The Times They Are A'Changin...

[Blueshirt]

In the words of the immortal Bob Dylan..."you better start swimmin' or you'll sink like a stone for the times they are a-changin'."

It isn't like anyone hasn't realized but the WWE is at a crossroads right now. Ratings are plummeting, characters are boring, storylines are forgotten, dropped, or constantly in flux. Creative has no idea what to do with old or new characters. New characters are introduced only to be dropped a week later while old characters are un-retired and put into feuds that have been occuring since January.

For the first time since I have been reading wrestlezone (1998), one thing is painfully clear. Everyone wants change, but no one is sure how to change it. The fact is if the WWE keeps down this path it will crash and burn. But the problem comes in when anyone is asked what they want to see done differently. So, here is my manifesto for what the WWE needs to do immediately to change their product. I call on every IWC member to tear my post to shreds. Call me stupid call me lame. Just bring something to the table if you do it.

1. Enough with the brand split. It was an experiment, it has failed. Ratings would immediately skyrocket, belts would have better fueds because of more talent and storylines would actually be developed within the multi-show format. The wwe currently has 6 hours of original programming to fill. During the most prosperous time in WWF history, it had 5 hours (raw, SD, and heat). Heat was blatantly a B show, with raw the A and SD the A-/B+. But, the same superstars appeared on each show. The reason to watch raw and smackdown was because storylines would actually be advanced. Although the brand split allows certain superstars to get more time in the ring, would anyone REALLY be upset if regal, dolph ziggler, or ricky ortiz were only seen occassionally as jobbers?

2. Embrace the love of cruiserweight style wrestling. The heavyweights have ran their course. Terrible move sets aside, the world wants to see clean wrestlers (clean meaning steriod free) doing spectacular things that normal people cannot do. The average wrestler is losing their ridiculous six packs (just look at Jericho circa 99 and nowadays) and embracing smaller frames. Without being juiced and looking larger than life, the WWE needs to realize that something else must be emphasized. Just because you embrace cruiserweight style doesn't mean that it has to be an insane spot-fest. Look at the Jericho-Mysterio match from the last PPV there weren't insane spots, but quick, exciting wrestling that told a story. This is where the WWE needs to go. Sorry Batista.

3. Embrace Kayfabe once more. Enough with trying to do both. This is entertainment. Period. Toeing the line has only hurt the credibility of the WWE. This is a televisio show, not a real sport. Although the athleticism is ridiculous, the fact that matches are choreographed and the winner is chosen before hand kills any sport like qualities that it has. And i don't mean this as a slam against wrestling. Wrestling is a make believe television show.Treat it as such.

4. There needs to be an off-season. Take a 6 week off season in between WM and late may/ early june. Everyone knows that this is the unofficial "off-season" anyway. This will absolutely help the psyche of not only the wrestlers, but creative as well. WWE can still run programming during this time, such as PPV recaps or best of shows. In the spirit of the WWE is just a television show, it needs to act this way. All television shows have re-runs, it's not such a crazy concept. This 6 week period will allow wrestlers to see their families and rest up from nagging injuries. Not to mention, this would be a great time to do a fan-fest in various cities and allow Cena or HHH to film movies without sacrificing their time on television.

5. Form a wrestler's union. If doctors were paid for, there would be less of a need to take these absurd pain pills and ignoring threatening injuries. This concept is so obvious that it needs to explanation.

So, here are 5 points. I have a ton more, but I know no one is still reading this.

 

[Kip The Fury]

You make some good points, let me add my thoughts if i may:

1 - Remove the Brand Split and we'd end up with the same names wrestling in the main event twice a week, basically the midcard would end up buried under the big names again, Cena, HHH, Orton, Edge etc. The brand split is allowing future stars like Morrison and MVP to get airtime and the push they need. Also theres the issue of burnout, wrestling twice a week is gonna cause problems for wrestlers in the long term. The brand split might not be ideal but it does have its advantages.

4 - i agree with the idea of a break but for wrestlers this can be done through storylines with a handful of wrestlers at a time being out the picture for a week or 2 rather than just shutting down everything for 6 weeks. From the creative side a 6 week break could totally ruin a storyline or a feud, they would just go cold after a long break.

Jus my opinions

 

[BillAlfonso]

Get rid of the writers, I'm tired of everyone saying the same thing. Today its:

Edge: "I'm going to beat you at Backlash, Cena." or

Orton: "I'm gonna beat you at Wrestlemania, HHH."

Back in the day, you had more personalities and the characters really showed on screen, like:

Stone Cold: "Hell, Rock, it's like this. Come Wrestlemania, I'm gonna stomp a mudhole in your ass, son. And that's the bottom line, cuz Stone Cold said so."

The Rock: "When Summerslam rolls around, Austin. The Rock is gonna lay the smack down on you bald-headed, double studded candy ass."

Don't get me started on Hogan, Warrior, Macho, and Flair. And if the wrestler don't have good enough mic skills but all of the in ring tools(Brock Lesnar, Bobby Lashley, Shelton Benjamin) the get him a manager.

 

[matth71]

the only thing is that I'm sure that those in wwe's creative are aware of these forums, and they would never ever use anything we put on here. it's really a big mess cause we discuss what they could do to make it better. but with putting our own ideas out there, there is a chance that wwe would never use those ideas just because they are on here. lol its like we are screwing ourselves out of good tv, but hopefully i'm completely wrong and they will either start stealing ideas or they are just unaware of the forums and actually come up with this stuff on their own.

