Are AJ, Natalya, and Tamina really that much better?

[boywithbluehanger]

This may open me up for a lot of "NOOB!" and "You don't know what the hell you're talking about!!" responses but I'm really curious if I'm alone in this thought.

Does anyone else think that A.J., Natalya, and Tamina, are not that much better than the rest of the Divas roster when it pertains to in-ring performance?

I ask this because as far as I can see, every diva pretty much does the same thing in the ring. They tumble, they recoil, they bounce off the ropes, they kick, they exchange punches a ton, they annoyingly scream, they do the occasional slam, and they (for the most part) have their own signature rhythms for usually 3-4 minutes tops. Adding a submission hold like the black widow or the sharpshooter makes it bit more fun to watch for anticipation sake but I don't see how it really makes those 3 ladies any better than say an Aksana or an Alicia Fox.

I'm not sure I understand what talents people are seeing other than those things I mentioned that almost all the Divas on the roster have. My only other guess is:

1. There's a fan bias with A.J. due to her past involvement in the male storylines
2. People simply assume Nattie and Tamina are better than the rest of the roster because of their lineage

Am I alone in thinking these three ladies are not SO MUCH better than the rest of the division in the ring?

 

[Hard Hit Prince]

As far as in ring goes Natalya can work a match like "the boys" with no problem. I've seen some of her work over in Japan and she surprised me, however bad competition doesn't really help. She is the Divas leader as far as working goes and there's not a doubt about that, and I for one always feel bad when I think that they have Sara Del Rey only has a trainer.

The thing you are talking about is the WWE style of match up - it's never about the quantity of the moves, specially when it comes to Divas. It's about the story, and the story generally is: villain attacks, babyface does the comeback (or false comeback spot) and babyface wins or the heel wins. However you have to give credit where credit is due, females like The Bellas have shown a lot more than what I was expecting for the past several months as far as in ring goes. Kaitlyn was telling good stories too and it's to bad she is out of the business.

Now onto AJ Lee, she's the divas division as far as total package. Her height is a problem, because in a match she always looks like a small child but the story makes sense. She isn't the strongest, she doesn't pull up powerhouse moves, she's a devious, opportunistic heel and that's what's good about AJ Lee - her character and, now, specially the promos. It's not for nothing that she's the longest WWE Divas Champion of all time. She deserves that accolade.

Tamina is very green in the ring, I mean she tries to be that kind of bodyguard women like Chyna used to be but it doesn't really work because she doesn't have the type of charisma to pull it of. In probably 4/5 months she has been with AJ Lee, she has been getting some wins and probably one good match with Natalya and that's it. She needs to show more personality to have people in her corner when she finally turns on AJ Lee. She needs to show a more ruthless side, being a heel asks for rubbing elbows in the face, humiliate and when you're a powerhouse it's easier to do that in the ring.

If I had to choose a top three in the women's division as far as talent, I would go with Natalya, AJ Lee and yes, probably Layla. But the future is bright with gals like Summer Rae, Paige, Emma finally getting their break. There's also some rough diamonds in Eva Marie for instance.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Does anyone else think that A.J., Natalya, and Tamina, are not that much better than the rest of the Divas roster when it pertains to in-ring performance?

Are you freaking KIDDING ME!? Do you even watch divas matches? Tamina I can understand you questioning.... but AJ and Natalya are so far ahead of the rest of the girls that they are on entirely different level in comparison. Are they phenominal? No. They can, however, work a decent match unlike the rest of the divas. Kaitlyn had improved significantly too, sadly she has left the WWE. The overwhelming majority of the others are just awful.

1. There's a fan bias with A.J. due to her past involvement in the male storylines

That has next to nothing to do with my fandom for AJ. I cannot speak for the other posters who support her on here, but for me personally those storylines account for a very tiny percentage of why I am an AJ fan. She is everything you could possibly want in a diva. She's attractive, she is good on the mic, has an interesting gimmick, and the most crucial of all being she can work a match. Not since the days of Trish and Lita has anyone fit all of the above at once. Had these criteria all been found with another diva who had nothing to do with the Daniel Bryan VS CM Punk feud then it would not change my thoughts on said diva at all. The same can be said if AJ herself was never involved with Bryan/Kane/Punk/Cena etc either.

2. People simply assume Nattie and Tamina are better than the rest of the roster because of their lineage

Natalya will never be as good as Bret Hart. That doesn't change the fact that she's been trained far better than any of the other divas have. It sounds more like you are biased AGAINST her due to her lineage. Tamina you are correct on though. She would not still be employed if she was not part of the Snuka family.

