The *Official* John Cena Thread

[Slyfox696]

With the old one being nearly two years old at this point, I figured it was time to begin a new one of these. And who better than me to start it?

Allow me to just put it like this. If you don't think John Cena is a good wrestler, then you obviously don't know what it means to be a good wrestler. You are probably one of them indy/ROH fanboys, who seems to think that doing bunches of flippys and cursing is what makes a good wrestler, not someone who understands match psychology.

Basically what I am saying, is either you think John Cena is a good wrestler, or you don't know what good wrestling is. Thanks.

 

[MaskedKane]

With the old one being nearly two years old at this point, I figured it was time to begin a new one of these. And who better than me to start it?

Allow me to just put it like this. If you don't think John Cena is a good wrestler, then you obviously don't know what it means to be a good wrestler. You are probably one of them indy/ROH fanboys, who seems to think that doing bunches of flippys and cursing is what makes a good wrestler, not someone who understands match psychology.

Basically what I am saying, is either you think John Cena is a good wrestler, or you don't know what good wrestling is. Thanks.

You killed your own thread with that statement. I voted that I liked John Cena, because he's a great entertainer. When it comes down to wrestling, he only knows 3 or 4 good movies, that cheesy crap move You Cant See Me 5-Knuckle Shuffle, the FU, and the STFU. Now look at good wrestlers like Shawn Michaels or Rey Mysterio. Many moves, and they dont do their signature moves all the time like Cena. and they're very athletic. There's no doubt Cena's athletic, but every second I see Cena I hear Jim Ross shout "The FU!" or "you Cant See Me" and it drives me insane. WE CAN SEE YOU, JOHN, WE CAN SEE YOU!

 

[Y 2 Jake]

If I were to vote I'd go for option number 3 - I don't like or dislike him. It's hard for me to get excited about a John Cena match. I only really enjoy his matches after all the hype is over. WWE could do a phenomenal job of booking his match with Jericho at Survivor Series, and I still won't care about it. I just find him to be a total bore. His never say die attitude, his flag waving patriotism and his piss poor punches all make me want to watch Edge a whole lot more.

But the guy does have good matches with almost everyone, especially when it counts. When they need somebody to deliver, it's usually Cena. Batista still has several guys that he can't work with. But out of all the wrestlers I've seen Cena face the only two I think he's had a total lack of chemistry with have been HBK & Booker T.

 

[Slyfox696]

See? This is exactly what I'm talking about.

You killed your own thread with that statement.

Nope, and I'll show you why.

I voted that I liked John Cena, because he's a great entertainer.

What's the difference between professional wrestler and entertainer? Give up? Answer is...nothing. They are the same thing.

When it comes down to wrestling, he only knows 3 or 4 good movies, that cheesy crap move You Cant See Me 5-Knuckle Shuffle, the FU, and the STFU.

Oh, so now number of moves has anything to do with the quality of a wrestler?

Like I said, you obviously don't know what it means to be a good wrestler.

Now look at good wrestlers like Shawn Michaels or Rey Mysterio. Many moves, and they dont do their signature moves all the time like Cena.

You're kidding right? The only thing Shawn Michaels DOES do is signature moves. You can watch a Shawn Michaels match and know EVERYTHING that will happen from opening bell until the pin, because he's been doing the same routine for over 10 years now. You're sinking yourself with this nonsense.

and they're very athletic. There's no doubt Cena's athletic, but every second I see Cena I hear Jim Ross shout "The FU!" or "you Cant See Me" and it drives me insane. WE CAN SEE YOU, JOHN, WE CAN SEE YOU!

So, basically, what you are saying is that you are a mark?

 

[Slyfox696]

But out of all the wrestlers I've seen Cena face the only two I think he's had a total lack of chemistry with have been HBK & Booker T.

I'm not sure he's worked with Booker enough to say one way or another, but HBK? Cena and HBK tore the house down with their match on Raw, and their match at WM 23 was one of the best main-events in WM history.

How can you say that he didn't have chemistry with HBK, when they put on two of the best matches in 2007 within just a couple weeks of each other?

 

[Richard]

At the end of the day, the real life people are just playing characters.

I voted for the option of I don't like the character John Cena but I can respect the real life John Cena. As said many times, he is a work horse and he can entertain people greatly, wether it be getting cheered or booed, he is doing what he is supposed to be doing, entertaining people and he does that well.

Going to have to disagree with Masked Kane. Incase you didn't notice, wrestlers have to play a character, right, stay with me here. I feel that wrestlers sometimes have to do the same things over and over again to create an identity for themselves. Stone Cold got immensely over for doing the same thing, he wasn't a technically great wrestler, but is one of the most popular 'Entertainers' in WWE's history.