 

[gloommerchant]

The main thing hurting the progression of storylines is so many ppvs. Just this sunday was Judgment Day, and already 5 or so matches have been made for Extreme Rules. The storylines have no room for development, hence we are seeing the same feuds over and over without any build up because of the time restraints. If there weren't so many ppvs, there would be more time for inmteresting storylines to develop. This is the main thing hurting the WWE. Too many ppvs.

 

[LokiCobain]

BillAlfonso, I think you made a point unintentionally that I don't fully understand. What happened to the manager? Managers have been voice boxes for guys who can't speak English, and that's it. They need to be brought back in some form or another as an actual character, not just a voice box. And they need to branch off and have a "team", like the Heenan Family. Armando Estrada would have been great, but they only gave him Umaga. Matt Striker would've been great. These guys are great talkers, and they'll make up whatever is lacking in the superstars they represent. Natalya is also a manager now I guess, but that's another problem. Take the one actually trained female wrestler and have her not wrestle. Genius!

I also think a big reason TNA keeps growing is because of the X-Division. Those matches steal every pay per view, and even in WCW, the cruiserweights were seen as the unsung work horses that carried the show. So obviously WWE gets rid of the title and they're all (except Rey Mysterio) but on the shelf. WWE has a handful of solid cruiserweights that have been around a while (Jimmy Wang Yang was in WCW...) and can help younger cruiserweights through the ropes. Instead, these guys are on the roster for no reason at all, and don't have a shot at being anything on the roster. Before Rey got his ridiculous underdog push, no one would believe any cruiserweight could defeat any big guy. And they can't recycle the underdog deal, although they probably will. By not having a title for the cruiserweights, it hurts guys like Evan Bourne that fans want to see, but he'll end his career with no accomplishments...MAYBE an IC run. Just make the Cruiserweight the midcard ECW belt, SOMETHING. For god's sake, Gregory Helms is the backstage interviewer!

 

[BillAlfonso]

BillAlfonso, I think you made a point unintentionally that I don't fully understand. What happened to the manager? Managers have been voice boxes for guys who can't speak English, and that's it. They need to be brought back in some form or another as an actual character, not just a voice box. And they need to branch off and have a "team", like the Heenan Family. Armando Estrada would have been great, but they only gave him Umaga. Matt Striker would've been great. These guys are great talkers, and they'll make up whatever is lacking in the superstars they represent. Natalya is also a manager now I guess, but that's another problem. Take the one actually trained female wrestler and have her not wrestle. Genius!

I also think a big reason TNA keeps growing is because of the X-Division. Those matches steal every pay per view, and even in WCW, the cruiserweights were seen as the unsung work horses that carried the show. So obviously WWE gets rid of the title and they're all (except Rey Mysterio) but on the shelf. WWE has a handful of solid cruiserweights that have been around a while (Jimmy Wang Yang was in WCW...) and can help younger cruiserweights through the ropes. Instead, these guys are on the roster for no reason at all, and don't have a shot at being anything on the roster. Before Rey got his ridiculous underdog push, no one would believe any cruiserweight could defeat any big guy. And they can't recycle the underdog deal, although they probably will. By not having a title for the cruiserweights, it hurts guys like Evan Bourne that fans want to see, but he'll end his career with no accomplishments...MAYBE an IC run. Just make the Cruiserweight the midcard ECW belt, SOMETHING. For god's sake, Gregory Helms is the backstage interviewer!

Having said that, my grammar was attrocious(I hope to God that I spelled that correctly). Anyway, thanks, just look at my profile name if you think that I don't favor the return of managers. I've said it before, Bill Alfonso is one of the few people that I would mark out for if they returned to WWE legitimately(the rest are , in no particular order except for the first two, The Rock, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Raven, RVD, Sabu, Sandman, The Dudley Family, Vader, Sid Vicious, and last but certainly not least, Brock Lesnar, I didn't know it but Christian was one.) I agree, the need to bring they cruiserweights back, simply because there's a market for them. That way you could get Mysterio away from the Heavyweights, I didn't say Main Event scene. I know that it's fake but it's like a movie, you still have to be realistic, how in the hell is Mysterio going to contend with people like Big Show, Kane, Mike Knox, etc. Sure he's fast but it's not like he can leave but eventually they will grab a hold of him and then it's a wrap. The only way I can see that is in an Extreme Rules match, like how RVD could beat Bam Bam Bigelow in the Real, I repeat, Real ECW because he used weapons and could use all of his offense against Bam Bam. They should also make each show an alternative if they're gonna keep the brand extension. Raw should be like the old WWF, more character driven. Smackdown should be like WCW, more match driven. ECW should be more like, well, ECW, pushing the envelope with their angles and the brutal matches that satisfies every red blooded american's thirst for carnage, especially with it coming on at 10:00 pm on SCI -FI(why the hell does SCI-FI have pro wrestling?). Superstars should be what the previous incarnation became before it was cancled, kind of a recap show with may be and actual new main event. I may be right, I may be wrong but I know one thing. They gotta do something

 

[finneycom1]

In the words of the immortal Bob Dylan..."you better start swimmin' or you'll sink like a stone for the times they are a-changin'."

It isn't like anyone hasn't realized but the WWE is at a crossroads right now. Ratings are plummeting, characters are boring, storylines are forgotten, dropped, or constantly in flux. Creative has no idea what to do with old or new characters. New characters are introduced only to be dropped a week later while old characters are un-retired and put into feuds that have been occuring since January.

