Title vs. Title....II?

[Marky-Marc]

So I live in New York and am currently snowed in because of this crazy blizzard. So i popped in an old DVD, I'm watching Hogan v Warrior from Wrestlemanis 6. The crowd is absolutely electric. Probably because it is two undeniable crowd favorites battling. So my question is, could a match like this, WWE Champ v IC Champ headline Mania again?

It would have to be either two faces (think Cena and Kofi or Cena and Bryan) or a popular face v. a hated heel (maybe Orton v Jericho). I think if they took the took the 6 or 7weeks between EC and Mania to properly build the fued then it could be awesome just like Hogan/Warrior was.

I think I'd like to see this. Possibly even the same way only with the insertion of the Royal Rumble. Have the IC Champ win the Royal Rumble then challenge the WWE Champ for Mania and whoever wins gets both belts, not a unification,just wins both, then you make them drop the IC title and you hold a tournament for it.

So my questions are as follows:

1) Would you want see this?
2) Do you think it could work as the Main Event of Wrestlemania
3) What two superstars do you think could pull this off to make it as big as Hogan/Warrior was?

 

[Dimice121976]

I remember Hogan vs Warrior very well, however today it wouldn't work. I would love to see something as big as that but, there is no way today it would work. If you go by the champs as of now, you would have to do either Ziggler vs Edge, or Bryan vs Miz. I dont know if there are two guys who could pull the match off as of today IMO.

 

[LigerBomb]

1) Would you want see this?
2) Do you think it could work as the Main Event of Wrestlemania
3) What two superstars do you think could pull this off to make it as big as Hogan/Warrior was?

1. Yes, yes I would. Love(d) the concept. Back when they had a Lt. Heavyweight/cruiser title I always wanted to see such a bout (though not with belts on the line). Liger Vs. Hashimoto is a fav. of mine. Pound for pound, at any given time, who really is the best? IC vs WWE title works in a similar way –minus the weight division components obviously.

2. 'Course it could. Lots of variables to control for though. Who are the two men, what's the rational for the match, does it get the proper build, what's the potential outcome/consequence, etc.

3. Currently I don't see any two superstars that could pull it off to the level of Hogan/Warrior. I can't think of a mid-carder that has the same kind of rabid following Warrior had. Dropping a main-eventer down to IC level just to make the match happen wouldn't lead to such a strong build either. Anyway, Cena would clearly be the choice to fill Hogan's spot in the equation.

P.S. While I fully admit that in no way would it ever compare to Hogan/Warrior, I'd like to see Daniel Bryan challenge Miz to a champ v champ match, have a slow and drawn out build, and finally end their feud proper.

 

[Pritch]

Yeah that type of match wouldn't work in today's world. Warrior vs. Hogan was more of two of the most popular guys in wrestling rather than title vs. title. In that case it was very similiar to when Rock and Austin wrestled at WM 17 when two of the most popular guys when at it. That will be the closest to that as we will ever get in today's world. Let's face it. There isn't anybody on any roster that is anywhere near that level today. Cena is popular but he isn't on that level and quite frankly there isn't anyone else on his level even, not even Orton although I like Orton more myself. Plus just about everyone has wrestled each other already

 

[Charismatic Enigma]

1) Would you want see this?
yes, if I thought it could still be done to the same level as Hogan/Warrior.
2) Do you think it could work as the Main Event of Wrestlemania
see previous answer
3) What two superstars do you think could pull this off to make it as big as Hogan/Warrior was?
Here's where things get complicated. At the time of that match WWE wasn't so notorious for shooting their wad on free TV. It was also really uncommon to see two faces have a "respect" match with titles on the line, usually someone was also playing the heel. In today's WWE, it wouldn't be so hard to have two faces go at it (HBK/Taker), however, the problem comes along in that it often feels WWE has blown every big money match they could potentially have on their hands, either at some throwaway PPV like TLC, or on Raw/SD.

There are really only a handful of guys in the company currently who have big enough followings to bring in reaction like the one you saw at WM6, and unfortunately most of those matches have already been done to death. Of course I'm talking about the obvious names Cena, Orton, Taker, HHH, etc.

I would love to see future main event talent like Miz, Danielson, Ziggler, etc. be involved with an established top level talent to get the rub from them and elevate both their careers, the problem is I don't think any of the mid card guys have the fan following to make the match as interesting as it would need to be.

