What If They Lived

[stavros241000]

What if they lived. What if Brian Pillman, Eddie Guerrero, Chris Benoit, Curt Hennig, Owen Hart and all those other mega-stars who died too soon, just didn't? Would Benoit ever have been WWE champion? Eddie Guerrero was booked to win the WHC, but Rey took his place, where would he be? Where would Eddie be? What would have become of Pillman? Owen Hart? What do YOU think? Who was the one that really died too soon? Who could have accomplished the most? Personally, I think it was Owen. Eddie & Benoit had already accomplished a ton, and Owen was said to have been retiring in 2001. I believe Pillman would have been a HUGE part of the Attitude Era, been a 5x WWF Champ, 1x WCW World Heavyweight Champion, and 6x IC champion, as well as being a 3x Tag Team champion. I believe he would have been one of the G.O.A.T, a top 20 of all time. I believe he had it all.

 

[zhaff2004]

I think you may be overrating Pillman slightly... I don't doubt that he could've been great, but a 5x WWF(E) champ, 1 time WCW champ, 6 x IC champ and 3x Tag champ, that puts him on the level of Austin, Taker, Rocky, HBK and HHH. That is some company... I'd go a bit lower and say he'd have been lucky to have obtained the success Y2J had in the WWE(F).

The roster at the time was just too stacked. It was only years after the attitude era that Eddy and Chris really started getting the recognition they deserved and even they didn't come close to winning the main strap 5 times.

I do believe, however, that he could've accomplished the most simply because he hadn't received as much success and recognition as other names such as Benoit, Hart, Eddy and Mr Perfect.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

He isn't overrating Pillman, but the problem wasn't the roster depth - it was the car wreck/injury he had in 96, right after signing his WWF deal that basically destroyed his ankle and in ring career. Had THAT not happened, there is no question that Pillman AND Austin would have been as big as each other. Pillman would have won that KOTR tourney rather than Austin and used it as the platform - It was telling that Brian made a controversial promo BEFORE 3:16 on that night - Austin's was a case of "doing it cos his friend couldn't" and the rest is history.

Pillman had the high-flying style of Owen and the technical prowess of Bret combined with the intangible that his mic work and crazed persona brought to the table. You think Austin and Rock could talk? Pillman was better and had that danger that Russo and others were pushing for. He also had the "overcoming adversity" story from his childhood cancer, as a Face to Austin's heel he would have been very much someone Vince could push in the traditional "boyhood dream" way.

But he DID have that accident, thus took far more painkillers than he should so no he wouldn't have gotten the accolades as he could barely move by the time he died - the heart condition that killed him was also there so it was more a matter of time rather than bad luck. an IC run was likely and I think on the way when he died, the fued with Goldust would have been the final step to that but Pillman post accident and when he signed were 2 totally different propositions.

Owen was never getting the title, he'd have worked those final 2 years and retired - Vince MIGHT have given him a run on the way out so he could be "squashed" for whoever his new star was or just for Vince's amusement. If Owen ever was gonna have it, it would have been in 94 in the cage or 95 instead of Backlund for Diesel to squash.

What you have to bear in mind is every incident affects everything thereafter. If Pillman lives/stays healthy then guys like Jericho and Benoit may not have ever made the WWF or may have come in to feud with him. Eddie dying forced WWE to look at new stars and the Benoit tragedy forced them to "stay PG".

 

[Jerichoholic8894]

I remember reading a while back (And I keep in mind that it could have been false, but I like to believe it was true). That a insider for the WWE said that the mega-push that John Cena received was actually what they had planned for Eddie Guerrero, small world huh?

 

[MrMojoRisin]

IF they had lived...

Let's see:

Benoit - Would have put some time in as the face of the WWE's ECW brand, before settling into a role in the WWE's developmental system as a trainer. Don't forget that he'd already been around for close to 20 years by the time of his tragedy, and his career was definitely winding down

Guerrero - Rumor has it that John Cena's push was originally supposed to be Eddie's. That's possible, or not... but had Eddie lived, there would have easily been a few years of Eddie on or near the top. His character was just incredible. His work was top notch. He was OVER.

Pillman - Depends. Does he still have his accident, or is it a healthy Loose Cannon who lives (the factors that lead to his death all began with the accident). A healthy Pillman living... completely changes the Attitude Era. Simply put, you wouldn't look back on the Austin/McMahon feud as the biggest thing of that era. You'd look at the Austin/Pillman feud. Brian Pillman, simply put... could have been one of the biggest stars wrestling ever saw... if it wasn't for that accident.

