What about Jay Lethal?

[Trill Co$by]

Ok so like I'm sitting here watching TNA for the past two months and I see this big thing with Immortal playing out and the only thing in my mind that I can't grasp is... what about Jay Lethal? What about the guy who Hogan was pushing to the moon and helped become X-Division champion once more? Surely TNA hasn't forgotten about him. He's been the guy who can take to Fortune since before they were known as Fortune... like seriously.

If you ask me, I'd love to see what Jay Lethal would do in the heel section of the roster, but I could also see how he would work for the faces here.

Anyway, where do you guys think Jay would fit in?

PS. i know he's working a program with Robbie E. but still he doesn't belong there.

 

[Hulk Hogan's Brother]

Well Lethal is sucking right now because the X-Division is sucking. Lethal should be a part of the main storyline of TNA vs Immortal on TNA's side. I think i would be possible once Kazarian gets the X-Division belt and starts a feud with Lethal. I mean Immortals would, sooner or later, hold all the belts. Kaz will be the guy holding the X-Division title. That is when Lethal would enter the main storyline.

Lethal will get his place under the sun as soon as TNA realize that pushing Robbie E was a mistake. Lets hope that happens soon.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Lethal sucks, plain and simple. He has no personality whatsoever and his matches are average for the most part. Kevin Nash was the best thing to ever happen to him because he brought character and life into the X-Division with the creation of Black Machismo but even that began to wear off after a while. He got pops imitating Flair so all I see that he is only interesting when he is mimicking other wrestlers. When he's not, he has a dialtone personality as IDR likes to say.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I'm kind of with LJL on this. Jay Lethal has been extremely lackluster for quite a while now. I remember saying that I wanted to see what Lethal had, what he was capable of with his own merits rather than merely impersonating the gimmicks of legendary veterans. Thus far, I have to say that I'm not all that impressed.

I think Lethal is pretty fun to watch inside the ring, but he's been portrayed as this sort of wishy washy mama's boy with little personality. Whenever he's been given time on the mic or anything lately, he mostly just talks about how and where he grew up, how family is the most important thing, etc. Not that those topics are necessarily a bad thing, but he's been extremely bland when he does it.

 

[eezy1]

I have to agree about Lethal sucking for awhile now. Since he ditched the madness gimmick the only notable thing hes done is cut an awesome promo against flair and fourtune, while impersonating flair. Jay needs a new gimmick fast or hes heading in EY`s direction in the company. Being himself simply doesnt cut it both physically and personality-wise. Atleast when he was the madness, the attire and gimmick totally masked his plain blandness as the real Jay lethal. He has alot to offer the X-division in-ring so I hope they find something for him.

 

[It's Damn Real!]

What about him is right — that is, what about him makes you think he deserves to be pushed in the first place? The guy fuckin' sucks. He's a generic personality who's championed because of his ring work. Chris Benoit had more personality in his pinky than Jay Lethal has in his entire body, and unless he's mimicking other wrestlers, he brings absolutely nothing of value to the company.

Little Jerry Lawler had him pegged perfectly.

So you wanna ask again, what about Jay Lethal?

 

[Joe's Gonna Kill You]

I like Jay Lethal's work in the ring but he doesn't have much of a personality expect when it comes to impersonating other Legends like Savage with his Black Machismo gimmick and recently when he get over mimicking Ric Flair. He doesn't deserve a Main Event Push but he is guy to have in the X-Division and compete for that title.

 

[a0161613]

Say what you want about Lethal - he is far, far better option as X Division champ than fricking, Robbie E, who has the personality of a mop and is about as good as one when it comes to working.

I think you have harshly underrated him. Comparing him to many of the guys that both TNA & WWE have on their books, he is far from dialtone. He is a talented enough worker, not the best but far from the worst. His matches with Angle and AJ show that.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Say what you want about Lethal - he is far, far better option as X Division champ than fricking, Robbie E, who has the personality of a mop and is about as good as one when it comes to working.

I think you have harshly underrated him. Comparing him to many of the guys that both TNA & WWE have on their books, he is far from dialtone. He is a talented enough worker, not the best but far from the worst. His matches with Angle and AJ show that.

Robbie E. has a gimmick and he plays it to perfection and shows personality in and out of the ring, something Jay Lethal does not. When Jay Lethal was first Black Machismo, it was fun and refreshing to see. After a while it got boring especially after his feud with Sonjay Dutt. He had that one good match with Angle a couple of years ago and a few average ones with Styles and that's it. He is just there for the most part. Lethal has to develop some kind of personality without imitating other wrestlers before he ends up a poor man's Charlie Haas.

