Is The Pro Wrestling "Stigma" Back?

[BillAlfonso]

Looking back on the WWE Films, "The Condemned," "The Marine," and "12 Rounds." I have to wonder why they didn't do so well at the box office and critically. I felt that all three movies were pretty good especially compared to the shit that Hollywood puts out on average. These movies ain't "Citizen Kane" but what is? I thought Austin and Cena both did great considering how green they were to the world of acting, no worse than Dwayne Johnson, in his first outings, and the movies were actually a bit entertaining. Sure, 12 Rounds was a bit of a rip off of "Die Hard With A Vengeance" but that doesn't make it bad. Also, look at the way Dwayne Johnson had to distance himself from his pro wrestling past to be considered a serious actor, why? During the last boom period of the late '90s pro-wrestling had a lot of breakthrough in terms of mainstream appeal and I know it isn't as popular as it once was so do you think it's lost the appeal so much that the "he's a pro-wrestler" label is back in terms of how the general public views the industry we all love?

P.S.

I just saw "Predators" for the first time, do you guys ever think we'll see a Predator movie where one of the Predators wins a fist fight against a human?

 

[Mitch Henessey]

WWE films are usually terrible. I didn't have too big of a problem with The Marine and 12 Rounds, but I couldn't stand See No Evil, The Marine 2, and The Condemned. I thought all of these films were pieces of shit. As far as the pro wrestling stigma goes, did it ever leave? Hulk Hogan took on Sylvester Stallone in Rocky III, and playing Thunderlips in Rocky did wonders for Hogan. The Rock was able to achieve some mainstream success when he played the The Scorpion King in The Mummy Returns, and he's been having a nice career in Hollywood so far. But guys like Hogan and Rock don't come along too often. Both of these men were HUGE stars, and they had tons of charisma.

Pro wrestling will NEVER be accepted by the mainstream media. Vince McMahon can keep trying, but it will never happen. The Rock separated himself from the world of pro wrestling, and he has been featured in some popular mainstream movies. Legendary and Knucklehead were torn apart by the critics. A lot of them made sure to take shots at the WWE. This will never stop.

The boom periods in pro wrestling come and go. We're not on the verge of one right now, but I wouldn't be surprised if another came along in the distant future.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

It is in a way. But it is in a sense justified. It only seems to be that certain stars and not the business as a whole benefit from this lack of stigma at certain times, and the particular stars who have all benefitted have all been megastars. Stone cold is in movies now, the rock has had a fairly good acting career thus far, hulk hogan is recognised worldwide and even to some extent mick foley has had relative success as an author, in some very minor way diminishing the stigma of all wrestlers as "dumb hicks".

But the least successful of all these would be mick, and his career by many wrestlers standards, is almost legendary. It's not as if when the rock was in the scorpion king, people who knew nothing about wrestling and just had a stigma about it would look at guys like raven and say well that guy is clearly normal, although we all kow he is somewhat of a genius.

In terms of how the WWE film company influences the opinions of those outside wrestling. Well all I can say is stone cold is a terrible actor so he isn't helping. I think the only guy who looks like a great representative for the sport is the rock, and he is trying as hard as he can to sever any ties he has, so that looks really bad for the sport.

The next time that the wrestling stigma is replaced by the recognition of a man as an actual normal human being, it will because of one star and not the whole company as a whole. I guess when you've got ric flair and mick foley beatng each other to bloody stumps with no real payoff, you can sortof understand why people don't look at wrestlers as being "normal".

 

[roadkill_]

Those three films failed because they were pure shit. 12 Rounds was like watching Die Hard with a Vengeance while being repeatedly kicked in the balls.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

When did the stigma of pro wrestling ever go away is what I'd like to know. For decades, there have been and there always will be people that look upon pro wrestling as being silly or low brow no matter how popular it gets. WWE's popularity can't be doubted when you look at the fact Raw & SD!, Raw especially, as they're two of the top drawing shows on cable. It's not uncommon for much of the year for Raw to be the #1 show on cable. But, no matter what happens, there'll always be people that simply don't take wrestling seriously.

