It's just stupid and pointless...

[LFC till i die]

So i was watching a old episode of Raw which i had taped not long ago where the main event was The Miz + John Cena v Justin Gabriel + Heath Slater. The Miz and Cena ended up winning the tag titles but lost them straight away to Slater and Gabriel which bought me to my question, why does WWE have superstars win titles them have them lose the titles straight away in the same night or not have them hold the title for long? Its stupid and pointless.
Let me give u some examples of this:
The one mentioned above. Why have Miz and Cena win the titles then have them lose straight away to Gabriel and Slater? I know its to further the fued between Miz and Cena, but c'mon.

Cens and Batista win the tag titles from Rhodes and DiBiase and they lose the titles. Like what was the point in having them win the tag titles if their not going to hold them for long?

Jericho wins the WWF title from HHH on Raw (think it was in 2000).

Cena wins the WWE championship at EC then loses it straight after the EC match to Batista.

Dolph Ziggler "won" the world title from Edge. Is Dolph actually recognized as a former world champion? But this was just stupid. What was the point in this?...

There are more but arent coming to mind.

So i want to hear your opinions. Do you agree or disagree with me.

 

[achromat666]

Simply speaking, because the WWE doesn't care about the tag titles.

At all.


Look at the last title holders before Slater and Gabriel got them: Santino and Koslov. Not even remotely a tag team, just 2 people they put together that don't interact in the ring as a tag team. No tag moves, no continuity, and no reason to be tag champions other than they wanted to keep them relevant.

The problem is far worse: the systematic destruction of anything resembling a tag team stable of any sort. Name one tag team, as in either came into the WWE as a tandem or have been booked for a long period as a team with the requisite tag team moves and tag finisher, that exist in the promotion that anyone knows or has had the belts?

The Usos don't count because they have been buried pretty much right after they broke up the Hart dynasty, and that team was the only thing holding up DH Smith or Tyson Kidd.

give up? It's because they don't exist. Even Gabriel and Slater aren't a traditional tag team, lacking the tag features I mentioned earlier. They're the closest as we'll likely ever see unfortunately.

As for the issues with the world title, You forgot the Kane's 1st title run. all 24 hrs of it.

But to your OP, yes extremely brief title runs of any sort are pretty pointless and elevate nothing but storylines that the titles themselves can do without.

 

[Matth3w]

Yeah it was a botch, hence instant rematch and Nexus winning them back. Before the rematch you can see various superstars talking to themselves and the referee to work out the finish.

 

[GW_Hart86]

Yea, the titles changing hands like a yoyo is pathetic, the WWE really need to pack it in....maybe if it happened once every few years to shock the fans, but its becoming too much of a regular occurrance, i know what you mean.

I also agree with the comments on tag teams for the most part. The WWE really needs to fix the tag team set up. I think The Core could be potentially great with a bit of work and a bit more gelling to gain some tag team features. I think the WWE should give a big push to the Uso's as well as they are a natural tag team, one of very few out there at the mo. I would also liked to have seen Debiase and Rhodes stay as a tag team for much longer, I feel both of them have been pushed too quickly into singles competition and getting too much of a push up the ladder before they have earned it!

 

[RatedRockstar]

It wasnt a botch it was planned, it was so miz could say i carried cena then buried him, it was stupid yes, but it was planned, idk why they thought it was a good idea but it did make me hate the miz at the time so it worked i suppose

 

[Peoples_Trashman]

i'd have kept them champs up until wrestlemania.. I think despite their hatred for each other. hav them defend the titles every week then at wrestlemania Defend the tag team titles successfully. Then have their match later in the show.. I dont ever remember wrestlemania opponents being tag team champions facing each other wether they were on the same side or not. An we'll say cena wins the title. they either do Corres rematch clause after that match an get them back or do it on raw an have miz screw cena in the match onces he's beat down Cash in his rematch clause an get the wwe title back... Cuz cena has held the belt majority of bout the last 5 years.. i mean last time he was really in the title hunt was Last Summer.. an jus recently got back in it.. It would be a perfect time afterwards.. To turn Cena heel claimin nobody in the locker room has his back.. cuz he still gettin beat up by nexus an punk an even corre or turn Corre or nexus a face stable to make their feud more believeable

 

[thraxiusrex]

I'll play devil's advocate here since everybody in this thread is on board for the WWE booking bash-fest.
The bottom line is that ideally, anything can happen. In actual sports, teams might win the championship one year and miss the playoffs the next. I think if every title reign had a similar, moderate length, it would get a bit boring and predictable. In real life, weird shit happens, flukes happen, etc.
So if you're trying to book wrestling as a legitimate competition, mixing in some short title reigns makes things look a bit more realistic in my opinion.