 

[boywithbluehanger]

Are you freaking KIDDING ME!? Do you even watch divas matches? Tamina I can understand you questioning.... but AJ and Natalya are so far ahead of the rest of the girls that they are on entirely different level in comparison. Are they phenominal? No. They can, however, work a decent match unlike the rest of the divas. Kaitlyn had improved significantly too, sadly she has left the WWE. The overwhelming majority of the others are just awful.

Yeeea this was pretty much the type of response I was expecting...
I watch all of the divas matches and personally I don't see anything that sets these 2 ladies SOOOO far ahead of the rest on the roster. I'll admit that they move well in the ring but it's not The Great Khali vs Daniel Bryan contrast as I feel people around here seem to make it out to be.

Natalya will never be as good as Bret Hart. That doesn't change the fact that she's been trained far better than any of the other divas have. It sounds more like you are biased AGAINST her due to her lineage. Tamina you are correct on though. She would not still be employed if she was not part of the Snuka family.

I'm not biased against Natalya. In fact I like her, A.J, and sometimes Tamina. I like most of the Divas on the roster actually. I just don't see why people claim that these women are so much better than the rest of the division when their matches are generally so similarly short and feature the same executions of unimpressive movesets. Just because A.J. or Natalya are capable of doing far more, doesn't explain why they're more liked than the ones who aren't as capable yet do the exact same limited actions in the ring. I think people don't fairly judge the rest of the talent and instead base their love for a few Divas on what they could do rather than what they're actually doing.

Silverback brought up a good explanation of the ability of A.J. and Natalya being able to tell a story in their matches but I believe that most of the Divas matches "tell a story" (I really hate that industry phrase. It's such a generic way to describe a good match without saying anything.) The only problem is that most live crowds aren't interested in slaps to the face, kicks to the stomach, over-selling with screams, and punches that halt the speed of the match. Or at least that's my assumption based on personal opinion.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Tamina I can understand you questioning.... but AJ and Natalya are so far ahead of the rest of the girls that they are on entirely different level in comparison.

Agreed. While Tamina essentially just hits spots and acts as a roughneck, Natalya and A.J. know how to work a match....and that puts them so far ahead of the other divas, it can't be understated.

Diva wrestling usually consists of spot-hitting, completely rehearsed and allowing for no deviation. Occasionally, you see one of them miss a spot and stand still, not knowing what to do next, much like a dancer forgetting her routine and stopping cold on the floor because she can't improvise well enough to get herself back to her regular routine.

If the diva who misses the spot is wrestling Natalya or A.J., she will be okay because the experienced woman will take over and lead the other back to the script. In fact, it's during those mess-ups that you can tell how much better A.J. and Natalya are than the others, simply because they actually know how to wrestle, not just learn a choreographed set of steps.

 

[deadman talking]

no i do not. As much as I like AJ, I dont see her in ring as that great. I dont think she has even improved(in ring). tamina and natti either. all overrated. Now to piss people off, the Bellas have improve both in and out of the ring. Their matches are actually becoming exciting for more than their looks. Alicia Fox is another one i dont know why they do not get behind more. She could be a bigger deal too.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I think the Divas, as a whole, have improved inside the ring. Cameron & Naomi are athletic, especially Naomi, and can be entertaining in the ring. Both are still a little sloppy and need to work on some timing issues.

Like 'em or hate 'em, The Bella Twins are both a whole universe ahead of where they once were. Considering that they didn't have the skill to execute a side headlock or to even hit the ropes well up until their return, the Bellas were a prime example of how little WWE thought of women's wrestling.

Alicia Fox can be a bit sloppy at times, but she's also pretty athletic and usually does pretty solid in the ring.

Eva Marie & Rosa Mendes are easily the two worst on the roster. Neither of them should even be on the main roster when you look at what they each bring to the table right now. Yeah I know they're both hot, but so what? Having a roster packed with beautiful women who can't wrestle is what's defined the Divas Division as a whole since...well really since just about always.

Aksana is...well, I'm not really sure why she's on the main roster either. Several months back, there was a report out alleging that Triple H sees something special in Aksana; but I'm not at all sure if the report is legit. She's not nearly as bad as Eva Marie or Rosa, but she's also pretty damn dull in the ring most of the time.

There's more to being a good in-ring wrestler than being able to pull off moves. AJ has a lot of charisma, she has no trouble putting together interesting promos and she knows how to use psychology, facial expressions & body language to help tell a story. She's made the most of every opportunity she's been given. She might not be as technically sound as someone like Natalya but, then again, she isn't trying to be.

