The Legacy of Hardcore Holly

[Taker123]

Right this may seem to you all as a boring thread however- I was just randomly looking up Goldust and got to looking up Cody Rhodes...then Hardcore "Bob" Holly. This man Hardcore Holly is /was a great athlete...he looked like a superstar..he sold well...performed consistent from 1999+...

He had a horific neck injury which did hold him back but do you guys think he deserved a better shot? Maybe a run or two (or presitge run with the IC title, US title) and even the World Heavyweight championship, WWE TITLE! He
was very agile in the ring and you believed what he did...he made you believe he was hurting his opponents, he was damn scary from time to time he was a proper, "bar room brawler" as JR would say and as Cole destroyed!! He was also as JR would say a "slobber-knocker"!! He was the Stone Cold of the undercard/mid card.

I enjoyed Holly...I just want you guys to give you input on whether or not you thought he was worthy of a better run? And what will his legacy be? I can't help he's just left a Stevie Richards/Al Snow legacy...great potential but could have been a hell of a lot more.

I think if he was in the original ECW - Paul Heyman could have done wonders with i.e what he did with Stone Cold

Lets be honest Holly; had the look, consistency, the believable factor, and he was enjoyable to watch?

You agree/Don't agree...I want your opinions...

 

[The Con Volt]

I have to agree that Hardcore Holly was an incredible worker, with a great crowd reaction and following. BUT. Holly is famous for being one of the most stiff wrestlers in modern history. And If you weren't paying attention to what happened to Mr. Kennedy, then I could understand why someone might be confused why these guys didn't go as high on the ladder in the long run. For the record, Holly did in fact get a world title shot once. But he just worked way to stiff and it pissed off too many people. Brock Lesnar dropped his ass out of the ring onto the steel steps, and I think we all know the end of that tragic story.

 

[INDYjon22]

Well the reason he made everything look like it hurt is because it did. Hardcore Holly was a very stiff worker, especially with rookies. That being said I always liked Holly. He was a solid performer for the WWE in his day. I think that he should have had at least one good run with either the IC or US title, I think he could have done well, especially with the US. They could have given him some sort of real American gimmick, be it face or heel. I don't agree that he should have ever won the world championship. He just wasn't that top rate caliber of talent that deserved a true world title reign. He had a good run though and I will be interested to see if the WWE inducts him into the Hall of Fame in time or not.

 

[Steamboat Ricky]

Hardcore Holly was awesome because of his name and the fact that he came out with Crash carrying those scales. He had some great matches with Al Snow, but without the Hardcore Division...Holly wasn't much to talk about.

 

[boozinjedi]

I totally agree,Hardcore Holly could have been so much bigger!!
I do also think that if Heyman had picked him up early..WOW!!!!
BUT if you want to talk about what wonders Heyman could've done...
Just imagine if Bruiser Brody had been around for the original ECW??

 

[The Best At What I Do]

Well the reason he made everything look like it hurt is because it did. Hardcore Holly was a very stiff worker, especially with rookies. That being said I always liked Holly. He was a solid performer for the WWE in his day. I think that he should have had at least one good run with either the IC or US title, I think he could have done well, especially with the US. They could have given him some sort of real American gimmick, be it face or heel. I don't agree that he should have ever won the world championship. He just wasn't that top rate caliber of talent that deserved a true world title reign. He had a good run though and I will be interested to see if the WWE inducts him into the Hall of Fame in time or not.

It was actually quite clear from watching Bob that he was too stiff of a worker with rookies. He sandbagged Brock and got a broken neck out of it. Not saying he deserved it but hey, he probably shouldn't of been such an asshole with the new guys. Anyways, back to the original topic, not much of a legacy to speak of with this guy. I've seen plenty of his work and while I appreciated the reality of the hits in his matches, he's never impressed me in any significant way

 

[Nadeem Ahmad]

Bob Holly really was a tough dude. He even looked like he could get a few shots in against Kurt Angle on "WWF Smackdown!" but did not seem defensive enough. I mean he looked to get tired faster than other guys and would go down quicker than dishing out impacts. That fact did not minimize the brash hits though. He certainly knew how to use a weapon and how to brawl but athletically could not be too versatile other than using a nice dropkick and a standing vertical suplex which was basically a sideways suplex. I think versatility, defense and stamina were the main factors that kept him away from prominence but I was still impressed nonetheless and thought he was more about the performances than about titles, victories or about promos.

