"I'm sorry, there simply is not enough time for us to give you to get over"

[Pepe Silvia]

OP: "You know. You have 6 Fucking hours of original programming a week. 6 entire hours of original programming. How can there not be enough time to grant to the Midcard (who rarely speak) or even to the Divas (who never speak) to get themselves over?"

I'm getting sick and tired of hearing this. Everyone talks about "6 hours of programming" Like they actually air, well, 6 hours. Wrestling has about as many commercials as a football game. I can safely say that about 1/4th of EACH show is commercials. That's an hour and a half.

Maybe it's a little less, but if you total up all the commer--OH, THAT REMINDS ME. All the vignettes about the thing happening on other shows. They're not long, but they're on each show. You know, reminding the people watching RAW that "Batista hurted ReyRey omg Cena get him HE'S A BAD MAN."

I personally feel that The 'E won't be able to give wrestlers time on RAW til the celebrity hosts are gone. ...But what about SD? Sure they're pushing Ziggler... Morrison.. ...Actually, that's fine in my eyes.

Now, factor out Superstars completely. That's not really an interview segment kinna thing. It's must an extra match or three.

I do agree that there isn't enough time on RAW to push new superstars, sans Kofi, due to the current state of RAW as a whole. Although, I do have one solution to end this...

Guest Host Janet Jackson!

Sidenote: The next time I hear an announcer call the Divas 'Smart, Sexy, and Powerful...'

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

OP: "You know. You have 6 Fucking hours of original programming a week. 6 entire hours of original programming. How can there not be enough time to grant to the Midcard (who rarely speak) or even to the Divas (who never speak) to get themselves over?"

I'm getting sick and tired of hearing this. Everyone talks about "6 hours of programming" Like they actually air, well, 6 hours. Wrestling has about as many commercials as a football game. I can safely say that about 1/4th of EACH show is commercials. That's an hour and a half.

Maybe it's a little less, but if you total up all the commer--OH, THAT REMINDS ME. All the vignettes about the thing happening on other shows. They're not long, but they're on each show. You know, reminding the people watching RAW that "Batista hurted ReyRey omg Cena get him HE'S A BAD MAN."

I personally feel that The 'E won't be able to give wrestlers time on RAW til the celebrity hosts are gone. ...But what about SD? Sure they're pushing Ziggler... Morrison.. ...Actually, that's fine in my eyes.

Now, factor out Superstars completely. That's not really an interview segment kinna thing. It's must an extra match or three.

I do agree that there isn't enough time on RAW to push new superstars, sans Kofi, due to the current state of RAW as a whole. Although, I do have one solution to end this...

Guest Host Janet Jackson!

Sidenote: The next time I hear an announcer call the Divas 'Smart, Sexy, and Powerful...'

Oh, you can get sick of hearing it all you want to. Personally, I get sick of hearing that Vince and company can't develop stars and they can't figure out why. You want to know why? Some of us are hitting on the WHY in this thread, and doing a damn good job at it, too.

The fact of the matter is that people in this thread have already presented various suggestions to actually help afford some time these guys and Divas actually need to help get over.

Such as:


1) Reducing the amount of mic time given to the regulars who don't need the mic time:

The ten, fifteen, and 20 minute segments given to the same people, who say the same things on the mic every single week .... like: Cena, Orton, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Jericho, and so forth (and that is just Raw)

Instead, simply have most of them just wrestle. As long as they appear, but the double appearances (1 for mic time, and then later for a match) are not needed.


2) Get rid of the Raw recap segments

3) Getting rid of the other recaps played when WWE comes back from commercial

4) Shortening the entrances of some talent

5) Eliminate some video packages

6) For Smackdown, ECW, and Superstars - maybe it's time to get rid of the Raw Recap since that is the primary show most people watch anyway. That way the talent on those shows has more time.

7) Air pre-recorded 30 second segments during the matches of talent that usually doesn't speak, to at least give them some sense of character or personality.


I don't want to hear the bullshit about the commercials. I know the commercials are an obstacle. But what I essentially see provided from people like you are excuses. In business, excuses are unacceptable. And in this case, it is no different. It's called working with what you have to work with, and working smarter.

And WWE has ample opportunities to make adjustments to work with what they have and re-organize some things around so the undercard talent can actually get over and be developed. They plain and simply aren't doing them.

 

[tapey1brad]

While I don't disagree with most of the things in this thread.
I do believe the main reason top guys don't "just wrestle" every Monday is to build anticipation for their match on PPV.
Why would I buy the PPV if I watch DX wrestle for free on Mondays?
I think it goes back to "why are these guys fighting?" discussion.
It seems like top guys can't just have a match for the sake of having a match. It ALWAYS has to revolve around a story or angle.

 

[The Gribbler]

This means that each show has to establish a main event feud, a midcard title feud, and a semi main event. This is half of the show, another quarter of the show is commercial time. We're left with 30 minutes where we need to preview the PPV and do a Raw Rebound segment. Now, we're left with fifteen minutes of TV time to get 40 guys on each show over.

But the WWE used to be able to promote a whole roster with just RAW during the attitude era before Smackdown! Came into being...