One problem with movies like The Condemned, The Marine & 12 Rounds is that they're just simply bad movies. I'm as much a fan of Stone Cold Steve Austin as anybody, but his acting ability as shown in The Condemned was beyond wooden. Same with Cena in The Marine & 12 Rounds. I give the WWE credit for trying to actually expand their influence. Hey, who wouldn't like to make more money right? The problem is that the WWE has mainly attempted to get these films over by having their name attached to it instead of having the movies actually be good.

Legendary wasn't a great film, but I do believe that it was a good step in the right direction for the WWE. Danny Glover isn't exactly a household name anymore and Patricia Clarkson isn't either, but they're two acclaimed actors that agreed to do the movie because they liked the script. The WWE made a movie with a half decent story about it and some decent performances.

 

[dman1373]

i don't ever remember seeing a great movie with a former wrestler staring in it. Not once. Its because they are wrestlers. If they were good actors then with the crotch of being ex wrestlers, they could get really good scripts. They are shitty action or family comedy stars. Thats it. If any of you can find me a movie with a wrestler as the star thats good, then i will light my house on fire.

 

[Eyebrows]

The stigma is there but you can't judge it based on WWE films. They don't do well because they're not that good. If they produced a good film I'm sure it'd do well.

Look at The Wrestler and the accolades that got. Rourke used up his box-office draw in the '80s and The Wrestler made him a star again. It pushed Aronofsky from indie darling into a guy that's directing an upcoming Wolverine film, and all of it centred around pro-wrestling. I think people who deride pro-wrestling should watch that film.

The box-office is a poor indicator of what makes a good film, though.

 

[Hollywood Naitch]

When did the stigma of pro wrestling ever go away is what I'd like to know. For decades, there have been and there always will be people that look upon pro wrestling as being silly or low brow no matter how popular it gets. WWE's popularity can't be doubted when you look at the fact Raw & SD!, Raw especially, as they're two of the top drawing shows on cable. It's not uncommon for much of the year for Raw to be the #1 show on cable. But, no matter what happens, there'll always be people that simply don't take wrestling seriously.

I dont think the "stigma" has ever gone away, but I think its back more than it has been for a few years. Even amongst my friends, who were all wrestling fans in the late 90s when we were younger, mention wrestling and you get laughed at or they say how much it sucks.

Same with most older people, they simply do not like wrestling and class it as childish entertainment with bad acting and fake fighting. If they see a film advertised as being made by WWE films, they will immediately (deliberately or not) have a negative opinion as to how good the film is/isnt.

Simply put, apart from The Condemmed and 12 Rounds, every other WWE film has sucked dick. The original Marine with John Cena was just about watchable but the rest have been fucking awful. If they are going to continue making movies, (and in my opinion they shouldnt, and should focus on making the wrestling better) then they just need to make better films and eventually some critic will look past the negative stigma surrounding the WWE and judge the film on what it is. Knucklehead and Marine 2 got shit ratings because they sucked as well as being a WWE film, but if they were actually decent, I think the reviews (while still being a little harsh as its a WWE production) would be better.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

The box-office is a poor indicator of what makes a good film, though.

^^ This. Hell film critics are a poor indicator of what to watch as well really. You're listening to another guy's opinions and taste. We're individuals; we aren't going to like the same things.

As far as the wrestling stigma being back, it never left. People just don't get psyched up for a WWE Films production. Not as much as they would for slightly mediocre industries like Lions Gate and Platinum Dunes anyways. The cash cow is the big names; WWE has a legacy that has gone unrivaled for the past 10 or so years. But MGM they are not. Most of it has to do with the acting, and the baby company that is WWE Films plays a role too.

What is the difference between Rocky 3, The Scorpion King, and a movie like Knuckleheads? Marketting. You are catering to the masses when you enter the world of movies; not just your homegrown fanbase either. That, and people knew who The Rock or Hogan were and didn't even watch wrestling. They were that big.

So publicity, marketting, and acting are the reasons why I figure the stigma is still there. Your average joe is more likely to buy into a movie if it has a fresh story and not some wrestler dude.