For the first time since I have been reading wrestlezone (1998), one thing is painfully clear. Everyone wants change, but no one is sure how to change it. The fact is if the WWE keeps down this path it will crash and burn. But the problem comes in when anyone is asked what they want to see done differently. So, here is my manifesto for what the WWE needs to do immediately to change their product. I call on every IWC member to tear my post to shreds. Call me stupid call me lame. Just bring something to the table if you do it.

1. Enough with the brand split. It was an experiment, it has failed. Ratings would immediately skyrocket, belts would have better fueds because of more talent and storylines would actually be developed within the multi-show format. The wwe currently has 6 hours of original programming to fill. During the most prosperous time in WWF history, it had 5 hours (raw, SD, and heat). Heat was blatantly a B show, with raw the A and SD the A-/B+. But, the same superstars appeared on each show. The reason to watch raw and smackdown was because storylines would actually be advanced. Although the brand split allows certain superstars to get more time in the ring, would anyone REALLY be upset if regal, dolph ziggler, or ricky ortiz were only seen occassionally as jobbers?

2. Embrace the love of cruiserweight style wrestling. The heavyweights have ran their course. Terrible move sets aside, the world wants to see clean wrestlers (clean meaning steriod free) doing spectacular things that normal people cannot do. The average wrestler is losing their ridiculous six packs (just look at Jericho circa 99 and nowadays) and embracing smaller frames. Without being juiced and looking larger than life, the WWE needs to realize that something else must be emphasized. Just because you embrace cruiserweight style doesn't mean that it has to be an insane spot-fest. Look at the Jericho-Mysterio match from the last PPV there weren't insane spots, but quick, exciting wrestling that told a story. This is where the WWE needs to go. Sorry Batista.

3. Embrace Kayfabe once more. Enough with trying to do both. This is entertainment. Period. Toeing the line has only hurt the credibility of the WWE. This is a televisio show, not a real sport. Although the athleticism is ridiculous, the fact that matches are choreographed and the winner is chosen before hand kills any sport like qualities that it has. And i don't mean this as a slam against wrestling. Wrestling is a make believe television show.Treat it as such.

4. There needs to be an off-season. Take a 6 week off season in between WM and late may/ early june. Everyone knows that this is the unofficial "off-season" anyway. This will absolutely help the psyche of not only the wrestlers, but creative as well. WWE can still run programming during this time, such as PPV recaps or best of shows. In the spirit of the WWE is just a television show, it needs to act this way. All television shows have re-runs, it's not such a crazy concept. This 6 week period will allow wrestlers to see their families and rest up from nagging injuries. Not to mention, this would be a great time to do a fan-fest in various cities and allow Cena or HHH to film movies without sacrificing their time on television.

5. Form a wrestler's union. If doctors were paid for, there would be less of a need to take these absurd pain pills and ignoring threatening injuries. This concept is so obvious that it needs to explanation.

So, here are 5 points. I have a ton more, but I know no one is still reading this.

I agree 100% with getting rid of the brand split.

Also, 100% agree with embracing cruiserweights. But, like you said, as long as it doesnt become a huge spot fest.

Not sure about the kayfabe thing. On one hand, I think WWE has pretty much killed that with the past 10 years or so basically telling fans: "Hey this is entertainment. They are all friends here." Well, they dont necessarily say that, but, you know what I mean. Onthe other hand, it IS a television show. People can suspend their belief a little, wouldnt ya say?

An off-season would freshen things up and add time to the wrestler's careers. The more I think about this, the more I definitely think there should be an off-season.

A union wouldnt be a bad idea either.

But, the writing needs to improve.

Overall, I agree with everything you have posted. I truly feel that it will turn around though.

 

[finneycom1]

Why not keep the Main Eventers spread throughout the shows and keep the lower card guys assigned to certain shows? Plus, we didnt have a brand split during Attitude, it seemed like it worked fine back then.

 

[Coco]

1. Enough with the brand split. It was an experiment, it has failed. Ratings would immediately skyrocket, belts would have better fueds because of more talent and storylines would actually be developed within the multi-show format. The wwe currently has 6 hours of original programming to fill. During the most prosperous time in WWF history, it had 5 hours (raw, SD, and heat). Heat was blatantly a B show, with raw the A and SD the A-/B+. But, the same superstars appeared on each show. The reason to watch raw and smackdown was because storylines would actually be advanced. Although the brand split allows certain superstars to get more time in the ring, would anyone REALLY be upset if regal, dolph ziggler, or ricky ortiz were only seen occassionally as jobbers?

Flawed logic here. The brand split has not failed as WWE's best year financially was 2007. In addition, new stars were given a chance they may not have been given on a merged roster where the old guys and the established main eventers would be hogging the top spots. While single branded PPVs failing may lead some to believe the split has watered down the rosters, that perception lies on the faults of the creative and booking department. If everyone on each roster was made to seem important and each show was used well, we should have twice as many big stars as we did pre-brand split. Unfortunately, creative got lazy when it came to anything that wasn't one of the top one or two feuds on a show, and we ended up with Simon Dean getting PPV spots for some reason. The merged PPVs have the same flaw, but because we only get the big matches from every brand, creative's continued idiocy is somewhat covered up.

The idea is not a failure, though. We've gotten some new main eventers out of it and made some good money. If any change needs to be made, it needs to be to the creative team and process.