 

[a0161613]

Without turning this thread into one about Robbie, if he has a personality then he neeeds to show it to stop the X Pac heat chants of "Robbie Sucks".

He has far more good matches to his careers than you give credit for, including the Steel Asylum from a couple of years ago - plus the match with Styles this year was better than you give credit for and he got a very decent match out of Flair - something nobody in TNA has managed to do yet.

 

[shattered dreams]

I like Lethal but he has been boring for a while. I do not think it is that he has no personality, just that he has no gimmick right now. He is funny in a variety of ways behind the scenes that go beyond impersonations. Until he develops a new character the X-division is the right place for him. He is a good worker and trying to tell a story there can be good experimenting/practice for him. He does not need to be anywhere near the main event right now.

 

[frankiep]

when fortune was forming originally i thought jay lethal might have a shot at being apart of them..but now he has faded. 3-4 Months ago Lethal beat Desmond,AJ,Flair all clean, now he can't even beat Robbie E? I believe TNA really dropped the ball on Jay Lethal.

 

[Mr Jones]

For those who say that Jay Lethal has no personality, fall back with that garbage.

But on the other side, Jay is in the X-Division and is getting pissed on by Hogan and Bischoff. In 2010, a young wrestler who is basically writing his own ticket by making a name for himself in the indies(ie: Bryan Danielson, Tyler Black, Nigel Mcguinness(before TNA screwed him over) and having the companies come to him is probably in a better position than a young wrestler who is already in the company, but is getting buried in the process. Jay's not being treated as a priority in TNA anymore. His feuds get thrown out with no build and he's barely getting a opportunity to be in the main event in the first place. What is there to brag about? It all comes down on what you want to be : A free agent that ends up being in one of the company's major storylines or being on the backburner at a company which is focused on wrestlers past their prime?

And something else, The Shore get no reaction on Impact whatsoever. Stop lying to yourselves.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

For those who say that Jay Lethal has no personality, fall back with that garbage.

But on the other side, Jay is in the X-Division and is getting pissed on by Hogan and Bischoff. In 2010, a young wrestler who is basically writing his own ticket by making a name for himself in the indies(ie: Bryan Danielson, Tyler Black, Nigel Mcguinness(before TNA screwed him over) and having the companies come to him is probably in a better position than a young wrestler who is already in the company, but is getting buried in the process. Jay's not being treated as a priority in TNA anymore. His feuds get thrown out with no build and he's barely getting a opportunity to be in the main event in the first place. What is there to brag about? It all comes down on what you want to be : A free agent that ends up being in one of the company's major storylines or being on the backburner at a company which is focused on wrestlers past their prime?

And something else, The Shore get no reaction on Impact whatsoever. Stop lying to yourselves.

Show me one instance where Jay Lethal, the man, has shown any personality. He's dull and boring as shit for a while now. He just goes out there, wrestles an average match, and then goes back to the locker room. I heard that Kevin Nash re-signed with TNA. If it's true, he needs to work with Jay Lethal because it worked well with him the first time. Robbie E may be annoying to some but he still gets a reaction better than Lethal.

 

[Mr Jones]

when fortune was forming originally i thought jay lethal might have a shot at being apart of them..but now he has faded. 3-4 Months ago Lethal beat Desmond,AJ,Flair all clean, now he can't even beat Robbie E? I believe TNA really dropped the ball on Jay Lethal.

You're right. TNA did drop the ball on Jay.

One reason is because they were slow to do everything with him. Even before he did the Black Machismo gimmick and had an upset win over Petey Williams, they were slow to act on it. Then, Black Machismo was born, which led to the matches with Angle and the big tag match at Against All Odds 2008. TNA finally realized that they had a up and coming star in Lethal. After that, they put together a half-assed feud with Sonjay and it did nothing, then they stopped pushing him altogether and he still had an X-Division title reign under his belt. TNA, and this was way before Hogan and Bischoff came in, has been bad at handling Jay since day one.

His career went wrong in so many was it's not even funny.

 

[Mr Jones]

Show me one instance where Jay Lethal, the man, has shown any personality. He's dull and boring as shit for a while now. He just goes out there, wrestles an average match, and then goes back to the locker room. I heard that Kevin Nash re-signed with TNA. If it's true, he needs to work with Jay Lethal because it worked well with him the first time. Robbie E may be annoying to some but he still gets a reaction better than Lethal.

