LET THEM WRESTLE!!!!

[That N Word]

OK I was in the Cruiserweight thread and came upon me to make this thread about the entire WWE Main Roster. In present WWE and it's been like this for a while now, they're not allowing the wrestlers to really do their thing. All wrestlers are stuck wrestling wattered slow paced versions of what they're actually capable of. You see a guy like AJ Styles or Sami Zayn that never fails to deliver in ring wise working watered down matches of their best matches. Occasionally on TV you'll get a match like Reigns/Rollins, Styles/Ziggler, Charlotte/Sasha, or a multi-person match that will deliver but that's because they're allowing them to in those matches and 9/10 removing commercials from them. Another problem is the commercials in the middle of matches that takes away from it all as well. I understand WWE has alot of sponsors but they should really try moving commercials around so their not in the middle of matches. How about instead of making filler matches and putting commercials in the middle of those matches, take the filler out and replace filler spots with breaks. Here's what I think needs to change when it comes to the Main WWE Roster-

This formula needs to change:

• Heel opens show; Babyface interrupts; another heel interrupts; followed by another babyface; Tag match is announced
• Commercial Break
• Tag Match returns with someone in a rest hold, slow-paced action...match starts to pick up and we're sent back to commercial
• Commercial Break
• Tag Match returns in slow-paced form outside of the ring and goes for 5 more minutes before some sort of finish
• Announcers hype up what's next /w/ graphic; cuts to somebody walking backstage with some weird music playing..Cruiserweight action is next
• 5-Cruiserweight Tag Match Pt. 1
• Backstage segment (usually involving Angle, or Rollins)
• Commercial Break
• IC Title scene
• Pre-recorded promo from Goldust
• Commercial Break
• Alexa Bliss talks; Bayley interrupts and get's beat up
• Announcers advertises next PPV and something on WWE Network; Talks about Finn Balor's upcoming match.."Let's show you highlights of Finn Balor's career he's so awesome!"
• "Who is Finn Balor" Highlight Package
• Commercial Break
• Finn Balor match
• Bray Wyatt Pre-Recorded Video Package
• Samoa Joe backstage interview
• Commercial Break
• Filler match and segment
• Commercial Break
• Tag Team scene match
• Commercial Break
• 2nd Cruiserweight match
• Commercial Break
• Women's match with no storyline devolpment
• Announcers hype up what's next; Compares Roman Reigns to legends, talk about how he's the new Face of WWE in different variants and how this is his yard; hypes PPV. Roman Reigns is standing by when we come back
• Commercial Break
• Roman Reigns backstage interview; Enzo Amore is found layed out and Big Cass acts as if he didn't do it.
• Commercial Break
• Filler match
• Announcers hype up main event; Babyface entrance
• Commercial Break
• Heel's entrance; Main event match with screwy finish after Samoa Joe get's involved..But Roman still get's a Spear and stands tall.

Not too much I can say about SmackDown but they're beginning down the same path. Raw cut alot of the filler out and mix the commercial arounds before matches (7 minutes breaks) and make them feel big to make people wanna stay for after a commercial break. Do commercials pre- and post match and instead of the 5 minute breaks make the breaks now 7 minutes to fill time and not have more commercial than product. People cannot invest in a match with commercials throughout them. Just like people can't invest in matches where the wrestlers aren't allowed to wrestle their own way and in slow matches all the time. It's one of the reasons why Triple H's matches don't always go over too well in the new era because they're all "slow and medothical." It's really hard to invest in that, this is a whole new era where the fans wants to see fast-paced action. Question yourself was Reigns vs. Triple H really bad? Was Rollins vs. Triple H really boring? I'd probably say not but the style it self is tired and makes them feel like Raw matches. I don't know is it just me or.. Should commercials be moved around outside of matches? & Should wrestlers be allowed to be them in the ring ALL the time?