Don't like the character, but he does what he is supposed to be doing well.

 

[Y 2 Jake]

I'm not sure he's worked with Booker enough to say one way or another,

He's worked with Booker as much as he has others. They had the best of 5 series in 2004 and faced each other plenty of times towards the end of 2006. All poor and all before Booker T stopped caring.

but HBK? Cena and HBK tore the house down with their match on Raw,

Depends. The house was made up of English kids. They react to everything and it's not often Cena makes it to the Raw shows in the UK.

and their match at WM 23 was one of the best main-events in WM history.

Matter of opinion.

How can you say that he didn't have chemistry with HBK, when they put on two of the best matches in 2007 within just a couple weeks of each other?

Because I've seen Cena have better matches with wrestlers who aren't nowhere near as talented as HBK used to be. Just a few months later Cena got something half decent out of Khali. If he can do that with a big lummox like him I expect something considerably better with somebody like Shawn Michaels.

 

[Slyfox696]

He's worked with Booker as much as he has others. They had the best of 5 series in 2004 and faced each other plenty of times towards the end of 2006. All poor and all before Booker T stopped caring.

I didn't see 2004, but Booker T was having bad matches with EVERYBODY by the end of 2006. And, I don't remember Cena and Booker T meeting 1-on-1 either.

Depends. The house was made up of English kids. They react to everything and it's not often Cena makes it to the Raw shows in the UK.

They were in England last night, and the crowd was fairly boring.

Matter of opinion.

Many share it though.

Because I've seen Cena have better matches with wrestlers who aren't nowhere near as talented as HBK used to be. Just a few months later Cena got something half decent out of Khali. If he can do that with a big lummox like him I expect something considerably better with somebody like Shawn Michaels.

Or, maybe the Great Khali is a better worker than Shawn Michaels? Or, more appropriately, cares about the match more than Shawn Michaels?

Which is kind of what I've been saying about HBK for years now. But, there's no doubt Cena vs. HBK was better than Cena vs. Khali. I think Cena's match with Khali was more impressive on Cena's part, but I think the HBK matches were better.

 

[Showtime]

I'm not gonna give my opinion on this much because I know Slyfox would be more than happy to turn my words against myself, he's too good at it. If I were to pick an option, which I guess I will, I'd pick the last one. I don't care for the Cena character, never have and probably never will, The rapper, the marine, the patriotism, give it all ask nothing back attitude, doesn't work for me, he plays his character well, but I don't care much for it. That being said I do respect him. Cena may or may not be a kiss ass to Vince, but he does have a passion for the biz and seems dedicated towards it. I'm not gonna say I jump to the TV every time Cena has a match, but the man is a consistent performer now. He does have good to great matches with alot of superstars. He's dependable, and wasn't very injury prone till recently. I respect that he wrestlers every night, and generally gives it his all, whether the crowd is for him or very much against him. He may not be the best wrestler, in the sense of mat skills, move sets, but he is the best wrestler the WWE has. He gets an instant reaction, work's well with many different wrestlers, solid mic skills, a constant draw and sells a shit load of merch, which Vince always likes his wrestler to do. WWE is trying to make him the Hogan/Austin of this era and whether that has happened or not is for Slyfox to debate with someone else

The final fact is, I don't care for the character, but I do respect Cena.

 

[Y 2 Jake]

Which is kind of what I've been saying about HBK for years now. But, there's no doubt Cena vs. HBK was better than Cena vs. Khali. I think Cena's match with Khali was more impressive on Cena's part, but I think the HBK matches were better.

The Khali matches were very impressive. Maybe I prefer them because of how plodding Khali usually is. Before those few matches the only person who got anything out of him was Taker, but that was from throwing himself around the ring for 10 minutes.

In 2007 Cena had better matches with Lashley & Umaga on Pay-Per-View imo. Even a lazy HBK is better than most wrestlers, or he was 18 months ago. I always though Lashley had unlimited potential, yet was still quite green. Cena's performance with him at The Bash was far superior to anything else I saw from him that year.

 

[Skillz]

It wasn't until about 2 years ago when I started to really like Cena. Before then I was kind of like one of those idiotic people that thought he couldn't really wrestle. And then I stopped being so ignorant, acknowledged how much he had improved since becoming WWE Champion, and started to really appreciate Cena for the great worker that he is. For the past 2 years he has been my clear favourite wrestler, and is now easily one of my top 10 favourite wrestlers of all time.

