Vince not happy with RAW Ratings. Could this lead to even more BIG changes?

[closet_fan]

http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/article/exclusive-vinces-backstage-reaction-to-wwe-raw-rating-133125

WWE Chairman Vince McMahon was reportedly "shocked into silence" when the overnight household ratings for Monday Night Raw came in at a 3.2 yesterday at the Smackdown tapings.

According to a key WWE insider who was backstage, "Vince did his best to no-sell the news, but the entire atmosphere of the backstage area changed once Vince was told of the rating."

WrestleZone was also told, "It seems like Vince and the upper echelon really believed this latest surge in excitement based on the CM Punk angle would really pop the ratings. The slow build back up is really scary for a lot of people right now. There's not an overflow of patience running around in WWE."

As a whole, I'm not that surprised that the ratings were moderate. With it being the Summer months, many people have other things going on than staying home on a Monday night and watching wrestling. Plus, I am sure many didn't think they were going to be able to top MITB. But with such a huge night on Sunday, one would think most would want to tune in to see how they could top it.

With Vince's reaction, and to be honest I don't know what a GOOD rating is, will we see even more big changes on the program?

Could Punk have to come back much sooner than they were hoping if the ratings stay this way?

 

[SullivanSmith]

If there is one thing that really drive ratings in wrestling television, it's unpredictability. The reason that the TV rating was what it was, in my opinion, is that WWE has lost that aura of unpredictability and needs to slowly start getting it back. And they're working on it - but they DO need to keep these surprises and big changes coming. They need to get that "anything can happen in the WWF/E" mentality they used to have.

Or they could just have John Cena stand in the ring for two hours and do that hand gesture he does. People seem to like that.

 

[KnowYoRole]

it doesn't help that aside from the opening and closing segments of RAW, the show was extremely uninteresting. they have to realize that one big angle isn't going to pop them 4.0 ratings. build interest in other divisions. and then freak out if you dont get the ratings you expect.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

Well from last week it went up .3 which isn't bad at all.

I can understand Vince's frustration but at the same time he's got to realize that big angles like this don't pop ratings hugely overnight. Back in late '97 early '98 they had Austin, DX and the attitude era happening and even though there were some big angles that made a lot of noise it took a while for the ratings to really start climbing. In order for big ratings to happen you have to keep a strong showing week to week and be patient. Nothing happens overnight and it all takes time. If they keep in the direction they are going (I think this is the 2nd or 3rd solid RAW in a row they've had) the ratings will soon follow.

It took Austin's popularity almost a year to really show up in the ratings, Vince just has to remember that Rome wasn't built in a day but if they keep course and keep delivering good, compelling television then the ratings will follow.

 

[closet_fan]

it doesn't help that aside from the opening and closing segments of RAW, the show was extremely uninteresting. they have to realize that one big angle isn't going to pop them 4.0 ratings. build interest in other divisions. and then freak out if you dont get the ratings you expect.

That's all I really watch. And lets face it; if you watch that alone, you pretty much know what is going on without watching the stuff in between.

They have said Vince overreacts quite a bit lately, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's freaking out even with all the hooplah over the past couple weeks.

 

[avi01]

Well maybe it isn`t as high as they expected given the buzz around money in the bank but maybe there expectations were a little bit too high. WWE won`t pull ratings like the old days for 2 main reasons.
One, people are not that interested in wrestling anymore...that was a golden era.
And two, DVDr..and that applies to all shows.

The ratings is still pretty solid here and they should keep strong storyline to keep the audience and create more buzz. The event of this edition of Raw might lead to interesting moments in the future but the actual show was not really that gripping. I think that if the buyrates of money in the bank were bad, then WWE should be upset.

 

[XXJJ]

I can understand why Vince would be upset at the ratings. The whole angle with CM Punk was well received. It gained a lot of mainstream coverage. Their was plenty of shock value and unpredictably with what happens next after MITB.

They had a low ratings the week before MITB and now a pretty average rating after MITB. Must be very disappointing, especially after spending all that time building up CM Punk anti WWE angle.