 

[achromat666]

I'll play devil's advocate here since everybody in this thread is on board for the WWE booking bash-fest.
The bottom line is that ideally, anything can happen. In actual sports, teams might win the championship one year and miss the playoffs the next. I think if every title reign had a similar, moderate length, it would get a bit boring and predictable. In real life, weird shit happens, flukes happen, etc.
So if you're trying to book wrestling as a legitimate competition, mixing in some short title reigns makes things look a bit more realistic in my opinion.

None of what I said was WWE bashing, it was frustration on a part of the card where talent traditionally gets lost and in many cases future endeavored because aside from a few key performers you barely see these guys in the ring unless it's on superstars. The mid card is every bit as much for them as it is for your developing stars. And if you actually pushed your mid card titles properly, story bits featuring established stars and former champions in the same tired 'lets put the rivals together in a tag team and have them go ballistic on each other' bit aside, you'd have a mid card worth watching that consists of more than 4 people per show.

This is especially true of the tag titles, of which there is now only one over 2 'brands'. and the only title with that distinction.

That's all I was saying.

However, having a title for a couple minutes however story based it may be is also getting damn old too, and does little to keep that title's value.

That's not bashing, I've been a fan of the WWE likely longer than many of the people commonly answering these threads have been breathing. The titles have less and less impact unless there on someone there pushing to the moon or on someone who's held the belt millions of times. And the mid cad belts are largely lost for the same reasons.

 

[Charismatic Enigma]

I'll play devil's advocate here since everybody in this thread is on board for the WWE booking bash-fest.
The bottom line is that ideally, anything can happen. In actual sports, teams might win the championship one year and miss the playoffs the next. I think if every title reign had a similar, moderate length, it would get a bit boring and predictable. In real life, weird shit happens, flukes happen, etc.
So if you're trying to book wrestling as a legitimate competition, mixing in some short title reigns makes things look a bit more realistic in my opinion.

I agree with this to an extent, but they still aren't really doing a good job of what you're talking about either. If it was a fluke win or something than in theory someone like Evan Bourne should get the best of Miz one day as a surprise, and he shouldn't lose it the same night just because he's undersized. He should then go on to be treated like any other legitimate athlete would in any other sport and have a scheduled date to defend his belt at which point he would then lose it, when the bigger wrestler was better prepared to face him.

WWE loves to have these surprise wins from someone who the fans don't feel is qualified like Ziggler and then find some lame excuse to take it back in the same night "just because".

In my opinion this is the biggest flaw of professional wrestling, period. When I watch the NFL, sure it's more likely the Patriots could beat the Lions but you know what...there's always a chance. The networks don't only show Patriots games just because they happen to win a lot. The WWE acts like it only ever has a handful of guys at any given time who are legit contenders for the belt, which is boring to me. I would rather see Kofi Kingston or Santino challenge for it (and actually believe there was a hope in hell they could win) just to have some variety in the programs.

I know WWE is all about marketing and they worry someone like Santino wouldn't be of enough interest to fans to headline a PPV, but I believe the only reason for that is because outside of main eventers you know no one ever has a real chance at winning the belt, and that's a stigma WWE created themselves, if they really made it feel like anything could happen the fans would buy in to it.

 

[Kaeden]

I believe each of these had a purpose in storyline. Afterall, titles only exist as props to propel stories. Cena and Miz was already explained. I, admittedly, missed the Cena/Batista thing.

The Jericho/HHH thing furthered the conflict between Haitch and Hebner, and got Hunter CRAZY heat for forcing the decision to be overturned. Cena and Batista at EC was to start their big feud, was it not? It gave a good reason to have the grudge, which centers the fight.

And i beleive Ziggler is ACTUALLY regarded as a former champion, allowing him to add that to his resume, despite not being 'ready' to carry it, as it seems. It also, pumps up Edge's title count.

While stupid, They rarely do it "just because". There's always a reason, even it doesn't always work.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I was feeling mixed emotions about this particular situation.

On one hand, while I know that Vince isn't particularly interested in what happens in the tag team picture in the WWE, it's always been a pet peeve of mine to see any title get passed around like a prop.

