Why The Change Of Mind?

[Da Big Champ]

I have been reading this forum for years and one thing I have noticed mainly in the WWE side of the forum is that a lot of people suddenly change their mind and stop supporting people they previously were. One of the most recent is Kelly Kelly. For years people wanted Kelly Kelly to become the woman's/diva's champion and people were talking about how she was the best diva on the roster etc. When kelly finally won the divas championship everyone started talking about how she is one of the worst divas, how she can't work a match etc.

Another example is with Zack Ryder who many people thought had a rubbish gimmick, was a bad wrestler and should have been future endeavoured and now everyone is a HUGE Zack Ryder fan when all that has happened is he has a youtube show and has been given more time on TV. He hasn't got better in the ring, he hasn't got a new gimmick and yet most fans are calling for Zack Ryder to win the US title.

This is just a recent example of the fans on this forum changing their mind after YEARS of supporting people and I don't understand why. I only ask because I'm unsure of why this happens and would like to hear peoples personal reasons.

I have put this in the WWE section because it is mainly WWE wrestlers that get turned on.

 

[Jackal960]

Interesting point. I don't want to narrow it to the examples you mentioned and would like to give a broader answer.

It could be because people don't want to share their unpopular opinions with everyone. When you think about it, if someone starts a thread criticizing CM Punk chances are his bars will go all red. You might be able to argue with a couple of people but if too many people is "quoting" you and giving you negative responses for your words then, you know, you might get discouraged to tell what you actually think until some other people thinks similar with you and start mentioning them in these forums. I remember there was a thread called "unpopular wrestling opinions" and ironically i got disapprovals for something that I thought was an unpopular opinion in the first place. But when an idea gets popular people who actually think like that will come on to the surface and you will realize there is a different opinion trend starting.

Another reason can be, most of IWC, like any other people, can't know everything. So what people do, they copy and paste others ideas. Others ideas effect yours as well. Kelly Kelly might be very interesting for some people and because you didn't care about the Diva's division, you might start to look at Kelly Kelly in a positive way. Then people calling her boring might affect you and you start to see negatives more than positives about her

And finally, people might just change their mind. Sometimes it is because WWE forces them to change their mind by pushing or burying a talent. Just think about the threads re Mark Henry or R-Truth a year ago, or think about the threads for Morrison a year ago and now. People might also find something about a wrestler that they overlooked for quite some time. With more in ring time, there is more time for you evaluate the strengths and weaknesses of a wrestler. You might end up liking Zack Ryder or hating Kelly Kelly as you mentioned.

 

[Dagger Dias]

People change their mind all the time. One day you might like one thing while the next day you may find out you prefer something else. It's really not all that uncommon for wrestling fans to change who they support because our likes and dislikes are constantly evolving every day.

As for the two examples in the opening post of Kelly and Ryder.... I have always liked Ryder and am glad he is getting some much deserved time onscreen. Some of us have followed him before his youtube show since his days back on ECW or as a clone of Edge over on Smackdown or even as far back as when he was one half of The Major Brothers. As fans it is enjoyable to see someone starting to succeed after following their whole career.

Then there's Kelly. I used to be one of her strongest supporters on here. There was a debate in a Mickie James thread back in December of 2009 between me and some guy from Aruba with a weird user name that has slipped my mind.... He had 50 or so posts and all of them were pretty much from that debate.... Anyways, Kelly came up constantly in our debate where he thought she sucked and I thought she could become the face of the division. That debate lasted over a month until he quit coming onto the forum anymore. My thoughts have changed since then. I don't think she is THAT awful.... but I no longer think she should be the face of the division. Beth and Natalya deserve that honor.

People change, and sometimes so do our opinions on what wrestlers we like or not. Now if only we could get those Cena haters to change THEIR opinion....

 

[Azane]

I saw the opposite.

Kelly we wanted her out, now nobody cares.

Ryder had a huge fanbase, but as soon as they keep throwing him into mainstream matches he has dozens of haters.

the best way to explain this, is that the IWC is made up of 1000's of people, so 1000's of people's opinions change, and the vocal people are usually against, so you skew your view of what's what when you try to sample this from forum posts.