I also felt that he was sarcastically yet unintentionally funny. Once on "WWF Raw is War" during the last part of the previous decade he tried to make fun of Tazz and I am paraphrasing but he said something along the lines which sounded like "What happenned to you Tazz? You used to be tough. You're just a commentator now." with a natural cocky smile on the face that let me crack up because I knew he was using a reserved yet unique personality. Later he had to job to Tazz but they were impressive because Holly used a bit of differing suplexes, holds and pushed him around but Tazz let quickness and punches turn the control was a rougher person of the bout. I thought it was a segment that might have been able to be seen at a smaller "Pay-Per-View" like "Backlash", "Judgment Day" or "No Way Out" but it was a momentary feud of the night. Basically around this time he had been going around and challenging strong people like Viscera, Faarooq and Bradshaw and other big people so Tazz probably was one of the other few wrestlers that he had not face before that time. He also was thought to have weighed with allegedly more than four hundred pounds like Crash was and I ridiculously wanted him to get a chance against the team of Big Show and of Undertaker during that previous summer when he tried to stand up to them on separate occasions.

 

[rayisawesomeness]

I personally loved him, especially in 2006 where he had a great run in ECW. If there is one thing I'll remember about this man, it's his toughness that he showed in his Extrme Rules match against RVD. If you guys remember, he had a disgusting gash on his back which he received after suplexing RVD through a table where his back caught the rim of the table. The match between the two represented everything about pro wrestling, passion. I don't care what people are going to say, it was a five star match in my book. It's that match I'll remember him for, not his some of his matches on SmackDown or his 2000 run.

 

[JBK2008]

Hardcore was a as solid a wrestler as Triple H, Shawn Michaels, the late Eddie Guerrero and Chris Benoit. He made everything look powerful and painful, but sadly most of the time it did hurt his opponent in reality. He was too stiff and it did rub a lot of guys the wrong way, especially the rookies. He always believed the rookies need to earn their stripes, not given to them.

That may have been his undoing, which is a shame because he could do wonders right now for ECW and all that young talent or even on SmackDown to help polish the mid carders there. He had the look and the ability, but his old school philosophies killed him.

As far as his legacy goes, he was a great wrestler. He performed with the best, but was just to hard on his opposition, and in the end, he made too many enemies in that sense and it came back to bite him.

 

[jazzua]

Wow, Holly as good as HHH, HBK, Eddie, and Benoit? I don't think so. He was definately a solid worker, but thats really tossing him in an area he doesn't belong. There is nothing wrong with being a very good worker, not everyone should be great, and those four are great, thats the difference. Holly was actually a fairly gifted athlete. He had one hell of a drop kick as well. I just have a hard time picturing him as anything other than a Billy Gunn...he just had that Billy factor to him. Great look, good worker, but mid card and thats it. I've always wondered what it is about wrestling and legacy's. If you think about it, that word is thrown around alot more than it should be. Normally, a legacy is garnered by someone who did something great. In wrestling, we want to give one to every performer there ever was. Holly was a solid talent, but a legacy belongs to a league he wasn't apart of.

 

[PEP3]

Actually, Jazzua, a "legacy" is simply the lasting impression one leaves and will be remembered by. "Legend" is what's left by someone who has done something great and leaves a truly significant impact on his or her industry. Anyway, not here to debate vocabulary choices...But I do think it's appropriate to wonder what someone's "legacy" -- lasting, memorable impression -- might be.

Early in Holly's career, he worked in a small southern wrestling company where he and his partner -- listed as his "brother," I believe -- feuded with The Rock 'n Roll Express. The teams traded the organization's tag belts a couple times. (That's not even included on his Wikipedia profile.) It was somewhat ironic, I thought, as one of my favorite memories of Holly is when he teamed with "Bodacious" Bart Gunn to form The New Midnight Express.

Despite winning the NWA World Tag Team Titles (odd, considering it was on WWF TV, as part of an "old school invasion" type storyline), Bart & Bob could never, ever hope to live up to the Midnight Express legacy (where the word is also synonymous with "legend"). Still, just as I was excited by the NWA invasion story, I was equally amped up for anything that allowed Jim Cornette to return to national television.

Afterward, WWE showed plenty of support for Holly as a performer. He received shots at Brock Lesner for the World title, a chance at JBL for the belt later on and for an extended period was the #1 contender to the ECW title, when WWE still considered it a "World Championship." He came up short on all those occasions, but it nonetheless reflects well on Holly that the WWE gave him ample time in the World Title hunt.

