What if HHH won KOTR 1996?

[KillBill]

Someone had started a thread about the King of the Ring 1996, and an interesting point was brought up. HHH was the one who was supposed to win it and get that push. However due to the MSG incident, he was punished and went nowhere for a year. But what if he didn't come out, or didn't get punished?

The answer is simple. There would be no Stone Cold Steve Austin. This is what started his run. We can all assume he would have gotten pushed eventually, but without that famous 3:16 speech, what would have happened? None of those T-shirts, maybe no huge push til later on, maybe no broken neck, i don't know, the possibilities are endless.

And HHH? I think he becomes bigger sooner, therefor not needing HBK to elevate his status. No jobbing to Warrior, none of that. So maybe he starts becoming a ME and upper mid-carder, therefor, maybe no DX. Then, no Montreal Screwjob. Or maybe DX starts earlier, or later.

I think they both become big, but HHH is earlier, Austin later, and without his 316 speech to catapult him, he becomes a star later on, and continues wrestling until maybe a few years ago. But maybe theres no attitude era, therefor, WWE loses business........

What do you guys think? Its the Butterfly Effect, change 1 thing, change everything......

 

[The Brain]

I don't think it would have made that much of a difference. Austin was just waiting to break out. King of the Ring was the first big push, but it would have come eventually anyway. Remember he wrestled Bret Hart at Survivor Series in the Hitman's comeback match. I could be completely wrong, but I think a match that big would have been planned well ahead of time. The program with Bret probably would have happened with or without King of the Ring. That is what really brought Austin to a new level. The biggest difference is he may not have ever had the chance to coin the 3:16 catchphrase. This was a huge help in his popularity, and was obviously a huge money maker for the WWF. I think Austin would have become popular and the attitude era would have happened. The only thing that might have suffered is merchandising. You could just as easily ask "what if Jake Roberts wasn't Austin's opponent in the final?" Austin could have beaten Mero, for example, in the finals instead of the opening round. He would have still won the tournament, but not been able to use the 3:16 speech.

As for Triple H, I don't think there would have been any difference in his career. After his MSG punishment was over he was given the IC title. The IC title was still considered a major push in those days. He may have won it a little earlier, but I think it's reasonable to say the IC title would have been the next step after King of the Ring. His career would play out the same. It was just put on hold for a few months. Shawn and Hunter would get in Vince's ear soon enough and bring attitude in just as it went down. Just for the record, Triple H had already jobbed to Warrior before the MSG incident and King of the Ring.

 

[y2empleh]

I don't really believe there would have been much change. KOTR is nice in theory but really doesn't amount to much other then a small push for a few weeks or months.

Let's look at HHH. Assuming he doe win the KOTR, he gets a mild push for a blueblood king then the KOTR eventually fades and yes he will need HBK and DX to elevate him.

Austin: Just because he doesn't beat Roberts in the finals doesn't mean he can't still give the infamous speech DOWN THE LINE. It was good marketing and eventually austin would have likely faced roberts in another ppv where they would do the post-match interview for the line then. I've never believed it was the austin 3:16 speech that got austin popularity, it was his eventual match with bret hart at wrestlemania that made austin popular.

 

[Showtime]

Considering he won KOTR the next year in 97 I doubt very little would've changed for him. As stated if he won instead of Austin then there wouldn't be Stone Cold Steve Austin and the whole Austin 3:16. HHH probably would've still won the 11 plus world championships, feuded with all the big stars, headline numerous PPV's, married the bosses daughter, DX, e.t.c. It's impossible to fully predict what will happen in someone's wrestling career if one event from their past was done differently. So when we are asking how HHH's career would've been if he won the KOTR the year before I'd say it would be exactly the same..... except without Austin. So a lot less meaningful.

 

[The Brain]

Austin: Just because he doesn't beat Roberts in the finals doesn't mean he can't still give the infamous speech DOWN THE LINE. It was good marketing and eventually austin would have likely faced roberts in another ppv where they would do the post-match interview for the line then. I've never believed it was the austin 3:16 speech that got austin popularity, it was his eventual match with bret hart at wrestlemania that made austin popular.

