why no huge arenas in the attitude era?

[TWJC: The Beginning]

So, most people think that the attitude era was the most successful period in WWE history. I basically agree. I have one question though, does anyone know why they never ran stadium shows in the attitude era? Beyond Wrestlemania X7 I can't think of a single stadium show in the attitude era. I consider WMX7 to be the end of the 'tude era BTW.

So why didn't they run stadium shows? the past few years in a supposed "downward spiral" (bullshit) period, they are drawing upwards of 70,000 at mania every year, why didn't they run more stadium shows? I would be willing to be that 100,000 people would have shown up at Wrestlemania 16 and 17.

 

[Peoples_Champ]

Wasn't that whole era part of when Vince was going through financial difficulties? He had to release Bret because he couldn't afford him, Turner was poaching his best talent, etc. I guess it would only make sense to have smaller crowds in non-traditional areas. That's probably what got the Attitude era going really well. More intimate settings in towns / areas where WWE and professional sports traditionally didn't venture.

I think it was a financial decision in the end, but there's no doubt that it probably played a huge role in the evolution of the product.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Wasn't that whole era part of when Vince was going through financial difficulties? He had to release Bret because he couldn't afford him, Turner was poaching his best talent, etc. I guess it would only make sense to have smaller crowds in non-traditional areas. That's probably what got the Attitude era going really well. More intimate settings in towns / areas where WWE and professional sports traditionally didn't venture.

I think it was a financial decision in the end, but there's no doubt that it probably played a huge role in the evolution of the product.

By 1999 they were selling out 10, 15, 20 thousand seat arenas routinely and drawing like 10,000 for HOUSE SHOWS. When I go back and watch Attitude Era Wrestlemanias, they just feel like another show. They don't have that grand feeling.

If you are having financial difficulties and you can pretty easily draw 50 thousand plus poeple, I think that'd be smarter than 20 thousand.

I have never been able to figure out why they never ran stadiums back then when they were doing so well.

 

[rge2010]

I suppose only Vince will know the answer to this. Many people say the Attitude Era started at Wrestlemania 14. This was obviously pre booked long before this. I suppose Wrestlemania 15 was also booked before the peak of the attitude boom.

Why WWE didnt capatalise on this for Wrestlemania 2000 is a strange one. But they did for Wrestlemania 17 I suppose with the Astrodome in Texas - so it was only 1 Wrestlemania 2000 that really poses the question.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

I suppose only Vince will know the answer to this. Many people say the Attitude Era started at Wrestlemania 14. This was obviously pre booked long before this. I suppose Wrestlemania 15 was also booked before the peak of the attitude boom.

Why WWE didnt capatalise on this for Wrestlemania 2000 is a strange one. But they did for Wrestlemania 17 I suppose with the Astrodome in Texas - so it was only 1 Wrestlemania 2000 that really poses the question.

But really it didn't have to just be mania. I bet Summerslam 2000 would have been able to fill a huge arena. WCW was doing like 30,000 people for NITRO at one point.

 

[Psyclone]

my best guess as to why is again just a guess but I think Vince hated the idea of doing open air arenas (but then again wrestlemania 9, pre attitude era, was in caesars palace, and hell maybe that soured him) because the "Open air" does dilute the crowd noise... I mean you could then say he shouldve gone back to the silverdome to see if he couldve beat wrestlemania 3's record audience (at the time) but really I don't know... It's a good question because with the TV audiences at the time, you couldve probably packed a hundred thousand into SOMEWHERE that was large enough...

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

my best guess as to why is again just a guess but I think Vince hated the idea of doing open air arenas (but then again wrestlemania 9, pre attitude era, was in caesars palace, and hell maybe that soured him) because the "Open air" does dilute the crowd noise... I mean you could then say he shouldve gone back to the silverdome to see if he couldve beat wrestlemania 3's record audience (at the time) but really I don't know... It's a good question because with the TV audiences at the time, you couldve probably packed a hundred thousand into SOMEWHERE that was large enough...