On the other hand, the way this angle played out did accomplish a couple of things. For one thing, it changed up the standard formula that everyone expected for this match. We've all seen tag matched in which fierce rivals are forced to tag together in which one of them winds up screwing the other one over. We thought it was going to be that standard formula in this match and so did every other person in the arena that night. Having Miz & Cena actually win the titles was quite unexpected and a legit surprise. Sometimes, you'll hear that wrestling is no longer unpredictable but whenever something legitimately unpredictable happens, it seems that there's even more criticism sometimes.

It also accomplished the beginning of starting The Miz on the path to being a relevant factor in his own WWE Championship match. For the first few weeks of The Rock/Cena situation, the WWE purposely booked the angle in which Miz comes across as a supporting player in his own title match. So, the WWE has Miz come out of nowhere and is strongly booked over the course of the next month or so as he leaves Cena laying week after week. In the process, Miz sort of morphs from looking like a very vulnerable young heel champion to an opportunistic heel that picks his spots and becomes a legit threat to John Cena. And, he no longer comes off like he's playing second fiddle to The Rock or Cena.

So yeah, the way the tag titles were used in this instance did get my dander up. However, the WWE tends to do things on a long term basis. You can look at something they might do one night and think "what the fuck?!?!" only for things to play out over time. Within a month or so, you can look back over at that angle that you initially hated and can at least say "Ok, yeah now I see why they did this". You might even come to like it and you might not, but at least you'll know why it came about.

 

[mral82]

i'd have kept them champs up until wrestlemania.. I think despite their hatred for each other. hav them defend the titles every week then at wrestlemania Defend the tag team titles successfully. Then have their match later in the show.. I dont ever remember wrestlemania opponents being tag team champions facing each other wether they were on the same side or not. An we'll say cena wins the title. they either do Corres rematch clause after that match an get them back or do it on raw an have miz screw cena in the match onces he's beat down Cash in his rematch clause an get the wwe title back... Cuz cena has held the belt majority of bout the last 5 years.. i mean last time he was really in the title hunt was Last Summer.. an jus recently got back in it.. It would be a perfect time afterwards.. To turn Cena heel claimin nobody in the locker room has his back.. cuz he still gettin beat up by nexus an punk an even corre or turn Corre or nexus a face stable to make their feud more believeable

The Last time WWE Tag Champ went against each other was at WrestleMania 21 w/ Rey Mysterio vs Eddie Guerrero as they was the WWE TAg Team Chaps and not the World Tag. The rock needs to save the Uso's from Jabroni heaven and manage them as he is their cousin and he said he cared about his family. Then that's wh he can help by givin them a personality check or might as well send them back to FCW. The whole point of the Title changes that are meaningless is it helps w/ the stories and also botches by the people who are involved go back and watch the "I QUIT!" match between Mankind and The Rock. Rocky says "I QUIT!!" 3 times but Earl Hebner doesn't stop the match til after the "PRE-RECORDED I QUIT, I QUIT, I QUIT!!!" from Foley is said then hew stops it.

 

[xsKiitz]

I personally think it added a lot to the Miz's character. He won the titles himself, proving that he could carry Cena in a match and win the titles, then lost them because he could. Sure, it was taking a MASSIVE dump on the Tag titles, but I guess that's the price WWE wants to pay to hype up the already not-so-good Cena v Miz feud.


Also, I think officially naming Dolph Ziggler a former world champion is the dumbest thing i've EVER seen. Honestly, I've been watching wrestling for quite a while, and this has to be the worst decision I've seen them make. He had the belt for what, 10 minutes? It's an insult to Ziggler to win his first World Title like that...

-

 

[yur_momma]

wow you were surprised they won the tag titles???? as soon as they said that miz and cena (two opponents) would be teaming to fight for the tag belts i knew instantly they were going to win. have two superstars in a feud who were forced to wrestle together for tag titles ever lost?? not that i can remember or look up...and if it has happened, the balance is so overwhelmingly in favor of the two feuding wrestlers winning the belts that surprise should be the last thing you felt. (michaels/austin, austin/taker, kane/taker, jericho/rock, cena/michaels, etc...there are probably more i just cant think of them)

xsKiitz: i agree about ziggler...its sad. why dont they count kendrick's momentary status as champion from the scramble match? (or any of the others from that night?). wwe has the biggest selective memory of all...

 

[BestForTheBusinesso9]

I think this was a very good idea in a number of different ways and at the same time in no way hurt Gabriel and Slater. They were probably built up by having the match against the two men involved in the Wrestlemania match even if they lost the first and needed help from the Miz to win the second. This did so many other things though beyond this.

