WWE isn't able to create new babyfaces or better I say, new stars?

[Smartie]

The title says it all.

Last year , Lots of new stars were born , but with a few exceptions, they were all common in one point :

The Miz,Sheamus,Nexus,Alberto Del Rio,Dolph Ziggler,Alex Riley,Drew Mcintyre,Dashing Cody Rhodes,Jack Swagger ... and Daniel Bryan+Morrison.

As you see , except the last one , they are all heels.And the sadder point to me is that it seems that the heat they draw is based on A)popularity of their rivals and B)the fact that WWE Universe doesn't know them!

Miz maybe different , but even him has used Cena , Bret hart , Orton Jerry Lawler and Coles's aid to gain the amount of heat he is drawing.And he also helped Bryan and Morrison so he can be called a truly new-born star.

People won't cheer or boo anyone unless they care about them.That's the problem I have with WWE's so-called "Youth Movement".

Last week on Raw , Nexus were alone because absence of Cena , and you could see they draw the least amount of heat ever.

I think the only reason people like ADR,Sheamus and Nexus have done not so bad is because they were facing people like Cena,Mysterio,Orton,HHH and Edge who by the way are built and made a long time ago.

Here the interesting stuff is :

The only way these new-born heels can do good on mic is when they start insulting babyfaces.

I mean there is absolutely zero creation.ADR always says :"My name is ... " and nothing more.Sheamus always talks about he retired HHH and talks proudly of his Irish heritage ,Barret's promos are fine only if there is a Cena in the ring.

Unfortunately and coincidentally , Bryan and Morrison are nothing on the mic except the times they are trash talking about their opponents.

One may say that wrestling's promos are all about trash talking and insulting your opponent , but at the same time , you gotta be creative.I'm gonna beat you , you're a coward and blah blah blah is not impressive anymore.

I think the reason for buyrates or ratings being down is not 'PG' , But it's because these new stars are living on the old guys fame and popularity ,So despite 2010 was a more appealing year to IWC , the mainstream fans who are WWE's main target , have not liked it that much , They liked it even less than 2009 which I think was a crappy year.

The bottom line: People don't give a shit about new stars,and that's the reason you really can't find an answer for :Who's gonna replace Cena and Orton? , and you may never will.

 

[gj2000]

Remember, those stars were only created last year. As WWE fans, we all get a bit impatient sometimes. Sure, some of the stuff i agree with you 100%. But give them time to create TRUE stars. It was very easy for someone to get over in the 90's or attitude era.
Saying 'ass' for example would get you an instant pop. You can't do that today. Making someone bleed back in the day would give you heat/pops etc., which would give credibility to the character. Cant do that today. Smashing someone over the head with a chair would make a devastating impact and sound, with the crowd collectively going "oooo". Cant do that today.
Its very easy to say that they all cant get over, but in an era with screaming little kids rooting for their heroes John Cena and Rey Mysterio, its a little bit harder for a person with a different character other than superman and a heavily based pg character, to get over.
You say the only way heels get over is by insulting baby-faces. Isn't that how all heels get over? The amount of times ive heard Edge insult John Cena, Vickie Guerrerro insult Dolph's opponent etc etc is second to none. Thats just how the business works. Cole insults Bryan. See how much heat he gets?
Mate, the bit where you complain about Alberto Del Rio is rubbish. It actually refutes your argument. By saying that one line, do you know how much heat Del Rio gets. When Del Rio gets out of that Rolls Royce, and cracks that cheeky grin, do you know how much i want to punch his face in? Thats a classic heel at work. And hes only been on Smackdown for just over 6 months.
Sheamus' promos are getting better. The only reason he's saying he put HHH on the shelf, is so that he can gain heat; Heat for putting a 13 time World Champion out of action;who wouldnt hate a person for doing that to Trips? Plus theyre planting the seeds for a potential Sheamus vs HHH feud too.
Wade Barrett's promos are more than fine. He carried the Nexus and dominated NXT. He has been on the main roster for less than a year and yet he is rising in that field.
Saying Bryan cant talk on the mic is a croc. Go and look at some of his ROH stuff.