Nash has not re-signed with the company.

But, LJL. It seems like you're trying negate the fact TNA dropped the ball. He already knew that TNA wasn't on their job and the shit was going to be in his own hands after that first push didn't do what it should have. Jay was more active on his own before Black Machismo than he has been since Black Machismo. Nash didn't create that buzz. Jay HIMSELF did. So Jay should have been able after TNA dropped the ball, to go hard and keep himself out there.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Nash has not re-signed with the company.

But, LJL. It seems like you're trying negate the fact TNA dropped the ball. He already knew that TNA wasn't on their job and the shit was going to be in his own hands after that first push didn't do what it should have. Jay was more active on his own before Black Machismo than he has been since Black Machismo. Nash didn't create that buzz. Jay HIMSELF did. So Jay should have been able after TNA dropped the ball, to go hard and keep himself out there.

It's not a fact that TNA dropped the ball on Lethal so I'm not negating anything. Lethal needs to take a example from John Cena. When Cena first broke into the business, he was in danger of getting released until he was heard freestyling and became a heel rapper and we see where that got him today. It doesn't happen 100% of the time but Lethal needs to find something that works for him and go hard at it. TNA should give him an opportunity to cut more promos to see what he's got. Sometimes you have to give them a reason to be noticed and that is what Lethal needs to do.

 

[eezy1]

I say he should just switch back to black machismo, itll always get him over. Besides I like the idea of Jay rediscovering the machismo and going after Robbie E for the strap. I think it adds a fresh dimension and that could be a decent feud for the X-division. Robbie thinks hes the coolest dude on the block and whos cooler than black machismo. Jay could polish up and improve his machoman gimmick a little, especially the promo side of things and his ringwork will speak for itself.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

I say he should just switch back to black machismo, itll always get him over. Besides I like the idea of Jay rediscovering the machismo and going after Robbie E for the strap. I think it adds a fresh dimension and that could be a decent feud for the X-division. Robbie thinks hes the coolest dude on the block and whos cooler than black machismo. Jay could polish up and improve his machoman gimmick a little, especially the promo side of things and his ringwork will speak for itself.

Going back to Black Machismo will be the worst thing to do because he will seem like somebody who can't get over unless he goes to the same gimmick over and over again. The Black Machismo gimmick fizzled out after a while because people stopped caring. Lethal has to find his own thing, work endlessly at it, and the higher ups will notice. Black Machismo should be dead and buried.

 

[Alex]

Thing is Lethal can't be interesting on his own, he needs something that's already been done to give him a boost and do his own thing on it (ala Black Machismo and Macho Man) For him to succeed he needs to find an interesting gimmick that's new and not a rehashed one.

 

[Trill Co$by]

The point totally got lost in this thread... Whether or not he's good in the ring and unentertaining (and for those who think he's not entertaining are just delusional to the max, but will cheer AJ Lee on NXT 3 cause she's short and DATES lethal)....

In the end, the purpose of this thread is why isn't Lethal in this storyline? Looking at it in a common sense situation, it's a no brainer that if anybody should be looking at this from a far and involved, it would be lethal... the guy that Hogan gave Flair's HOF ring to, the guy that Hogan backed against Premature Fortune... the guy who beat Kaz and AJ clean countless of times AND took it to Ric Flair... how can someone with that much involved with TNA and Hogan not have an opinion or a simple part in this storyline?

 

[Alex]

I think what people are getting at is he's rather bland compared to the other guys in the storyline (even Kaz) and that's why he's not there. If he were to pick up his character a bit he might've made it and might have either been a part of Fortune or fighting against it.

 

[DangerousDave]

Lethal had a great gimmick and dropped it. That was his imitating other wrestlers, which he was brilliant at. The Black Machismo gimmick was entertaining and when it got old he moved on to Flair. I laughed my ass off at those Flair imitations and Flair's reaction to them. What I would like to see now is his Robbie E imitation which would bring a lot more entertainment to his feud with Shore. He should recruit some bimbo to play the part of Cookie. This would be a great way to drive Robbie E and Cookie nuts. If he did this for every feud he got into or wanted to start he would really have something going for him. Since he dropped the Flair gimmick he has been totally bland. He needs to put that talent to work.