If you really wanted to pull this off the RIGHT way, I can only think of one match that could bring this reaction out and that would be the Rock vs. Cena. You'd have to get Rock to come back and somehow easily mop the floor with Ziggler to win the IC title while he's a guest host of Raw or something, then have Cena win the title from Miz at Rumble, meanwhile have an ongoing storyline of how the Rock views the IC title as a joke doing "via satelite" segments tormenting Ziggler with the belt that he isn't going to get back, so somehow the GM or somebody would have to order Rock to return to WWE as a defending champ or lose the belt, and have him say the only way he would do it would be one last main event at Mania or something.

Storylines like this always come together kind of half ass and then have killer reactions, like Rock/Hogan at 18, so I really think something like this might be doable, but thats the only way I could see it working in today's WWE.

 

[#hamler]

1) Would you want see this?

Yeah, I wouldn't mind seeing this once again. It adds a lot of ecitement to the WWE or World Championship match. A Title vs. Title II match would add a sense of unpredictability to the match. The only problem with this type of match would be WWE would have to really be high on the certain mid carder holding the Intercontinental or US Championship. They would have to trust they can deliver in the main event match. They'd have to trust them because it is the main event of the biggest WWE show of the year. Could it work, I think so.

2) Do you think it could work as the Main Event of Wrestlemania

The second main event, ehh not so much. But maybe the first main event. Why the Hogan/Warrior match worked so great is because they were both very veryover. That would be hard to find a mid carder that is that over as the Warrior was. I'd love for it to happen as the Smackdown Main Event though.

3) What two superstars do you think could pull this off to make it as big as Hogan/Warrior was?

That's hard. Like I said, Warrior was incredibly over as a major face. It would be har to find a mid carder holding the Intercontinental or US Championship to be as over as he was. I could think of someone who could work just as well though. Alberto Del Rio vs. Edge foir the World Heavyweight Championship and Intercontinental Championships. That match is destined to happen at Wrestlemania. I could see the WWE slapping the Intercontinental Championship on Del Rio so he could be in a match like this. He's not as over as Ultimate Warrior but he is over...as a heel. Like I said earlier, WWE would have to really be behind him because this would be his first 'Mania. He could pull it off. I would love this idea.

 

[The Saviour]

YES,I would love to see it happen,if it has the proper build up and intensity.
Could it work as a WRESTLEMANIA ME?It depends on what superstars are competing,you put Cena in there as a World Champion,it is a Main Event for sure.But it depends also on how capable is the other champion or how over he is.
To answer your third question,may be if they give JoMo a perfect build up from here on till Mania.It can go like this:He will more probably lose at Rumble,so have him also enter the match itself,where he should go on to win.Then have him in some high profile matches on RAW,say vs Orton and have him win some of them.At EC lets say Cena takes the title from Miz inside the chamber.And Morrison beats Daniel Bryan for the US Title at EC.This way Morrison is way more over in the crowd than he is now.Finally have him come out on RAW and challenge John Cena in champion v champion match at WRESTLEMANIA.Cena is already the biggest star and you'll have a hot Morrison who's just missing a World Title,from his resume.Pretty similar to what happened during Jeff Hardy's first title win.

 

[legend23x]

The other thing that made the match so big is that it was really the passing of the torch from Hogan to Warrior. In that time, Hogan was dominant and had been at the top of the mountain for some time. Warrior came in and after destroying everyone, was in a position to challenge Hogan for THE top spot. At the time, the IC title wasn't just a mid-card title like it is today. It was just a step below the WWE Championship so the IC champion was a viable contender for the world title.

Now you have a number of main event guys who all fight for a main title whether it is the WWE title or the World Title. Then a big step below that you have the IC title or US title and the midcard guys who fight for it. For a title vs title match they would first have to restore the IC title to a semi-main event status for it to make sense. That is something that wouldn't be a bad idea at all though. I don't know that there is anyone yet in the WWE who really has that opportunity to be the guy they want to pass the torch to though. Ever since that moment where they really gave it to warrior and he dropped it shortly after they have been hesitant to do so.

 

[Mr_billy]

1. I would Love to see this again.

2. Unfortunately not, the IC and US championships are now pretty much relegated into the mid crd,and are not secondary ME titles like they once were. Back in the day, an IC title match was a main event, and the World Title was a huge deal, and the champ didn't show up at every show, except maybe for a promo.

3. This being said, the only superstars I can see doing this is Bryan somewhere down the line, And Cena is a big enough draw, or Rey as an IC title holder.