The youth movement has just begun. Dont jump on the bandwagon just yet and say "WWE cant create new stars". Its not an overnight job. It will take some time to do; to build credibility for the new stars. HHH used to have the blue blood gimmick - You think that got overnight success? Sure, some will fall in the next few years, but give it some time, and your stars will be created

 

[CarlSinclair]

I see your point on their lack of baby face creating however

The entire point of wrestling has always been Heel v Face... Heels have always gotten their heat from beating on/talking smack about babyfaces. Its the rule not the exception.

They are all mostly 'real heel's as well.. no more of the 'cool heel' garbage we lived through in the 90's

 

[Dave]

This is so far off base, it is unreal.

The fact of the matter is that heels get over by feuding with people that are considered faces. The point of getting them over, is so that people will boo them. If a heel is beating on John Cena one week and then Bret Hart the next week, of course they are going to be hated. That is the plan after all. The superstars you have mentioned that these new talents were feuding with should be looked at as tools. Tools to ensure that the new talent gets over. Wrestling is like that. They use other wrestlers to build notoriety and anything to talk about. There is a reason that The Miz and John Morrison have gotten over and it is because they have been given the stage to work their magic. The have beaten some of the best talent and that gets the fans behind them. There is no reason you should be attacking the new talent because they have only feuded with the best talent the WWE has to offer. That is the way of things and it likely won't change... It doesn't have to.

As far as the babyface situation goes though, I find myself agreeing with you. There hasn't really been any great faces on either show at the moment, especially with the talent you have been mentioning. Morrison is about as close as you are likely to come but it just seems that a new talent has more steam and more promise if they enter the WWE as a heel. That is not to be attacked though, it has worked for most of the new guys who have come in. Wade Barrett, Sheamus and Alberto Del Rio have come into the company as heels and have cemented their place in the main event scenes. You can't really argue with success, to be honest. They are heels and they have been successful in that alignment. Would it have been different if they were faces when they were brought in? Absolutely.

 

[Smartie]

The point is even You and I can go inside the ring and break for example's Cena's leg and for several weeks talk about it and even get booed.Would we be stars? NO.

A star is someone who you tune in to watch what he does.how many people outside of IWC do you find who tune in to watch Del Rio?No one.

WWE is still on shoulders of Cena,Orton,Edge,Mysterio,Taker.

I'm not aiming at the young and new guys,I'm aiming at WWE.With the current pattern,What can a guy like Barret do more than he has already done?Win the championship?Swagger did that and went nowhere.

The main point that i mentioned is creating babyfaces.They have failed.Hart Dynasty didn't work.Ezekiel Jackson get drafted 2 or 3 times this year,Kaval is released.no more Cryme Tyme.They've lost Matt hardy and MVP.Kofi is still busy with IC title.There's only Bryan who was a star before WWE and I really don't think WWE has done anything extra for him.

The only babyface WWE made in past 3 years is Santino.I think you got the point.

 

[90s wrestling kicked ass]

this is exactly the problem. the pg rating is destroying wrestling by preventing new stars from being born especially while the current stars themselves are un intresting. yes i know the wwe was kid oriented in the 80s but back then we had guys like ricky steamboat and ric flair that could actually wrestle. the last wrestlers the wwe has that are able to wrestle are HHH and jericho and those guys are looking to retire. in conclusion R.I.P. WWE cause of death pg rating. i mean how can we beleive 2 men are "fighting" when they arent even allowed to bleed? say what you want about TNA but id much rather watch AJ Styles or the motor city machine guns than ANYTHING wwe has now that HBK is gone.

 

[vampirek]

this is exactly the problem. the pg rating is destroying wrestling by preventing new stars from being born especially while the current stars themselves are un intresting. yes i know the wwe was kid oriented in the 80s but back then we had guys like ricky steamboat and ric flair that could actually wrestle. the last wrestlers the wwe has that are able to wrestle are HHH and jericho and those guys are looking to retire. in conclusion R.I.P. WWE cause of death pg rating. i mean how can we beleive 2 men are "fighting" when they arent even allowed to bleed? say what you want about TNA but id much rather watch AJ Styles or the motor city machine guns than ANYTHING wwe has now that HBK is gone.