Cena is the best wrestler in the WWE today, bar none. And it's not really debatable. He's the biggest draw. He always gets the biggest reaction from the crowd. He oozes charisma. He has great mic skills. He has great psychology. He knows how to tell a great story in the ring. He sells really good. And he has great matches. What else can you ask for in a wrestler?

Cena will be the face of the WWE for the next 10 years. He already is one of the greatest champions in WWE history. As long as he stays healthy, and doesn't decide to prematurely leave the business like The Rock did, I truly believe that he will go down as one of the very best the WWE has ever had.

 

[The Undercover Man]

I like John cena, but i just hate his gimmick. His gimmick is an excellent one for getting kids into wrestling and for gaining ratings and i suppose thats what a business needs, someone that will pull in ratings and that is John Cena.

Anyone who says Cena does'nt deserve to be a main event wrestler/performer is nuts! WWE need Cena to be a main eventer otherwise how will they make money? Cena is WWE's "life line" so to speak, WWE's income rests on Cena.

As a wrestler Cena isn't actually that bad, he is a decent enough wrestler and he is excellent on the mic, the only thing that does bore me is him being in the main event because i'd rather see others there ,but like i said earlier, he should be there because he makes WWE millions of pounds and brings ratings up.

Cena is just like the "new" Hogan, he was'nt the greatest wrestler but he new how to entertain the crowd and thats what Cena does, he can work a crowd. Cena has done a great job in WWE so far and by the end of his career should be near or even above Hogan in the money production stakes. Cena is truly WWE's main man

 

[MaskedKane]

See? This is exactly what I'm talking about.
Nope, and I'll show you why.

What's the difference between professional wrestler and entertainer? Give up? Answer is...nothing. They are the same thing.

Oh, so now number of moves has anything to do with the quality of a wrestler?

Like I said, you obviously don't know what it means to be a good wrestler.

You're kidding right? The only thing Shawn Michaels DOES do is signature moves. You can watch a Shawn Michaels match and know EVERYTHING that will happen from opening bell until the pin, because he's been doing the same routine for over 10 years now. You're sinking yourself with this nonsense.

So, basically, what you are saying is that you are a mark?

Wow...just...wow. entertainer doesnt mean wrestler. It means big with the fans, widely known, and used for commercials. Wrestler is someone who can actually wrestle (or, in the WWE's case, pretend to wrestle real good) which Cena lacks.

In fact it does. If every second you see a 5-Knuckle Shuffle people are gonna hate ya. Take One Night Stand 06 example. I think I heard the crowd say something along the lines of "F*ck you Cena", "you can't wrestle" and "Same old sh*t". I agree.

I didnt hear you mention Rey Mysterio in that counter.

 

[My$terio_Fan]

Meh? I find Cena to be a bore when the WWE push him down our throats. I really don't like his "never say die" attitude or his gimmick(or lack there of). He usually bores me with his matches(I personally prefer flips and such)but even I can see what a great entertainer Cena is. He bores me but entertains millions. He has a connection with the crowd that alot of wrestlers don't have. He know's how to play the never say die face to a T so that the fans support him even more. He get's boo'd by people who are tired of him always coming out on top but if he was to ever turn heel everyone would probably drools over him(like Edge). The guy is solid on the mic and when he is not being pushed to the sky(like his JBL feud) I actuall enjoy him somewhat. Cena is the most popular person in the WWE right now, like it or not.

 

[Slyfox696]

Wow...just...wow. entertainer doesnt mean wrestler.

No, it means PROFESSIONAL WRESTLER. Entertainer = Professional Wrestler.

A real wrestler is someone like say Rulon Gardner.

But, since we're not talking about Olympic wrestling, it means the same thing.

It means big with the fans, widely known, and used for commercials.

No, that's what is known as a GOOD wrestler. Like Cena.

Wrestler is someone who can actually wrestle (or, in the WWE's case, pretend to wrestle real good) which Cena lacks.

How does that make sense? What is "actually wrestle" supposed to mean? That makes no sense. It's a pretend fight. From ROH to NWA to WWE, they are PRETENDING to fight.

What you are probably trying to say is TECHNICAL wrestling. Well, I got news for you junior, technical wrestling is no different from brawling, which is no different from submission which is no different than aerial wrestling. They are all STYLES of wrestling. Are you going to try to tell me that someone like Bryan Danielson is better than Stan Hanson, because he rolls around on the mat for 45 minutes doing fake moves on a willing partner?

Because, if you are, that's just stupid.

In fact it does. If every second you see a 5-Knuckle Shuffle people are gonna hate ya. Take One Night Stand 06 example. I think I heard the crowd say something along the lines of "F*ck you Cena", "you can't wrestle" and "Same old sh*t". I agree.