 

[The Brain]

Even though Hogan vs. Warrior was heavily hyped as title vs. title the IC title wasn’t really relevant in that match. Does anyone really think of that as and IC title match? Looking back it should have been obvious Warrior would win. The winner was going to forfeit the IC title so what would be the point of Hogan winning it? That match worked because it was two incredibly popular fan favorites facing off. The face vs. face match was very rare back then. It’s pretty common now. That match wouldn’t have lost any significance had Warrior not been IC champion. If that match were booked today Warrior probably would have just dropped the IC title before mania. If Warrior just lost the IC title before mania he would have looked weaker than Hogan. Nowadays wins and losses don’t mean as much and anyone can overcome a defeat quickly. So to answer the question I don’t think we’ll ever see title vs. title at mania again because it wasn’t really significant the first time, and with the way title reigns have changed over the years would be less significant now.

 

[orton0384]

I remember the E tested out the waters with this in February of 2008 I want to say on a RAW. Randy Orton was WWE Champion and Jeff Hardy who lost at the rumble was going for redemption again. This time with his Intercontinental title on the line. The match in my eyes was a dud. At the time it was the E's 2 hottest stars and the crowd just wasnt into it as much as I thought they would be. Even with a weeks worth of hype 4 promo videos explaining the importance of such a match and flashbacks showing previous unification matches.

 

[darthbonkeys]

yes i would pay see a main event for wrestlemania champion vs champion espically if it was Daniel Bryan vs The Miz. Now i know that would be a big as seeing their is no main stars in the match like orton, cena, undertaker. But i can imagine they could do it right if they picked from when daniel bryan beat miz for the us title. Miz could say Bryan did him a favour by winning the us title because that gave him something less to worry about and that helped him become a champion because that was all he had to focus about. And he could brag about how he was a wwe champion and daniel ws not. Then you could have like bryan winning the royal rumble and using it early because he never got even with th attack he sufered from the miz at survivor series and their would no better way to get back then letting the mi see bryan walk into wrestlemania as champion but in the end he wins by dq because michael cole interferied. The next week the miz can say he is a awesome champion and that bryan used his chance and won the match but not the title because he was not i his league but he deserved a win but he would not getting a rematch because he used his chance. Then bryan could come saying that he made a propersation to the gm him vs the miz title vs title no dq or just a singles match and then you could make it a feel good moment like if it is a no dq because a friend of bryans could stop alex riley from interfering and thenyou could have michael cole try and interfire by trying tohit bryan with a chair but misses and hits the miz (if it was a normal single match the referree would be out for this) then bryan could put michael cole in the le bell lock and then he would pin the miz for the one two three and would win the title and it would be a feel good moent because he overcame such a lot to win the title

 

[Mike Diesel]

I would not like to see it again, because if it were done now, it definitely would not be the same.

Like some other people hit on, back then the IC belt was more prestigious and not viewed as a mid card title. It does seem like they are trying to bring more prestige back to the belts with the current US and IC title holders (they can both put on above average matches, and have had the titles for quite some time now). But that is also the problem, there are TOO MANY title right now.

In the 80's/early 90's, there were 4 titles. WWF Championship, Intercontinental, Tag Team, and Women's championship. Then the attitude era came, along with European, Light Heavyweight, Hardcore titles, thus watering down the importance of trying to win the Intercontinental title. It was hard to win the IC belt before then, but once the attitude era kicked in, anyone could have won a belt at any time.

It would take a TON of work to make this match seem as important as the WM 6 match. I think for this years Wrestlemania, it would be rushed. You would HAVE to get the belt off of Ziggler or Bryan, because they are in no way ready to headline a WrestleMania in a title vs title match. The belt would have to go to a mega star, and it would seem beneath anyone who has been in the main event picture this past year to win a mid card title.


If I remember the last time this was done, it was ALMOST done correctly, in WCW. Goldberg had the US Title, and beat Hogan the WCW champion. The only problem was, Bischoff put it on free TV when they could have had a zillion buyrates if he waited for PPV. Where was that match? GeorgiaDome in Atlanta, where's WrestleMania this year? Hmm... maybe the OP is onto something here....

 

[JoonDaGr8One]

For a match to be as big as the warrior/hogan you have to put john cena in because he is the hogan of this era. So that leaves them to find the warrior aka the number 2 face who is gaining ground on the number one face. They only 2 option to me are rey & kofi because those are really the only true top tier faces to me but they don't seem like a real threat to cena to me, unless kofi gets a super kofi push.