Speaking of Natalya, if you want to see a good example of how good she is & can be in the ring, watch the match of her going against Paige for the NXT Women's Championship a few weeks back. She's not all that much of charisma, but people still like watching her get in the ring to do her stuff.

Tamina is the least charismatic Diva on the roster, but she has a much more physical style about her than most of the other women. She also has a tougher look & overall presence than most Divas. For instance, they don't try to sex her up with skimpy little outfits, so it helps her to stand out.

 

[Pedigree1]

AJ and Natalya are heads and shoulders above the rest of the Divas. Pure and simple and its not close. True enough,when most of the divas miss a spot,they stand there like a deer in the headlights wondering what to do next.. AJ and Natalya have no problem in overcoming this,especially Natalya IMO. Shes a hart,she has wrestling in her DNA,taught by the very best to ever compete..

AJ not quite sure who taught her i think Jay Lethal of all people.. AJ while very small in stature,the divas most of em tower over her,but AJ makes it work.. Theres a reason why she is longest reigning Divas title holder of all time (The current diva title not to be confused with Fablous Moolah's 3 decade reign).. Tamina looks scary to me,she really does. Still green in the ring,she has quite a bit to go before we can talk about her.

I do like the Bella Twins,they have improved quite a bit in the ring my hats off to them. Alicia Fox,i dont see enough of her to form an opinion,but from what i have seen she is athletic and is what a Diva should be. Intelligent,Gorgeous,Athletic and has integrity.

Rosa,is MIA and from i remember was nothing to write home about. Sloppy in the ring i see her more on twitter than anything else..

 

[kumarjtk]

wwe get back some old divas like melina, beth. According to current roster nattie is the only diva to wrestle a quality match. But not one diva make a good match. Wwe has no way to take the belt away from aj lee bcoz she is fan favorite. she is not a good wrestler, she attaract the fans that it. wwe bring back former divas or bring back nxt diva like emma, paige and wrestle with aj lee and get back the belt from aj lee.

My idea is put bailey to main roster and give title to her, she played as mickey james earlier carrier.

 

[JoeMallard]

The one thing that separates AJ Lee from every Diva on the main roster is that SHE CAN CUT A PROMO! That is the only reason why no one has been able to take the title off of her. While The Bella's have improved in the ring, they have not proven that they can say anything besides "Loser". Being able to tell a story and/or know how to carry a feud is a BIG piece of the business.

 

[pkrebel]

You don't know what the hell you're talking about!! LOL just kidding but seriously I think the Divas division is seriously heading in the right direction, AJ is great she deserves to be the longest Divas champion, she can wrestle she can talk on the mic, if the division was full of people like AJ (besides the fact it would be freaken hot) it would be awesome, beisdes AJ, Natalya can go with anyone including the men and Tamina is a real power house.

Sure AJ was helped by having storylines with the men but so did a lot of other divas, remember Eve Torres? She was heavily involved in the Kane-Cena fued but she didn't have the mic skills and didn't have much of a character to get over. AJ did and she did because she played her character well and can talk on the mic and later proved she is great in the ring. With AJ as the face the Divas division will go along way IMO

 

[Animeboy010]

To be quite honesty I think AJ is extremely overrated. Reason she looks good is because she is the only diva with a gimmick and material to work with. the other divas are generic and always get terrible booking. and i'm very sure that the wwe is doing that on purpose to establish AJ as the greatest diva ever. Even with the fact that she is average inside the ring. I guess She's a good wrestler, but not great. Her fans act like she some kind of wrestling god,when she's no where near that good. her ring skills are decent. most of her matches are just throwaway matches and nothing special..



A good portion of the women on the US indie scene could also out-wrestle AJ, especially the women in SHIMMER. AJ Lee wouldn't last 5 minutes in the ring with a woman like Madison Eagles, or Cheerleader Melissa/ Jessie McKay.Now moving I know Natalya is one of the best female wrestlers of all time. can hold her own against the ladies I mention above''even female wrestlers in Japan/Canada,Australia. Kinda sad Natty by Nature has wasted her career in wwe, she deserves far better..

 

[Alastor]

They are perceived to be better than the other Divas purely because they don't look like supermodels. Just like how male wrestlers are perceived to be better by certain sections of the fanbase just because they don't look like bodybuilders. Reverse biasness or whatever it is called.

