The United, or Divided, States of America?

[Razor]

This thread is going to be my treatise on the growing disparity between Americans in this country. It won't be super long. Promise.

I figure I would start out with the obvious and go from there.

Political Parties

One thing everyone has seemed to forget is that any American, no matter what political party, simply wants the best for America. They just think a different way is better to go about it.

Republicans; tax cuts and huge military we can't afford. Stuff to the elderly just because.

Democrats; raise taxes and somehow come up with enough social programs to still run out of the extra money.

Libertarians; Hey yo. How about we cut the size of government and lower taxes? You know, like what the Republicans used to wanna do.

Green Party; Is this mic on?

The major source of contention in this great country, we have degraded into a nation of Blue states and Red states. We have degraded into outrageously ******ed extremes. Either you're a Republican or you're a Marxist and terrorist. Either you're a Democrat or you hate minorities and hope every child in America dies of starvation because their parents were Jews or Muslims and not the requisite Christian.

Can anyone else see the mind-boggling stupidity that is rampant in the above paragraph? It sounds like war propaganda. You were either with Germany or a money-grubbing Allied Power. You were either with America or a baby-killing Japanese Kamikaze pilot. If you weren't with Britain than Winston Churchill would just plain shit on your chest. Because he rolled that way.

What's especially bad is that these extremes inherently limit intelligent discussion. Instead of talking with Glenn Beck about how Obama's bailout wasn't totally bad, we hear another horrendous story about how Obama wants to turn every child into little Hitler Youth. All because he wants to put into practice a program that will require children to volunteer in high school or something like that. Hitler Youth. Beck broke Godwin's Law for that bullshit.

Or we get people like Olbermann who lists Palin as a "Worst Person in the World" because she's exceedingly stupid.

I mean, c'mon people. We're not evil if we want taxes raised. Promise.

The Rich and the....Not-So Rich

I can bore you with charts and figures. Let's just say that the economic recession hasn't hit the richest 3% of our country as hard as the rest of the 97%. Something about the bottom 80% of Americans owning 7% of all liquid financial assets (essentially money and US Treasury bonds).

There is a movement in America about a system of fairness. That's all good. The Capitalist system has inherent risk built into it. A safety net of Unemployment and Jobless Benefits easily fits into the big scheme of things. As long as we're not taking away land and partitioning it off to poor farmers like we did to the Native Americans all those years ago we're still good to go. No Socialism or Communism here.

This system of fairness has evolved into some kind of horrid "RAGE RICH RAGE" epidemic. Ask any revolutionary or conspiracy theorist who they're targeting. The answer will be "Aliens," "those rich fuckers that control our government," or "Duh man. The rich aliens that control our government."

Rich people are not the enemies here, people. Neither are the poor, moderately wealthy people. We are Americans. How about learning how to not hate because of someone's financial status? That'd be wonderful.

I'm going to skip over the religion section of my treatise and bust right into what will probably be the most controversial segment of my thread.

I'm a (Blank) American!

Let me preface this by shooting down all claims that I am racist for this section. I'm not. I love everyone. In fact, I have a rather strong black woman fetish. Basically, I have no ill-regard for someone based solely on skin color alone. And since that is the definition of racist, I win.

Prima: I'm an African American!

Secunda: I'm a Mexican American!

Other dude: I'm a Chinese American!

Yet another: I'm a Chinese-Korean-Irish American!

And another: I'm a European American!

The others: Wait, no you're not. You're white.

Think back a few hundred years ago. The nation was just first starting out. We had all kinds of people from Europe relocated here. We also had Native Americans, but they were sorta not really cared about. And we killed a lot of them.

Did everyone go around saying "I'm a Scotch-Irish American!" No. They said "We're Americans! Yay! Fuck the British and their tea and their Stamp Acts!"

When the slaves were freed by the Emancipation Proclamation, what did slaves call themselves? Other than "Freedmen," of course.

"Americans." They didn't say "We're African Americans!" Though, really, they would actually be right when they call themselves that. Because they're actually from Africa.

