the forums with that kind of drivel.
But I'll tell you what. There is a thread that I created not long ago, asking posters what they actually enjoy about the WWE product. It kind of died when I asked posters to be more specific than simply naming superstar after superstar and not being more specific (Heaven Forbid, that means more work), but I think the thread would be right up your alley. Feel free to post away without any rebuttal from yours truly and hopefully nobody else. Rather, it simply gives other posters a better idea where you are coming from and share with them your ideologies.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=73010
What you call cutting edge isn't really cutting edge to me. Really Mid-South and Memphis wrestling was way more edgier then the Attitude Era ever was, and really that is what spawned ECW, and in turn WWF took elements from ECW, Mike Tyson, real life tension between Bret and HBK/WWE, HBK being an asshole, Vince showing the real Vince McMahon, and Phenomenal Star on the rise in Austin, and it all meshed together well. It wasn't really anything edgy, it was just presented with great production and Awesome characters in Austin and McMahon.
No denying that Vince Russo took elements from ECW and pitched it to Vince McMahon. McMahon actually did something right and listened to Russo, hence saving his company. But certainly, Heyman deserves credit for being an influence on Russo. Russo, however gets the credit for the actual story writing.
But Vince Russo gave Vince McMahon the vision of where to take the company, while Vince and his circle of aging Yes Men had absolutely no idea what to do.
And you probably are going to see history repeat itself, to be frank, after TNA gets in gear. I am certain that Bischoff and Hogan have some surprises up their sleeve and will kick the product into high gear.
Sidious, I don't care about the bottom line. For a while all you cared about was ratings, you were way more a bottom line guy then I was. However when the end result is WWE still doing great business, you want to back track and go another way with the defense.
Yes, you do care about the bottom line. I know other posters on here are most likely not familiar with your work elsewhere, but you are the epitome of what I label a "WWE Shareholder".
As far as my interests, I have stated many times that what comes first for me is being entertained. The numbers are merely used to support my arguments. But rest assured and it's coming straight from the horse's mouth, what comes first for me is what entertains ME.
If you want Attendance to be higher, PPV buys to be higher, and a Ratings to be higher. Wouldn't that mean that YOU are indeed A WWE Share Holder?
I can argue ways on how to increase each of those ... sure. However, by offering choices to your customers, which is what I have advocated all along (including a product that actually interests me and is targeted to people in my age group), the rest will fall in line. So I argue it from a point of what most interests me, but also what happens to be best for business, as well.
So, no. I don't agree with your logic.
WWE has never been bigger on a Global front either. Expansion = Money also, but whoops, I forgot, we aren't supposed to be talking about that...Right?
No, you can feel free to use that to support your argument, as long as you truly enjoy the product you watch, as opposed to being a mindless little lapdog that enjoys being Spoon Fed by Daddy Vince.
Being that you have never stated anything remotely critical of Vince in the past, other than the steroid issue, I can't help but think that, however.
Additionally, speaking of being a "WWE Shareholder", we were talking about the whole "violence against women" topic. Would you care to explain why all of a sudden when Orton DDT'ed Stephanie prior to Wrestlemania, why you were marking out and getting all excited for Orton and into his character?
You say one thing, but when Vince does it .... you abandon your principles, and all of a sudden, it's "A okay". And that is a perfect example of the "Shareholder" mentality.
Like really, I could realy tear this whole Hogan/TNA thing to shreds, but I won't, because people seem to be excited about it. However I really don't see them feeling the same way 6 months, scratch that, 2 months from now. But I wouldn't say anything about it, because it would just take the fun out of people speculating and having something fun to talk about the next few weeks...Though I am going to love the apologist and excuses fans come up with when it fails.
The "Shareholder" yet again at work. Hoping that healthy competition to WWE fails even before it gets off the ground. If it doesn't have the "WWE" label attached to it, you just can't get into it.
What people like you should be doing is actually promoting it, as competition leads to a healthy wrestling business and forces all involved to work that much harder. The fans can only benefit from it.
However that isn't what "The Shareholders" are after. Rather, they are happy with Vince having a monopoly over the business and accepting whatever it is he decides to give them.
I have another thread for you. Please check out the "General WWE sucks Negative Complaining" sticky thread. First, check out the poll and then feel free to counter some of the things people are saying in there. Maybe you can feel free to discuss DX and the way Cena has been booked recently, as well.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=48854