LOL

I love when people bring up a match from over 2 years ago, which was performed in front of idiotic fans who were too stupid to realize their own hypocrisy. They chanted "you can't wrestle" and "same old shit" at Cena...while simultaneously cheering for Rob Van Dam. How stupid is that? Rob Van Dam has been doing the same old shit since 1996, and has yet to prove he can regularly put on a good match.

Meanwhile, Cena carried his sorry ass to a very solid match.

I didnt hear you mention Rey Mysterio in that counter.

Probably because you would have had to read it?

Besides that...what does Rey have to do with this topic? I think Rey was a tremendous wrestler before his injury, and once the WWE matches him up with someone besides that big oaf Kane, you'll start to see some good Rey matches again.

I think Rey is a fine wrestler. I think HBK COULD be a good wrestler if he'd ever pull his head out of his ass. What point are you trying to make exactly?

 

[Yrrab]

I think Sly is using this thread as a death-trap

Lucky me, because as of late I've started to enjoy Cena. I used to be super ultra anti-Cena, because of the way he was booked. Superman, blahblahblah. We've all been there. WWE forced him down our throats. He worked his ass off, people eventually got sick of champion. And sure, he never really lost the belt, but I think a lot of people were glad to see someone new as champ, although I was a bit dissapointed in it being Hunter.

Anyways, Cena just seems like a great guy. I hated him blindly the same way I probably hate Batista, but I warmed up to him. Over the past few days I've just been going over and watching a few of Cena's matches. From his debut (which was awesome), to the Batista match at SS. The guy puts on a great fucking match. I don't really care how much of a moveset anyone's got, but I do enjoy selling and telling a great story in the ring. Cena's got that.

Orton and Cena have had the best fued I've ever seen on RAW, WWE era. I hated their fued until the night Orton punted Cena's pops. I mean... jesus. It gave Cena a great story to tell, and just propelled Orton and showed just how far he'd go for the belt.

I'm not really excited about Cena coming back, at least not like I was with Orton. But, I do enjoy watching the guy.

 

[I own a set of balls]

Okay, one thing's first, as I have mentioned before, the current John Cena is NOT a superman anymore. Or was he a superman in 2005 & 2007. Folks, let's think back to the year 2005, otherwise known as the year when the mega powers (Cena and Batista) revealed their status. At wrestlemania 21, John Cena won the WWE champion while Batista won the World Heavy Weight Championship. So both of them are power plants right? WRONG. John Cena was NOTHING MORE than a Runner up from #1 in WWE in year 2005. 2005 is the year of BATISTA, not JOHN CENA. Sure, John Cena has successfully defended the title in a few matches against JBL, but that is NOTHING compared to the opponent Batista had (Triple H, 'Tista even defeated HHH in Hell in a Cell).

A better example of Cena being runner up was the Royal Rumble, when Cena lost to Batista.

Now in 2006, it was the only single year that shows the overpowered of John Cena, who maintained all those events Edge has performed, even defeating Edge at his own game (TLC). Nevertheless, that was the year Cena lost the championship. And in 2007, it was NOT planned to be Cena's year. Sure, Cena won literally all the pay per views, however, he and HBK were seen as less a wrestler than Batista and Undertaker, who actually looked like that they can defeat the team of Cena and HBK.

Now back to the point about Cena not being big in 2007, HE IS NOT PLANNED TO BE THE BEST. The wrestler who was planned to be the man of 2007 was triple H. But unfortunately, Triple H didn't make it due to a knee injury. And remember how Triple H came back as a face? Ever since that, Triple H's been winning. Just look at 2008, the current wins of Triple H were probably suppose to happen somewhere in 2007, but did not happen due to his knee injury.

And if you say that Cena's still being a nuclear powerhouse in 2008, you are blind. Ever after Cena's return after Royal Rumble, the man has mainly been known to job to high profile wrestler. He lost due to Triple H's pedigree in Wrestlemania, He was eliminated by Randy Orton in Backlash, He was defeated cleanly by Triple H at NOC, he was even defeated by JBL, and our favorite match at Summerslam, he was defeated by Batista cleanly.

And speaking of his 3, 4 or 5 moves. That is bullshit. No, my mistake, that is BEYOND bullshit.
Is "sit out hip toss", "fisherman suplex", "lou thesz press", "twisting belly to belly suplex", "Diving leg drop", "neck snap" and 2 sig. moves sound like 3, 4 or 5 moves to you?

For those of you that says he performs 3, 4 or 5 in a match, are you BLIND?

I'm not a fanatic of his, but I am a simple supporter of his (accidentally clicked fanatic button, but nevertheless...)