 

[TheTruNoLimit]

Why freak out? Isn't this one of their better #'s in the last several weeks?

This is going to cause a typical knee-jerk reaction and Vince is going to blame Punk for not being a "draw." It's typical Vinnie Mac.

Keep in mind, with arguably one of the 2 or 3 most marketable stars in WWE history returning when the Rock came back for the build into Wrestlemania, they didn't get above a 3.7 or 3.8, right?

It's going to take more than one angle. It's going to take a completely solid show. The Rock returning and having Stone Cold on during the Wrestlemania build too is proof of that! No one angle is gonna boost ratings overnight.

 

[closet_fan]

I can understand why Vince would be upset at the ratings. The whole angle with CM Punk was well received. It gained a lot of mainstream coverage. Their was plenty of shock value and unpredictably with what happens next after MITB.

They had a low ratings the week before MITB and now a pretty average rating after MITB. Must be very disappointing, especially after spending all that time building up CM Punk anti WWE angle.

Was I the only one who thought the show was going to be a dud as soon as Vince announced that there was going to be a tournament? The wrestling itself was decent at times. But as far as the storyline, it felt meh.

I know there wasn't a whole lot you could do to further the angle since they want Punk off TV for awhile. But to me, as soon as Vince announced the show's intentions, I lost all interest and flipped the channel.

I only found out about the ending when I watched it on YouTube Tuesday morning.

 

[bongorider]

3.2 is a pretty poor-to-average number coming off the back of a PPV. And after this kind of build-up it's WAY below expectations.

Let's face it, this Punk angle, as much as all the internet wrestling community is enjoying it, has so far produced 3 "meh" ratings. If the MITB buyrate isn't big. 170k buys or so, then this angle is gonna get dropped faster than you can say "nexus"

 

[KnowMyRole-ShutYourMouth]

If CM Punk were to shoulder the blame for the low rating, then that would be extremely misguided. He wasn't even on the show. He wasn't even named until Cena brought him up at the end. They held a tournament to crown a "new" champion, so all the heat they gained @ MITB was lost. You could feel it with the crowd.

The whole problem was no one bought into the tournament. I, and I'm sure I'm not alone, thought Cena would interfere in the Finals or something shady would go down and we wouldn't crown a champion. It turned out Vince just postponed the match and Triple H came out and changed the entire landscape.

The big thing to focus on is if the ratings continue to increase as this angle builds up, especially for the inevitable RAW where CM Punk returns to confront Triple H. THAT will be the telling sign that this angle is over. You let Punk leave with the title, Triple H takes over, next week I'm sure we won't have a new champion, and in probably 2 weeks time Punk will be back on RAW with the title.

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

Well for starters, I have been a fan of WWE since it was WWF. Twenty years ago, the company's performance was starting to suffer from a critical standpoint, myself I still enjoyed the product thoroughly back in the early 1990s (As Hogan was being phased out of the picture, guys like Razor Ramon, Ric Flair, the return of Mr. Perfect to action, Shawn Michaels rise in singles prominence and Bret Hart's World Title push as well as Yokozuna's rise as a top WWF heel all kept me intrigued). However, the WWF was nowhere near its glory days like it was during the Hogan era.

You fast forward to present day, the wrestling industry as a whole still has its fanbase, people are still buying tickets to live events and what not, other facets of the company are still doing well (i.e. merchandising) however, TV ratings are taking a hit, these things happen in the wrestling business. This is by no means a precedent. I have no idea how much truth there is to this report of Vince "no-selling" his reaction to this week's less than stellar rating. Maybe he is sweating it, maybe he isn't. Who really f'n knows? The guy's only been running the company full time for about 30 years, if what the numbers are saying is true, the guy has been in a LOT worse predicaments, like standing trial in a Federal Court of Law for instance and playing second fiddle to WCW in the ratings war for almost two years, and even after the Attitude era started, WCW still had a little fight left in it until the end of 1999 into early 2000.

Therefore, this performance drop with the CM Punk angle is nothing for anyone to be worried about in my estimation. It's a little disappointing to see it of course, but as a longtime fan, I've seen the company be in worse spots than this. For anyone panicking or believing all the hype behind Vince's supposed "breakdown", I wouldn't read too much into it.