Doesn't have to be outdoors. It's not like huge enclosed stadiums are a new thing. Could have done the Edward Jones Dome in St. Louis, the Georgia Dome. I think it's ridiculous because when the WWF was REALLY struggling in the mid 90s, they had the Rumble in the Alamodome. Makes no sense. I was really hoping someone had some sort of article or something from the late 90s but I don't think there is one. Just speculation.

 

[Psyclone]

Doesn't have to be outdoors. It's not like huge enclosed stadiums are a new thing. Could have done the Edward Jones Dome in St. Louis, the Georgia Dome. I think it's ridiculous because when the WWF was REALLY struggling in the mid 90s, they had the Rumble in the Alamodome. Makes no sense. I was really hoping someone had some sort of article or something from the late 90s but I don't think there is one. Just speculation.

again yeah i agree I don't know why they didn't go to huge enclosed stadiums after it, but maybe it had to do with the fact that the georgia dome was in WCW territory, and who knows why they didnt go to st louis... I was just offering an opinion and honestly have no knowledge of why they didnt (because I agree with you they probably couldve set new records)

 

[Headman]

I remember by late in the Attitude Era they were moving Smackdown from the Worcester Centrum Center which is already a small arena to the building next door (I forgot what it was called.) due to low ticket sales. Even with the Rock and Austin there the WWE seemed to hit a rough patch. I just chalk it up to the fact that wrestling became a trend in the mid to late 90's. It wasn't a better show it was just what was hot at that brief moment in time. Wrestling was like Pokemon, and fans who were just coming of age in that era view it to be better than it really was.

 

[DecidedlySo]

They did do one. February 13, 1999 a special Saturday night edition of Raw is War aired from the SkyDome in Toronto.

 

[RATED R CHAMPION]

I think wrestlemania had not become the GLOBAL PHENOMENON yet, I mean wrestlemania was globally known, but is it now some 10-12 years later that it has REALLY become something global were you have mania live in 30 countries and people coming to the wrestlemania site with their country's flag. The streak now is SOMETHING REALLY BIG, which back in the attitude era was just getting mentioned, so that's part of the reason. The financial struggles most of you have mentioned is also a part of all of it, and get used to it, in coming several years you'll see wrestlemania in big stadiums, it's not coming back to small closed 20,000 people arenas

 

[ITrippedTheShockmaster]

I think it was part a financial decision on Vince's part. He was just getting WWF/E back to prominence during this time. Maybe he wasn't confident that he could sell out massive arenas all the time. He knew he could sell out smaller event centers during that time. Huge stadiums? Probably, but why risk it? Besides, the massive arenas are usually saved for the PPVs. Holding events in smaller arenas gave it more of an intimate feel, as weird as that may sound. People don't like to be a mile up or back from the action. Huge arena shows can seem large and pompous. At that time, they wanted in-your-face action with lots of crowd interaction. Think about it - this era was kind of competing with the underground popularity of ECW in a way, which performed in bingo halls and the Hammerstein Ballroom. Smaller fully enclosed venues = louder and more rowdy crowds. Made for better television.

 

[boozinjedi]

There's no doubt they could've done it and sold it out.
I think Vince likes to hold off on those size of venues until Mania.

To give it that "an Event,A happening" type of feel.

Yes they did do a Raw or two at Skydome,now Rogers Centre back in the day..BUT it wasn't in a full stadium setup from what I have been told.

They could always fill stadiums if they tried.I might be wrong on this.
BUT I remember when I was younger in my teens.
They had what was a glorified house house show at the Canadian National Expo(CNE)at where the BlueJays played beforethe Dome went up and it drew somewhere near 70,000.

And that was(if I'm correct) the summer BEFORE WM3!!