So what is with the recent abuse of individualism over ethnicity? I don't go around saying "Hi, I'm Steven. I am descended from a family that was integral in the founding of the town of Maulden in Britain. I am also related to the Blackfoot and Cherokee Indians. I am therefore British-Blackfoot-Cherokee-European American. If you talk bad about the British or are against reparations for the Native Americans in question I will call you a dirty racist and advocate the murder of your family. How are you?"

But yet, we have entire swaths of our communities drawing battle-lines over color. It's ******ed. It's one thing to fight for the rights of your fellow man. I wouldn't hesitate to go out and march for black's rights if necessary. Or Hispanic rights, or hell. German rights if need be.

These terms have grown a life of their own and promoted yet another way to separate Americans. Into groups based around skin color.

TL;DR The Thread Question:

I submit that America is dividing itself over three basic principles that are being blown up WAY out of proportion. Race, politics, and money. Religion would be in there, but I don't wanna take the room up.

Am I right? Is race actually bringing the country together? How about money? Politics? Are any of these things actually as bad as I say? Is our country really degrading into a mass of divisions staring race, then moving into Democrat/Republican, then once more moving into the rich and the poor?

Or am I just blowing smoke up your ass?

Stake your claim.

 

[RockFan89]

The major source of contention in this great country, we have degraded into a nation of Blue states and Red states. We have degraded into outrageously ******ed extremes.

I honestly don't think our country is that divided. Whether I get along with someone is not dependent on their views on the federal reserve, the war in Iraq, or abortion. We get along with each other all the time despite our differences. The "******ed extremes" are very small in number and I would also like to recognize extreme is in the eye of the beholder. In a liberals mind, many libertarian positions are extreme, but I wouldn't label libertarians on the right and socialists on the left as "******ed".

What's especially bad is that these extremes inherently limit intelligent discussion. Instead of talking with Glenn Beck about how Obama's bailout wasn't totally bad, we hear another horrendous story about how Obama wants to turn every child into little Hitler Youth. All because he wants to put into practice a program that will require children to volunteer in high school or something like that. Hitler Youth. Beck broke Godwin's Law for that bullshit.

Or we get people like Olbermann who lists Palin as a "Worst Person in the World" because she's exceedingly stupid.

I like how you devote a paragraph to Glenn Beck and yet just a line on Olbermann (a line that at the same time attacks a conservative). Anyway, between the two maybe 6 or 7 million people actually listen to them. There are over 300 million people in the U.S.

There is a movement in America about a system of fairness. That's all good. The Capitalist system has inherent risk built into it. A safety net of Unemployment and Jobless Benefits easily fits into the big scheme of things.

So how long should jobless benefits be granted? I think 99 weeks is enough time. Now I don't think the unemployed would rather sit at home then go back to work, but I do think many of the unemployed would not work for low wages at McDonalds or Wal-Mart even if the opportunity presented itself because the unemployment benefits are very near that of a minimum wage job.

More than fairness, America has stood for liberty and I think that is the more important goal to have.

Rich people are not the enemies here, people. Neither are the poor, moderately wealthy people. We are Americans. How about learning how to not hate because of someone's financial status? That'd be wonderful.

I agree, but you had just stated:

I can bore you with charts and figures. Let's just say that the economic recession hasn't hit the richest 3% of our country as hard as the rest of the 97%. Something about the bottom 80% of Americans owning 7% of all liquid financial assets (essentially money and US Treasury bonds).

While you didn't flat out say it, your statement seemed to hint that the rich have too much money. It's ideas like that divide our country and spur class warfare.

These terms have grown a life of their own and promoted yet another way to separate Americans. Into groups based around skin color.

There is nothing wrong with taking pride in your ethnicity. I'm Indian (Asian) and proud of it, but I am more proud of being an American. And I firmly believe that the overwhelming majority of Americans feel the same way. Sure we have groups like the KKK and Black Panthers, but there numbers are minuscule. And while I do get annoyed by racially based organizations, at the end of the day, are country is not being hurt by it.

Am I right? Is race actually bringing the country together? How about money? Politics? Are any of these things actually as bad as I say? Is our country really degrading into a mass of divisions staring race, then moving into Democrat/Republican, then once more moving into the rich and the poor?

