What Means More? (Pujols v. Bonds)

[NSL]

As of today, Albert Pujols sits at 32 home runs, and is just starting to really heat up. At this pace, he could end the season with 65+ home runs. This begs the question, will it "mean" more, than Bonds seasons of 70, and 73, with all the talk of steroids?

While I will never say Bonds wasn't a great player (he was, look at his time in Pittsburgh), there's too much controversy surrounding his great seasons, to justify them as being better than the seasons of guys like Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle, and Roger Maris. If Pujols hits more than 61, Maris' record pre-McGwire/Sosa/Bonds, it will remembered more, and held in higher regard than anything those 3 did. While they were doing their thing, it was great, but let's face it. we could see a Hall Of Fame, without them in it. Pujols is just padding his resume right now for Cooperstown, and is doing it with zero controversy swirling around him.

I'm not saying Pujols is better, has had a better career, or is a better person than Bonds. I'm just stating that I think an honest season of 61+ will mean more than the rest we've already seen.

 

[Thriller Ant]

I totally agree. As far as a lot of baseball fans are concerned, 61 is still the number to beat. I loved Mark McGwire, he was great here in St. Louis, and Sammy Sosa, but they have both been connected to steroids and very few people believe that Barry Bonds was clean. The last 100% untainted number is 61, and Albert has a chance at it. He's never been connected to steroids, does great work in the community, and is the best baseball player I, personally, have ever seen. If Albert hits 62 or more, I will consider him the single-season home run king without question.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

I wouldn't. This all comes down to if you think steroids are good for the game, or bad. I'm on the side of the fence that thinks it makes everything more exciting. In the early nineties, the home run derby had around 20,000 fans in attendance. (That's a rough estimate, obviously.) Now, it's packed! More fans go to watch games now because it's a more exciting game to watch. I love seeing lead changes, grand slams, etc. Thus, I hold nothing against anyone connected to steroids. Steroids were not banned until 2004 by Major League Baseball. Barry Bonds only broke the law, but not a single rule. You don't disagree with me that Plaxico Burress is a great receiver just because he illegally carried a gun, do you? Same situation here. Barry Bonds hit 73. He is the home run king.

 

[NSL]

You don't disagree with me that Plaxico Burress is a great receiver just because he illegally carried a gun, do you? Same situation here. Barry Bonds hit 73. He is the home run king.

I'd disagree with you on Burress, because he's over-rated. And, he's an asshole for carrying the gun. Baseball is also held in a much higher regard than football. While Manny was left off the All Star team, Shawne Merriman was nominated for Defensive Player Of The Year.

Bonds tainted America's pastime, while Pujols has embraced it, and dominated in a way we haven't seen in a long time. There was a thread here, a while back, about who could clean up the game if they were clean. Two players named the most, were Pujols and Wright. Pujols hitting 62 would go a long way to getting Congress off Selig's back.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

I'd disagree with you on Burress, because he's over-rated. And, he's an asshole for carrying the gun. Baseball is also held in a much higher regard than football. While Manny was left off the All Star team, Shawne Merriman was nominated for Defensive Player Of The Year.

Manny only played about 40 games. You don't get on the all-star team for only playing 40 games. He came back with less than 10 before the break. It wasn't because of steroids.

Bonds tainted America's pastime, while Pujols has embraced it, and dominated in a way we haven't seen in a long time. There was a thread here, a while back, about who could clean up the game if they were clean. Two players named the most, were Pujols and Wright. Pujols hitting 62 would go a long way to getting Congress off Selig's back.

It's only tainted because baseball purists see it that way. I don't see it as tainted. I see it as exciting. Maybe that's because I want to still support The Rocket, Pettite, and A-Rod.

 

[NSL]

Manny only played about 40 games. You don't get on the all-star team for only playing 40 games. He came back with less than 10 before the break. It wasn't because of steroids.

I don't remember the exact year, but Nomar Garciaparra got voted onto the team, after not playing at all. Guys make the Pro Bowl after missing 5-7 games, almost 50% of the season. Manny could've made it. He played 50% of the first half.

It's only tainted because baseball purists see it that way. I don't see it as tainted. I see it as exciting. Maybe that's because I want to still support The Rocket, Pettite, and A-Rod.

And baseball purists are the ones that go to the games, watch them on TV, obsess over fantasy leagues, and let the owners know what they think. I'm sure there's more casual fans than not, but a sport can't survive on casual fans. Look at soccer in the US, or hockey in Florida.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

I don't remember the exact year, but Nomar Garciaparra got voted onto the team, after not playing at all. Guys make the Pro Bowl after missing 5-7 games, almost 50% of the season. Manny could've made it. He played 50% of the first half.

He didn't play fifty percent. Let me look. He played 36 games, 41%.

And baseball purists are the ones that go to the games, watch them on TV, obsess over fantasy leagues, and let the owners know what they think. I'm sure there's more casual fans than not, but a sport can't survive on casual fans. Look at soccer in the US, or hockey in Florida.

No they aren't. Purists are the ones that prefer the old days of small ball to the era of the home run, detest steroids, etc. I go to games, watch them on TV, I don't actually do fantasy baseball, and I would gladly let Steinbrenner know that he NEEDS to acquire Roy Hallady.

There aren't any fans of hockey in Flordia, or soccer in the USA. Casual fans are the ones that go to WWE events and mark out, not the cynical ones that come here and complain about everything. That's what a casual fan is. I should have said the average fan. That would have been better.

 

[CH David]

He didn't play fifty percent. Let me look. He played 36 games, 41%.



No they aren't. Purists are the ones that prefer the old days of small ball to the era of the home run, detest steroids, etc. I go to games, watch them on TV, I don't actually do fantasy baseball, and I would gladly let Steinbrenner know that he NEEDS to acquire Roy Hallady.

There aren't any fans of hockey in Flordia, or soccer in the USA. Casual fans are the ones that go to WWE events and mark out, not the cynical ones that come here and complain about everything. That's what a casual fan is. I should have said the average fan. That would have been better.

The reason that purists prefer small ball, is because it is the right way to play a game. Great example, and FTS will hate me for it if he sees this because I brought it up. Game 4 of the 2005 World Series. 8th inning of an awesome pitchers duel between Brandon Backe and Freddy Garcia. Brad Lidge comes in for Backe in the 8th. Willie Harris pinch hit for Garcia, singled. Was bunted to second, and moved to third before Jermaine Dye singled him in. Sox win 1-0 and clinch the World Series.

Small ball is the way you produce when you can't hit for shit on a particular night. The winning formula for baseball is pitching, defense, and timely hitting. The reason everyone loves the home run, is because it is exciting to them. Trust in me when I say this, if you try swinging for the fences every swing you take, you will fuck up, and you will have a low batting average and make outs on balls that you would normally have a hit on. If you just take normal swings, the home runs will come. But that is the era we live in, home runs are the entertainment, when small ball takes the back seat.

Now onto your question NSL. I think I may be the resident baseball purist on here, I don't know. If and when Pujols breaks 61, he will be my home run king. He is doing it clean and not tainting America's past time, which for the MLB is 109 years, and fuck, the NL has been a major league since 1876, so what Sosa, Bonds, and McGuire did was taint not only MLB history, but also the National League's history as well.

The reason why steroids are bad in general, do we even need to go through it. It is bad to let kids know that steroids are okay to take. They cause roid rage, obviously, and have led to quite a few teen suicides. Do we really want that in our society? So steroids equals tainted records. Maris is my single season home run king, and Hank Aaron is my all time home run king. If Pujols breaks it, he is the king then.