 

[FlairFan2003]

I dont know for sure either, I do know that the rent for a stadium is significantly higher than an arena, and open air shows run the risk of being ruined by rain. With ticket prices and merchandise sales you can turn a huge profit at the arena level. I read where a non televised, non PPV standard house show for WCW in Washington DC in spring of 99 drew over $930,000. I can only imagine that a PPV on the scale of WM would bring in significantly more revenue.

Also keep in mind that WCW was very competitive in terms of ratings and PPV buys during this time, the audience was much bigger than it is right now but there was a lot more competition for those dollars. You had to maximize profit margin where you could.

 

[LittleJimmy]

Stadiums have been used throughout the entire history of Wrestlemania mixed in with smaller arena shows, but it wasnt until a couple of years ago that VKM mandated that WM be held in big stadiums that were either open or with a retractable dome. This is the reason that WM30 will probably be held at Cowboys Stadium instead of MSG like it should be.

To try and make some connection between a certain era of wrestling and the venues in which Wm has held is absurd. WM is going to sell out no matter where it is because it is well.....Wrestlemania!! I have a feeling that this thread was created to just try and de-value the "Attitude Era". No matter what some of you say and want to believe that era was the biggest and most profitable era in WWE's history, just let it go.

 

[HBsam31]

Interesting question, because they could have easily sold any stadium out at that time. I can't even begin to figure out the answer. Could it be they were coming out of an extreme down time for business prior to the attitude era? Maybe Vince liked the packed in smaller noisy crowds. This is definitely a question I would like to know the real answer to.

 

[cmatthews]

when the WWF came back to atlanta in 99 the held all their Raw events inside the Georgia dome during that time wcw was using the dome as well for nitro. then in 2000 wcw switched over to philips arena which wwf switched to in july 2001.

 

[The Liar]

when the WWF came back to atlanta in 99 the held all their Raw events inside the Georgia dome during that time wcw was using the dome as well for nitro. then in 2000 wcw switched over to philips arena which wwf switched to in july 2001.

Yeah, I remember watching a 1999 RAW not that long ago, and it was in the Georgia Dome. The fans were chanting "asshole" and Stone Cold told HHH something like "what you've got is 40,000 people calling you an asshole." Now whether that was a legit number or not, I don't know. But it does puzzle me as to why RAW was held in a bigger arena than WrestleMania and SummerSlam.

 

[Equimanthorn]

I think that with the supposed financial troubles, they just didn't see it as viable. Stadiums will cost TONS more to rent than Arenas and the sheer scale of such a production was just too high a cost. Yeah, they probably could have sold them out, but when you've got WCW breathing down your necks doing house shows in the same area, inflated ticket prices are going to work in your opponent's favour more than it is yours.

WM 9 soured Vince's view on open-air shows for a long time, hence no open-air Manias. I think, also, they just didn't want to risk the prospect of putting on smaller shows in megadomes and then having to tarp off sections to make it look less of a failure, because a lot of prospective customers went to see WCW for cheaper. Why risk it when you can make just as good a return (in scale) in the arenas?

 

[The Fabulous Rougeau's]

It just wasn't that prevelant back then. Calling WM 14 the beginning of the attitude era means there were 13 prior events where only 3 of them (3,6 and 8) where held in stadiums and 2 of those (3 and 6) were during a boom period for the company.

Also, right before the attitude era the WWE was having a tough time getting 10000 fans at the show, so once buisness took off again I could imagine Vince being content with sellout after sellout at areans that fit 20000 people and didn't want to push it with stadiums. It wasn't until the continued success of the attitude era for Vince to start going to big stadiums again starting at WM 17 with Houston and then in Toronto and Seattle after that.

 

[braveh]

This is just a thought, maybe, probably the Wrestlemania brand and reputation had not recovered as quickly as Raw's reputation. After the weak years of WCW domination I'm sure Wrestlemania wasn't thought of as the premier wrestling spectacle it is today.

98 and arguably 99 some would say Starrcade was the most talked about PPV.

 

[jrush1978]

This is just a thought, maybe, probably the Wrestlemania brand and reputation had not recovered as quickly as Raw's reputation. After the weak years of WCW domination I'm sure Wrestlemania wasn't thought of as the premier wrestling spectacle it is today.