O please do shut up about any rating, it has been discussed a thousands times that for the majority of its history WWE has been PG. Smackdown has been PG since it began.... it didn't change a thing it simply removed the sex... only reason why it went up. Everything else changed due to other factors.

Now on to this thing about the WWE not being able to create new faces 'new stars'. Do you know what Bret Hart, Undertaker, Austin, HHH, The Rock, Angle, Jericho, HBK, Cena, Orton etc all have in common before coming the big face characters they were all heels. It's nothing new, WWE builds the majority of its stars as heels before changing the ones they feel can be mega faces. The fans care more about heels than faces because the heels want you to see them beaten and thus help create the face. You can't do it the other way round otherwise you are forcing the fans and you create a Cena issue, where he is both face and heel with the fans (not a tweener)

The likes of The Miz are bound to become the faces of the future, I say The Miz because he suits the type of face WWE looks for. Where some on the other hand are just born to be heel like ADR.

 

[Honkey_Kong]

Heels typically are heels because they do bad things to the faces. Look at Earthquake getting over with Hulk Hogan in the 90's by breaking his sternum. Or Rick Martel spraying "Arrogance" in the eyes of Jake The Snake. Or The Undertaker attacking Hogan when Flair was talking smack to him. See that's what really makes a heel.

So to say those guys aren't "real heels" is total BS.

And as for ADR, that guy is a classic heel. I think he's as good of a heel as DiBiase was back in the day, just evil.. I don't know how the average fan thinks of him and neither do you, but the guy is great. Sheamus has become a lot better too (I'm no fan of him).

One of the problems they have is getting a face over and to the top. Let's face it, people don't really like good guys enough to care about them. They love to hate the bad guys, but they hate to love the good guys. That's why it takes forever for them to get a main event face. People like Cena were heels long before they turned face.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

A wrestling organization does not need 20 top stars. They have their current top guys that sell: Cena, Orton, Mysterio, Edge. They don't need other guys to reach their peak yet because it would be wasted (i.e. Blowing their wad too soon)

Also, Cena, Orton, HHH and Undertakers all took their biggest jumps as heels in popularity. This generation is unlikely to be much different.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Another one of these threads? Honestly, I think this just goes to show how little some fans know about wrestling. No company, not even the WWE, can just snap its fingers, point at someone and say "Ok buddy, you're gonna be the next star and you're gonna be headlining for us in 3 months". Simply because some of these wrestlers aren't at the level you personally think that they should be or aren't doing what you think they should be doing doesn't mean that they're not stars.

I do agree that the babyface situation isn't as overly strong as the heel situation right now, but I don't exactly see why that's automatically a bad thing. At this particular time, it just seems that most wrestlers just starting out in the WWE or getting their first real pushes, exposure in high profile feuds, etc. just have more momentum coming into it as heels.

As far as the company still resting overall on guys like Cena, Mysterio & Taker, that's true to a certain degree. New & younger stars have to be created & built up in order to take the place of older wrestlers that are leaving. Cena is the top babyface in the company, and rightly so. He does EXACTLY what faces are supposed to do. Older talent has been slowly pulling out of the limelight over the course of the past year and are being used to help build up this new talent before leaving. For the ones that haven't left yet but will be before too long, it'll be the same thing. Triple H has been gone for months and the last time we saw him was after he'd been decimated by Sheamus, Alberto Del Rio has been feuding with Rey Mysterio and gotten a LOT out of it, Wade Barrett made his bones in the WWE by picking at John Cena's bones with the rest of Nexus.

I have little doubt that many of these heels mentioned will turn face and I have little problem believing that they'll be strong faces and fans will embrace them. This has been a tried and tested method that the WWE has used for a very long time and has ALWAYS worked. If you don't believe me then look at how Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Stone Cold Steve Austin, The Rock, The Undertaker & John Cena started out: almost all of them started in the WWE heels and/or really got their career kickstarted by becoming heel characters before eventually going face.