The only person who seemed on cena's level before he went heel was batista, they had a good fued but it could have been bigger. This wrestlemania could have been there first encounter and let them be face vs face it could have been huge, but i liked batista heel turn so i'm not tripping. The only mega match they can pull off now is cena vs taker he is only guy everybody believes can beat cena and cena is the only guy who people believe can beat taker at mania.

 

[bestever1100]

jack swagger i think could be the mid carder for this match he has main evented before he needs a bit more of a push but wwe has a lot of time to push him but i would like to see alberto del rio win the ic title and fight edge at mania

 

[ChavNation13]

I'm gonna say that they could have cena vs cm punk at the Royal Rumble then Dolph could cut Promo's about cena until they fight for the i.c title. Now people are gonna say it wouldn't work due to the all of cena's hype and giving him a mid card title wouldn't make sense let alone winning the title at all but then you bring in the Undertaker in to win the world heavyweight title thus having cena vs taker at mania with both titles on the line.

And in my opinion its a DREAM match with all the hype of possible. Two fan favourites, 2 great titles, 2 great champions. Plus you got Raw vs Smackdown and the face of the WWE vs One of thee greatest wrestlers and streaks of all time.

 

[The Brain]

I'm gonna say that they could have cena vs cm punk at the Royal Rumble then Dolph could cut Promo's about cena until they fight for the i.c title. Now people are gonna say it wouldn't work due to the all of cena's hype and giving him a mid card title wouldn't make sense let alone winning the title at all but then you bring in the Undertaker in to win the world heavyweight title thus having cena vs taker at mania with both titles on the line.

And in my opinion its a DREAM match with all the hype of possible. Two fan favourites, 2 great titles, 2 great champions. Plus you got Raw vs Smackdown and the face of the WWE vs One of thee greatest wrestlers and streaks of all time.

Right now Taker vs. Cena is the only thing that can close to Hogan vs. Warrior. I've been waiting for Taker vs. Cena at mania for a couple years now. With that said the title for title part is just not necessary. As you mentioned Cena holding the IC title wouldn't make sense. It's a step backward. Also nobdoy would care about the IC title in this match. If Taker were to win his accomplishment would be defeating Cena and retaining the world title. If Cena were to win his accompishment would be ending the streak and winning the world title. The IC title would be lost in the shuffle of the match.

In 1990 Warrior was a dominant and proud IC champion who was ready to take the next step. Nobody in the IC division has anywhere near the kind of momentum or popularity Warrior did back then. Cena has been world champion so many times that putting the IC title on him for this angle would be recognized as a cheap ploy to put more hype into a main event that would already have enough hype without it.

 

[Marky-Marc]

Even though Hogan vs. Warrior was heavily hyped as title vs. title the IC title wasn’t really relevant in that match. Does anyone really think of that as and IC title match? Looking back it should have been obvious Warrior would win. The winner was going to forfeit the IC title so what would be the point of Hogan winning it? That match worked because it was two incredibly popular fan favorites facing off. The face vs. face match was very rare back then. It’s pretty common now. That match wouldn’t have lost any significance had Warrior not been IC champion. If that match were booked today Warrior probably would have just dropped the IC title before mania. If Warrior just lost the IC title before mania he would have looked weaker than Hogan. Nowadays wins and losses don’t mean as much and anyone can overcome a defeat quickly. So to answer the question I don’t think we’ll ever see title vs. title at mania again because it wasn’t really significant the first time, and with the way title reigns have changed over the years would be less significant now.

I see wht you're saying here but i think the only reason the IC title was overlooked is because Warrior won. If Hogan won it would have been his first, and only, IC title. The fact that Warrior won then forfeited the IC title makes it look overshadowed I agree.

But what I'm getting at is if you have a poud young IC champion challenging the top dog, it would bring prestige to the championship and also make it seem like the IC title is just a step below the WWE title. Back then that's what it was, today it is different but I think that could be changd.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

The thing about Hogan & Warrior that made it such a must see situation was because they were the two single biggest stars in wrestling at the time. They were the two biggest faces, they were both bringing in tons of money to the WWF and they both seemed to be larger than life itself to fans in those days. Their match at WM 6 was actually pretty good and may well have been the best match of both their careers. The match told a great story and the WWF was able to make fans view this match as a real clash of titans and, for all intents and purposes as far as pro wrestling goes, that's exactly what it was.

