Ryback the man vince doesn't see money in.

Gavschenko

Pre-Show Stalwart
Think about it after what Shawn Michaels said in an interview about he was talking to Vince about a current top WWE star who he doesn't see money in. Yes I know Ryback ain't 250 pounds but he is 6'3.Think about it if you don't count ryback's fall in the lumberjack match against cena, Ryback has not won a ppv match since last years money in the bank when he defeated Hawkins and Reks. Ryback was one of the most over people in the company feuding with punk at last years HIAC, so why did he get beat month after month. After watching last nights Raw this made me think. I have been wanting to do a Ryback thread for awhile due to him always getting beat at ppv's and after last nights weak showing something is going on. I have two questions to ask:

1. Did they make ryback weak so cena could be the top face like they de-pushed ryder when he was red hot?

2. Is ryback the man that vince said couldnt draw money so he decided to stop the push.

Let me know what you think is their another reason why he has been pushed aside?
 
Ryback lost month after month last year because WWE booked themselves into a corner. They already had Punk/Rock set for the Rumble, so when Cena got injured they put Ryback in his place to try and get him over more. He was way over, but him losing all the time in bs fashion killed all his momentum.

Then they screwed up by turning him heel before he could finish his business with The Shield. He's the one that should've beaten them since they debuted solely to screw him.

But I have a hard time believing VKM doesn't see any money in him. He's got the look Vince loves. It has nothing whatsoever to do with Cena, they just didn't put any forethought into his push. He should've stayed around the midcard until after WM29. By booking him poorly they screwed his character up immensely and now they're basically starting back from square one. Maybe even less than that, because he's worse off now than he was when he debuted.

And to say they depushed Ryder because of Cena is assinine. Ryder was never going to hit that level.
 
1 - No that is utter nonsense. 'De-pushing superstars' is a complete myth. If there is money to be made they will make it. Ryback and Ryder were never red hot either, not even close.

2 - Nope, Vince is high on Ryback according to people in the business, he has been booked pathetically, especially at PPV's. Ryback will never 'be the man' but he can make WWE alot of money.

He has had two shots at the title, CM Punk and recently John Cena. He has come up against number 1 and 2 in the company. I wouldn't say he is getting depushed, simply his push is over.

For what it is worth, I think the man in question is Curtis Axel - he is around 6f3 and 250lbs. Vince and Heyman have obviously had another squabble and Vince has given Heyman benefit of the doubt.
 
Ryback is a guy Vince has reportedly been high on since back in his Nexus days, the issue has been timing and in Ryback's case the timing has always been wrong.

He wasn't ready when he was slingshot into the feud with Punk for the WWE title as a face, the succession of Punk to Rock to Cena was obvious to a blind man so it meant he was never going to continue his forward momentum.

Then he gets a heel turn after losing as a face too often and it looked like the chance to give him a bit of a fresh start and rebuild him as a monster heel. Only once again he finds himself in a "Needs must" situation and is booked immediately into another WWE title feud that he has zero chance of winning as Cena just got the belt back.

Now it looked to me that they protected him in both matches with the first match being a draw and him winning the first fall in the 3 stages of hell rematch, doing that rare thing, pinning Cena clean while never actually being pinned or made to tap out by him.

However since then they have went in a very odd direction, making him into to a whiny chickenshit, making him look soft and having Jericho call him Cryback, that kinda thing sticks. Very strange.
 
Ryback lost month after month last year because WWE booked themselves into a corner. They already had Punk/Rock set for the Rumble, so when Cena got injured they put Ryback in his place to try and get him over more. He was way over, but him losing all the time in bs fashion killed all his momentum.

Then they screwed up by turning him heel before he could finish his business with The Shield. He's the one that should've beaten them since they debuted solely to screw him.

But I have a hard time believing VKM doesn't see any money in him. He's got the look Vince loves. It has nothing whatsoever to do with Cena, they just didn't put any forethought into his push. He should've stayed around the midcard until after WM29. By booking him poorly they screwed his character up immensely and now they're basically starting back from square one. Maybe even less than that, because he's worse off now than he was when he debuted.

And to say they depushed Ryder because of Cena is assinine. Ryder was never going to hit that level.