 

[That N Word]

Excuse piss poor grammar I was eating lmao but also add more time to matches. Timing plays apart in that as well. Also I did not mean to put the 5 in there! OK...Diving out

 

[Fire Marshall Bill]

Both your arguments are extremely naive. Both of them come down to money, and there's not even a second thought needed.

Commercials - Duh. Commercials make money. Period. You don't want them in the middle of matches? Well then get ready for shorter matches all the time. And frankly, they do their best to vary it. Sometimes it's during matches. Sometimes it's during entrances. Sometimes it's between backstage segments. Sometimes it's even before or after some vignette. They can only vary it so much.

Limited movesets - WWE is an entertainment business, despite how many asses that chaps around here. They need to be able to rely on their bankable stars. All of them are bankable in some way. Some obviously more than others. If you have wrestlers going out there and doing whatever they want, you increase risk of injury/death. Death is obviously something that WWE doesn't want. Injury also hurts them financially though. Look at Rollins. How are they supposed to rely on him as a cash cow if he's out consistently for months at a time due to injury? Do you really think guys like Cena, Orton or even Big Show can't do more moves in the ring? Big Show once did a moonsault! Cool? Yes. Safe? Hell no. Hell, even when DB got super popular they limited him completely. If you're blind to that, sorry. It's true. How much money are they making on him now that he's out?

If they want to let people go out there and do more, I'd say that's more what the Cruiserweight Division was designed to accomplish. I guarantee you those guys are still limited, but they do a lot more fast paced, high flying styles than they would allow their wrestlers who A) make more money for them, and B) would probably be a lot more dangerous doing.

 

[Aeon Mathix]

The limited movesets thing is what always got me about people that complained about John Cena for years on end and saying he can't wrestle with his 5 moves of doom. Its a signature and finisher sequence, hell WWE video games even adopted this for everyone because that's what they do.

John Cena: shoulder block, shoulder block, back drop, five knuckle shuffe, AA or STF
Shawn Michaels: Flying forearm, nip up, atomic drop, scoop slam, elbow drop, sweet chin music
Triple H: knee face buster, spinebuster, pedigree
Randy Orton: clothesline, clothesline, powerslam, apron ddt, rko
Sami Zayn: dropkick, dropkick, swinging neckbreaker, blue thunder bomb, helluva kick

I could go on all day, but the point is their movesets are there for a reason. These guys wrestle over 300 times a year sometimes, you can't expect a different move every single time. You need something that will get people's attention and get them on their feet because they know the finish is coming. It's called building up a match. Every single Babyface vs Heel match in history has gone this route. Heel whoops face's ass the whole match, Babyface starts their comeback like the ones I listed above. Watch any Shawn Michaels, AJ Styles, any WWE internet darling match and I guarantee you know which move is coming next.

Commercials are a necessary evil and where not just WWE but every TV show generates most of their revenue. I won't even go into detail why eliminating those would be idiotic. Besides even if they did, it would just mean Triple H or Stephanie get more time to bore us with their promos.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

If they simply went out there and did all these different moves, many of which are pretty high risk, then it'd be no time at all before someone got injured or killed. WWE's touring schedule is legendary for its intensity, the wrestlers are on the road some 300+ days out of the year and even if some of those guys don't wrestle every single night, they're still out there on the road in cramped airplane seats, rental cars, buses, etc. nursing the same sort of wear & tear on their bodies that those who do wrestle just about every night are going through. At various times, I've said that if the Young Bucks ever came to WWE, they'd have to modify their style in the ring or they'd burn themselves out within a year or two from either exhaustion or injury. One reason why a lot of indy stars who did a lot of high and/or dangerous spots in their work went to NXT is so that other aspects of being a wrestler could be developed so that all those big moves, spots, etc. meant more when they were used and so the wrestlers wouldn't wear their bodies out.