Race and money are just things politicians use to drive up anger for votes. Yes there are some people who are dividing our country, but the vast majority of Americans have no ill will towards those they disagree with. America has always and will always be a nation filled with immense diversity in all aspects of society, but that is not what will divide America, that is what has made America.

 

[Jonnie Walker]

I think that if 9/11 showed us anything, it was that we are United. Sure, we all act divided, and we may not agree on everything, but if a national tragedy like that happens, there is no Hispanic American, there is no African American, there is only American. I mean, during a war, there will be people who are for it and people who are against us. I think that the South Park episode "I'm a Little Bit Country". There's always going to be people who want to fight the war, and there will always be people who are against it. We can't have the country appear war hungry to the rest of the world, but we can't appear weak at the same time. There will always be anit-whatever protests, but if a national tragedy occurs, we are all American, and we all feel the effects of what happened. That's why we're called the United States of America, because even though we will always argue about something, whether it's war, politics, or who the best sports team is, we all take pride in our country, even through the flaws of it.

 

[Via Armbar]

I think that if 9/11 showed us anything, it was that we are United. Sure, we all act divided, and we may not agree on everything, but if a national tragedy like that happens, there is no Hispanic American, there is no African American, there is only American.

Well sure. You take away a man's security, their structure and routine and you get to see what people are really made of. You stare down the barrel of a gun and all the sudden we aren't ''him'' or ''her'', it becomes US. Birds of a feather flock together my friend and a common enemy can make cats and dogs drink tea together. All in all I do believe that the tragedy brought Americans together in a way that we weren't before. How much of it has stuck is debatable but still some of that overall bond remains.

RACE

Yikes. The big R word. Bringing some together while ignoring others for hundreds of years. It would seem as if people have forgotten that there is a difference between ethnicity and nationality. Are we not all American's since, ya know, we live in America? Does that make our nationality American? The combining of nationality with ethnicity is an attempt at people identifying themselves. The need for people to belong, to feel like one of many is an incredibly old emotion. What defines these groups ranges from skin color to tongue, from clothing to religion. Whatever people can find to collectively identify themselves with they will latch on to. You see it not just in adult society but in middle schools around the world. The cliques, the groups. Everyone needs to be something; everyone needs to belong.

People want to celebrate this difference. They want to display any form of heritage and lineage they have. The problem with this is when you identify, you exclude as well. There can't be groups without outsiders and the other way around. Differences are what separates us much more than common interest ever has. Only in times of desperation do the common interests over power what we had so quickly labeled ourselves as. In a world that is much more hectic and fast paced than it was say fifty years ago. Now more than ever have people felt the need to be their own entities. With things moving at the speed of light, people can be passed by so easily. Whether it be in the job market, their love lives, it doesn't matter. Without a label, people get lost in the shuffle. When though does the separation permanently separate us beyond repair? This is an underlying issue and one that will more than likely always be around. Is it separating us right now? I don't believe it to be one of the bigger issues, but an ugly one that is always hiding in the shadows.

Money

Damn. Even the word is beautiful. If their is one driving goal of mankind, it would be money. I wish I could say it was the overall pursuit of happiness of yourself and all of your fellow men. Sure, money may not buy happiness but it can buy a Ferrari. Have you ever driven a Ferrari? Me neither but hell I'm sure it would make me happy.I firmly believe that money is the true reason for the existence of not only religion but the wars it causes. You give people a promise, and absolute end that gives warrant to all of the questionable aspects of life and you've got a one way ticket to cash. Something that can control people like that, something that can control almost every action we take is going to absolutely divide people.

What some have, others will always want. This aren't minute differences. These are things that can drastically change every day life and individuals future. People start off with the ability and right to provide for themselves and their family to whichever extent they so wish. Hard work pays of people and the American Dream isn't just a line from a Hallmark card. The thing is, is that really the truth? Does everyone start off as equals with equivalent chances to do good for themselves. That's very much up for debate.