I think the problem with the Shield is that the Shield ended up getting more over than they were expected to. Once WWE saw that Ambrose, Rollins, and Reigns were getting a huge following, they took a huge detour in their booking and Ryback ended up getting sacrificed to put THEM over.


I really don't think Vince see's Ryback as a possible replacement for Cena. As much as Vince likes his big monsters, those guys are hardly ever #1 in WWE. They may win titles, but in reality, the powerhouse brutes are only pushed so that they can be the ultimate enhancement talent, a "dragon" for the "little guys" ("little guys" can be anyone from a Daniel Bryan type to a big muscular guy like John Cena) to overcome and look like the big hero.
 
I think the problem with the Shield is that the Shield ended up getting more over than they were expected to. Once WWE saw that Ambrose, Rollins, and Reigns were getting a huge following, they took a huge detour in their booking and Ryback ended up getting sacrificed to put THEM over.


I really don't think Vince see's Ryback as a possible replacement for Cena. As much as Vince likes his big monsters, those guys are hardly ever #1 in WWE. They may win titles, but in reality, the powerhouse brutes are only pushed so that they can be the ultimate enhancement talent, a "dragon" for the "little guys" ("little guys" can be anyone from a Daniel Bryan type to a big muscular guy like John Cena) to overcome and look like the big hero.

Wrong. All top guys from Hogan to Rock to Batista to Cena were/are all "big men" (Heavyweights).
Small guys other then Bret Hart didn't really do well as the top guy.
I don't get why the IWC hates every heavyweight wrestler.

Also,the Shield aren't as over as IWC thinks they are.
 
1 - No that is utter nonsense. 'De-pushing superstars' is a complete myth. If there is money to be made they will make it. Ryback and Ryder were never red hot either, not even close.

If you think ryder was never red hot you must not have watched the product in 2011 and 2012 cause the crowd went nuts for him especially at MSG when the rock was sucking up to the crowd their chanting we want ryder yeah ryder is from new york but this was Rock's first match in about 8years that shows how over he was.
 
dont think vince was talking about ryback but i do think they may of already blown it with him.the guy is not only huge but he actually looks like a mean sob who was likened to goldberg on top of that the crowd where really into him.i think on this occasion they should of gone with the obvious and have him go on a win streak and batter everyone.but instead they had him lose all the time which killed his momentum and now hes been made out to be a wimpy coward i just dont get it.also i usually hate the tactic wwe use sometimes where they slap a world title on someone and assume that immediately makes them a huge star but i think it might of worked for ryback had they gone with the undefeated monster option instead of turning him into cryback.
 
I've always wondered this and I'm sure I'm not the only one, but does anybody blame Rybacks fall on Cena's injury? Just think, if at HIAC last year, we would have seen Punk/Cena and Ryback wouldn't have necessarily been put into the WWE Championship picture for a long time. He didn't have to be put in the Triple Threat match at Survivor Series, and The Shield could have still debuted to stop Cena from beating Punk.

If Cena never would have been injured, we might still see an undefeated Ryback, or at least a Ryback getting big pops still. Thoughts?
 
I see someone mentioned they think it is Curtis Axel. I doubt that. He's not even billed as 250, and is nowhere near that size from what I can see. Christian, billed now at I think 212, was announced for a short while at about 180 or so when they were going through a brief phase of honestly in the weights.

I was thinking Michaels might have been referring to the Ryback as well. He doesn't strike me as a legit 300 pounder like Stan Hansen or Blackjack Mulligan. I remember early reports from back in the NXT days that Vince thought the former Skip Sheffield had potential. And from the Ryback's own out-of-character interviews, he sounds like he has the drive to want to get to the top, which would impress Vince. But perhaps Vince's opinion changed when Mr. Reeves got his chance on the big stage. I don't think he has the look that people say Vince loves. He's got some of it, being that bodybuilder visual. But the Ryback is overly muscled on a relatively smaller frame than past top guys, and he lacks the leading-man appeal of guys like Cena that appeals widely.
 
Ryback is certainly not the one who Vince "doesn't see money in." The person who Vince doesn't see money in is Daniel Bryan and I don't care what Shawn Michaels tweeted or what any website reported.

Wrestlers' twitter accounts and wrestling websites are there to work the internet fans. Honestly, I think the original report that Vince didn't see money in a particular star (obviously implied to be Bryan) is a work too, especially considering Vince's recent comments towards Bryan on TV.