It's just the WWE not prioritizing their matches, so far as I am concerned, I need to hear a midcard promo and see the lower card getting over far more then I need to see a replay of RAW. Thats what superstars, afterburn and the experience are for (all three of which I get here in Australia on one network or another) If the main event promo shit is done right I don't need them to go over the PPV again...with the time they waste on the guest host shit I could see a whole midcard promo and I wouldn't feel like I just wasted my time.

There is more than enough time, the WWE just needs to decide what is truly important...

Just My Opinion

 

[JJYanks121]

I'm tired of this. I'm tired of all of it. How many times can you blame one man for everything? When in doubt, blame Vince, Stephanie, and maybe HHH for everything you find wrong with the WWE.

Don't blame the talent themselves for not presenting ideas. Don't blame the talent for being boring and lifeless. Don't blame the talent for coming up with nothing as to where their character could go. And don't blame the talent for just showing up and doing what they are told. Blame Vince!

Seriously, it's a bit ridiculous already. The midcard talent is getting more TV time than ever. Guys like Swagger, Miz, Kofi, Sheamus, and even Evan Bourne are getting more TV time than ever these days. The first 4 specifically are getting time to create a character for themselves, pick their wardrobes, create dialogue, and their angles are selling to the point where since Wrestlemania, the midcard titles have been on PPV more than once! This is a vast improvement, but yet, we are still complaining. If you are a young talent and you want to make an impact, you go in, make yourself a regular and everything, make your face known to creative and continue to push them with ideas for your character/persona. You have to constantly be in their ear and the time you do get on tv or at house shows, make the most of it. THAT is how you get over. The majority of time will always be spent on angles that will appear on PPV. This is a PPV driven business. People forget that because there's a lot of wrestling on TV, but the money is made on Pay Per View. However, not everyone can settle their scores on PPV because there isn't enough time there. We all understand that. We should also understand that you EARN a spot on PPVs, it isn't handed to you.

I think some posters are under some sort of crazy impression that if they like someone, that person should get like 20 minutes of TV time or something. There are A LOT of people to get on TV and most shows, everyone makes an appearance. My buddy and I try and figure out who is not on each Raw that we watch. Usually it's very few guys. Generally it's Carlito and maybe Masters that aren't on, but most guys get an appearance. To even be on TV is an honor and a privilege and something that most in the industry don't get. If you are privileged enough to get that opportunity, your job is to find a way to make the fans care, whether you have a match, 10 seconds of promo time, or 10 minutes.

Enough is enough though with the "not enough time" stuff. ANY amount of time is enough time, so if you are on, make the most of it. Those who do, earn more time like Kofi, Swagger and Miz on Raw. Those who don't make much of it like Carlito (who was in US title matches a couple of months ago and now isn't on TV) do not get time. It's that simple. The guys who were main eventers in our favorite time, the attitude era earned their spots. Many took crappy gimmicks and found something that worked for them. Rocky Maivia, the original Kofi in a way, became the jerky Rock in the Nation of Domination and with every little bit of mic time, stole the show and went on to become "The Great One". The Ringmaster was given a chance to say what he felt after winning King of the Ring and that 30 second promo led to the creation of the face of the attitude era. 30 seconds was all it took.

Bottom line, talent has to earn their spots and earn their time on TV, and with each moment they earn, take it and do as much with it as humanly possible. That is how I live. I make the most of any opportunity I've ever been given. If you guys want to just complain about lack of opportunities, that is your prerogative, but maybe you should take a step back, first realize that the midcard is relevant for the first time in a while, and that guys who earn their TV and PPV time are on your box and those that don't, aren't.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

I'm tired of this. I'm tired of all of it. How many times can you blame one man for everything? When in doubt, blame Vince, Stephanie, and maybe HHH for everything you find wrong with the WWE.

Don't blame the talent themselves for not presenting ideas. Don't blame the talent for being boring and lifeless. Don't blame the talent for coming up with nothing as to where their character could go. And don't blame the talent for just showing up and doing what they are told. Blame Vince!

Seriously, it's a bit ridiculous already. The midcard talent is getting more TV time than ever. Guys like Swagger, Miz, Kofi, Sheamus, and even Evan Bourne are getting more TV time than ever these days. The first 4 specifically are getting time to create a character for themselves, pick their wardrobes, create dialogue, and their angles are selling to the point where since Wrestlemania, the midcard titles have been on PPV more than once! This is a vast improvement, but yet, we are still complaining. If you are a young talent and you want to make an impact, you go in, make yourself a regular and everything, make your face known to creative and continue to push them with ideas for your character/persona. You have to constantly be in their ear and the time you do get on tv or at house shows, make the most of it. THAT is how you get over. The majority of time will always be spent on angles that will appear on PPV. This is a PPV driven business. People forget that because there's a lot of wrestling on TV, but the money is made on Pay Per View. However, not everyone can settle their scores on PPV because there isn't enough time there. We all understand that. We should also understand that you EARN a spot on PPVs, it isn't handed to you.