 

[Kitten Cutter]

People are nuts to say Jay Lethal has no personality. That's like saying Zack Ryder has no personality. The problem is we don't see Lethal enough on TV for him to have a personality to satisfy the IWC. Jay Lethal has proven over and over how loyal he is to TNA, which is why I've been writing in several places that if TNA was smart, they'd build him up to win the TNA World Heavyweight Title at Bound for Glory 2011.

After Lethal's feud with Flair (which was awesome, by the way), what happened to him? Nothing. Nothing for months until he surprisingly won the X-division title. Then he showed up once in a blue moon. It stinks when your title changes happen at HOUSE SHOWS and it barely gets mentioned. Now, he's only being used to push Robbie E. and Cookie, which is just a damn shame. It makes Lethal look weak and sad that he loses to a new guy barely in for a month. He's cut good promos, but not many of them. How many promos do you remember him cutting in the past month? The past year? What are you guys looking for? How can he talk when Hardy and Jarrett ramble on 30 minutes of the show combined alone?! How can he do much when creative isn't giving him anything? It's not like he can bring his own woman to match Cookie, and it's not like he doesn't WANT to do anything. It's more Creative dropping the ball on him than him failing. (Unless you recommend he breaks rules and does everything anyway without being given the green light, which may result in a future endeavors email)

Maybe you want him to show personality in the ring, but he sells offense well. He's trying to help get Robbie E. and Cookie over, and he's done as good a job as he can do. He's not working against Styles or RVD or Dreamer who are veterans that know how to tell a story and show it in the ring, and cover up crappy wrestling. How can Lethal look good personality wise or wrestling wise when he has a below-average major league rookie to TNA? You can say Eckos has the skill, but his reluctance to keep a finisher and spotty acting at best tells me otherwise.

I'd love it if TNA had a story in place where Dixie rewards Lethal with some way of representing TNA to get it back in some kind of match. If he were at least of part of an opposing storyline to take on Fourtune, if he were to join Fourtune by bumping out Kaz or Styles, I think you'd see a hell of a lot more than the time he's been given.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

Well yes indeedy. TNA man most all of his career, basically an equivalent to the Miz in WWE and at least AS talented.One day he has to be TNA world champion for a coctail of reasons, he is good enough in the ring, he is good enough outside the ring and he is such a nice genuine guy that I will support him his entire career no matter how he performs or how good his gimmick. Just lucky that jay lethal happens to be a great wrestler. If he isn't TNA champion one day, call THAT the biggest misjustice since Kane's 1 day title reign.

But the way i see things, jay lethal is 25 years of age, he hasn't hit his prime yet so he doesn't need to rise to the top just yet, thats one great thing he has one his side. Few performers are as mature in the ring as lethal at his age and I honestly think that I'd be happy to wait a couple of years and have him dominate the X-divison scene just like jericho did in the intercontinetal scene before he rose up. But one things for certain... jay lethal is the man, and he's going to rise to the top one way or another.

Sorry to respond to comments about his personality. Jay lethal has been a little stale to watch recently becuase they GAVE lethal the x-divison belt which he represented just fine....against no competition, he had no feuds to defend his title with so obviously there'll be no personality injection there. Then they lump him in with a guy everybody thought was bad at first, gave him a chance next week.....didnt improve, waited til he showed how he could go in the ring.......OH NO, and the final insult was having him get over lethal for the belt. Lets get this straight right now, THE SHORE in TNA is a mistake, ric flair and fortune couldn't make them relevant. To give robbie E the belt after his dismal displays is a terrible move, but I do understand that they put a bit of effort into the shore and want even the slightest hint of a payoff so fair do's.

For me having robbie beat lethal in the way that he did was a great thing. Jay Lethal could be one of the most beloved and greatest guys to potentially pull off an under-dog gimmick. The robbie-lethal feud is heating up....a little...its tepid to be honest, and the only reason is because it involoves lethal. He does have personality but the situation he's been put in recently stops us from being able to see that, and thats not his fault. Honesty watch this guyz:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHbQe7QJjNQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDy4Wq9OmGg

I cant find the other full segment but this is a short clip of it. Tell me lethal doesn't have personality. Anytime you get the branding by flair to get put over consider yourself special, lethal is a diamond in the rough ever becoming refined as time goes by. Lethal made flair look old, and in an age where flair is having to teach guys how to do promos that is something raw and untapped, something that will take lethal to the top when the call is given.