 

[RicSpade]

I have to slightly disagree with this statement, I don't think its the WWE itself who doesn't want to create new babyface stars its the fact that they don't want to push who the fans really want pushed. Think about it, next to Edge and Mysterio Hardy and MVP got the biggest pop on Smackdown, but there was no title run for them, their reaction was to try and dull them down so you'll cheer for who they want you to cheer for. I think the same thing goes for Evan Bourne too, Cena wanted him pushed he goes over on Jericho and the crowd loves it and then goes on a losing streak gets hurt and looks extremely weak against CM Punk.

I know faces aren't born overnight but sometimes you make the mistake of not listening to the fans, hence why RVD was taken so long to be WWE champion even though he got that Hulk Hogan/John Cena crowd reaction, or Jake Roberts never being the top guy because he was so over people cheered when he attacked Hulk Hogan in a feud they never let happen.

So honestly is it that they we get horsefed crap, their not pushing who we want pushed, or there really aren't any makable faces right now, you decide

 

[Dzone]

I really think the only way WWE could create a new babyface is if they had an establish heel that could draw, and people like Kane simply do not fit the bill. Whereas if Triple H was still around as a heel, I'm pretty sure we'd be seeing the rise of the next babyface.

I don't mind WWE producing heels, however, because they can in the end turn face if needs be, as someone mentioned it is usually the case that being a heel is the easiest way to "test" the wrestler. I know this sort of contradicts my original point but I'm sure if WWE was leaded by a heel and the main faces were put out then bringing in a new babyface would be "easy" (if they have the talent... of course).

 

[holdingholder]

I think the trend has always been that the top stars always either start off as heels or get their first major run as a heel. Think about the top stars of the last couple of decades, The Rock, Stone Cold, HBK, HHH, Angle, Jericho, Taker, Lesnar, even John Cena. All built up there character by getting major heel runs. It's just much easier to generate heat than get the audience to get behind a face. In my opinion its nearly impossible to become a top star unless you start off as a heel.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

This arguement is so overdone and just wrong on so many levels. Remember Steve Austin? Now are you going to tell me that Steve Austin was shit because he only got over because he had Bret Hart to work with? Or take Triple H for that matter. He only got over when he worked with Mick Foley. He must be complete shit. And speaking of Mick Foley, that dude got over only when he worked with the Undertaker. That dude must suck, no?

The thing is what you are seeing now is nothing new. Very few stars, especially those that have some personality, debut as faces. Most of them debut as heels because as we have seen, young heels are just more believable than young babyfaces. As you have said they are bound to get heat when they insult or hurt a top babyface. That does not mean that the wrestler does not have any talent. In fact if the heel wrestler is able to hold his own in a feud with a top face, that tells you that the guy has talent. As the feud progresses the heel shows off facets of their pesonality and that is what makes the feud interesting. Look at The Miz's feud with John Cena and The Great Khali's feud with John Cena. Which of the two feuds was more interesting? Surely the answer is Miz vs Cena and that is only because of Miz's personality. That is why Miz is a star and Khali is a nobody. Now according to your theory Khali should be as big a star as the Miz but that is not the case. Do you know why? Because Khali is just not that good.

As far as creating new faces go, it is the guys who are currently heels that will make good babyfaces in the future. That is the case because they have shown off some personality and the fan actually cares them. Why should a fan care for Morrison or Bryan? Yeah they can have good matches but how is that going to create any sympathy for them when they are in trouble. But as far as Alberto Del Rio and Miz go, the fan is actually aware of what their character is all about. That will make it easier for the writing team to design a storyline for them when they turn face and thus it will be easier for them to get over.

 

[martymcfly]

The title says it all.

Honestly, the grammar used in that title makes it very confusing. Are you talking about no babyfaces, no new stars, or babyfaces not being stars? And unless you're foghorn leghorn, what's with the "I say" part? Might as well throw in a "son" or "boy" while you're at it.

Last year , Lots of new stars were born , but with a few exceptions, they were all common in one point : The Miz,Sheamus,Nexus,Alberto Del Rio,Dolph Ziggler,Alex Riley,Drew Mcintyre,Dashing Cody Rhodes,Jack Swagger ... and Daniel Bryan+Morrison.