I think some posters are under some sort of crazy impression that if they like someone, that person should get like 20 minutes of TV time or something. There are A LOT of people to get on TV and most shows, everyone makes an appearance. My buddy and I try and figure out who is not on each Raw that we watch. Usually it's very few guys. Generally it's Carlito and maybe Masters that aren't on, but most guys get an appearance. To even be on TV is an honor and a privilege and something that most in the industry don't get. If you are privileged enough to get that opportunity, your job is to find a way to make the fans care, whether you have a match, 10 seconds of promo time, or 10 minutes.

Enough is enough though with the "not enough time" stuff. ANY amount of time is enough time, so if you are on, make the most of it. Those who do, earn more time like Kofi, Swagger and Miz on Raw. Those who don't make much of it like Carlito (who was in US title matches a couple of months ago and now isn't on TV) do not get time. It's that simple. The guys who were main eventers in our favorite time, the attitude era earned their spots. Many took crappy gimmicks and found something that worked for them. Rocky Maivia, the original Kofi in a way, became the jerky Rock in the Nation of Domination and with every little bit of mic time, stole the show and went on to become "The Great One". The Ringmaster was given a chance to say what he felt after winning King of the Ring and that 30 second promo led to the creation of the face of the attitude era. 30 seconds was all it took.

Bottom line, talent has to earn their spots and earn their time on TV, and with each moment they earn, take it and do as much with it as humanly possible. That is how I live. I make the most of any opportunity I've ever been given. If you guys want to just complain about lack of opportunities, that is your prerogative, but maybe you should take a step back, first realize that the midcard is relevant for the first time in a while, and that guys who earn their TV and PPV time are on your box and those that don't, aren't.

You made a good argument about making the most of what you got. Unfortunately, I can't really agree with 95% of it.

And the reason I can't is because there is a BIG difference between simply being allotted time ... and being allotted "mic time", which is specifically what the critique of the thread is. Nobody is saying that people don't get time. Do they get the time where it counts, though? And that is on the mic.

A wrestler will be given X amount of minutes to go out there and do a segment. Unfortunately, they can not simply do whatever they want to do with that time. They are told straight down to a T what they are going to do. So, if they are told they are simply going to have a match, then that is all they can do. They will not be granted mic time unless they are told.

However, mic time is what talent needs in order to establish that connection with the audience. That is MORE important than match time.

Why? Because it is that "putting the cart before the horse" mentality that we have talked about for quite some time on here. In order for the audience to get involved and become emotionally invested in your match, they must first actually care about you as a performer. That won't happen unless the talent is able to develop a personality and a character with the audience.

Also, in the backstage area, it has been made quite clear that the environment is not as simple as the talent being pests and bugging the right people backstage, until they get their time. Just the opposite. Today's WWE environment is that you are NOT encouraged to go up to the Creative team to have input in your character. Rather, they come to you when they are ready. Things are quite different from the Attitude Era where that type of mentality was actually encouraged.

So if:

1) Creative does not want you to approach them unless they approach you
2) Won't give you time to speak on the mic
3) Doesn't work towards developing your character whatsoever


Then how are you expected to simply get over on in-ring work? Provide a list of the most successful WWE superstars, and how many of them got over more so with their ring work as opposed to the characters they portrayed and their mic abilities. Run down the Hulk Hogans, Steve Austins, The Rocks, the Dusty Rhodes and so forth ... and how many of those guys were able to connect with the audience more due to their in-ring work, as opposed to their characters and segments on the mic?

As long as the WWE is run as tight-shipped as it is with Creative, it gives essentially no leeway to the performers at all to get over, other than what Creative permits you. And if you think that talent should be able to make that connection based solely on what they do in the ring with the 5 minute match they may be allotted each week, and nothing else, well then I don't know what else to say.

There have been several proposals in this thread of how to rectify the problem. All of them have been excellent suggestions.

WWE did not have problems in the past with giving time on the mic to all aspects of the card. Hell, even Kai-en-tai got mic time back then. If that could be done then, then there is NO excuse why it can't be done today.

The problem is with what the time is being spent on. Break down the format of the shows, which is the same every single week, and one can clearly see that there are numerous time wasters across the board, which is taking up unnecessary time in the broadcasts, which instead could be allotted to numerous performers, who are simply trying to catch a break and connect with the audience.

Let's take pre-recorded segments to air during the talent's match, for instance. If the talent is having a match anyway, and this 30 second clip airs during that same match, then what is the problem with why this can't be done? The same thing was done on Superstars, Wrestling Challenge, and Raw in the past. Where is the harm? 30 seconds during a match with a pre-recorded clip so the wrestler can at least get some mic time to develop some sort of character.

 

[SinCityBlitz]

I'm tired of this. I'm tired of all of it. How many times can you blame one man for everything? When in doubt, blame Vince, Stephanie, and maybe HHH for everything you find wrong with the WWE.

Don't blame the talent themselves for not presenting ideas. Don't blame the talent for being boring and lifeless. Don't blame the talent for coming up with nothing as to where their character could go. And don't blame the talent for just showing up and doing what they are told. Blame Vince!