2. Embrace the love of cruiserweight style wrestling. The heavyweights have ran their course. Terrible move sets aside, the world wants to see clean wrestlers (clean meaning steriod free) doing spectacular things that normal people cannot do. The average wrestler is losing their ridiculous six packs (just look at Jericho circa 99 and nowadays) and embracing smaller frames. Without being juiced and looking larger than life, the WWE needs to realize that something else must be emphasized. Just because you embrace cruiserweight style doesn't mean that it has to be an insane spot-fest. Look at the Jericho-Mysterio match from the last PPV there weren't insane spots, but quick, exciting wrestling that told a story. This is where the WWE needs to go. Sorry Batista.

The heavyweight style has not run it's course, not by a long shot. We live in a world where the top draw is John Cena and where Batista, Undertaker, and Triple H are also major draws. I'd be willing to say that Lou Thesz or Nick Bockwinkel styles of pro-wrestling are dated, but that's not what you're talking about. Putting heavyweights on the outs would alienate a lot of fans, push away a lot of money, and just be plain stupid.

I do believe the cruiserweight division is something that money could be made off if given proper screen time, attention from creative, and was made to seem like a big deal; the world title of that division, the top of the sport for some men. The same goes for the tag division. The same goes for the women's divison. The WWE fails badly in these areas. But to say that the cruiserweight style is innately better or that those wrestlers are cleaner than the top heavyweights is a joke. Guys like Hurricane Helms, Funaki (!!), and Chavo Guerrero were named in the Signature Pharmacy debacle, not to mention that the only luchadors to ever receive top billing in the WWE (Rey Mysterio and Eddie Guerrero) had their names dragged through the mud in that scandal. And you're also pretending that today's most athletic wrestlers have realistic bodies? How about John Morrison and Evan Bourne? Those guys are ripped and toned like crazy, and Morrison was also named by Signature.

I like cruisers, but the way you talk about them is extreme. Also, it's not your place to put your opinions forth as "what the world wants to see."

3. Embrace Kayfabe once more. Enough with trying to do both. This is entertainment. Period. Toeing the line has only hurt the credibility of the WWE. This is a televisio show, not a real sport. Although the athleticism is ridiculous, the fact that matches are choreographed and the winner is chosen before hand kills any sport like qualities that it has. And i don't mean this as a slam against wrestling. Wrestling is a make believe television show.Treat it as such.

The heated rivalries and assaults aren't kayfabe enough for you? I'm of the belief that something can be fake but still grounded in reality. No reason to think that making wrestling anything more like a cartoon would help matters.

4. There needs to be an off-season. Take a 6 week off season in between WM and late may/ early june. Everyone knows that this is the unofficial "off-season" anyway. This will absolutely help the psyche of not only the wrestlers, but creative as well. WWE can still run programming during this time, such as PPV recaps or best of shows. In the spirit of the WWE is just a television show, it needs to act this way. All television shows have re-runs, it's not such a crazy concept. This 6 week period will allow wrestlers to see their families and rest up from nagging injuries. Not to mention, this would be a great time to do a fan-fest in various cities and allow Cena or HHH to film movies without sacrificing their time on television.

That's awesome! A six week period where fans can forget about wrestling and WWE can lose money by not selling PPVs, not moving merch at live events, and and not selling tickets! Great idea!

5. Form a wrestler's union. If doctors were paid for, there would be less of a need to take these absurd pain pills and ignoring threatening injuries. This concept is so obvious that it needs to explanation.

I agree with the idea of a union but I don't agree that a union would cut down on drug abuse. There needs to be greater testing in place for that. Still, a union is the one thing you're correct about.

 

[Blade]

First, they cannot stop the brand split. They have too much talent currently on their roster. People are complaining how there's supposedly no young stars getting a chance at main event level. Well if they ended the brand split, those people would actually be right. There'd be far too much main event talent on one roster, no one would get enough time in the spotlight. Just think: Triple H, Cena, Batista, Edge, Orton, Hardy, Punk, Show, Undertaker, HBK, MVP and Jericho all trying to get some time. It'd be madness.

Secondly, while they're not going to make cruiserweights the faces of the company, they definately are pushing smaller guys right now. Jericho, Edge, Punk, MVP, both Hardys,Mysterio, Legacy.... You cannot accuse any of these guys of taking steroids, with the possible exception of Orton, but that's a matter for another thread. All the while, guys like Mark Henry and Kozlov are off the C-show not doing much. Vince is getting over his big man fetish and the main event of the future should be full of guys who look muscular without looking over the top.

Your 3rd and 4th points are completely contradictory. You can have WWE embracing kayfabe or give the wrestlers and off season. If you're taking kayfabe seriously, are you honestly going to believe wrestlers are going to take 6 weeks break from their personal rivalries or quests to get championships? Would you have believed if, after Wrestlemaina, Orton had said "Oh well, I lost fair and square. There's no point going for the title again, I'll take a 6 weeks break and have another whirl at it when I get back!" I mean, come on.

And the fifth suggsetion... Meh, I don't really have an opinion one way or the other and I probably won't until I'm out in the working world myself.

 

[Blueshirt]

Coco,

Nowhere in my entire post do i say "what the world wants to see" don't put words in my mouth. I'm actually pretty sure that I said this is what I want to see. I meaning me, not the royal "we."

First, saying that the WWE had its most profitable year in 2007 is like saying the stock market almost hit 15,000 in 2007, so it was at its most profitable then. The WWE has sunk since 2007, it has grown stale. So maybe it is time to change the formula? But, then again not doing anything after the market crashed in the 20s was a great idea because it had been working before then.