 

[nxtgeneration]

i think its the fact that people just simply want to think they are smarter than the wwe corporate.

Just like John Cena. everyone wants him to turn heel, but once he does, i can see people saying they want him as face. Zack Ryder. Had only a small fanbase, but it was him that came out and said wwe wasnt using him properly. Now people follow him. Even now i see signs of this changing, people going back to dislike him (not so much hating, but they certainly dont want him world champ like they used to) as wwe is starting to use him. Laycool even, most people didnt like them when they were around, now they are gone, they want them back.

Its simply the "iwc" thinking they can do everything better than the wwe

 

[DeathClutch]

Wrestling is a fickle business.
To get over you need to do that one thing that people stand up and go "holy shit that was cool...." personally I lost interest in CM Punk as a heel from early 2010 but when he returned as the new leader of Nexus I was like holy shit this is awesome (little did we know that angle went no where) but still I enjoyed his work with Orton then next thing you know the guy is dropping pipe bombs and everyone's riding on his coat tails.

Basically it boils down to opinion, I'm an advocate for the Hardcore title and will argue with anyone that it should be brought back, I don't care I'm the only one who believe in the belt I don't care, plus going against the grain is fun, I love a good debate.

 

[Dalinkwent]

I've always thought Kelly Kelly was garbage and while I'm not a huge Zack Ryder mark, he entertains the fans and is over. To be fair I think Zack Ryder's Youtube show is what changed many people's minds about him and his potential on the WWE roster, it's hard not to respect someone who works hard to get over despite WWE not using them. On the other hand it's also not impossible for talent to grow on people. I wasn't a big fan of Sheamus, Miz or Drew, but after watching these guys for over a year I've been impressed with each one of them for different reasons.

 

[EastCoastFan]

Personally, I never liked Kelly. The people who like Kelly are guys who think with their genitalia and are all too willing to forgive her lack of ring skills because she's a hottie. I think she's just an updated version of Torrie Wilson - all show, no go.

 

[jbratton]

I was never big on Kelly, but after what I saw today, I have even less respect for her. I always thought that she received the push that she got because of her looks, because it clearly wasn't for her in ring ability or mic skills. Then, just before I logged on here, I was reading the newest issue of Maxim magazine, which Kelly unveiled on Raw this week. In the interview with her, she talks about doing the stinkface, which everyone knows started with Rakishi. She says "I got it from this old wrestler named Rafiki, who used to do it in a diaper" Hard to respect someone who doesn't even know the name of a person they claim inspired them.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Wrestling is a fickle business.
To get over you need to do that one thing that people stand up and go "holy shit that was cool...." personally I lost interest in CM Punk as a heel from early 2010 but when he returned as the new leader of Nexus I was like holy shit this is awesome (little did we know that angle went no where) but still I enjoyed his work with Orton then next thing you know the guy is dropping pipe bombs and everyone's riding on his coat tails.

Basically it boils down to opinion, I'm an advocate for the Hardcore title and will argue with anyone that it should be brought back, I don't care I'm the only one who believe in the belt I don't care, plus going against the grain is fun, I love a good debate.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I think wrestling fans are fickle, but moreover, I like to go for the underdog. For example, a lot of people were excited when Kofi Kingston got pushed a couple of years ago, and had his feud with Orton. I think people were ready to accept him as champion. But a couple fo PPV losses, and people turned on him, and called him a spotmonkey.

People used to love Jeff Hardy in WWE, but now turn on him when he is TNA. Also, they wanted him to win the WWE Title, but once he had won one or two, they lost interest in him.

A lot of the IWC are quite infantile, and just follow like a bunch of sheep. Like some people said here, if one or two push their opinions, others follow because they don't want to get insulted by the other posters. It's peer pressure.

I have never been worried about that, and have no trouble calling out posters if they feel they are out-of-line and hypocritical. Too bad many others haven't been able to do that.

I agree abotu bringing back the Hardcore Title, but I liked the 25/7 rule, and how they went to bars and the Mississippi river for Hardcore Matches. Of course, the PG rating will only mean "watered-down" hardcore matches.