What exactly does it mean to you to be a star? Because if it means someone who headlines matches people care about or frequently in title pictures, I wonder why Alex Riley and Cody Rhodes are on that list. It can't be based off of length of time since all of them have been in the WWE for some time now outside of riley and bryan. And why are some others, such as bourne, r-truth, santino/koslov, ezekiel jackson, and kofi missing from this arbitrary listing?


And then the rest of this rant is all over the board...you make points but you don't explain what you mean, and you change topics and thoughts constantly...

As you see , except the last one , they are all heels.And the sadder point to me is that it seems that the heat they draw is based on A)popularity of their rivals and B)the fact that WWE Universe doesn't know them!

First, heels always generate heat when they attack popular faces, especially sneak attacks. That will never change, and why should it. And what does it mean that WWE doesn't know the wrestlers? You never explain what that means and how you think that should be rectified.

Miz maybe different , but even him has used Cena , Bret hart , Orton Jerry Lawler and Coles's aid to gain the amount of heat he is drawing.And he also helped Bryan and Morrison so he can be called a truly new-born star.

Oftentimes faces help heel wrestlers get elevated to the next level. Why is that so troubling to you?

People won't cheer or boo anyone unless they care about them.That's the problem I have with WWE's so-called "Youth Movement".

I have no idea what the youth movement has to do with anything, and you fail to explain it. But people only cheering wrestlers they care about? That has been true for a very long time. What is the problem? Are you saying that everyone should boo or cheer every single wrestler? And that kids and youths are the reason they aren't? Makes no sense.

Last week on Raw , Nexus were alone because absence of Cena , and you could see they draw the least amount of heat ever.

That's because a group of men standing in a ring doing nothing gives no one a reason to react. I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here.

I think the only reason people like ADR,Sheamus and Nexus have done not so bad is because they were facing people like Cena,Mysterio,Orton,HHH and Edge who by the way are built and made a long time ago.

As mentioned above, a good way for a heel to get to that next level in the WWE is to feud against an already established face at that level, who can help bring them up. That is nothing new and I still don't see the problem with it.

Or let me put it this way, since you complained but you never addressed this: How would you like to see a heel elevated to the next level? What would be a good way to do this? Your arguments might make more sense if you explained them or offered alternatives.

The only way these new-born heels can do good on mic is when they start insulting babyfaces.

I mean there is absolutely zero creation.ADR always says :"My name is ... " and nothing more.Sheamus always talks about he retired HHH and talks proudly of his Irish heritage ,Barret's promos are fine only if there is a Cena in the ring.

Heels insulting babyfaces again is part of what makes them heels. But to say this is their only option is ridiculous. Some insult fans. Some do heel actions, by cheating, jumping opponents from behind, etc. ADR says a LOT more whenever he gets a mic than "my name is" so if that's your example it's a poor one. And then your other examples don't seem to fit your main point.

Unfortunately and coincidentally , Bryan and Morrison are nothing on the mic except the times they are trash talking about their opponents.

One may say that wrestling's promos are all about trash talking and insulting your opponent , but at the same time , you gotta be creative.I'm gonna beat you , you're a coward and blah blah blah is not impressive anymore.

I think the reason for buyrates or ratings being down is not 'PG' , But it's because these new stars are living on the old guys fame and popularity ,So despite 2010 was a more appealing year to IWC , the mainstream fans who are WWE's main target , have not liked it that much , They liked it even less than 2009 which I think was a crappy year.

I honestly don't see how anything you said in the last few paragraphs fits with anything else you've said in this post. I think what you're getting at is you'd like to see better mic work? If there's more buried in there, I apologize, and I still don't see the relation between that and better faces or stars.

The bottom line: People don't give a shit about new stars,and that's the reason you really can't find an answer for :Who's gonna replace Cena and Orton? , and you may never will.

No one cares about the new stars? Which programs have you been watching? I will agree that pertains to some that you listed such as alex riley or cody rhodes, and it seems right now that WWE creative doesn't really know what to do with swagger or drew, but to say no one cares is a little ridiculous.