98 and arguably 99 some would say Starrcade was the most talked about PPV.

Very well might be true for 1998, I forget sometimes exactly how big WCW got there for a couple years.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

Why WWE didnt capatalise on this for Wrestlemania 2000 is a strange one. But they did for Wrestlemania 17 I suppose with the Astrodome in Texas - so it was only 1 Wrestlemania 2000 that really poses the question.

I am late into this topic but ...

I recall a pod cast with Jimmy Korderas and the co host asked Korderas why the WWE decided to have Wrestlemania 2000 in the Anaheim Pond when WM was held in that same arena 4 years prior.

I believe Korderas said the WWE at the time was really pushing for a lot of mainstream attention so they felt having WM at the LA Area would get WM that kind of exposure. I am guessing if there was a Stadium Available in the LA Area they would have booked WM there. But I guess the Pond was the best venue available.

 

[thebarber]

http://prowrestling.about.com/od/wrestlemania/a/wmthevenues.htm

As you can read, its only been since Wrestlemania 23 where WWE has consistently conducted Wrestlemania at the massive outdoor areans. Pre 2007, only Manias 3,6,8,17,18 & 19 had over 20k people in attendance.

From reading many interviews, apparently the talent themselves prefer to work indoor arena shows with the crowd nearby for reasons that vary rom a greater atmosphere to being able to hear the other guy in the ring during the match. Sure it makes much more sense to have more tickets on sale to make more money, but remember WWE also books the arenas over a year before the following years Mania. Back in the late 90s, WWE were in financial peril, 1998 onwards they seemed to get out of this rut, WWE onviously wanted to build up their security before being able to perform the Manias in massive arenas again. Guessing as history has shown, Vince was right.

 

[FlairFan2003]

Wrestlemania was always a premiere event, even in the down years. Lets be clear, the down years for WWE were 93-95, before Monday Nitro, The NWO, Goldberg, etc.

Although WCW business started picking up in late 93, it wasnt at the expense of WWE entirely. No doubt the Brett Hart "NEW Generation" era was a dud creatively and saw a major business downturn but WCW's initial upswing had more to do with old NWA fans coming back than WWE fans switching. Those fans were leaving and staying away.

As WCW business upticked further in 95 it was still older fans returning, not a huge number of WWE die hards bailing. The NWO explosion did bring WWE fans bored with a product they were loyal to but werent enjoying but it really brought in a large number of old 80s fans who quit watching in the early 90s. Even then the WCW audience was more NWA fans and older WWE fans that hadnt been watching much wrestling for several years. WWE business was mostly the same or better in the early Attitude era in 97 as it was in the 93-95 time frame.

WrestleMania was always an event that was talked about and noticed by ALL wrestling fans, it was the most watched PPV in all but one year in the 90s (Starrcade 97). There were certainly WCW shows that did well, often eclipsing most if not all non WM PPVs (Halloween Havoc 97 & 98, SuperBrawl 98 & 99, Starrcade 98) but the most watched show was consistently WM.

The audience dynamic started shifting in mid 99 as the older 80s fans started switching to WWE, you still had 10 million plus watching wrestling every week but instead of a near even split like it was in most of 98 and early 99 by late 99 it was 70-30 WWE. The decline of WCW and the over the top craziness of WWE slowly started chasing away much of that audience. Now, with older favorites like Hogan, Flair, HBK, Taker, etc completely or almost completely gone today's audience is just a bit larger than the 93-95 years, loyalists and kids, little attention from casual fans.

As far as venues, renting an arena is cheaper than a stadium and with an active WCW fighting you among advertisers and sponsors for marketing dollars from the same audience it made sense with the business of the "New Gen" era to use arenas. Why does WWE still use stadiums now when over all business is down ? They dont have to share the advertising dollars with anyone so it's easier to generate revenue even though business is slower tham it was in 97.