Hart - You would have seen a few more years of him going through the motions, and he would have simply retired home to Calgary and his family once he had enough saved up. Owen had a great career, and was enough of a talent that he could have been one of the best ever... but he always saw wrestling as a way to provide for his family, and nothing more than that. He may have eventually gotten a Christian style run with the belt, but that's about it. The one thing if he'd lived though... is I think Bret would have come back while he still had gas left in the tank, and we would have seen a final Hart Foundation run (Bret alluded to something like that in his book, with Austin and Rock trying to talk him into coming back, and him considering it because he hated WCW, but then Owen dies and that changes everything).

Hennig - Not much different as far as he's concerned. His career was pretty much over by the time he passed away

Art Barr - Adding him, because he could have potentially been as big as anyone else had he lived. If you don't know about him, just think of it like this. A lot of what Eddie Guerrero brought to the ring.... he learned from Art Barr. An American who could merge styles from around the world, tell a story in the ring that would leave you on the edge of your seat, and draw so much heat that he made the first DX look like choir boys? It would have been amazing.

 

[lil bitch Kid]

This is clearly a case of revisionist history remembering guys for what fans wanted them to be and not what the really were:

Pillman: I do t know that Brian would have ever got the main event title. As much as the loose cannon personality was a role and a gimmick, Pillman was unpredictable to work with as well. Austin played the role of the anti-establishment face perfectly. Pillman would have been redundant. Yes, there might have been a top feud between the two, but Pillman wasn't going over. Yes, btw, the injury held Pillman down.

Owen: while I think Owen deserved a push to te top more than any others, Owen was and would always be in the shadow of Bret.

Guerrero: I've said it once, I'll say it again and again, Eddie was good, maybe even great, but not a main event talent. He got the title off Brock is a very weak way, and then defended it, also, in ways that made him look weak. Eddie, as champ, rarely, if ever, won clean, and never finished a ppv show as far as I can remember.he got pushed w cause of te feel good nature of his story. And any mention of Eddie being slated for the Cena push is, well, wikitastic.

Perfect: umm, he was a bloated shadow of a building of his former self when he died. So, no. He would have/could have been the most laudable asset in developmental.

Benoit: he was slated to win the ECW title the night he killed his wife, son and self. He would have helped build that brand with legitimacy rather than reliance on younger guys to get it done. I think Benoit's time in ECW would have fast tracked the pushes to Raw and SD for Morrison and Punk.

 

[WWEvsJosh]

I really dont think any of them would have changed anything for the most part.

Eddie- I think he could have won another world title here and there but him being where Cena is today is just BS. He would be where Booker T was or where Jericho is but he would not be at the top of the card.

Pillman- Same with Eddie I think. Good but not Austin good. He had all the tools but so does many wrestlers, that does not just meen you will be huge.

Why Mr. Perfect is on here is beyond me. He was done already.

Benoit- Is the same as Eddie. If he was going to be huge he would have been. He won one World title in the time of when he won at WM20 to his death. If they had plans to keep him in the amin title scene he would have been there by then. I dont even remeber him getting many title shots after he lost the World title.

Owen- Good but really was never going to get the title.

 

[EastCoastFan]

Brian Pillman was a talented wrestler and his "Loose Cannon" character went great with the Attitude Era, but I don't think Pillman would have had a run as WWF Champ. I-C Champ, maybe, but not the big one.

Eddie Guerrero had a great career and reportedly was going to get another world title reign at the time of his death. He would have continued to be a key player on Smackdown, maybe even getting a move to Raw.

Much of Chris Benoit's problems came about because of Eddie's death. If Eddie had lived, Benoit would not have lapsed into that terrible depression. He was not going to get another world title reign, but would have been ECW champ once or twice before the brand shut down in 2010. Afterwards, he probably would have become a part-time wrestler and road agent.

Curt Hennig's career was already winding down at the time of his death, as he was a jobber during his last WWF/E run in 2002. He probably would have retired and/or become a road agent.

Owen Hart was not getting a run as WWF Champion. He was a great in-ring wrestler, but he never really established an identity for himself other than being "Bret Hart's brother". He was reportedly slated to win the I-C title at Over The Edge the night he died, though. My guess is he would have defended the title for a while, then dropped it to someone else and remained a mid-card wrestler. It's well documented that Owen was looking to eventually get out of the wrestling business (according to Bret, Owen almost quit the WWF in 1993). If Owen had lived, the biggest difference IMO is that it wouldn't have taken so long for Bret and Vince to bury the hatchet.