The thing is I don’t think the 3:16 line was planned. It was a spontaneous line that stuck. This was one of those special things that just fell into place. No one told him to say that and I don’t think anyone would have written that in later on. It just happened. I don’t think Austin would have worked with Roberts down the line. They were not feuding. They just happened to cross paths in the tournament. I agree it was the feud with Bret that really made Austin popular. He still would have been popular. I just think WWF would have missed the opportunity to market all that 3:16 merchandise. Austin 3:16 was to the 90’s what Hulkamania was to the 80’s. He probably would have still sold a lot a merchandise, just not nearly as much without the famous 3:16 phrase

 

[Y 2 Jake]

Maybe no Steve Austin, whatever, who cares. I'm more intrested in what'd happen to Triple H. He was awful until Mick Foley got his, possibly grubby, hands on him. Winning it a year later was the best thing for Triple H's career. A year easiler and I think he would've failed spectacularly. As such I think he'd be a footnote in wrestling history, I really do.

 

['Classic' Ric]

What if Tom Zenk won it??????

 

[ssvegita77]

I beleive in the butterfly effect, so I really don't think Austin would have been as huge as quick. The speech really put him on the map. I remember as I watched KOTR 96' and heard him say it I knew right at that moment that something big just happened. It wasn't just the speech though. It was the fact that Austin got a bloody lip from Mero, got it stitched up, came back, annihalated the newly born again veteran and then gave an interview saying what we all were thinking.

He talked about how Jake was an old shriveled up husk of a former talent. He made it like beating Jake was no trouble at all and it wasn't. Jake supposedly had bruised or broken ribs from his first match w/ Vader and Austin relentlessly went to work on them. The whole night showed that he was tough, ruthless, hungry and fed up(thats the kind of guy I want to support). Steve showed what alot of people who followed his career had said, that Steve Austin is a star waiting to happen. KOTR 96' was about Steve Austin tapping into his full potential. It was truly awesome.

HHH did well to be punished for that year. I would see signs in the audience that would say "HHH Midcard 4 Life," and I would just laugh. I picked him to be champ very early on (I had no idea he would turn out as a 12X Champion). I don't know if he needed HBK's endorsement but it certainly helped. He is clearly his own man now, but I'll forever associate him as one of Shawn's running buddies. If he won KOTR 96' it wouldn't have segued into the forming of DX. In fact he probably would have feuded (and lost to) w/ HBK after his feud with Vader concluded. In HHH's case I would definately say all's well that ends well.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

I think we would have seen Triple H leaving for WCW around 1997 after losing to Shawn and Bret in feuds and ending up where Booker T did for them... With a few title runs before returning later on...

3:16 wouldn't have happened, but Austin would have still got over, probably feuding for the IC title with Marc Mero and Mr. Perfect and maybe Ahmed before going into a feud with Bret and getting over... He wouldn't have fought Owen when he did, or broken his neck... Austin would still have won the title at a similar point, but been a lot healthier and around much longer...

 

[cmiller52]

If MSG doesn't happen HHH never becomes a jobber which he was for aboput 2 months hell he didn't even last a min with warrior which wouldn't have been a match. unless I'm mistaking it took HHH almost a year after kotr to win the IC belt... before stone cold won the KOTR the winner always got a world title shot at summerslam... I think if HHH won they would have went with HHH vs HBK only to loose but then with the IC... he would have never lost a match with marc mero. Also he might have won the next Royal Rumble

Stone Cold would have been a career heel. no austin 3:16 as stated in other post. no match with brett hart because he would be getting pushed as a top heel yet... no cheat in RR97 in fact I don't think he would have got pushed until next KOTR

Finally Brett never leaves the WWE... why... cause stone cold wouln't have gotten chears with out the 3:16 speach fans loved him for some reason... Brett has even said that it was his match with stone cold at WM13 where he started to part with WWE. Stone cold got cheared as a heel while bret was the face which led to brett becoming a heel Brett would have never been a heel if stone cold didn't get cheared. Brett would have remained a top face and would have been happy... brett didn't want to be a heel and hated it even more when he wasn't even the top heel so he left got screwed and never came back.

DX would still happen but it would have been a heel version of the Mega Powers...

also why did HHH get punished for the MSG thing i never got that

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Trips was punished as he was the only guy left they could touch...