 

[Jeff]

3.2 is a pretty poor-to-average number coming off the back of a PPV. And after this kind of build-up it's WAY below expectations.

Let's face it, this Punk angle, as much as all the internet wrestling community is enjoying it, has so far produced 3 "meh" ratings. If the MITB buyrate isn't big. 170k buys or so, then this angle is gonna get dropped faster than you can say "nexus"

However, the fans are enjoying this angle. It is entertaining. The problem is the WWE thinks that ratings are going to shoot through the roof right away. It takes time. Granted the whole CM Punk thing got some mainstream media, but WWE has to continue to get mainstream media. They need to keep doing things to make people go, I should tune in and to make the mainstream media keep talking about them. Even when a wrestling fan from the late 90s does see something about WWE. Why would they care to tune into a CM Punk/John Cena feud over some shinny belt that they are calling the WWE Championship. They need to build their product.

 

[darbare]

ratings are really a poor indicator of whos watching what...the way Nielsen works is, they count how many of their boxes are being used at any given time...but you also have to take into account how many people are watching together....if theres one box being used, they count it as one person...when in reality it could potentially be like 5....I think a 3.2 is strong, considering they count individual boxes, and stuff like DVR...so when you take the total number of people watching, if they were to count the ratings then, it would probably be like a 4.0 or something like hundreds of thousands added on if that makes sense....most people dont watch it by themselves, especially the kids who watch with their parents and maybe their friends...also, most people dont even have a Nielsen box or know what the hell it is, but thats how they tally ratings, which really sucks for good shows that get cancelled because the numbers arent accurate

 

[rge2010]

Proof that no one apart from the IWC really cares about CM Punk. The angle was built up over the internet by the ROH marks because 'their hero' did something a few weeks ago.

Punk is good, but not great and lets not kid ourselves, he is NOT a draw and the ratings prove it. It has all been about Punk and the ratings have done shit. I cant believe people didnt tune in to see if he turned up last night, but then again if they dont care why would they?

The casual wrestling fan, which is probably the majority of wrestling fans couldnt give a shit about precious Punk. Thats gunna hurt a few of you marks out there but its simply the truth.

 

[bongorider]

Therefore, this performance drop with the CM Punk angle is nothing for anyone to be worried about in my estimation. It's a little disappointing to see it of course, but as a longtime fan, I've seen the company be in worse spots than this. For anyone panicking or believing all the hype behind Vince's supposed "breakdown", I wouldn't read too much into it.

I think you are missing the point. No one is saying that ratings are so bad the business is going into a downward spiral.

The consternation is because a lot of us hardcore fans really love this angle, and we like to see Punk getting a push. But in the ratings, this angle is not delivering.
The worry is that Vince will lose faith in this angle, depush Punk and revert to type. And we'll have another 5 years of people being fed to Cena.

However, the fans are enjoying this angle. It is entertaining. The problem is the WWE thinks that ratings are going to shoot through the roof right away. It takes time. Granted the whole CM Punk thing got some mainstream media, but WWE has to continue to get mainstream media. They need to keep doing things to make people go, I should tune in and to make the mainstream media keep talking about them. Even when a wrestling fan from the late 90s does see something about WWE. Why would they care to tune into a CM Punk/John Cena feud over some shinny belt that they are calling the WWE Championship. They need to build their product.

So why should the WWE writers have any faith that this will produce in the longterm? Why have patience with this angle, over all the other dozens of angles which didn't produce right away and were dropped?
And even if we agreed that they should, will they actually do it?
Do they have the patience required to see this through, there's no indication that they will. The Nexus debut last year was one of the most shocking things in recent memory, and there was a huge buzz. But when ratings didn't climb and the merchandise wasn't selling, the whole stable got depushed, re-organized, split up and rebranded.

 

[Profit]

Proof that no one apart from the IWC really cares about CM Punk.