 

[James]

He isn't overrating Pillman, but the problem wasn't the roster depth - it was the car wreck/injury he had in 96, right after signing his WWF deal that basically destroyed his ankle and in ring career. Had THAT not happened, there is no question that Pillman AND Austin would have been as big as each other. Pillman would have won that KOTR tourney rather than Austin and used it as the platform - It was telling that Brian made a controversial promo BEFORE 3:16 on that night - Austin's was a case of "doing it cos his friend couldn't" and the rest is history.

Pillman had the high-flying style of Owen and the technical prowess of Bret combined with the intangible that his mic work and crazed persona brought to the table. You think Austin and Rock could talk? Pillman was better and had that danger that Russo and others were pushing for. He also had the "overcoming adversity" story from his childhood cancer, as a Face to Austin's heel he would have been very much someone Vince could push in the traditional "boyhood dream" way.

But he DID have that accident, thus took far more painkillers than he should so no he wouldn't have gotten the accolades as he could barely move by the time he died - the heart condition that killed him was also there so it was more a matter of time rather than bad luck. an IC run was likely and I think on the way when he died, the fued with Goldust would have been the final step to that but Pillman post accident and when he signed were 2 totally different propositions.

Owen was never getting the title, he'd have worked those final 2 years and retired - Vince MIGHT have given him a run on the way out so he could be "squashed" for whoever his new star was or just for Vince's amusement. If Owen ever was gonna have it, it would have been in 94 in the cage or 95 instead of Backlund for Diesel to squash.

What you have to bear in mind is every incident affects everything thereafter. If Pillman lives/stays healthy then guys like Jericho and Benoit may not have ever made the WWF or may have come in to feud with him. Eddie dying forced WWE to look at new stars and the Benoit tragedy forced them to "stay PG".

I'm not dismissing your post, but how did the CB murdering force them to stay PG? I thought that had to do with a lot of the pressures from their sponsors?

 

[GameOver]

stay PG? they only left strictly PG entertainment for the 4 years of the height of attitude era and even then it was TV14, the other 70yrs they've been family entertainment, PG based.

getting rid of all the edge, violence, blood is purely stockholders, network and sponsor deals requests to make the show totally family friendly and all this happened when they went publicly traded in October of 1999 after WCW went belly up the show was rapidly toned down. and within 2years we had the Ruthless Agression era, which was a toned down version of Attitude. Benoit didn't happen til 2007 years after they went publicly traded and 1 year after they implemented the Wellness Protection Policy as a result of Eddie Guerrero's death, Super Cena (kiddie fiddler) was the main man at the time of CB's incident, obviously the aftermath of that was they had to be really carefull and thus they went restricted even further the use of chair shots, head shots, blood to a minimum. CB's may have had something to do with how far PG they have taken it but it certainly wasn't the reason they stopped the attitude era.

the other thing to consider, WWF pre the attitude era was very family friendly, Hogan was very kiddy friendly too and did all the Charity stuff Cena does, well what was available at the time but he appealed to 90% of the crowd not 50/50 like Cena. The Attitude era just took everything far too much the other way and they had nowhere to go, they couldn't keep pushing the bar higher, stars were killing themselves to go higher and higher. Hence a change back to a simpler time gives everyone a chance to long for something again, rather then, meh we see people getting hit with chairs every match and bleeding over and over, it's overdone. and they can move forward which they have done in small steps.
so if you look at the ebb and flow we've done the Hogan era V2 and Cena's winding down making more and more room for the New Generation V2, what comes next is anyone's guess at this point but i seriously doubt it will ever be that same level of evil violence and sex that lasted for 6 magical years.

as for the question at hand,
Owen - woulda stayed relevant as an upper midcarder til his contract expired then he would've left wanting to follow Bret but wasn't allowed out of his contract.
Eddie - woulda been champion atleast twice more, he was scheduled to win again just going on the push towards a face change again b4 he died
Benoit - was never a big thing in Vince's eyes so he woulda been a mainstay always in the title hunt but not often the holder, and maybe he woulda been a lockerroom leader like Taker
Mr Perfect - would've retired he was badly injured anyway
Brian Pillman - would definately have won singles gold, not necessarily the big one but t say he was on the same level that Austin achieved is bullshit, he was good but he was no Stone Cold Steve Austin. he was o par with Stunning Steve no doubt but SC Austin was a completely different tier.