A situation like that is like lightning in a bottle and the special feel generated by it isn't something that you can just manufacture whenever you feel like it. It was the right time, the right place with the right wrestlers.

The recent Champion vs. Champion match series with Daniel Bryan & Dolph Ziggler was great, a far more enjoyable match than Hogan vs. Warrior at WM 6, but their star power doesn't remotely compare to what Hogan & Warrior brought to the game. That's one thing that Hogan & Warrior brought to their match in spades and had the feeling of a once in a lifetime thing and it worked perfectly.

In this day and age, with the internet and youtube! and DVRs and all this other stuff; there's really no such thing as a "can't miss" event in wrestling. Because, if you do miss something, you can always head online to view it or watch it on your DVR at your convenience.

 

[Castanedaa99]

I would love to see this type of match. In this era though, it would probably be the rumored Unification match of both Heavyweight titles. Like many others who have posted before me, I can't see anyone in the current roster pulling it off though.

The way fans were reacting to the Hogan/Warrior match pretty much is similar to the Austin vs. Rock matches of WM 17 and 19, or the Taker/HBK match of WM 25

IF the WWE were to pull it off at WM 27, it would have to be Taker vs. Cena, but at this point, it is too late to pull that off with the timeframe left, and WWE likes to pull PPV matches with only 1-3 weeks prior to a PPV

 

[Tech N9ne]

I think it could work. But not in the Face Vs. Face example you provided. A Cena/Kingston or Cena/Bryan battle for 2 titles is not appealing at all. I think Cena overpowers either one of them and simply would be stupid.

But, take this years Mania. If they were building something with Cena/Orton as a possible match. Say Cena wins the WWE Title. So he and Orton are to match up at Mania. They have a pretty good build up for a month in a half or so. Maybe 3 weeks before Mania Orton somehow captures the US Title in a surprise and they decide to put both titles on the line.

I don't think an up & comer versus Cena/Orton, title for title would work. I think a rivalry match would make more sense. Why would the world champion care about a mid-card title? Maybe the rivalry is so intense that the World Champ would want to beat the other guy so bad that he would want to take his title from him as well.

EDIT: Another way it would work is if they were going to unify the 2 titles, then it would make even more sense.

 

[Marky-Marc]

I think it could work. But not in the Face Vs. Face example you provided. A Cena/Kingston or Cena/Bryan battle for 2 titles is not appealing at all. I think Cena overpowers either one of them and simply would be stupid.

But, take this years Mania. If they were building something with Cena/Orton as a possible match. Say Cena wins the WWE Title. So he and Orton are to match up at Mania. They have a pretty good build up for a month in a half or so. Maybe 3 weeks before Mania Orton somehow captures the US Title in a surprise and they decide to put both titles on the line.

I don't think an up & comer versus Cena/Orton, title for title would work. I think a rivalry match would make more sense. Why would the world champion care about a mid-card title? Maybe the rivalry is so intense that the World Champ would want to beat the other guy so bad that he would want to take his title from him as well.

EDIT: Another way it would work is if they were going to unify the 2 titles, then it would make even more sense.

I'm not talking about unification because a unification match would be big in itself.

I'm talking yhe same way they did it at WM6. Elevating the IC Champ to Main Event status because he is ready and making it happen because the fans want to see it.

Reading everyone's responses I've thought about it and think the best option may be Morrison v Cena.

Having Orton win the US Title for no reason is stupid and would be predictable if he were to challenge for it. Maybe have Morrison lose his little fued with the Miz, and have him fall short of the WWE title several times in 2011. Then have him win the US (Or IC title) in like August of next year. Give him a strong run, then have him win the Rumble and challenge WWE Chapm Cena for Mania. The way the fans feel 50/50 about Cena and love JoMo I think it could be pretty big.

 

[The Eighties]

At this point in time it wouldn't work because there is no one coming through that has garnered close to a real following, when Hogan met Warrior both guys were massively over and had never had a singles match, so his elevation as IC champ was natural progression.

In current day WWE no one in the mid-card has close to the overness Cena has, however they could have had their Super-Face vs Super-Face match between Cena and Batista a while back had they not chose to shoot their load at Summerslam.

While it wouldn't be close to the same heat-wise I do think Cena vs Bryan could work in a champion vs champion scenario, if they booked it using mainstream vs indie king and technical maestro vs brawling powerhouse as the hooks.