From another standpoint, though one no less practical, just imagine if WWE told the wrestlers to go out there and just do whatever came to mind night after night. How long do you think it'd be before someone got hurt/killed and WWE wound up on the end of a lawsuit because of it? Injuries happen enough as it is, so just imagine the injuries mounting up if they told all the wrestlers to just go buck wild every single night in the ring. Right now, you've got wrestlers who haven't worked for WWE in decades trying to sue them for allegedly lying to them about the possibility of cranial trauma and injuries they claim happened while they worked for WWE. In my opinion, it's all pretty ludicrous because nothing went on in WWE that they didn't suffer working in other companies and territories. Some of them used drugs in WWE and Vince looked the other way, but so did everyone else as the promoters didn't care what they did as long as it didn't interfere with their work.

As for commercials, as has been mentioned, commercials mean money and help to generally pay the bills. I personally like how the picture in picture tech is being employed during matches on SmackDown Live, though I don't know why they don't use that during the main event match slot. I'd say that Raw will wind up doing the same thing at some point, which is a plus in my opinion.

When it comes to the general match formula, it's something that works for WWE. Last year, the company took in fairly close to $750 million in revenue and it's making more money now than at any time in its existence. Last year was the third or fourth consecutive year in which the company saw record revenue and while some of what WWE does or doesn't do can get on the nerves of internet fans sometimes, they obviously know what they're doing despite the protestations of net fans and dirt sheet writers.

 

[Franchize1990]

As far as commercials go, I agree that having them in the middle of matches are a problem and take away from the match a little. Having said that, both Undying and Fire Marshall Bill said it best, it's a necessary evil and it's something that the WWE can only do so much with. That ad revenue gives the WWE a good chuck of its income and it's probably something that they don't want to mess with.

Regarding the style of wrestling, the combatants in the ring need to be able to sell to the fans both in the arena and watching on television a story through their actions, which is much easier to do at a slower pace than it is to do moving at fast speeds. Wrestlers should be able to take their time in selling a move as though it actually hurt rather than moving from one move to the next as though nothing is phasing them. It's formulaic but it's that way for a reason, it works with the majority.

Also, when it comes to TV matches, not everything needs to be Reigns/Rollins, Styles/Ziggler, or Charlotte/Sasha because now what are you saving when it comes to the PPV if you're the WWE or any other major wrestling company?

 

[Slash-LN]

I remember seeing a couple years back that there were rumors that some of the main roster wrestlers were jealous of the wrestlers in NXT because NXT allows more freedom in matches.

There's definitely a risk vs reward premise here that boils down to quality vs quantity.
If people are trying to jam too many moves into their set that's taking time away from perfecting the moves they use. At the same time repetition gets boring.

They should be allowed a little more freedom. Everything doesn't have to be high spots but it doesn't hurt to add some new moves in.

When you're too formulaic you prevent some of the people that made their names elsewhere from continuing to do the things that made them a star in the first place.

That's partly why Mistico failed as Sin Cara. Because he never learned the WWE style. But if they had let him go out and be Mistico instead of trying to force their style on him and didn't have him wrestle under those stupid lights in the process he probably would have done better.

With that thought though. The formulaic way has its advantages because if everyone is wrestling under the same formula you don't have as many clash of styles going on. There's less adaption needed.

Sticking with Mistico. A lot of people didn't know how to work his style because they hadn't been exposed to it.

Even going back to WCW and the cruiserweights most of them worked better together than they did with people who weren't as accustomed to the quicker pace.

There's really two sides to the argument but a better balance would be nice.

Especially for major shows. Not really sure what to call them since they aren't technically pay per views anymore.

I'd like to see stars go all out in those at least.

 

[filthyanimalz]

Just one of the reasons WWE and wrestling in general is experiencing a sharp downturn in popularity. Not surprised there are so many commercials when you consider the fact they are very proud to say they are no longer a Wrestling promotion but a sports entertainment promotion. In a way it is smart to money grab from as many advertisers but you can't expect those advertisers to be lining up when it is time to renegotiate TV deals with diminished viewership. In comparison when you look at other less commercialised countries around the globe you can see that wrestling is as popular as ever or even more popular than ever and many promoters and now beginning to realise this and capitalise on it. However it is pretty sad that a product that was once proudly embraced by America is now being somewhat shunned. I have to agree with you, they should LET THEM WRESTLE.