 

[pharrison0scorpion]

kelly kelly always has been and will remain terrible in the ring. her mic skills are non-existent and the only reason she got the divas championship is because she looks good. it seems that that is one of the only things they look for in divas nowadays. obvious exceptions are kharma, beth, natalya, tamina (although beth and natalya dont look bad), as they have been saying theyre not barbie dolls. eve, the bella twins, kelly kelly, they all got pushes to the title cos of their looks.

on to ryder. i loved ryder before his youtube show. when it came out it was massive news for me and i loved it for a while. when zack made appearances backstage like with snooki and john cena it was brilliant for me and i loved it. i lost interest in his show when i realised that it was just a massive lie. he doesnt really care about it at all, he just used it to get a push. and all he wants is twitter followers so he can get more of a push. it seems now he has his push, he is putting less effort into Z True Long Island Story and i have a feeling he might stop it soon. it seems like he used the fans to get him his push, and then hes going to abandon them when he gets over. yeah im one of the people that changed their mind.

in general though, people change their minds about wrestlers because they do something they dont like or turn face/heel or they realise they were wrong about them. like everyone thought zack ryder deserved a push but now i see i was wrong about that.

 

[XXJJ]

Generally, when a wrestler has long term success.. he will receive backlash from the majority of the IWC. That has happened to most top guys.

People change opinions a lot because wrestling is very subjective. People always used to say how boring R-Truth was as a good guy rapper, and he had bad mic skills. But now that he has an unstable crazy type of heel gimmick. IWC is raving about his promos. Does that mean he improved his mic skills? Or that his current gimmick now appeals to a certain part of the WWE audience.

Ryder is pretty simple. His youtube show gained him fans. He has developed a cult like following with the IWC. Poking fun at the WWE on his show for not pushing him is stuff smarks will eat up. If he never did the youtube show he would be viewed as a Santino type.

I always thought Kelly Kelly was garbage though.

 

[Mustang Sally]

...and now everyone is a HUGE Zack Ryder fan

No, not everyone is and part of the problem with your analysis is that it points to the notion that you're dealing with absolutes. Even when Kelly was champion, plenty of people thought she was a poor ring worker; management deciding to give her a title run didn't change that.

Similarly, with Zack Ryder, he has his fans and his detractors now that he's getting pushed, and it depends on whom you're listening to at the moment. He's not any better or worse as a wrestler than he was before; he just has more people seeing him work now. Some have become fans, some haven't.

A lot of the ebb and flow in a performer's rating circles around whether the company is behind him/her or not. Obviously, they're getting far more comments and attention when they appear on TV than when they don't.

In Zack's case, he created a lot of the attention himself with his Internet stuff. I believed it wouldn't get him air time with the company, but I was wrong. Zack changed a lot of people's minds once he started showing up on TV, but he still had his supporters and detractors, just as before.

Consider John Cena. He's the biggest thing in WWE; the #1 attraction. Still, as illustrated on this forum, there are people who detest him, even as others love him. Some folks think he's terrific in the ring.....and others think he's terrible. If you start hearing one group of fans more than the other, you might think there's been a "change of mind," as you put it. On a given day on this board, you might think "everyone" hates him......but we know better.

There's been no change of mind; just the mixed opinions of many, many people.

 

[4realpeoples]

What's wrong with wrestling fans changing their minds? I know I've changed my minds about a few wrestlers from time to time.

In 2005 I went to WWE Judgment Day to watch John Cena face JBL in an "I Quit" Match. I thought John Cena was the coolest wrestler back then. Granted, I was 13 then but now, at 20, I don't find John Cena all that great. I'm not saying he sucks, I'm just saying I'm not a big fan of his anymore.

I used to be not a fan of Cody Rhodes. I thought he was never going to go anywhere in WWE, now he's one of the biggest heels on SmackDown and now I'm a big fan of his.

My point is that people tend to change their minds about wrestlers. Nothing is wrong with that. I actually like seeing people have their minds slowly change. Changing minds can only be a good thing when it comes to wrestling. Ryder and Kelly? So what if people changed their mind. Different opinions spark the debates that drive these forums.