Seriously, it's a bit ridiculous already. The midcard talent is getting more TV time than ever. Guys like Swagger, Miz, Kofi, Sheamus, and even Evan Bourne are getting more TV time than ever these days. The first 4 specifically are getting time to create a character for themselves, pick their wardrobes, create dialogue, and their angles are selling to the point where since Wrestlemania, the midcard titles have been on PPV more than once! This is a vast improvement, but yet, we are still complaining. If you are a young talent and you want to make an impact, you go in, make yourself a regular and everything, make your face known to creative and continue to push them with ideas for your character/persona. You have to constantly be in their ear and the time you do get on tv or at house shows, make the most of it. THAT is how you get over. The majority of time will always be spent on angles that will appear on PPV. This is a PPV driven business. People forget that because there's a lot of wrestling on TV, but the money is made on Pay Per View. However, not everyone can settle their scores on PPV because there isn't enough time there. We all understand that. We should also understand that you EARN a spot on PPVs, it isn't handed to you.

I think some posters are under some sort of crazy impression that if they like someone, that person should get like 20 minutes of TV time or something. There are A LOT of people to get on TV and most shows, everyone makes an appearance. My buddy and I try and figure out who is not on each Raw that we watch. Usually it's very few guys. Generally it's Carlito and maybe Masters that aren't on, but most guys get an appearance. To even be on TV is an honor and a privilege and something that most in the industry don't get. If you are privileged enough to get that opportunity, your job is to find a way to make the fans care, whether you have a match, 10 seconds of promo time, or 10 minutes.

Enough is enough though with the "not enough time" stuff. ANY amount of time is enough time, so if you are on, make the most of it. Those who do, earn more time like Kofi, Swagger and Miz on Raw. Those who don't make much of it like Carlito (who was in US title matches a couple of months ago and now isn't on TV) do not get time. It's that simple. The guys who were main eventers in our favorite time, the attitude era earned their spots. Many took crappy gimmicks and found something that worked for them. Rocky Maivia, the original Kofi in a way, became the jerky Rock in the Nation of Domination and with every little bit of mic time, stole the show and went on to become "The Great One". The Ringmaster was given a chance to say what he felt after winning King of the Ring and that 30 second promo led to the creation of the face of the attitude era. 30 seconds was all it took.

Bottom line, talent has to earn their spots and earn their time on TV, and with each moment they earn, take it and do as much with it as humanly possible. That is how I live. I make the most of any opportunity I've ever been given. If you guys want to just complain about lack of opportunities, that is your prerogative, but maybe you should take a step back, first realize that the midcard is relevant for the first time in a while, and that guys who earn their TV and PPV time are on your box and those that don't, aren't.

Great post. It's like every week we get a new reason why the WWE is failing yet last time I checked they were doing pretty damn good.

Like you said the mid card guys are getting plenty of time to get themselves over. But I have a feeling that even if they were given an open mic a week later we would have a topic like"why are they giving the worthless mid-carders the mic so much." It will never end because people like to bitch to make themselves feel important.

I could run down a list of things wrong with the WWE right now and and none of 1-10 would involve the mid carders because that is the one area where they are doing their job.

 

[Shadowmancer]

I'm going to assume that this comes down from a post I made about Yoshi Tatsu. And about how there is not enough time in ECW for him to get over with his gimmick. I thought I explained my position and the general position that is involved in this case. Anyway here goes.

ECW has an hour time slot on TV lets be reasonable and say that it is more like 45 minutes with ad breaks. This is me working off what I can see in New Zealand and that fills up an hour. Now ECW has a Champion, right now that happens to be Christian, he is guaranteed a slot on the show, whether talking or a match often times both. Why would that be, its because he is the face of the brand, so lets give him roughly 10 minutes for a match and promo, probably more reasonable to be 15-20 minutes. So now the show has somewhere between 35 and 25 minutes left for other things. Within that time I allotted to Christian is stuff to do with his major storyline. They generally have two other matches, generally about 5-8 minutes in length, sometimes longer. Using the lower end of the assumption for time left that means that means 9 to 15 minutes remaining. Lets take out 3-5 minutes for the RAW rebound. shrinking the amount of time left again to 4 and 12 minutes. That leaves roughly 4 minutes without counting the Commentators doing a recap of the show and storylines for a second angle that the writers want to get over in any one show.

Now this is all hypothetical but it does show that a standard formatted ECW has very little time for wrestlers to get over on anything other than their matches. The personality aspect comes later when they are "promoted" to Smackdown or Raw, where there is the ability to be more lenient with a guy that they want to get over with promos and the like, if the powers that be decide to give that chance to them.

Personally I would love them to take Jericho's way and just go to a room with a camera and work with it to get better even though it may not get shown on TV it will get the attention of the higher ups of a person that is willing to work on something and it may get them more time on TV to develop into a fan favourite or a out and out heel.

 

[Toroc102]

“I'm tired of this. I'm tired of all of it. How many times can you blame one man for everything? When in doubt, blame Vince, Stephanie, and maybe HHH for everything you find wrong with the WWE.“

As long as we know their the ones in charge. I mean if things suck at work aren’t the bosses the ones that have to get the blame?, it all starts at the top. And it’s obvious Vince has all the power in the WWE, it is not a democracy, Vince has the final say on everything, veto power on everything, and the power to fire anyone, there is no board of directors.