 

[wrestler36]

AJ and Natalya are the superior of the divas from a wrestling standpoint and I think both Bellas have improved by leaps and bounds. Not sure why she's not on TV these days, but I'm surprised nobody has said anything about Layla. She's actually a very good wrestler as well as very easy on the eyes. She was having some fantastic matches when she was the Divas champion.

 

[Slash-LN]

A lot of AJ for me is her character and her story telling in the ring.
However she and Natalya are better in the ring than the current roster of Divas.

AJ vs Natalya is going to be your best match up with the current roster. The two best wrestlers are going to put on the best match most of the time. If you want to have your best chance for a good Divas match this is it.

On the next level you can match AJ and Natalya up with pretty much any Diva on the roster and they are going to be able to make that Diva look better than she really is. You're still going to get a decent match out of this scenario.

The next level is where Tamina fits in. She won't be able to hide the flaws of her opponents as well but she can still carry them to a passable match. On her own she probably isn't as good as AJ or Natalya but she's still better than the rest of the Diva's roster.

On the lowest level you match up the weaker workers.
Aksana vs. Nikki Bella for example.
It's going to be harder for them to hide their flaws because neither of them is that good. This is going to be the type of match that people are going to be bored with and spend more time pointing out the flaws than they are going to give any positive remarks to. Or they're just not going to watch it at all because given each Diva's in ring history they're just going to assume it's going to be bad.

 

[Reflection]

I agree with you.
AJ Lee is the best female diva in the WWE in terms of wrestling skills; her ability to play different characters well is praiseworthy too. As far as her popularity goes, I think it has more to do with her being from the WWE, than being in angles with major superstars... although that was important too, because it gave her all the time she needed to show her talent; much more than the <5 minutes her fellow divas got. Also, she climbed her way up from the bottom of the ladder, and didn't get selected because of being a hot model or because of being from a wrestling family. so she must be really good to have made it this far. Having said that, AJ Lee is great, but she's no Gail Kim or Awesome Kong... However she gets more praises than those two.

Natalya simply sucks these days. I don't care if she was great in Japan or Mexico, or was trained in MMA by Jesus Christ or Kung Fu by Lord Buddha, or that she apparently knows 1000 moves in her brain like Chris Jericho... I care about the present, what matters to me is what she brings to the squared circle on this day... And what I see, I'm not impressed with. She may be better than most of the Divas, but thats not enough. Her first signature move is the inherited Sharpshooter, but she takes so much time connecting it, that its hardly believable. Also, it clearly looks pretty loose on camera. Her second finisher is the Discuss Clothesline, which she mistimes most of the time. The opponent is either too far and she has to reach out to hit her, or the opponent is too near and she has to hit her with the biceps area. Apart from these two, her other moves are punches, normal clotheslines, and tripping her opponent. Most overrated diva online in the Universe era.

As for Tamina, I haven't seen much of her work apart from enforcing for AJ Lee or doing the Superfly splash... So it would be unfair if I comment on her, be it positive or negative. But considering that she is a mother, I'm content with her work, and the very fact that she is able to work well enough to be a part of the main active roster.

 

[Bernkastel]

I think I'll throw in my 2 cents here.

AJ, with the lone exceptions of Kaitlyn - whose now gone - and Vickie - who I haven't seen in a while - is the only woman actually talented enough to stand out on her own. Her matches have always been consistently entertaining. Just making it 10 minutes without making me want to reach for the controller is a big accomplishment. No one else has that ability. I'm starting to take a mild liking to the Bella's - or just the one with the implants. That's the one getting the heat from what I've seen. But even then it's not consistent. AJ deserves her position because she's the only truly marketable diva right now due to her skills as a worker.

Natalya and Tamina? They're both average. There's no difference between them and any other wrestler. I've been saying that about Nattie since 2010. I can't even remember the last time I was entertained by her without having to revisit matches from years and years ago. AJ has been consistently entertaining since she debuted. Kaitlyn was too. Vickie as well. Tamina? Never clicked even once. I'm guess she's still around to fill the "generic heel powerhouse" role like Victoria in her waning days.

 

[GameOver]

Tamina isn't, she's just a generic heavy, other then being able to do her fathers Top Rope Splash.

AJ however is better, she has the ability to grab attention and can go in the ring for her size, as can the Bella's when they want to be, Natalya has been booked to look just average for along time, when she came in she was dominant then quickly slipped into the bridesmaid/Victoria role of just being comic relief. I see noone on the NXT roster that is worth caring about either.

a skinny Sheamus clone who has done jack shit since they gave her the title, 2 generic stupid characters in emma and bailey, and Ric Flair's daughter that's only wrestled a few times and is not in the least bit impressive.