In those days WWE was still heavily kayfabed and the internet was far less active, thus many didn't even know that Nash and Hall were leaving... Breaking chararacter in the ring as they did, the Kliq did several things in one moment...

1) Give a finger to kayfabe and the "traditions of keeping in character" when in view of the public... at the time still very integral to WWE... in essence they damaged the business in the eyes of many in the locker room...

2) Sent a message to the rest of the locker room that even though Nash and Hall were leaving, they still called the shots backstage... behind only Vince... it was a never before seen display of true wrestler power... which Vince did not like... and it advertised Nash and Hall's depature, encouraging people to tune into the competition...

3) It was done while Vince as not in the building... As such it was a major breach of trust from some of his most trusted performers...

Trips was the scapegoat... HBK was too far into the main event picture to damage... and he was known for taking his ball home with punishments before... so Hunter bit the bullet... He jobbed for a very long time, far longer than 2 months and was put into the infamous Hog Pen match (which legitemately risked his health due to an unplanned cut...) Love him or hate him... Trips took his punishment and showed the loyalty to the company the others didn't...even though he was least to blame... and it's why Vince respected his opinion thereafter.

 

[The Brain]

If MSG doesn't happen HHH never becomes a jobber which he was for aboput 2 months hell he didn't even last a min with warrior which wouldn't have been a match. unless I'm mistaking it took HHH almost a year after kotr to win the IC belt... before stone cold won the KOTR the winner always got a world title shot at summerslam... I think if HHH won they would have went with HHH vs HBK only to loose but then with the IC... he would have never lost a match with marc mero. Also he might have won the next Royal Rumble

A lot of people have their timeline messed up here. Jobbing to Warrior was NOT a punishment for the MSG incident. He jobbed to Warrior at WrestleMania in March. The MSG incident took place in May. He was feuding with Mero immediatley after Mania and had already lost to him before MSG. He then won the IC title from Mero in October only five months after MSG. Someone else mentioned the hog pen match as part of the punishment. That took place in December 95, six months before MSG. He served about a four or five month punishment. That's it. I don't even remember him jobbing that much. I think he was kept off tv almost entirely. I could be wrong as I did not have cable back then so I did not get to see raw a lot.

 

[byrnside]

Sorry I had to go back and edit this, as I didn't read all the other posts, which I'm now regretting. So please don't ban me for spam!

original statement: I disagree, I think Austin's push would've just gone back a little bit. He still could've gone over at the Royal Rumble, or even the next King of the Ring. 3:16 probably wouldn't have happened, but as far as I'm concerned, that's not what most of us remember Austin for anyway.

New statement: I'm with the Brain, a lot of you are confused about the timeline. The hog pen match wasn't even supposed to be with Triple H. If I remember reading [I think in Triple H's book] correctly, it was supposed to be Adam Bomb [Bryan Clarke] in that program with Henry Godwinn, not Triple H. Adam Bomb was too big of a primadonna [ironic, eh?] to do the slop thing, so Triple H stepped up and did it. If I'm not mistaken The Wrestlemania 12/Warrior thing happened before the MSG thing. That was more trying to keep the Warrior happy, than it was to keep Triple H down. And Triple H won the IC strap before 1997 started, which would've been a little more than 6 months after the MSG thing. Triple H didn't need the rub of HBK, Stephanie or anyone else. He busted his ass just like most everyone else to get to the top. Being friends with HBK, and marrying Steph just made it happen faster. Marrying Steph didn't make him a good wrestler. Triple H lives and breaths the business, and if I was in wrestling I would do the same thing.. Make friends with HBK, Kevin Nash, Flair, etc. [or their current equivalent] to learn as much as I could too. It obviously worked.

 

[Tastycles]

I'm with Jake on this one. Had HHH won in 1996, Austin would have won in 1997, and he probably would have ended up in the same place he did. That character was there for the taking. HHH was fully Hunter Hearst Helmsley in 1996, which is not the gimmivck or style of a succesful wrestler. He'd probably have won a midcard title, flopped, and then become a jobber before leaving. The key for him becoming remotely relevant was getting put with Shawn Michaels, and more importantly Chyna, on screen, and had he had a singles push earlier, that wouldn't have happened.

Ultimately, we'd have spent a good portion of the 2000s with people like Kane as the World Champion, that would have been the difference that would be most apparent.