Second, last time i checked the wellness program was working. Even though it may be a flawed system, it is still weeding people out. In this case, I do not believe that Mysterio or Morrison is still using. Am I wrong? Probably. But there is a huge difference in the stature (not muscle mass) of the stars today.

Third, there is a difference between cartoon and kayfabe. I didn't say lets bring back Big Boss Man and Nailz to fight. I'm saying if a character is playing a heel, it isn't the best idea to have a blog and act like a face. My point about kayfabe is the WWE cant have its cake and eat it too on the WWE website. If it wants to be taken seriously about injuries and such, then it cant post fake news about Jeff Hardy being assaulted. Wrestling is about characters if the WWE stuck to that, they'd still be phenomenal. If a star like HHH wants to do interviews on CNN or some reputable news service, then he should go on with his real name. No other entertainment on the planet uses character names outside of the ring. It should be split between real life and ring life, saturating the two just makes the WWE look foolish when they actually go on CNN to discuss the Benoit or steriod situation.

Fourth. How much money does the superbowl make? How long after is it before the season starts again? Everyone goes to the superbowl and watches the superbowl because everyone knows it is the last time football will be seen for months. It adjusts itself. If everyone knew that Wrestlemania would start a 6 week offseason, more people would buy the PPV because everyone would know the WWE would have to make it spectacular. Charge $5extra and there is the makeup for one of the PPVs that you were missing.

 

[Coco]

Coco,

Nowhere in my entire post do i say "what the world wants to see" don't put words in my mouth. I'm actually pretty sure that I said this is what I want to see. I meaning me, not the royal "we."

2. Embrace the love of cruiserweight style wrestling. The heavyweights have ran their course. Terrible move sets aside, the world wants to see clean wrestlers (clean meaning steriod free) doing spectacular things that normal people cannot do.

I wish I could see you blushing...

I mean it's in writing for the sake of fuck. How hard is it to scroll up?

The WWE has sunk since 2007, it has grown stale.

Opinion.

So maybe it is time to change the formula?

SmackDown is changing things up and pushing new guys. But looking at the good things the company does wouldn't negate your pointless points, so I guess it's best to ignore the new guys being pushed and the overall strength of the card on the blue brand.

Second, last time i checked the wellness program was working. Even though it may be a flawed system, it is still weeding people out.

Occasionally, and it only normally outs guys they can handle losing. The top guys are sheltered from consequences and dates for the "random" testing have leaked to the wrestlers before. The system is crap, plain and simple. Besides, this is the company whose screening system failed to notice Benoit's steroid abuse and properly evaluate his mental health. If there is a place I don't trust with the wellness of the wrestlers, it's the WWE.

In this case, I do not believe that Mysterio or Morrison is still using. Am I wrong? Probably. But there is a huge difference in the stature (not muscle mass) of the stars today.

Yet you were talking about six-packs and frames, not stature. Besides, the likes of Jeff, Punk, and Morrison aren't midgets, in case you haven't noticed. As far as stature goes, they're in the Bret Hart/Shawn Michaels league, so pushing guys their size is nothing new.

Third, there is a difference between cartoon and kayfabe. I didn't say lets bring back Big Boss Man and Nailz to fight. I'm saying if a character is playing a heel, it isn't the best idea to have a blog and act like a face.

Someone hasn't seen Matt Hardy's blog, have they? The week the man turned on Jeff, he was heeling it up on the web. And who says kayfabe is dead?

If it wants to be taken seriously about injuries and such, then it cant post fake news about Jeff Hardy being assaulted.

Umm... correct me if I'm wrong, but that's KAYFABE. Why are you arguing against yourself?

If a star like HHH wants to do interviews on CNN or some reputable news service, then he should go on with his real name. No other entertainment on the planet uses character names outside of the ring. It should be split between real life and ring life, saturating the two just makes the WWE look foolish when they actually go on CNN to discuss the Benoit or steriod situation.

Oh my God... Are you actually suggesting tackling that situation head on in the media was bad for them? Keeping quiet would have been much worse as letting something fester just lets the media run with it. Going out there and killing it as efficiently as possible was their best bet.

Getting in the media is a good thing, and for the sake of brand recognition CM Punk should go by that name outside of WWE and so on. I'm sorry, but if the media wants to talk about a guy, especially positively (about Punk) like below, it's best to have him go by CM Punk.

[Youtube]3ZUe_62u57E[/Youtube]

Fourth. How much money does the superbowl make?

Different brand with a different image. Stupid point. This is entertainment, like you said. Not sports.

How long after is it before the season starts again? Everyone goes to the superbowl and watches the superbowl because everyone knows it is the last time football will be seen for months. It adjusts itself. If everyone knew that Wrestlemania would start a 6 week offseason, more people would buy the PPV because everyone would know the WWE would have to make it spectacular. Charge $5extra and there is the makeup for one of the PPVs that you were missing.

Most potential customers of the WWE buy Mania anyway. Your plan won't draw extra fans, it will just kill the company for six weeks.

 

[Blueshirt]

Coco,

Oh no, I am so seriously blushing because mixed in talking about clean wrestlers doing stuff normal people can't do is why people tune into wrestling. Of that I am convinced.

I'm only going to touch on a couple of things because you obviously haven't kept up with the reading of his blog.

You say its opinion that the WWE is falling down...but its product and ratings are crashing, every other post on this site is speaking of a terrible buyrate or horrible ratings.