“The midcard talent is getting more TV time than ever. Guys like Swagger, Miz, Kofi, Sheamus, and even Evan Bourne are getting more TV time than ever these days. The first 4 specifically are getting time to create a character for themselves, pick their wardrobes, create dialogue, and their angles are selling to the point where since Wrestlemania, the midcard titles have been on PPV more than once!”

Really? All it seems to me is that they just replaced the previous mid-card scene on Raw, sure these guys are getting more time then ever but its still way less MId-Carders and way more crap than it used to be. We still have D/X on tv about 5 separate times on one Raw putting down whoever closest to them as fast as they can, still have guest hosts that aren’t gonna be their next week taking up about 30 minutes of tv, still have all the completely pointless comedy, pretty soon Dibiase and Big Shows movies will come out, which means about 15 minutes of each show devoted to promoting two movies most of us will never see.

“If you are a young talent and you want to make an impact, you go in, make yourself a regular and everything, make your face known to creative and continue to push them with ideas for your character/persona. You have to constantly be in their ear and the time you do get on tv or at house shows, make the most of it.”

I’ve seen countless stars do this only to get jobbed out to the next monster heel, who always get their spots handed to them. Why does everyone else have to work so hard just to get squashed as soon as the newest pet project comes by. You talk to someone the wrong way in the back and you’re back at square one.

“I think some posters are under some sort of crazy impression that if they like someone, that person should get like 20 minutes of TV time or something. There are A LOT of people to get on TV and most shows, everyone makes an appearance.”

The thing is the Main-Eventers DON’T need to be on every show for the same amount of time every time. Absence makes the heart grow fonder. UT isn’t on TV for like half the PPV’s he’s on. Back in the day Hogan wasn’t on WcW every night and that just made me want to watch the next one more. You never knew when Crow Sting was gonna show up and it made him one of the biggest wrestlers ever. Hell the man didn’t even have a SINGLE match or say a SINGLE word for 18 months and he probably could‘ve outsold anyone in the entire company. If some midcarder that I barely care about anyway doesn’t have a significant role on TV frequently then they get forgotten and their heat gets lost. It’s the same reason that you promote the return of Main-Eventers from an injury and not mid-carders, you have to get people to care about them first, if they aren’t getting over then its Vince’s job to make sure they do get over.

“To even be on TV is an honor and a privilege and something that most in the industry don't get. If you are privileged enough to get that opportunity, your job is to find a way to make the fans care, whether you have a match, 10 seconds of promo time, or 10 minutes.”

The first few times it happens its an honor and a privilege, after that if you get deemphasized on tv you get deemphasized in the minds of the fans. I think most fans even non IWC’ers know this in their subconscious. Its called getting buried for a reason.

“The Ringmaster was given a chance to say what he felt after winning King of the Ring and that 30 second promo led to the creation of the face of the attitude era. 30 seconds was all it took.”

For one thing that promo was about 2 minutes long. For another, it was on a PPV after he’d finished winning the KOTR for christs sake he'd just gone over atleast 3 other guys in one night, Stone Cold was already damn sure in for a push and that promo was ok’d with Vince for sure, now a days obviously you couldn’t cut that promo since hey, their pg now. The Rock had already won the IC Title as smiling Rocky Maivia. Obviously they had plans for him too.

 

[Pepe Silvia]

1) Reducing the amount of mic time given to the regulars who don't need the mic time:

...Ehh... This could be good and bad. I'll go into more detail later. Ahm tired and got class later. I do agree we need less DX + Cena segments, but I rather enjoy the Legacy ones between the three of them. But a lot of people tune in just to see Cena these days...


2) Get rid of the Raw recap segments

This is pretty much mandatory. They have a website that gets... Ballpark figure. 50 million hits a day? Probably way off but it's 5 AM and I don't really care. All they need is a quick pop: "....After Kofi defaced Orton's NASCAR! Visit WWE.com for more details, photos, and videos on the latest RAW!" Bam. Done. And then people see the ads on the side of the page, OOH A SALE ON DX GEAR. And the 'E makes more money on merchandise. New stars get more possibilites for segments. Everybody wins.

3) Getting rid of the other recaps played when WWE comes back from commercial

EXCEPT for the "During the break, X did Y to regain control over Z in this match!" Yeah. The only time I'd argue this was the Sheamus match. That deserved it, just for the selling of the PB by Noble. That was vicious. The kiddies are gonna hate this guy.

4) Shortening the entrances of some talent
...Other than Taker's enterance, these aren't really long enough to make a significant cut in the runtime. Minute each, minute and a half?

5) Eliminate some video packages

Vince will never do this. He wants money. I won't say need. He WANTS it.

6) For Smackdown, ECW, and Superstars - maybe it's time to get rid of the Raw Recap since that is the primary show most people watch anyway. That way the talent on those shows has more time.

I'd get rid of them on ECW and Superstars, and most of then on SD, except do one the week before the PPV. Especially the Big Four. Either that, or WWE makes a Weekly Recap other than the WTF... They might have one. I don't visit WWE.com unless I missed a show.

7) Air pre-recorded 30 second segments during the matches of talent that usually doesn't speak, to at least give them some sense of character or personality.

...This would cause the announcers to have to shut up. dude, I'm 200% for this. I can't stand any of the announce teams anymore. I don't know why.