 

[stingray11214]

WWE is a scripted television show that contains wrestling.

The above sentence is what currently describes what you watch on Monday night. However, if you want to see Professional Wrestling, you can go to Comet's website and watch RoH. Or, you can get the FITE app, and watch scores of wrestling promotions. Or, you can drop $$$ and support your local Indy promotion. Miss Cody Rhodes? Pining to see Amazing Red? No Problem! Go to your local Armory or Bingo Hall, and catch wrestling.

However, if you think WWE is about pro wrestling, you are seriously mistaken. Nobody in Creative has any history in the business. Most of them write soap operas. None of them watch wrestling, and God forbid they say they are a fan of pro wrestling. VKM and his minions will find a way to get rid of them. Give the wrestlers freedom? Are you nuts?

 

[ShinChan]

I can feel what you say about the commercials. But it's a double edged sword. WWE can't get rid of them and I can't blame them.

However something like picture in picture for commercials could be done to serve the purpose of both the sides. The advertising continues and the continuity of a match doesn't get affected as well.

As for having more wrestling, just watch NJPW, ROH, Lucha Underground. Because they are actually wrestling promotions. It isn't like if you won't get storylines there. You'll for sure. Also, there are so many choices out there that you can just have the cream of every choice. That's something I do. Give yourself an opportunity to watch great wrestling all around the world regardless of which promotion it is.

 

[LBGetBack]

I truly don't know how anyone can even sit and watch Raw or Smackdown live in this day and age. Just way too much of a time investment for so little excitement. In a given 3 hour Raw, there might be 20 minutes of actual excitement if you're lucky. Too many boring rematches or variations of rematches. Too many commercials. The outcome of the matches don't really matter at all because everyone just trades wins with whoever they're feuding with.

The early days of the one hour Raw where you didn't see the same wrestlers every week was so much more exciting.

I'm a PPV only guy now, who might occasionally go back and fast forward through a Raw/Smackdown to catch the few exciting parts, once the episode is up on the Network.

 

[Radical]

Should commercials be moved around outside of matches? & Should wrestlers be allowed to be them in the ring ALL the time?

I've been saying this for a while now: the placement and frequency of commercials in WWE shows these days is KILLER in keeping ongoing interest in watching the show live.

It's so weird to me when these days so many people have access to so much more programming that doesn't have commercials or can use DVRs to fast forward through commercials AND, in WWE's case, they nicely package up the key parts of the their show into little 2-6 minute YouTube clips just HOURS after the show. So many reasons why the placement and frequency of commercials cannot be helping them in getting higher ratings and more regular viewership and followers.

In the Attitude Era they didn't DARE throw to a commercial during a match, they barely wanted to do any commercials, but they way they tried to keep people's interest is always have some sort of hook/preview before the commercial about what's going to happen or have some sort of incident happen before the commercial so you would want to see what happens next. And in the AE they also did more quick IN SHOW commercials.

I think WWE should seriously start thinking about doing more in-show ads and keeping commercials away during matches.


As for letting the wrestlers wrestle more? I partly think they DO let a lot of the wrestlers wrestle more their style, it's just that they have shows like 3-4 times A WEEK! I know they are supposed to impress us on the Live TV shows but, really, do they really have to do a 5-star match every Monday and Tuesday or else it's not good enough for us?

If the storylines were more involving, intense and interesting then the actual WRESTLING part of matches would be great bonus but what happens to progress the STORY would be just as interesting.

I think WWE is missing a piece of interest in that there are very few factions in WWE that kind of 'take over' and MAKE you take interest because they are so overbearing.

Some of the most popular and memorable times the WWE has had are when factions take over. More recently; The Shield, Nexus, Evolution, NWO, DX, The Corporation, etc.

Get back to having some serious factions and just see if it gets people to pay attention more.