When something that dictates so much of our lives is so unevenly spread, problems are bound to arise. Pointing the finger of blame is an incredibly hard to do; do you point it at the people who have more or the people you think have somehow kept you down? Money is absolutely one of the things dividing the country. It divides other countries and has for a very very long time. No economic structure is without flaw, there is no way to permanently and logically eliminate the gap between the have's and the have-not's. There are ways to improve things. Problem is getting people to realize what the problems are and aim the blame in a direction rather than each other. If there was one absolute force that drives the things that tear American's apart, it's money. The basis of religion, the basis of war. Two things people are very split on and money is the root.

Politics

This is where the divide is most obvious. Ironic how one system could be so divided when the ultimate goal and end should be the same since we are all supposed to be one nation. Razor said that the ultimate goal of both parties is the same. Is that true? Because it would seem that the parties disagree rather strongly on issues who respective outcomes are outright opposite. Of course everyone wants wealth and happiness. Everyone wants to live long and prosper (Vulcan's FTW). What we all consider ''living well'' and ''prospering'' is all based on personal attributes. Can a country truly thrive if the definition of the word varies on whether or not you're blue or red? Can an ideal state be reached when there are such extreme ideological differences in what makes an ideal state just that?

Next to nothing I feel is in the realm of impossibility. When there are so many splits in the thread though, the possibility of a solid and united union decreases dramatically. There are big splits and small ones, but things crumble very quickly when personal interest is involved. Of all the issues listed above, I truly feel that political unrest amongst ourselves and the issues can divide a nation just as quickly as common interest can create a nation. Such as we started off as. United States of America? For now. Currently a large portion of the population is held together by the fact that we are in a recession. We have a common interest. Once again we are Americans because the same problem is effecting the common man. Without the ability to understand that we all want to be happy, we all want to live well and what we can truly do to get there than we will continue to unravel and become a nation of nations. A group of groups.

 

[Hawkeye]

I like to think of America as a huge family, and like a family,we naturally won't like some,will stay away from some,and love others to no end. But when something important happens like a death or wedding or birth,we all come together to react,be it rejoicing or mourning. America is the exact same way. We divide ourselves in so many different ways until something major happens,at which point walls begin to come down,barriers are broken. Two people who were once strangers will become close friends and bond in the face of adversity,or share in one another's victories.

When the 9/11 tragedy happened,we weren't a divided land in a complete sense,but we were less social to strangers.Granted I live in Houston where everyone says hi unless there a complete douche,but I think generally speaking we would keep to ourselves more.After the tragedy,we realized more than ever that life is fleeting,and we should keep our friends and neighbors closer to us than we were.And with that thought a more congenial nation was born,as it had been several times before in history I'm sure. We will always be divided on issues,but deep down as proud Americans,we will all love our neighbors because we're all in this together.There are several douchebags out there that tarnish this notion,but I assure you that they can't diminish the pride of the American people as a whole.

 

[Rhonda Rousey's Sports Bra]

It's a fairly simple answer for me, we are divided by choice and united when forced to be, it's all about what's better for the individual. We choose to divide ourselves into political parties by the way we think, or as alot of people I know, by the way you're told. Race isn't really a choice but people choose to identify with their own race. Examples would be blacks listening to rap and watching basketball. Racial profiling? Not if it happens, which it does. I could go on for days about race and how stereotypes are usually true, but I'll save that for when I feel like going on a rant. Money, well that can be a choice, sort of. Much like race it's a choice to identify with your income tax bracket, an example of this would be the "rich kids" only hanging out with other "rich kids" it happens alot. In a school with a wide array of different "classes" you can see it. Walk through the halls of any American school and you can see it, well save for politics, most kids know fuck all about politics.


Now on to the point of being united when forced to be. 9/11 was brought up earlier and is a good example of America being forced to put differences aside and unite for the greater good of their own livelyhood. Everyone needed to unite to make sure their life wasn't affected by the attacks and the way to do that was to join together with the people that they didn't identify with.

Now I know there are always exceptions to the rule, but these are my thoughts on the matter and I've yet to be swayed in another direction. Maybe I can be, but only time will tell.