I personally want to thank you for not saying "Making the matches shorter." That's the one thing they DON'T need to do. Without interview segments and the like, playing out your character is the one way to become someone. One thing which would give about a total of 2 minutes to the show, which is negligible, but still a factor: That "JOBBERTHEGREAT IS MAKING HIS WAY TO THE RING, HE'LL BE IN ACTION... NEXT!"

Two sidenotes: 1. You mind if I use your "WWE Shareholders" term? :3

MODERATOR COMMENTS (Lord Sidious)

No, you are more than welcome to use the "WWE Shareholder" term. I'd have PM'ed you, but you have your PM's turned off.

Anyone can feel free to use the term, without permission. We'll know what you are talking about.

2. I got bored and discovered this one day: There are a few quicklinks to a Show's page on WWE.com. Raw = wweraw.com, ECW = ECW.com, and SD! is smackdown.com

 

[Tastycles]

The problem is that the WWE has a habit of making sure every single main guy get on the mic every week. This is a serious problem when you have, say, Cena, Orton and DX all in different feuds because it means that they will, between them and their opponents, take about an hour of TV time in the ring and on the mic.

The problem means that you end up with a single midcard at a time push, which is ******ed to say the least. What they should be doing is having, say DX on the mic, Cena in the ring and Orton beating someone up or something. They're all on TV, but their combined time reduces to say 35 minutes, giving vital additional time for devlopment of both Miz and Swagger instead of just one for example.

The vast majority of stars coming through in recent years have been fine in the ring but shit on the mic, because they don't get to practice. Morrison, Punk as a face, Jeff Hardy etc. would all have benefitted from being given serious mic time 3 years ago.

The situation on ECW is improving that, because just about everyone gets mic time there, but it doesn't fix it forever. The WWE absolutely need to have they're main eventers on every show, but giving them mic time, segment time and match time is overexposure.

Jack Swagger would benefit a hell of a lot more from a backstage interview with Josh Matthews than he ever would from beating guys like Primo Colon. This is one of those problems that's easily solvable, as has been proven by ECW and, to a lesser extent, in Smackdown, but never will be in the immediate future.

In short, all you need to do is reduce the total exposure of the main eventers, ensuring that they are on TV but not necessarily fighting, give variation to what midcarders do, e.g. talk one week, fight the next, and finally, give more attention to those that aren't over. It can be done, and I think Smackdown is heading in the right direction - neither Batista, Mysterio nor Undertaker actually had a match last week, I don't think, and some lesser lights got mic time, but it wasn't quite there.

 

[Audioslave]

This thread is utterly and completely false.

If anything, the younger guys on the show have been given MORE promo opportunities. Miz, Kingston, Jack Swagger, CM Punk, Paul Burchill, Sheamus, Morrison, Shelton, Cryme Tyme, etc. Regal's gotten much more promo time than he has had in years. Ron Killings sometimes gets time to shine. Drew McIntyre, Matt Hardy, Jeff Hardy.

This may have been true a few years ago, but as of the past year or so it's been remedied.

The only problems they're having, it seems, are with the buyrates going down. It could be the economy, it could be that the product (even with young guys getting mic time) is stale and unimaginative. And, unlike what JJYanks said, it's not so much the talent, but the feuds, angles and stuff that creative gives them. It mostly feels like a stale product. There's no reason to tune in week to week. There's no "must see" feel to their programming.

 

[Pepper Wadman]

This is quite simple really but I wont go into much detail because I will no doubt be referred to as a WWE Shareholder and forced to leave through insults.

The simple answer is:

WWE is entertainment. It's not a sport. It's not even Sports Entertainment.

Vince said it himself it is simply entertainment. To Vince it's not about giving new stars time (which, I agree Sidious. It makes absolutely no sense coming from a wrestling fan's perspective... Vince is indeed killing the sport we all knew and loved) HOWEVER, it's more about whats popular and whats over already.

WWE reminds me of Saturday Night Live or the later years of MAD TV. They relied too much on re-occurring characters. Like the annoying Stewart. Basically it was just feeding us the stuff people popped to or reacted to. Basically they seen that it had worked before and therefore will inevitably work again.

Look at the Guest GM every week. The comedy skits that are worse than anything done in the attitude era. 40 year old members of DX. This sport is a joke and is simply not meant to be taken seriously because Vince finds this crap funny.

Why people wake up, log into wrestlezone and try and pick it apart each night is beyond me. Maybe to give themselves something to cling onto. Some kind of end result. Like those who cling to Religion because of a fear of death. It's like they want to know why they watch bullshit wrestling each week on tv and they will stop at nothing to come up with ANYTHING to satisfy this thirst for the truth... come to think of it, my Religion reference seems to not apply here after looking back.

Reality is, Vince seems to think he knows what it takes to run a successful wrestling promotion and he is doing it his way. With bad comedy skits and guest hosts, Jillian singing despite already being over (remind you of any characters on SNL or MADTV anyone?), Santino (who is funny BTW), Nascar drivers as General Managers???? 40 year old main eventers STILL hogging that world championship... sorry... both world championships.

WWE films? Come on.