 

[The Dragon Saga]

I can't remember cheering for Kelly Kelly - unless it was on the debut of ECW where I was cheering for her to let the bra drop but that is neither here nor there. As for Zack Ryder, I dislike him even now and I disliked him when he first started the gimmick. I don't get it, I probably will never get it, I think it's idiotic and God doesn't even know why people find it funny. I watched a good ten of his YouTube shows and the only even remotely funny part is when he was attempting to climb over a fence and stated, "I can't get over. How come I can't get over?!"

It's just the way the IWC has always been. They cheer for someone to get to the top and once they do that, three out of five times they turn on said person. John Cena had huge support before he won the WWE Championship, he won it from JBL and it was all down hill from there. Fans turned on him slowly until a large majority hated Cena but most had the common sense to respect and realize that although he isn't a great wrestler he is a great worker and can put on a solid match almost with ease.

It'll continue to happen forever. Some people just change their minds but it's when a majority turn that you realize what's going on and then attempt to back up their turn with non-sensical arguments. I hated Mark Henry only a few months back but I think the dude is steller at the moment. Hated Cody Rhodes too and now I even like him. It's just the way somethings go.

 

[Jessie Lynn DivaGirl]

WARNING: THIS IS TO BE AN ALL SERIOUS AND LITERAL POINT. READER DISCRETION ADVISED

It's an involenteering aton made by the human brain, There really is no good guy or bad guy and yet we push for the ones who seem pathetically incapable of winning. When they do win we suddenly realize their flaws and correct our error.

In other words we cheer them on when no one likes them, then we're supposed to like them and we hate them. Or they don't do anything so we ignore them then they do something and we praise them. That's why I only watch Smackdown if my guy Justin has a match.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Wrestling fans can be fickle and that most definitely applies to a good number of internet fans. Some fans are just flat out never satisfied and just want to gripe about whatever. That's true with your average fan as well as a very large number of the IWC.

For instance, I don't know how many posts I've read in which people demand that CM Punk be elevated to main event status. Once it happens, people start coming out of the woodwork criticizing him left and right. That's just one of the numerous times I've seen people just seem to flip flop on a particular wrestler. At times, I'm wondering if a lot of the criticism is due to the simple fact that he's in the WWE. Some net fans just flat out hate WWE and most things associated with it. But if Punk was out there on the indy circuit still wrestling in front of, if he's lucky, 150 people in some broken down dive somewhere, a lot of people would practically be calling him a wrestling god.

It's a good example of the sheer lapse in logic, double standards and unrealistic expectations & wants that dominates the perception most wrestling insiders have of the IWC. Why? Because those sorts are the ones that usually post the most and often have no realistic idea how wrestling works.

 

[Cracka Jack]

I think there are two possible, simultaneous answers to your question.

1. They don't. No one is suddenly changing their mind, it's just that the general consensus on someone or something is slowly shifting, or that one group's opinion on something will be more noticeable at a given time and less noticeable at another. It's part of the problem of when people use the phrase "the IWC". Not only are they pretending to not be a part of the IWC, they are treating us (yes, us) like a hivemind that all share the same opinion. Like when people say "the IWC hates John Cena"; not everyone here does, it's just that that opinion is very strong and very obvious in many of the fans who post on sites like these.

2. People's opinions and perceptions can change. I'm not sure where or when this stigma became attached to changing one's mind, but I've never seen anything wrong with it. People change over time, due to things that happen to them, people they meet, hearing differing opinions, etc. For example, I used to think Mark Henry was a useless bore, hardly worthy of jobber status. Now, he's one of the most entertaining wrestlers in the WWE today and a deserving World Champion. I saw Henry in a way I had never thought of before, and my opinion of him changed dramatically. It happens.

 

[asslber]

I think it has something to do with seeing them more.

Back when people wanted Kelly Kelly to be champion, she didn't really have many matches, but from what people saw, they liked her. Now that she's champion and been getting shoved down our throats, we all now know what she does in the ring, and it's not very impressive.

Same can be said about Zack Ryder. Back when people wanted him future endeavored, we got what? 1 Zack Ryder match every couple of months? Definitely not enough to see what he had in store. Now that he's been on tv almost every single week(wrestling a match too I might add), we now all know what he's capable of. Something we didn't see him before, because it was just that - we didn't see him.