As for smackdown, wwe calls raw its FLAGSHIP show. Smackdown is on My9, a network that isn't carried by some major markets. The ratings of smackdown are lower then raw. Additionally, last time I checked, most of raw's stars right now (not including undertaker or edge or hardy...even though the latter two were moved in the previous draft) were just transplanted FROM RAW. Please tell me how that is changing the formula. Additionally...edge and hardy was started last winter, so how is that changing the formula..?


The wellness program only started to work after Benoit's death. It was a direct response to it.

Now its your turn to not read. I said THE WWE HAS TO PICK A SIDE FOR THEIR WEBSITE THEY CANNOT DO BOTH. THAT WAS TO BACK UP MY POINT.

ALSO, i said they should USE THEIR REAL NAMES ON CNN. Not that they shouldn't GO ON CNN. Christ.

Okay, you want a television entertainment example. Look at season finale's of shows. People tune in to season finales in greater numbers for the same reason as the superbowl. Look at the finale of American Idol (terrible example I know) but it mixes the live action and television aspect of wwe) the finale numbers are absurd. Vince McMahon dreams of those numbers.

It won't kill the company for 6 weeks, television shows on television stations do it all the time. Although WWE is unique because it is a telvision show wrapped in athletic entertainment.

 

[Coco]

You say its opinion that the WWE is falling down...but its product and ratings are crashing, every other post on this site is speaking of a terrible buyrate or horrible ratings.

Mania 25 did a million buys at 55+ dollars a pop, Raw ratings going into Mania were good, and Raw ratings rose last night. I see no problem with the financial health of the WWE at the moment, especially in these tough times. They're sitting pretty.

As for smackdown, wwe calls raw its FLAGSHIP show. Smackdown is on My9, a network that isn't carried by some major markets. The ratings of smackdown are lower then raw.

What does this have to do with anything? The fact that the product isn't available in every market doesn't change the fact that a tide of change is sweeping the blue brand. I never said they got better ratings though.

Additionally...edge and hardy was started last winter, so how is that changing the formula..?

God damn it, is there something wrong with having an on-and-off feud for a few months? Either someone is complaining about stunt booking or someone is complaining about a stale product, but the one thing I know if fickle fans such as yourself shouldn't be deciding what is right for the product.

The wellness program only started to work after Benoit's death. It was a direct response to it.

I still see no proof that it's working. Either the guys are getting better at working around it or so much time will pass that it's dropped. 'Tis the reality of wrestling that most of them are users that the system isn't going to handle properly. Putting on a show for the cameras and making an example of William fucking Regal isn't good enough for me.

Now its your turn to not read. I said THE WWE HAS TO PICK A SIDE FOR THEIR WEBSITE THEY CANNOT DO BOTH. THAT WAS TO BACK UP MY POINT.

But you picked kayfabe and then bashed the stairwell story. You don't even know what way you want it.

ALSO, i said they should USE THEIR REAL NAMES ON CNN. Not that they shouldn't GO ON CNN. Christ.

Not using their real names hurts though. We've been over this. Someone like Taker wouldn't go on CNN, but not everybody needs their gimmick to be protected like. Punk can go on CNN and be Punk and it won't hurt kayfabe.

Okay, you want a television entertainment example. Look at season finale's of shows. People tune in to season finales in greater numbers for the same reason as the superbowl. Look at the finale of American Idol (terrible example I know) but it mixes the live action and television aspect of wwe) the finale numbers are absurd. Vince McMahon dreams of those numbers.

Once again, they have a larger fan base than WWE every week. A finale isn't a magic fix for the WWE. The fans have to actually be there to begin with.

It won't kill the company for 6 weeks, television shows on television stations do it all the time. Although WWE is unique because it is a telvision show wrapped in athletic entertainment.

House MD doesn't go on the road and sell out arenas every week, Hugh Laurie doesn't have a t-shirt and arm band he needs to sell at those live events, and House MD doesn't miss out on people not buying their monthly PPV offering.

 

[JohnnyB41]

People, there is one thing to do that is easy, and would fix so many problems....go back to brand only PPVs. Having brand only ppvs means more relevance to mid-card titles as they would almost have to have storylines and title matches at ppvs. More and better rivalries would have to come back to fill ppvs, and we wouldnt have the same main events at every ppv. It is a very simple solution, easy to do, and would improve the product almost overnight.

 

[Coco]

It should, but it won't. Creative is lazy and didn't use the single brand PPVs like they should have. Instead of two great rosters, we got shit like Tomko vs. Stevie Richards and Mordecai vs. Scotty 2 Hotty on PPVs. If creative changed their direction and became a proper machine that made use of all the TV time it has in a week, then this problem wouldn't exist. Single branded PPVs could be good, but a lack of them isn't the problem. The problem is the booking for them.

 

[FromTheSouth]

You make some good points, let me add my thoughts if i may:

1 - Remove the Brand Split and we'd end up with the same names wrestling in the main event twice a week, basically the midcard would end up buried under the big names again, Cena, HHH, Orton, Edge etc.

So? Do you think anyone pays to see the midcard? The people are there to see Cena, Edge, HHH, Orton, etc. I'm sorry if there isn't enough time for Evan Bourne to flip around like a coked up monkey having a seizure. Fuck him. And besides, the midcard would be fine. It's the bottom of the card that would be hurt, and frankly, I could give a shit if Ricky Ortiz and Dolph Ziegler get on TV.

The brand split is allowing future stars like Morrison and MVP to get airtime and the push they need.