Ok, I think in the end that this original post basically boils down to the original poster claiming that there are too many heels and he doesn't like that the heels are heels because of feuding with faces. But it has been addressed before that heels are a lot easier to build up than faces--a lot easier to make you not like a new wrestler than like someone. I believe that most established stars did not really get their boost until they took their turn as a heel. That has always been the case and always will be.

Let's face it, to go from lower to midcard, or midcard to high card status, logically, you have to earn it. That's the only options that heels have, so it takes a lot of time to push them to that next level. On the other hand, heels have it easier--they can cheat to get to that next level, and once they are there, they can continue to cheat and stay at that level. Them being at a level they don't belong at continues to draw ire from the crowd and they want to watch to see this heel get his due. Eventually, the heel is at that new level long enough that he is good enough to stay there. Faces do not get that luxury, which is why they are stuck waiting around for their time for a monster push.

So in the end, I certainly agree with the poster that the WWE could use more credible faces right now. Fortunately in the WWE it's pretty easy to turn someone face if they need to.

 

[Ruthless-RKO]

I am going to keep this short.. Nearly all wrestlers start of as a heel.. Heels can get over much quicker.. how? Take out a current face and your a heel instantly.. These new stars you say were born last year maybe heels. But here we always talk about how some of them will make good faces.. Some of the best wrestlers were heels at the start of their careers.. e.g. Triple H, The Rock, Kurt Angle.. just to name a few...

 

[WarMachine1890]

How is anyone supposed to get over when it's about Cena. I mean look as soon as they did the Cena is fired angle, they had the perfect opportunity to start building up a new star to oppose the Nexus. Even if it was for a month or two you could have had anyone going up against them anyone on the roster worth building up. Instead we have Cena in ring gear every week with the focus all on him attacking the nexus and destroying any credibility they had. It kind of showed me that they didn't have enough faith on anyone in the roster to be able to carry RAW for a few weeks. You can just imagine Vince thinking they were going to lose money and ratings. A little off topic but the week Cena was announced to be injured, their would be refunds at a house show if you were a Cena fan. That has to be a little discouraging main eventer or not. I mean any other guy wouldn't get that treatment HHH, Orton whoever. But other than Cena WWE creative also had a tendency to build some one of hot for a few weeks than they kill the push. I might be wrong but most come from Randy Orton. Off the top of my head is Kofi and Bourne. Went in hot lost a few to Randy, can't recall a clean win, and then they go back to midcard. Then there was the championship match last week. This match should have been the last match build it up interveiw Miz and Morrison. Maybe have Riley trying to take Morrison out. Fellow wrestlers wishing Morrison good luck. Rivals telling Miz to watch his back cause they're next. no, instead we get it at the beginning with out the build up I'm sure not everyone knew it would be the first match of the night. Then you have a steel cage match where you knew Randy was going to be in and win and just walked out the door and kind of made Seamus and Barret look like the mid carders he's been burying. Something like that also shows me they don't have confidence in Morrison. Unless Morrison wins the rumble which i doubt that build up with Seamus was for nothing and utterly wasted.

 

[m6usin786]

Maybe WWE find heels working better than faces. Look at Morrison and Daniel Bryan.. have they had a major push like all the heel stars shown. Its because of what the fans are interested in and what they are interested in is what happens to the heels and they are the ones that get the most reactions.

 

[JDX]

If you can get heat without picking on anybody or cheap shotting a face, you've got unlimited talent. But I do agree with no new faces being made. Bryan can only fall into the Mysterio World title situation and Morrison I think had a title match vs Jeff back in summer of 09 and what happened? He lost but put on a great match and went back to the mid-card. Right now he could stay in the ME but I won't hold my breath. All the hot heel are young but they are fighting the veterans and losing. There is nothing really wrong with this but, and I really hate saying this, WWE needs a new young Cena. A guy unknown by the WWE universe somewhere in his twenties they can mold like they did Cena at the start by beating or almost beating some huge veteran. The torch needs to be at least taken out the case

 

[Kofi/ZigglerClassic]

Actually if the only new stars that are getting pushed are heels that's the WWE's fault. There were plenty of young stars like Kaval, Yoshi, MVP, and even Evan Bourne who were getting crowd and little kids reactions but WWE either gave the order to bury them (Kaval), don't give them mic time, or release them. The only faces that truly got over and didn't get the full axe was Kofi and Big Show. But they've been in the business for awhile now so I wouldn't call them new.