So all those "Punk" Chants on RAW, those were all IWC marks? Sure.. whatever you say dude. Maybe they were just chanting that Mr. McMahon was a Punk, go with that, you'll have to in order to make your argument seem legit.

The angle was built up over the internet by the ROH marks because 'their hero' did something a few weeks ago.

I have never seen an ROH match, when CM Punk first started out with WWE I was not a huge fan of his. But over the years, one can not deny his in-ring ability and his absolute talent on the microphone.

To say that the angle was only for a specific group of people, is just stupid. I have friends who haven't watched WWE except on occasion, every once in a great while, who were calling me up the night Punk delivered his shoot promo telling me how crazy it was and that they were excited to see how it played out.

Punk is good, but not great and lets not kid ourselves, he is NOT a draw and the ratings prove it. It has all been about Punk and the ratings have done shit. I cant believe people didnt tune in to see if he turned up last night, but then again if they dont care why would they?

He wasn't advertised for the show, his contract was up. And i'll admit after that first segment where they didn't mention him and announced the tournament was taking place, I lost interest. I'm sure i'm not the only one who did this, but you can't blame someone who wasn't even there for the ratings decline.

The casual wrestling fan, which is probably the majority of wrestling fans couldnt give a shit about precious Punk. Thats gunna hurt a few of you marks out there but its simply the truth

.

Thats not the "truth", thats you trying to troll.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

There's always a possibility that no matter what Vince does, the WWE just isn't going to draw the numbers that it used to. How many viewers a show gets doesn't necessarily reflect the quality of what's being put out.

The angle with CM Punk has been one of the most talked about and well recieved storylines in a very long time and there's always the possibility that the numbers will increase over a steady period of time as the angle progresses. The fact that CM Punk didn't make an appearance on Raw this past Monday might suggest that the initial plan was to stretch this out over a long period of time. But, if Vince was expecting bigger numbers, then there's a chance that he might decide to try and move things up ahead of the original schedule.

The summer is usually a "downtime" as far as television goes and WWE is usually no exception. However, another factor that has to be taken into account is the fact that there's a lot more competition for WWE on Mondays now than there was 10 years ago. Whether you're a fan of the shows or not, Pawn Stars and American Pickers are two huge hits for The History Channel and the majority of their audience is in the same demographic as Raw. Shows like The Closer and Rizzoli & Isles are also big draws over on TNT. Back in the day, Raw's biggest competition was either WCW Monday Nitro or Monday Night Football during the fall & winter months. Now, Raw has competition year round from shows that draw big numbers and a lot of critical acclaim. There are always going to be peaks and valleys in the ratings game, just how it goes. As long as WWE continues to average roughly 5 million viewers for Raw, which is what they generally do draw, then they're doing just fine.

I had zero problem with this past Monday's show because the whole show came across as a means to an end. If they'd done this exact same show during the Attitude Era with an identical central storyline, championship tournament, etc. it would've gotten rave reviews all around.

 

[Pedigree1]

not suprised by this at all!! MITB was so good that i knew there was no way Raw was going to be as good!! Punk said he wasnt going to be there i think he was at a cubs game or something. The numbers better pick up fast or i dont know how much longer this angle will last

 

[dansaint]

I still think HHH will stay in Vince's ear to continue with the youth movement. Also WWE shouldn't be worried about ratings...and more focused on buyrates.

remember...UFC draws 1's for their weekly shows but their buyrates are high.

If one person can persuade Vince to stick with the youth movement and be patient and let thinks cook...that has to be HHH

 

[Hitman-HBK United Inc.]

This whole thread and people panickign is simply mind boggling to say the least! Since when has a dramatic change occured overnight? Some people might be quick to point out "Hulkamania"! And while that may be partially true, it's not as if the WWF was in dire straits when the expansion started, they were doing very well as a reigonal promotion, and making good money.

I hate to draw comparisons with different eras, because the rules are different in different times. But some things don't change, and one of those is that nothing changes overnight. Remember 1997?? I'm sure some people here do. Remember how awesome the main event scene was at that point?? I'm sure a lot of people do! Remember how the ratings spiked overnight?? Wait...you don't?? Well there's a good reason for that, because it DIDN'T happen!