 

[pshanbhag92]

On October 5, 1997 Brian Pillman passed away.

When he died, he was in the middle of an extremely entertaining feud with Gooldust, at the end of which Pillman was supposed to come up top. He was pretty over with the crowd and had an amazing gimmick 'Loose Canon' gimmick going for him.

My question is, how far do you think he could have reached if he had not died?

I think, Brian Pillman would have been in the main event had he not died. I mean, with Bret Hart getting screwed and Shawn Michaels leaving, there was a serious gap in the main event. I think Pillman would have feuded with Austin after WrestleMania 14. We'd have seen Pillman VS Austin instead of Dude Love VS Austin. Mick Foley would have continued to tag with Fuck and face the New Age Outlaws.


After Bret Hart got screwed at Survivor Series, Pillman would have betrayed Owen a tag match and joined DX. That would have been pretty cool.

 

[wrestler36]

I think Brian would have had a huge on screen presence, but I think it would have been more as a manager for somebody or a stable of guys, rather than a wrestler. He was never the same after the Hummer accident and was relying heavily on meds. If he had stopped the physical aspect of wrestling and became a manager or some sort of GM style position, he still could have had a huge impact, whether feuding with DX or Austin or even the NOD.

 

[AhSpicyDrop]

Honestly he probably would have stayed in the mid-to-upper midcard rankings for the rest of his career. Pillman had a ton of shock value and he could make people want to watch him, but not in the sense of headlining. He had a lot of nagging leg problems that would have prevented him from carrying out any sort of longevity on the road in the sense of working high level matches.

If I had the book back then I would have cashed in on Pillman's "loose cannon" style and had him host a talk show ala Piper's Pit. I think that would have grabbed the audience's attention for the long-term while keeping Pillman out of the ring outside of important feuds that would come along.

 

[#heel420]

I think he probably would have reached the main event at some point and have a feud with Steve Austin for awhile. I don't know how long he would last in the main event scene though, just because the talent pool was so deep then. Other than that I see a lot of IC title reigns.

 

[JUSTINMFNBEEMER]

Didnt i just read this same basic post less then a week ago?

Im guessing he would hover around upper mid maybe top then have retired within a couple years due to his ankle, perhaps became an announcer.

 

[Dysturbed]

In case this for some reason isn't merged with the thread from two weeks ago, I will repeat my thoughts.

The Pillman dvd made is pretty clear that he was in a lot of pain when or after performing so unfortunately I don't know how much longer he would have been healthy enough to compete. Hypothetically though, if he was able to compete with less pain, despite the accident (meaning with the lessened high flying ability), I think that he would have eventually ended up as one of the top stars, or at least feuding with them of having a big midcard role. Just as The Rock and Triple H as well as The Rock and Austin had midcard feuds that eventually translated into main event feuds, Austin vs Pillman could have ended up that way as well, in theory at least. At some point he could have maybe become a face since certain heels tend to eventually get cheered. At that point maybe a renewed Austin/Pillman team (more likely just an alliance) could have existed, even if there was tension involved. Things of that nature. Realistically though, he probably would have lasted only a few more years of active competition. Ideally, if healthy enough he would have reached the main event scene.

 

[pshanbhag92]

I totally agree that he would have wrestled for maybe 3-4 more years before retiring. Still, I strongly believe we would have seen a Brian Pillman VS Steve Austin feud, right after WrestleMania 14. They had the history and the chemistry. It would have been awesome.

The Rock would still have been The Rock. Triple H how ever I think would not have gotten the opportunities that he got, if Pillman would have been there.
A factor to note is that Pillman was friends with Austin, and Austin would probably insist on working with Pillman since they were good together.

 

[pshanbhag92]

The roster at the time was just too stacked..

What stacked? After WrestleMania 14, the roster was extremely thin. How many legit main event stars were there in WWE? Their corner stone, The Undertaker and their new star Stone Cold Steve Austin. That was it. Bret had been screwed, Shawn was injured, Sid had left and Vader was considering retirement and thus was being used to put of younger guys. That is four wrestlers who were big time main eventers just an year earlier. WWE had Mick Foley, but even during that period, he wasn't a legit main event star. My opinion.

Undertaker was busy feuding with Kane, and Stone Cold needed an opponent. And who did he get? Dude Love.
Sure, the real feud was with Mr. McMahon, but it was Dude Love who face Austin at the PPV main events.
This spot of Dude love I feel could have gone to Brian Pillman.