Problem is, the current creative team doesn't know how to create a face character whose name doesn't end with Mysterio, Cena, or orton.

 

[gj2000]

The only babyface WWE made in past 3 years is Santino.I think you got the point.

You cant be for real, can you? Thats a ridiculous statement to make. Let me go through the babyfaces they have made over the past few years

Evan Bourne
Kofi Kingston
R-Truth
Natalya
Beth Phoenix
John Morrison
Randy Orton (Was Heel)
Daniel Bryan
And the list continues.And i havent mentioned many stars that WERE over as babyfaces but have now been turned heel.

There's no need to complain about them not being able to build up new babyfaces. It takes time

Why rush into it, when you can still draw buys and ratings off Orton, Cena, Triple H, Undertaker etc.?

 

[Smartie]

Evan Bourne
Kofi Kingston
R-Truth
Natalya
Beth Phoenix
John Morrison
Randy Orton (Was Heel)
Daniel Bryan

The only thing you have done is to list the name of babyfaces.But the fact is:

Evan Bourne is out now but even before that he was usually teaming with Mark Henry and the only thing he has is his finisher.Why anyone think he is over is beyond me.

Kofi Kingston is the living sample of WWE failing to create new babyfaces.For all the people who say they need time , well i think they have had enough time for kofi , but We still see him with the belt he had 4 years ago , and he is even in a lower position than that time.

R-truth being over is only limited to his entrance song.It's better than nothing but He is not there to advance,he is there to help the others.

Natalya may be the only true babyface they've made , but my Argument didn't involve Divas , because I think Diva Division is only good fo the live attendance to see the hot bodies anf for TV viewers to take a break.

Beth Phoenix is kind like Natalya.

JoMo is my favorite star to rise in 2011 , but the truth is people are mostly silent during his matches.he still has a long way up to the being a top tire star and I do have hope for him,but He may very well never become a star as big as Cena.

Randy Orton was a babyface and WHC 7 years ago , so His case is just a simple turn who people were waiting for 3 years , he was build in the ast and doesn't belong to this conversation.

I think I talked about it 7 years ago.


To all the people who say It takes time:I'm afraid When there is nothing in the beginning , how come taking some amount of time is gonna help.

Back to the time that Cena and Batista were made , These guys were able to amuse the crowd , but today's stars aren't.That is a FACT.

Now you have a 3-time WHC who by the way is really talented talking in the ring and no one even listens to him.

10 years ago people like Rikishi and Scotty 2 Hotty or APA were able to pull a bigger ovation than half of these guys you named combined.

So my questions are : A)How come taking time is gonna help someone who is not anything special right now?

B)How come taking time is gonna someone who already has been champion and people still don't care about.


Come on people,How can you compare JoMo to Cena even when Cena was taking his time.

And pay attention to than by fans , I don't mean this forum's members , I mean the normal guy who isn't a hardcore wrestling fan.To those guys , It's not the golden formula that we use:A star is : In-ring skills+mic skills.To those people a star is someone who can entertain them in a special way.

 

[gj2000]

The only thing you have done is to list the name of babyfaces.But the fact is:

Evan Bourne is out now but even before that he was usually teaming with Mark Henry and the only thing he has is his finisher.Why anyone think he is over is beyond me.

Kofi Kingston is the living sample of WWE failing to create new babyfaces.For all the people who say they need time , well i think they have had enough time for kofi , but We still see him with the belt he had 4 years ago , and he is even in a lower position than that time.

Natalya may be the only true babyface they've made , but my Argument didn't involve Divas , because I think Diva Division is only good fo the live attendance to see the hot bodies anf for TV viewers to take a break.

Beth Phoenix is kind like Natalya.