Vince needs to be worried about making his product better, rather than worrying about the numbers. Create a buzz, than the money will come in. Now I'm not dellusional enough to think that there's going to be another "Golden Era". As a fan, I'll settle for a mere "significant improvement" in things. Let's keep in mind people, this whole hype behind the Punk angle, has only been going on for a MONTH! One MONTH!

Austin's earliest PPV main events weren't drawing all that much higher than what the WWE is drawing now in terms of PPV buys. But things were slowly improving, despite how WM 13 bombed in 1997, the B PPV's (in your houses) started doing slightly better than the last half of 1996. Speculate...than accumulate!

This is no reflection on Punk...or Cena for that matter, and let's keep in mind people, that the main focus, SHOULD be the quarter hour breakdowns. That's how these things are measured.

I couldn't care less if MITB just draws an average number, if it's domestic draw does better than most, than there stepping in the right direction. If not, than I think it should motivate the company to keep trying.

 

[TheHitMark-SirJoseOle]

I think you are missing the point. No one is saying that ratings are so bad the business is going into a downward spiral.

The consternation is because a lot of us hardcore fans really love this angle, and we like to see Punk getting a push. But in the ratings, this angle is not delivering.

The worry is that Vince will lose faith in this angle, depush Punk and revert to type. And we'll have another 5 years of people being fed to Cena.

Duly noted, however I must stay solid on my stance, I didn't say that anyone was saying that the business was going into a downward spiral. I am merely saying that we are in a wrestling lull, it's not exactly like it was in the early 1990s, but let's face it things are nowhere near the energy level or intrigue that the Attitude Era was. And that is no offense to guys like Cena and Punk, it's just what it is.

I can see the latter concern as well, but I think even with someone else other than Punk involved in this angle the same things would be occurring right now ratings wise. The energy is just not there by comparison to years ago, I don't want to dismiss the hardcore fan element, but in this case I think the industry is just in a position where the ratings are going to take a while to increase period. We basically need another event to send wrestling back into a boom period, at least my in view.

And right now nothing is really doing that in wrestling, again that's not to say that the industry is dying or that the product itself is subpar, but wrestling is in a lull right now, plain and simple. It would suck to see Vince depush CM Punk as a result of that since I don't see him being the reason ratings are taking a hit, but just the same, I stand by what I said about the current product's appeal to demographics beyond its hardcore fan base.

 

[H33LTurn]

Wasnt Edge's live sex celebration a 7. something? Anyway...

you made a good point, it is the summer and a lot of people dont really feel that WWE is something to keep them home in front of the TV. It is kind of surprising that RAW got a 3.2 given the fact that so many former fans have started paying attention to the product since the Punk promo. I guess some are just watching online. At least the ratings are going up gradually. I'm pretty sure the Triple H bombshell will get more people to tune in next week.

 

[LFC till i die]

TBH, i was quite suprised with the ratings for this weeks Raw. What with the storyline between CM Punk, John Cena and Vince Mcmahon, which has been the best thing to happen in the WWE for a while, you'd have thought people would be tuning in to see what "happens next". But here's an idea to get ratings up. Bring back the shock value. The suprise element. People will tune in. Now and then they pull a suprise, an OMDayz moment but they should do this more often...

 

[FitFinlay4Life]

To my awareness (so correct me if I'm wrong), these ratings work in quarter hour segments and the overall rating is an average. I don't think the problem is CM Punk or John Cena, the problem is who else is there to care about?

On Monday night, we knew from the start that we were unlikely to see John Cena (or potentially Punk) until the final segment. What incentive was there for people to watch the rest? Swagger, ADR, Kingston and Truth have all been pushed and depushed regularly, Riley is unproven, Ziggler is regarded as a midcarder and, whilst former champions, neither Miz nor Rey have ever been pushed as being strong champions.

The simple fact is that, until Punk's ascendancy one month ago, no-one has been portrayed as being even remotely on Cena's level (and that includes Randy). If creative only care about John, what incentive is there for the general public to care for anyone else?