1) Gave Miz some credibility-Everyone had been talking about Miz not being able to win clean and needing some credibility. Well he single handedly took down the tag champions in a match and got the clean pinfall.

2) Toyed with the crowd-You had fans cheering for Miz and Cena acting as the typical face tag team partner. When the pinfall occurred everyone was wondering what was going to come of this and shocked pretty much everyone.

3) Give Miz more heat-By letting the fans actually cheer for the Miz it let them to be even more disappointed when he took out and turned on Cena. Like another poster added this put The Miz off the backburner for the Wrestlemania match.

4) Could have been a tester for Miz as a face-This was kind of the blueprint for what a Miz match as a face would look like. No outside help and no cheating tactics. He was also put up against a fairly over heel group that included its more recognizable faces in Barrett and Jackson.

The bottom line is every title is there to advance storylines and ultimately make money for the company. Sure, prestige is needed for titles and you want to maintain some level of credibility but no matter what the main goal is Wrestlemania. I realize that in this day and age the number of title reigns have become increasingly more important but things like this are in no way new. Heels use to lose and regain titles all the time in ways like this at house shows and other events. This one just happened to be on TV and the only reason it will even be remembered is because sometime down the road Miz or Cena will be mentioned as x time tag champion. Who cares? Really we all know that the tag titles didn't change hands and the Corre still came out of the show with the titles they went in with.

 

[Arsenal 4 life]

You are all forgetting that wwe made a title for short title reigns! just so a jobber can have a bit of credibility! remember when the hardcore title was defended under '24/7' rules.

 

[DethMetal]

WWE doesn't care for the tag titles.

At all...

Oh. Another example is when Jeff Hardy won the World heavyweight title and CM Punk cashed in.

As for it being stupid and pointless, it bugs me more with the minor titles than a World title. With minor titles, you know the rivaled partners aren't gonna hold the titles. They plan the world title ones better. Most are unexpected. Also, it adds to the whole, "Anything can happen in the WWE."

 

[stasheroo]

I'll play devil's advocate here since everybody in this thread is on board for the WWE booking bash-fest.
The bottom line is that ideally, anything can happen. In actual sports, teams might win the championship one year and miss the playoffs the next. I think if every title reign had a similar, moderate length, it would get a bit boring and predictable. In real life, weird shit happens, flukes happen, etc.
So if you're trying to book wrestling as a legitimate competition, mixing in some short title reigns makes things look a bit more realistic in my opinion.

I think this does the opposite of that.

It once again illustrates a bad-for-business mentality where the 4 or 5 top guys are so much better than everyone else that they can win titles without trying or without actually wanting to work with the partner they're forced to tag with.

And it further shows the complete disdain the WWE currently has for anyone and any thing associated with tag-team wrestling.

Maybe Vince McMahon has forgotten how much merchandise the Legion of Doom moved for him?

I put it in the same vain of the son-in-law's recent squashes against current and future talent. How does it make good business sense to disregard your talent and your titles in such a manner?

 

[multiverseman.com]

I've ALWAYS liked it when two singles opponents won the tag titles to further their feud. It only devalues the titles when done wrong. In the current tag climate, Cena/Miz HELPED the titles. Let's face it, people care more about them than the current tag teams.

 

[Calderownz]

In my opinion, they do this for a few reasons. Good reasons, in my opinion.

Take the Miz/Cena situation. First of all, they needed to give this feud a little more edge. So, they make two opposites that hate each other a tag team. Not just a tag team, but a team with a chance to win the championship.

As a fan, you start to think of how they lose. Maybe they brawl and it costs them the win. Maybe they actually win. How do they co-exist as champions when they hate each others guts.

So, to actually do something that's not expected, you have them win and lose the championships on the same night. The reason? The Miz helps them win and then forces the loss. As far as the two main players in this segment, it couldn't have done more to build the feud. This is classic material for the reel right before their match at WrestleMania.

While I will say that this does hurt the tag team involved, I don't have much of a problem with it in this case. This team isn't build as an incredible team and they simply aren't that over. WWE could do more to change that. However, as it stands, they are simply a team.

Psychologically, if they were a better, more strong-faced team, I'd say this story line hurt them. However, Gabriel and Slater have no legitimate credibility as it is in the division as the division is bad to begin with.

 

[Reddog1146]

i think it is too make whoever lost the title in the first place look not so weak. i do not like rapid title changes, if you win a title then the superstar should hold the title for at least a couple of weeks. it makes the titles more valuable, now ANYONE can win the tag team titles and that is why nobody cares about them.