With all that said, what is likely to be "Hardcore" Holly's legacy? It might not be huge -- he's far from one of the "greats" -- but he certainly made an impact on the WWE during his 15-year tenure with the company. Surely he will be remember for his incredible number of WWE Hardcore titles (six). He might even be remembered as a WWE tag team champion (3x).

More likely, as has been pointed out time and time again here, he'll be simply remembered as one of the stiffest workers of the modern era. I'm not sure that's entirely something to brag about, though.

 

[Blade]

He never really did anything. In more ways than one. There was a reason he was part of the job squad, because he just wasn't really good enough to do anything of worth. He showed nothing but mediocrity and in return he had a mediocre career.

He had 1 world title shot at Royal Rumble 2004. But that was obviously a filler match because all the other big stars on Smackdown were either already in a match or were in the rumble. Plus due to Holly's douchebag-ey-ness, he caused Lesnar to injure his neck which gave the match some kind of build up.

But apart from that, Holly never did anything decent. And he doesn't actually have a legacy, either. Crash has a way better legacy than him.

 

[jazzua]

I do understand the definition of the word legacy. I also expected someone to mention it. I'm not confusing it with legend, but more so with the way others use it. Problem is, in order to technically leave a legacy you have to have something to leave. In my mind, even though it may not follow the terms actual definition, I don't see Holly as having a legacy. He left no impression on me as a fan that will ever make me think, yeah, I remember Holly doing this or that. So, if you want to really dive into it, I suppose his legacy to me would be that he is forgotten. Not much of a legacy really. When talking about a legacy, it is still most commonly used to describe something great, or bad, someone did. I don't expect to have any sort of legacy when I die. I will have lived life like the majority of people, trying to stay ahead of bills, enjoy my family, and stay as happy as possible. To me, thats not a legacy, that's just a life. The term legend itself, as I hope we can agree, is definately a word that people have ignored the definition of for a long time.

 

[jmt225]

Hardcore Holly, in my opinion, is as shitty of a wrestler as one can be, and that’s exactly what his legacy should be.

The guy is absolutely worthless. Honestly, the only time I was ever entertained by him, was when he was getting rag-dolled by Brock Lesnar. That’s literally it. Nothing else from his career is memorable. Nothing.

Also, behind the scenes, he was a prick, and no doubt that will be apart of his legacy as well.

The guy is simply a shit stain in the history of World Wrestling Entertainment and I’ll never know why WWE kept him employed for as long as they did.

 

[X]

Awww MAN shit, even my man JMT is shitting all over Holly? Oh man, I was going to come into this thread and defend the man but now I see I that I'm possibly the only person to have ever liked Bob Holly as a wrestler. You guys are way too harsh on the guy, he busted his ass for years despite being given absolutely nothing to work with. Sure, he was never going to be more than a midcarder at best, but the guy was a legit tough motherfucker who you would not want to get into a fight with. That guy has absolutely destroyed his body in professional wrestling, you can't say he didn't give it his all, shit remember that huge gash he got in his back from that table in the beginning of the WWE ECW? He finished that match like he was just hanging out at a barber shop, cool as a fuckin' cucumber.

Haha, fuck you guys, I will remain a fan of Bob Holly. He had some underrated matches with Al Snow both inside and outside of the ring. His legacy may just be as a lower card wrestler, but he had to be one of the toughest S.O.B.s the WWE ever employed. You would not want to walk into Bob Holly in a dark alleyway.

 

[Nadeem Ahmad]

What was the finishing move of Bob Holly? I think the signature move was the "standing vertical suplex" but which manuever did he use to finish the few matches that he won with? I think I read somewhere about the "Alabama Slam" but I barely believe any text that I see to be true. I think he used something like a "pumphandle" into a powerslam but Test did that stuff too mostly as a trademark.

Oh I needed to edit this message after I remembered that the "pumphandle" into the powerslam was the finisher of Test and the trademark was instead a "gutwrench powerbomb".

 

[jazzua]

What was the finishing move of Bob Holly? I think the signature move was the "standing vertical suplex" but which manuever did he use to finish the few matches that he won with? I think I read somewhere about the "Alabama Slam" but I barely believe any text that I see to be true. I think he used something like a "pumphandle" into a powerslam but Test did that stuff too mostly as a trademark.

Oh I needed to edit this message after I remembered that the "pumphandle" into the powerslam was the finisher of Test and the trademark was instead a "gutwrench powerbomb".

The finisher I remember most was the Alabama Slam. It was his best move next to his drop kick. He did do it quite well, it looked painful for sure. I personally can't remember anything else, but I'm positive he used something else during the beginning of his run in WWE.