As far as Ryback's push cooling off, I'm puzzled. I think Vince just gets bored. He gets caught up with his "pet projects" for awhile, then moves onto the next. It was Ryback, followed by Fandango, and next it will be the Wyatt family. Not to say these guys won't have staying power, but after awhile, I think Vince simply focuses on something else, thus making it seem like a wrestler is losing his push.
 
Let us all face it. WWE fucked up. They fucked up big time. Ryback could have been big. All he needed was a mouthpiece to exercise the WWE Universe's system, and he could have been considered the next top dog. WWE did book themselves into a corner, because every situation they put themselves in, he couldn't win. At Hell in a Cell, he couldn't beat CM Punk that early for the WWE Championship; at Survivor Series the debut of the Shield interrupted his ascent without him looking weak; at TLC the Shield had to win to look credible; at Royal Rumble they didn't want him to headline WrestleMania 29 in New York / New Jersey, one big ass event; at Elimination Chamber the Shield continued their dominance; and at WrestleMania 29, he should have won, but WWE gave it to Mark Henry. I won't complain, I love Henry, but Ryback needed the moment of lifting him up and getting the three count.

This feud with John Cena was make or break for me. If Ryback didn't win at Extreme Rules, I knew he wouldn't win at all. The ending surprised me, so I didn't mind that he didn't win, because he didn't lose either and he looked dominant in doing so. At Payback, he had no chance in a piss poor stipulated match.

Ryback needed a steady growth and someone to be there with him. Paul Heyman? Maybe. It doesn't need to be Heyman, but someone like Heyman who understands the superstar he is working with and understands the crowds he is in front of.

I can see Vince saying that Ryback has had it. I really couldn't suggest how you start to build him up again. He has so many big losses to his name, you can't forget that. That will hinder his chances in the future. Plus, the crowd don't buy into him, and I think that is the most important aspect. The easiest option - get rid of him. What does he benefit in the WWE? The Wyatt Family are coming, The Shield are looking great and are three stars in the making, NXT has some good up and coming talent. Ryback doesn't shine. Perhaps it is time to pull the plug on Ryback. Shame.
 
Wrong. All top guys from Hogan to Rock to Batista to Cena were/are all "big men" (Heavyweights).
Small guys other then Bret Hart didn't really do well as the top guy.
I don't get why the IWC hates every heavyweight wrestler.

Also,the Shield aren't as over as IWC thinks they are.
Yeah, Austin sucked and didn't really get over. Neither did Ric Flair. You would think that someone with the name ProWrestlingFan would think before posting something so obviously wrong.

The Shield are very over.

As far as Ryback goes, he is generic. He really doesn't stand out with anything that he does. Guys like that are a dime a dozen. He is not going to be a money maker.

Ryback is certainly not the one who Vince "doesn't see money in." The person who Vince doesn't see money in is Daniel Bryan and I don't care what Shawn Michaels tweeted or what any website reported.
So Vince doesn't see money in the guy who is actually making him money? That makes no sense.
 
So Vince doesn't see money in the guy who is actually making him money? That makes no sense.

Exactly. It doesn't have to. As long as Vince's self serving agenda is met, it's all good.

But just as I said earlier, if Vince is as much of a visionary as he wants everyone to think he is, this would be a work all the way. Fans are supposed to think Vince is a self serving a-hole who doesn't like the wrestlers that they like.
 
i wouldnt be surprised. it made ryback look so fucking weak this past weak. he fought justin gabriel and justin gabriel injured his ankle. FUCKING JUSTIN GABRIEL OF ALL PEOPLE! JUSTIN GABRIEL IS A JOBBER WHO HASNT APPEARED ON TV AT ALL! lol justin fuckin gabriel injured ryback's ankle?? what??

then this week. the miz won by forfeit against ryback. THE MIZ? i dont know how u guys put it, but the miz has no credibility compared to ryback. its just so embarassing how ryback forfeited. lol!
 
Ryback lost month after month last year because WWE booked themselves into a corner. They already had Punk/Rock set for the Rumble, so when Cena got injured they put Ryback in his place to try and get him over more. He was way over, but him losing all the time in bs fashion killed all his momentum.