They still would. The top 15 guys in the company aren't going to take up 5 hours of TV. Maybe 2 total hours of the week would be devoted to the top card, one hour to commercials, and an hour for a Morrison/MVP match, a tag title match, an IC match, and a Diva's match. And besides, the WWE has always done a good job of putting midcard guys in with Main Eventers. Cowboy Bob Orton wrestled Hulk Hogan on TV 50 times. The Miz has a story line with Cena right now. Shit, even CM Punk got a World Title Run, and never left the midcard.

Also theres the issue of burnout, wrestling twice a week is gonna cause problems for wrestlers in the long term.

Because they don't wrestle four house shows in addition to their TV time?

The brand split might not be ideal but it does have its advantages.

The only advantage is that Vince gets to run two touring companies and makes more money. The product is suffering. Everyone compalins that wrestling isn't as good as it was in 2002 and before. Do you know why? The brands split back then, and instead of one all star team of writers, they have two half assed teams who don't have the slightest clue what continuity is.

 

[Coco]

Sam, the current creative direction would kill the midcard if the rosters weren merged. Only the top feuds get focused on to begin with. If the brands were merged, you double the top of the card to:

-Cena
-Orton
-Batista
-Show
-Edge
-Triple H
-Jeff Hardy
-Shawn Michaels
-Undertaker
-Chris Jericho
-Mysterio

Fitting feuds with those guys on each show leaves almost no room for new guys and they'll be getting the kind of focus and Knox-Truth match gets at this point. Then when the mass retirement comes, people are going to be shocked when we have no new main eventers. Before the brand split, this wouldn't have been a problem. Now, it's a huge problem. That problem could be controlled if creative were on their game, but they're not. It could be a clusterfuck.

 

[FromTheSouth]

That's eleven guys. How does the WWE do TV main events? It wouldn't be 11 singles matches a week. It would be three tag team matches, as not all of them would wrestle on both shows, five promos, and two run ins. That's seriously, no more than an hour and a half of TV time a week.

You guys who think that the midcard would get killed think that if Cena and Orton are fighting at the next PPV, that we would get two Cena/Orton matches, and four promos a week from just those two.

It would be more like this, Cena gives a promo, gets attacked by Legacy, saved by the Colons. Six man tag, the teams get the rub from the stars, and the midcard and main event both get TV time, together. The next show has a colons vs. priceless match. Orton gets involved, Cena saves, they fight as they go off the air. There would be plenty of time for the midcard.

I once worked out four hours of TV time and got 45 guys on TV for at least 8 minutes during a week. It's doable, even with commercial time.

 

[Coco]

Have you seen the booking Legacy gets lately though? Last week, one feud involving them and Batista took up about half of the air time. You're smart enough to fit all those guys in product properly. But the creative team doesn't know how to handle itself. Put Punk in with those 11 guys and you have the same twelve main event wrestlers in different combinations in sixish segments on each show. On a show that sometimes struggle to get eight segments in, that's a roster that is too stacked. We need a less inept creative team for this to work.

 

[Blueshirt]

Coco,
Greatly enjoying the spar. Kudos to you almost not restorting to name calling.

Couple of things,
I am not a fickle fan. I have been watching since 1990ish (not that I'm totally proud of that...)

Also, you keep talking about how awful creative is (completely agree) but isn't creative a product of the system? A new system would HAVE to force new ideas...

 

[Coco]

Thanks for continuing to reply as well. I'd rather someone give me a hard time rather than give up before we get all our points out.

I don't think all of your ideas would help force creative to get more ideas out. The denser concentration of star power with the brands merged may very well cause creative to fall deeper into the sloth we all know they're capable of displaying. Lazy booking would run wild if they had more stars ready-made for both shows. I can't imagine it going well even though I'd like it to.

And I think you mistake the way I mean "fickle." You may have been watching since 1990, and that's good and well, but you can still be fickle. Many fans will jump on a bandwagon only to hop off shortly after a guy reaches the top. I don't get why Hardy in the main event scene needs changing. He's only been there, inconsistently at that, since last year. He has a lot more to offer at that place on the card, yet you'd put a stop to one of his most time-tested feuds despite the fact that they've only wrestled a hand full of televised main events? It makes no sense to me. In some cases, staying the course can be a good thing.

 

[Razor]

1. Enough with the brand split. It was an experiment, it has failed. Ratings would immediately skyrocket, belts would have better fueds because of more talent and storylines would actually be developed within the multi-show format. The wwe currently has 6 hours of original programming to fill. During the most prosperous time in WWF history, it had 5 hours (raw, SD, and heat). Heat was blatantly a B show, with raw the A and SD the A-/B+. But, the same superstars appeared on each show. The reason to watch raw and smackdown was because storylines would actually be advanced. Although the brand split allows certain superstars to get more time in the ring, would anyone REALLY be upset if regal, dolph ziggler, or ricky ortiz were only seen occassionally as jobbers?

Eh. The one thing I like about the Brand Split is that it gave more of a main event scene to be explored. If we end the brand split, we have what, 60 wrestlers on essentially one show? Tons will have to be cut/made into jobbers. Unless you're wanting one main event to flow through the shows with the mid-cards of the show being the main match makers? That's putting an awful lot on your mid-carders.

One thing about a static main event is that if you want someone to be tested in the main event, you have no chance to try things out on your other shows before giving them a big jump. No more giving Morrison the run on ECW before you move him to Raw, no more letting Swagger get into his own on ECW before giving him the pressure of the main event on Raw. It's all or nothing. You have to instantly throw them against one of your main eventers and hope they stick. SO much potential to Fail. But, then again, the same chance to succeed.