Edit: I'm aware Cena is currently holding the WWE title but more or less it's Trips or Taker. Orton seems to get his hands on it often but when I think of either world title I'm left thinking: Triple H or Undertaker.

 

[school-of-hard-knocks]

To me this comes down to the problem of characters vs. personas. Wrestling characters are rapidly being killed off in favor of personas. Think about it. John Cena is the hero, Orton is the crazy violent guy, Rey is the small guy, Batista is the Animal and I could go on. Those are the most bland descriptions I could think of. Tell me: other than Taker and Punk, what actual A-list people have characters? We know what their archetype is but no specifics or anything about them. This to me is a product of the post Attitude Era. Once we got done with that time where everything was over the top and insane, we shifted into the 2002-2006 era where everything was dumbed down for us. Evolution was the real beginning of people not having characters. You just had the past, present and future of wrestling. Cena was a rapper and that's about it.

Now, what caused this change? Yeah I'd agree promo time had a lot to do with it. However it's not directly the lack of promo time I'm looking at, but rather the insane amount of promo time that the main guys get. People like HHH, Shawn, Orton, Jericho etc. don't need to get over with the crowd anymore as they already are. However, those people get the most time on the mic and in front of the camera. Why? Those people are well established and popular/hated, so it's not like they need to really say a lot. So many shows start with one of those guys in the rign talking for 10-15 minutes to just set up the show for that night. That's 1/8th or 12.5% of your whole show dedicated to a handful of characters, not counting the time that they'll get in the ring later. Let's say there's two matches announced at the beginning of the show: Shawn vs. Orton and Cena vs. Jericho. All of those guys are over, but if you use 16 minutes to set those matches up, fifteen for each match counting intros (that's being generous too), that's 45 minutes gone for 4 people, leaving about 75 minutes for the entire roster to use, not counting the segments/promos in the back during the show. That's possibly nearly half the show dedicated to people that we already know, that are already over and that flat out don't need this time. And if Vince is there too, he'll eat up a ton of time. Throw in an absolutely pointless Divas match which is going to happen and be no different than last week's, and the midcard and lower card guys have about an hour to have 15 guys have promos, matches, intros etc. We'll ignore the recaps, replays and ads/commercials there too, which in reality would give those guys about 30 minutes. See why they're not getting over? The established guys need to shut up for a bit. They're far too developed and we just flat out don't need any more of it.

I don't agree with this. You are reaching in trying to find a difference in between characters and personalities. I'll give you an example, John Cena. He is a hero and a rapper and we know nothing else about him according to you. That is not true. I have never researched Cena in my life yet I know where he is from, that he was a wrestling fan since he was a child, that he started lifting weights when he was 14, what gym he went to, etc, etc, just by watching WWE. They've ran probably 20 different packages about his past and where he comes from.

In the world of pro wrestling you need different personalities. You need the good guys and you need the bad guys. You need people you can agree with and you need people you disagree with. And then they need to be engaged in some kind of a conflict that will attract your attention as a fan. If anything WWE does a good job at this. I've never seen Vince just throw someone out there and tell us to cheer or boo him. There is always a story behind it. Even for a guy like Kofi Kingston who never spoke, WWE ran a month worth of video packages for him before he made his debut.

And ultimately fans are the the ones who decide on who is going to be face or a heel. Take Steve Austin for example. He was supposed to be the ultimate heel. But the fans got behind him. Vince realized he could make more money with him as a face and the rest is history. The same goes for John Cena. He was supposed to be built into the main event heel. But he got over huge with the fans and was turned face because of it. And He's remained a face ever since because he's been making a ton of money for WWE.

Now onto the issue. Should there be more promo time for the midcard wrestlers? It depends. You have to realize that WWE is a business. Most of their decisions are money motivated. So should you give the TV time to someone who won't make money for you? It is not as simple as some people try to make it look like. DX makes money. Cena makes money. Undertaker makes money. Rey Mysterio makes money. So these are the people who WWE will spend most of their time on. Then there are people like Orton, Jericho, Big Show, CM Punk, and now Batista who are the top heels and they get a lot of TV time because their job is to get the people whom they are feuding over.

So if someone is to get the TV time and time on the mic there has to be some kind of a stock invested in them. This is why Miz has so much time on the mic. Morrison has been getting a ton lately as well. Drew McIntyre has been getting the mic. These are people who are gonna get the main event spot soon. And WWE is building them up for it. The bottom line is, whether you like it or not unless a given wrestler has a main event potential he will not receive a lot of time on the mic.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

I agree that mic time for each performer is important..... But what happens if the wrestler don't have the mic skills to get over with the fans!

Well, most of them probably won't have to worry about it anyway since apparently Vince now feels that only the Main Event guys should really be allowed to speak, anyway. So if you aren't Main Event, you aren't going to be doing much talking anyway.

But also, in the past, that was one of the key functions of a ringside manager and that were used for. Unfortunately, Vince is too cheap to want to pay for them.

But that's for another thread.

At the same time, I have to question what they bother doing in FCW. By the time they graduate from FCW, they should have a grasp of some basic mic skills.

And then, they could be able to work towards developing them on ECW.