He would have feuded with Austin, becoming a huge star in the process. He would have been a focal point of the Attitude Era. When talking about the Attitude Era, we'd be taking Brian Pillman's name in the same breath as Undertaker and Triple H.

But he would have retired by 2001, due to his injuries.

 

[pshanbhag92]

Brian Pillman - Already wrote about him.

Eddie Guerrero - Maybe one or two world title reigns. But his best days were behind him. He would be in the upper mid card, jumping to the main event when ever WWE needed him to. Like Big Show has been doing.

Chris Benoit - Chris Benoit's time was up. He'd be the top guy in ECW for like an year, then maybe come back to Raw for one last feud before retiring. Nothing great.

Curt Hennig - Curt Hennig's career in WWE was over. He wouldn't come back. Maybe sign a legends contract several year later. At best, he would have had a mediocre run in TNA, being used to put over younger talent.

Owen Hart - He would have been kept in the mid card for the rest of his career. Not even the upper mid card. He would have been used to put over guys like Jericho and Benoit in 1999-2000 and would have finally retired in 2001ish.

 

[MINISTRYrising]

OWEN HART - I don't think you would have ever seen owen in the main Event, But I do think he would have had a run as IC Champion. To be fair I don't think Owen would have remained in WWE much longer and I think he would have either retired or ended up wrestling for another promotion.

BENOIT - I'm sure he would have had a nice run as ECW champion and maybe he would have had another shot as World Champion, but that would have been it. I think in the end you would have seen him leave WWE and either have gone to wrestle in Japan or gone to TNA, Where he would have had at least had one run as TNA world champion.

EDDIE - Eddie would have gone on to win the World Title a couple of Times and maybe another run as Tag Team champion with Chavo at some point down the line. After his in ring career would have ended I'm sure Eddie woiuld have remained With WWE as possible a GM or ring announcer

MR PERFECT - I have to agree with everyone else when they say that his in ring career was more or less over by this point. I'm sure you would have seen him wrestle the odd match now and then for WWE like Jim Duggen does but that would be it. Most likely he would have ended up a agent or possible as a announcer, With him managing his son for a while when he first debuted.

PILLMAN - While the guy did have tallent, I don't think he would have ever been a main event guy. I think he would have had a run as IC champion and Run as Tag Champion with somebody, But that is about it.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Brian Pillman was never going to be a big time, main event star in WWE because he just didn't really have it in the ring anymore by the time he got to WWE. I don't recall exactly, but I think all the bones in one of his ankle were fused together? Pillman was a high flyer and an athletic guy in his prime but he lost a a great deal of that by the time he was in WWE. I don't think Pillman would have been as big as Austin. Austin was just the right character with the right look at the right time.

Eddie Guerrero would probably have a few more World Championship reigns under his belt in WWE. It's entirely possible that he might even still be in the ring today either in WWE or TNA.

I think Chris Benoit would be someone that spent much of his time in the upper mid-card scene, making occasional trips into the main event picture. I'd say he'd have had at least 1 more World Championship run in WWE. For some reason, I think Benoit would have left WWE at some point and wound up in TNA.

When Curt Hennig passed away, his best years were well behind him. He's already accomplished all he was going to. Hennig is one of the best to have never been WWE Champion. By now, Hennig would either be long since retired from the ring, wrestling in TNA, working behind the scenes or on commentary in TNA, working behind the scenes or commentary in WWE or just out of wrestling altogether.

When it comes to Owen Hart, I think he would have eventually been WWE Champion at least once. I think he'd be someone like Chris Jericho in which he'd be in the upper mid-card and main event scenes frequently. If he were still alive, I think he'd still be involved in wrestling somehow.

 

[TheBottomLine]

Personally, the way the Owen Hart character was going at the time of his death could mean he was winding down, but I could be wrong, he could have had an IC title run ir two left in him, I don't really think he would have won the WWF title tbh.

Pillman could have been great, his feud with Austin, especially the 'Pillman's got a gun' side to it was excellent, although a bit soap opera-y. But as people said, after the crash, messing up his ankle definitely took away from him and his in-ring ability.

I haven't got much to say about Mr.Perfect, he was past it when he died, he wasn't going anywhere when he died.

Now Eddie and Benoit, these two could have had another title run or two left, Benoit was on the ECW brand at the time, maybe there to help push stars along, who knows, and as I think it has been said already, he was billed to win the ECW title that night. Eddie could still be going now, I could still see him fitting in this era atm. Benoit too, it's shame how mentally unstable people become after years and years of wrestling.