2. Embrace the love of cruiserweight style wrestling. The heavyweights have ran their course. Terrible move sets aside, the world wants to see clean wrestlers (clean meaning steriod free) doing spectacular things that normal people cannot do. The average wrestler is losing their ridiculous six packs (just look at Jericho circa 99 and nowadays) and embracing smaller frames. Without being juiced and looking larger than life, the WWE needs to realize that something else must be emphasized. Just because you embrace cruiserweight style doesn't mean that it has to be an insane spot-fest. Look at the Jericho-Mysterio match from the last PPV there weren't insane spots, but quick, exciting wrestling that told a story. This is where the WWE needs to go. Sorry Batista.

Eh.....I don't think the heavyweights are exactly why ratings are dropping. Are you sure you're arguing for the entire crowd or just what you and 50 people on these forums want to see? Because every time Cena steps into the ring he gets a hella pop. And he's no cruiserweight. For some reason Batista gets a reaction. As long as the heavyweights can still do their jobs, we shouldn't totally shove them out of the picture.

The drop in ratings isn't a bad case of "Heavyweight Hatred." It's the fact that Orton has the title and just happens to be shit. The ratings were falling under Triple H, just as they did before Orton got the title the first time, and continue to fall under Orton. It's proven by the fact that Flair can raise the ratings .3 of a point. I guarantee you that jump wasn't "Oh, Orton is in his 2nd month as champ!?!?! Why haven't I been watching before?"

Though, at the same time, we shouldn't completely ignore the cruiserweights. And the WWE, for the most part, isn't. We may not have cruiserweights dominating the Main Event scene, but they are having their representation in the mid-cards. We don't need all of one, or all of the other. A mix of styles will work just fine, as we do right now.

3. Embrace Kayfabe once more. Enough with trying to do both. This is entertainment. Period. Toeing the line has only hurt the credibility of the WWE. This is a television show, not a real sport. Although the athleticism is ridiculous, the fact that matches are choreographed and the winner is chosen before hand kills any sport like qualities that it has. And i don't mean this as a slam against wrestling. Wrestling is a make believe television show.Treat it as such.

I can see where you're coming from. They seem to want to keep the kayfabe around the titles intact, while at the same time doing shit like making fun of Hardy for having his dog die in a fire. Real life is real life, and only has a place in wrestling when real life directly conflicts. Like the recent Nuggets/Raw scheduling debacle. Perfect example of when wrestling should lash out at real life. Other than that? Keep home at home.

4. There needs to be an off-season. Take a 6 week off season in between WM and late may/ early june. Everyone knows that this is the unofficial "off-season" anyway. This will absolutely help the psyche of not only the wrestlers, but creative as well. WWE can still run programming during this time, such as PPV recaps or best of shows. In the spirit of the WWE is just a television show, it needs to act this way. All television shows have re-runs, it's not such a crazy concept. This 6 week period will allow wrestlers to see their families and rest up from nagging injuries. Not to mention, this would be a great time to do a fan-fest in various cities and allow Cena or HHH to film movies without sacrificing their time on television.

Makes sense. Though I don't know if it can be pulled off. I've always sorta liked the idea though. I got ya.

5. Form a wrestler's union. If doctors were paid for, there would be less of a need to take these absurd pain pills and ignoring threatening injuries. This concept is so obvious that it needs to explanation.

A wrestler's union is touchy. A wrestling union would cost more money for the company, and Vince has an easy way to end the wrestler union. Whoever is in it and is in the WWE gets fired. Simple as. Vince treats the wrestlers as contractors, and I'm sure he believes most are expendable. Which, honestly, they are. If he can keep a hold of Cena/Triple H/HBK/Undertaker/Edge, he can stay afloat. And there are tons of wrestlers who will do anything to work for the WWE..that's including working without a Union.

But the basic idea? Sounds really good. But that can be handled by WWE just doing it themselves. I'm not a business man, and that probably costs loads more money than is practical. ..Honestly, though, they really only have 70+ employees that they would have to cover with health insurance. But meh. Vince won't be having it.

 

[finneycom1]

Like I said in two earlier posts, I agree with Spiegs.

Seriously, how would combining the rosters kill the mid-card. This is when the creative team needs to be, well, creative!

Plus, if the roster is too big for a combination, then I say, do some housecleaning. Why do we need Hornswoggle, Jesse, Festus, etc. If you combined all 3 rosters, and fired about 25 performers, would be perfect. Let 'em go to TNA.

In addition, lets take a look at the Main Event picture since it was mentioned earlier that there were too many ME'ers.

HBK- Has less than a year(if the reports are correct)
Undertaker- It varies but no more than 2 or 3 years. Hell, he hardly wrestles now.
Batista- 1 to 2 years left
Mysterio-Move him to the cruiserweight division
Jeff Hardy-Move to the IC upper-mid card
Big Show- See Jeff Hardy

There's six of the eleven mentioned in an earlier post.

This leaves:
Cena
Orton
Jericho
Edge
Triple H

Like I said, Creative needs to get creative. 25 firings and some ME stars moving out of the ME and you are about where the Attitude Era was.

Start some factions or something. Have Edge and Jericho team up to fight for the Tag Titles. Remember when Big Show and 'Taker were a tag team and at a ppv they would fight like Kane and X-Pac? Get creative!!!