 

[Pepe Silvia]

Funny that you mention FCW. Why don't they put a few FCW episodes on WWE.com or something? That way they could get a better feel for who the fans can, will, and are getting behind. Maybe do a poll around WM asking the fans who they'd like to see come up from FCW.

 

[JJYanks121]

This is a point I am going to agree with you on, Sidious. FCW an ECW for that matter are minor league outlets where performers who are contracted to the WWE have a chance to learn "the WWE way". Moreso than any other wrestling outlet, this means to develop an ability to sell a feud verbally and non verbally before ever taking part in combat. Some guys get it pretty quickly and are out of FCW quicker than others. However, with some guys, it's kind of like bringing up a AAA baseball player who's simply not ready for the pros. He might have the ability to hit the home run or steal bases, but his understanding of the sport and IQ for it is quite low and he has more to learn. Most of those people are sent back to the minors for more training, but that doesn't mean everyone will get it. Sometimes, guys simply won't get the nuances and will simply be talented people with a low ceiling.

As for responses to my post, I'm glad it got people talking and I'm glad I was able to counterpoint to the original argument, but one thing I do want to point out is that none of us truly know what go on behind the scenes. Unless one of us personally knows a wrestler or creative member or something, I gotta think we're all drawing conclusions based on what we read or hear from the internet. I stand by my statement that I believe you have to go above and beyond to get noticed in any facet of life. Last week in reading the HHH interview where he mentioned Sheamus attending Raws when he was an ECW superstar on his own dime just to learn by watching is something that stands out to management. They see a guy, perhaps moreso than other young guys, who is going out of his way to learn how to get better. So this guy makes an impression and gets a shot on Raw quite early in his WWE career. Along with that, he's been given a little mic time. It isn't much, and his accent is hard to follow, but he's doing what he can. On top of what you say, you also have to excel at facial expressions, reactions, acting, emotions, and anything else to sell a match or angle. It's one thing to have a match or to cut a promo, but you can accomplish a lot from what you don't say as well. There's a lot more that goes into being an on screen performer than perhaps we realize usually. I can tell you from being on screen as a sketch comedy player that even with one line is a sketch, you can be the funniest one if your facial expressions, reactions, and non verbal actions are funny. The same applies to verbal confrontation and physical confrontation in wrestling. You have to be aware of everything you are doing out there because the camera picks it all up and the viewer does too.

In terms of whether the young talent has enough time, they've been getting it. I've been seeing a lot of Miz and Swagger and Kofi lately, as well as Sheamus over the last couple of weeks. That's just Raw. Again, you can't fault WWE for giving on screen time to the main eventers because they've earned that spot and they sell. PPV buys are down as it is. If you take away their time and try to sell a PPV on short segments of little significance and give that time to midcarders who may or may not be on the card, what are you accomplishing? I know the answer will be "you are accomplishing a solid future", and I agree that the future is always a concern, but it is balance. You can't push everyone, and you can't push no one. You can't eliminate the veterans and main eventers, and you also can't ignore your young talent. Moreso than the last couple of years, I feel that is the case right now, at least on Raw. Whether any of the upper midcarders ever main event PPVs is up to them and their development. You can disagree with me and tell me that if Vince don't like 'em, they wont' be main eventers, but I'm of the belief that if you work hard and are THAT good, and people want to see you, you will get what you want. Ultimately getting the fans to care about your character is on you when you are out there. If i was a wrestler (and i'm not because I'm a short, skinny Jewish dude), I would be working my tail off and forcing creative's hand to give me angles and storylines and matches. If they ignore me and "push who they wanna push regardless", then that's fine, but I couldnt' live with that unless I tried my hardest to get their attention. The guys who have gotten their attention have also gotten the attention of the crowd, which is why you see the guys you do on TV.

 

[MRA858]

I dont know if this has been said i just skimmed everyones responses. But how about on ECW instead of like 2 matches and recapping the other week programs. and seeing the same thing over and over, you give a guy a lil mic time... since they have the young superstar program... instead of HI IM GUY WHO IS REALLY GLAD TO BE HERE... and i just get tired of seeing recapping on ECW

 

[Southwind]

This is a great thread, how lame no time ? That is flawed at best that's a cop out the WWE has 365 days a year to build new stars just because creative (insert expletive) doesn't mean that the talent is failing.

The way the WWE tries to build up stars now is pathetic, oh lets get Cody Rhodes and Ted Dibiase big ! I know, let's let them hang around Randy Orton have no voice no personality and we will feed them to every babyface they come across !! All that may damage them permanently, and make them a joke but since they are around Orton they will be huge in no time!!

Sarcasm aside, I don't like excuses especially if they suck let's see if there is "no time", then why not take that awesome team of the 40+ year olds DX off the screen. Clearly, one or two less extra segments won't make HHH feel that insignificant right ?

Some older talent needs to step aside and let younger guys work, but that probably won't happen so don't get your hopes up.

Kofi and Orton can be good, but to say the WWE hasn't messed it up, yet like a thread here did is wrong. They did mess it up, Kofi needs to talk more develop more as a character the dumb kick to Orton won't do anything period.

"Not enough time" what a crock, it sickens me how so many have been brainwashed by a tyrant like Vince Mcmahon.