 

[HBK-aholic]

Cena is boring. I've enjoyed maybe 3-4 matches of his in the last few years. I'm not denying the fact he's a good wrestler, I voted for I dislike him but he's good. However just because everyone else finds him entertaining, I don't have to. And I'm here to give my opinion, not the collective view of millions. There's just something about him I can't get into. Which is a shame, because when he had the rapping gimmick he was as funny as hell. He's changed now though, and he'll never go back to anything similar. A good thing for the WWE, no doubt. It'd be stupid of them to change their biggest star. But I'd like it if they did.

 

[Danmen001]

What can I say? I went from being a Cena fanatic (then again, I was 12 ) to being neutral about him, and now, I'm back to being a Cena fanatic.

To me Cena's matches are always good. They always ... mean something, I guess you could say. Starpower is one of the things that makes good matches, besides being a good worker obviously. Cena can do both of those. I also have always found it funny when people say "Cena only knows x amount of moves", yet they can go ahead and be able to name all of his moves. They actually know what they are - if that isn't building power to your moveset, nothing is.

Cena lover for life.

 

[a7xoff]

After several months since I actually posted in the other Cena thread. My opinion on the guy continues to change. I used to think that it really was just the same thing match in and match out when it came to Cena. After watching WWE for the past few months I reall can't pick out 1 wrestler who does not do the same thing match in and match out. Example: Batista spinebuster, jump on rope like a monkey, Batista Bomb. See it's the same sequence match in and match out. Getting back to Cena though. I have a ton of respect for the guy. Even when he's injured he still goes out and meets with the fans, and basically does whatever he can do while he's injured.
Nobody can complain that Cena does not deserve to be in the spot he is now in the WWE. He has a great work ethic which surly gets rewarded. As far as gimmick, I don't like it at all. I find it very bland, though Cena cuts one Hell of a promo. Still like the current over his rapper gimmick.

 

[Skillz]

It was a great idea to start a new Cena thread with a new poll. The old one was almost 3 years old, which means that that poll wasn't reliable anymore. People's opinions change over time and it's clear now that way more people respect Cena, compared to 2 years ago, 1 year ago, and even 6 months ago.

When people say that Cena has the same match over and over again, they are not looking at the matches in the right way. They are only looking at what moves are done, not the story that is being told. Being able to have different matches is not about what moves you do in each match. It's about what kinds of different stories are being told depending on the wrestler's character, the opponent's style, and the type of feud. Cena is a master at being able to adapt himself to get the best out of his opponents. All you have to do is watch his matches over the past 3 years to see how versatile of a worker he is.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

It's amazing to see how people's opinions of John Cena have changed over the past few years.. Months.. Three years ago, 90% of the people here hated Cena. Now, over 50% like him, and 75% respect him. That's a major improvement.

John Cena is a hell of a worker. He's had two major injuries and he's come back from both months before he should have. No one can deny that John Cena has the biggest heart and passion for the business today. I was blown away when he came back in the Rumble this year. What was that, four months before he was scheduled to be back? And he came back a month or two before most people do from this type of injury. It's amazing, to me.

He had a good match with Jericho tonight too. Awesome stuff.

Czena rox.

 

[JaJaBings]

His injuries prior to his shock return at Royal Rumble might be a work. Claiming it to be longer than it was supposed to be, so that it'll throw the audience off guard when he comes back 'prematurely', as seen during the Royal Rumble.

But I won't deny he's very passionate about the business and has no qualms stepping into the ring the minute his doctor gives him the thumbs up sign. For that, I respect him.

Even loyal workers such as Undertaker, HHH, HBK might have some reservations about entering the ring ASAP after recovering from their injuries.

 

[Shadowmancer]

I still maintain that John Cena is a more entertaining chaser of the title than he is as a holder of it. I look forward to this reign being relatively short compared to his last one. hopefully he does nothing with the belt this time. There is no need to with the Big Gold Belt. I don't have much to say other than Cena is now bigger than the belt he doesn't need it as a crutch to be over with the fans, I would rather of seen him come back and lose due to other factors for the first match back. It makes him seem invincible which is always a bad sign.

 

[CCS]

Well , John Cena's champ again. I'm not going to judge his reign yey because it's only 12 hours long , But i HOPE it wont be another long drawn out reign. Cena's over a year long reign in 2007 is why many fans hate Cena. If he has a good 4 month reign i wont have a problem with it. Cena's proved himself to be a great champion and a great ambassador for the WWE. (Let's just hope the belt doesnt spin , Lol.) I see Cena holding the title to at least Judgement Day where he'll lose it to whoever wins the money in the bank match at wrestlemania. I'm looking forward to his reign and upcoming feud with Batista. It should be interesting at the least.