JoMo is my favorite star to rise in 2011 , but the truth is people are mostly silent during his matches.he still has a long way up to the being a top tire star and I do have hope for him,but He may very well never become a star as big as Cena.

Randy Orton was a babyface and WHC 7 years ago , so His case is just a simple turn who people were waiting for 3 years , he was build in the ast and doesn't belong to this conversation.

I think I talked about it 7 years ago.


To all the people who say It takes time:I'm afraid When there is nothing in the beginning , how come taking some amount of time is gonna help.

Back to the time that Cena and Batista were made , These guys were able to amuse the crowd , but today's stars aren't.That is a FACT.

Now you have a 3-time WHC who by the way is really talented talking in the ring and no one even listens to him.

10 years ago people like Rikishi and Scotty 2 Hotty or APA were able to pull a bigger ovation than half of these guys you named combined.

So my questions are : A)How come taking time is gonna help someone who is not anything special right now?

B)How come taking time is gonna someone who already has been champion and people still don't care about.


Come on people,How can you compare JoMo to Cena even when Cena was taking his time.

And pay attention to than by fans , I don't mean this forum's members , I mean the normal guy who isn't a hardcore wrestling fan.To those guys , It's not the golden formula that we use:A star is : In-ring skills+mic skills.To those people a star is someone who can entertain them in a special way.

Okay, i will talk it out real slowly for you. Youve got absolutely no base for your argument. Ill go through it step by step

All Evan Bourne has is not just his finisher! That is a ridiculous statement to make. Have you seen him go in the ring? His high octane style is what a viewer wants to see in this day and age.

When Kofi Kingston makes his entrance, do you know how many kids scream in the audience? This again, sir, quite obviously refutes your statement. I doubt he is in a lower position than a few years ago. Dont you worry. Kingston will have his time in the sunlight

Your argument didnt involve divas? Excuse me, your thread specifically stated, "WWE isnt able to create new babyfaces". That, to me, sure doesnt sound like you're talking about just male superstars. You think they're only for that? That, sir, is why you are a smark.

How are people mostly silent during Morrison's matches? Thats a stupid statement to make. Flashback last week! Did Morrison get silence when he hit starship pain? In fact, any week? When he hits a pele kick? The crowd surely doesnt stay silent for that? Why are you comparing him to Cena? So early in his career, and with what Cena has accomplished, why would you compare him to Cena? It seems like that is all you are doing.

Um, people weren't waiting for Randy Orton to turn babyface? Actually, by observing Elimination Chamber, You would clearly see that Ted Dibiase got a massive pop when he eliminated Randy Orton. And he theoretically, hasnt turned. He is a tweener, isnt he?

That statement about you saying "When there is nothing in the beginning , how come taking some amount of time is gonna help.

Back to the time that Cena and Batista were made , These guys were able to amuse the crowd , but today's stars aren't.That is a FACT"

This statement is just plain ol' stupid. Your argument has so many flaws in it. Back when Cena and Batista were IN THEIR FIRST YEAR, they did not amuse the crowd to the mere lengths that you are saying they are. Actually, Lesnar vs Cena at Backlash 2003, i thought Cena was a stereotypically boring ass character. Back when Batista debuted, i thought he hit a spinebuster, and that was his only move. But, they were given some time, a couple of years, and look where they got to.

You're shooting down new talent, at the level Cena and Batista were at when they were just starting out. Look how much they sucked back then. And i bet you would have shot Cena straight down when he debuted, saying he would be nothing like The Rock.

I can quite easily compare John Morrison to Cena back when he was taking his time. In fact, apart from the mic skills, Morrison's matches, given the right opponent, are far, far more entertaining than Cena's back then, and now.

When you say, how is time going to help anybody whos been champ, and the fans still dont care about them. Sir, you've just refuted your own claim. TIME buddy, time. By The Way, none of these guys have ever been World Champions. Wouldnt you think when they eventually become world champions, the crowd will rally readily behind them, and invest more emotions in them?

I could continue all day with this argument, and no offense, but i still don't think you would get it, and your arrogance and "impatience" would continue to flicker under the bright lights of 'smarksism'.