This is where it all it started. Ryback was hot, and then WWE had to put him up against Punk. Yeah, I guess you can say WWE tried to preserve his momentum by not having Ryback lose clean against Punk. But fact of the matter is, he still lost each match. The writing was on the wall, when Rock came out to announce his WWE Championship match on Raw 1,000, and then Punk turned heel by attacking Rock to close the show. We all knew Rock VS Punk was the money match, with Rock dethroning Punk during his year+ title reign at the Rumble.

Then the heel turn came. Ryback deserves credit for working to improve himself as a bad guy, but again, WWE puts him in the WWE Championship picture at the worst possible time. After WWE made such a big deal out of Cena gaining redemption over Rock at Wrestlemania 29, you knew there was no way in hell he would lose the title to Ryback, because Cena holding on to the WWE Championship for the remainder of 2013 and going into 2014 seems like more of realistic possibility with each passing week.

And what the fuck last night? You have Ryback quit in a match against MIZ of all people? A man of Ryback's size and strength being whiny coward makes sense at all, and it kills the mystique for the "destructive monster" side of his character.

It's not over yet, but character wise, Ryback is in a deep hole right now. Beating Chris Jericho might help things, but what's next after that? You can't throw Ryback back into the WWE Championship picture so soon, especially after Cena threw him through the roof an ambulance. Hopefully, Ryback will stay far away from the WWE Championship picture for a while, and maybe his character will have a chance at regaining some momentum.
 
In my mind right now, the last thing I care about in WWE is Ryback. He was interesting, and then the poor creative for him that has been covered in this forum, the silly loss at Wrestlemania for no apparent reason, the heel turn has been abysmal. For me the nail in the coffin happened when Jericho called him Cryback... that wont end soon... Jericho has a way of setting something in motion. The best thing that can happen for Ryback is to "get hurt" at MITB and lose to Jericho, then he needs to "heal" for about 6 months and come back at the Royal Rumble as a surprise entrant and let him show his strength and reboot this gimmick. I think the guy is a talent, but creative has seriously derailed this guy.
 
I think the Ryback case has finally driven a well-overdue final nail into the coffin for me. Before anybody says anything, I'll go on record of saying that I'm not an IWC mark. I'm not some blindly loyal TNA mark looking for any chance I can get to urinate on any one product. I am a fan of professional wrestling, period - and I do understand that the 'E' is just that...Entertainment, and not even a shadow of the industry to which it used to be part and parcel. Also, this isn't a matter of "hey, just change the channel or turn it off". For me, this is me being tired of watching something I love dearly fail night after night because one man doesn't know when to shit or get off the pot or he just doesn't care anymore (if indeed he ever did).

What's happened to Ryback is terrible. It's absolutely disgusting to me. Sure, we could chalk it up to 'right place, wrong time', as that seems to be what's happened to him for the most part. The problem is, it's more than that. His start (as the Ryback character) was done right, in my opinion. He got to take his time and let the proverbial 'fish in the sea' grow acclimated to his presence and before long they started swimming with him. Before we knew it Ryback was over...and he was over HUGE. Before long, he was a reason for tuning in and a reason for shilling out the funds to pay for tickets and PPVs. In other words, he was putting asses in seats.

Then, the unthinkable happened. Cena had to take a shelf for a little bit and Ryback got to catch a rocket to the main event level and into a feud with CM Punk. His ovations were thunderous by this time and he was over on a level that hadn't been seen for a long time in the 'E'. One reason is because he was something different, something new. He was a much-needed change of pace in a time where 'the pace' was having to choke down Hulk Cena night after night along with every other fan in the building/living room/bar over the age of 10.

He was a welcome change, and we as fans let him know it every time he showed up to deliver the Shellshock. His only words in the rare cases he took a mic were the only words he ever needed: "Feed...me...MORE!". People on here can say what they want, but Ryback was RIDICULOUSLY over during that time, and he kept it up for a while. But here's where the problems start.

Some of you may agree with me, some of you may not...and some of you will certainly balk at the idea...but Ryback was screwed over. Not just by the Shield on-screen either. I believe that he was so over at that time that people over the age of 10 probably weren't going to care when John Cena made his imminent return. Of course not, and why should we have cared? We had Ryback now. But in the end, what Vince giveth, Vince taketh away. Ryback wasn't just knocked back down a few pegs like some who have entered the same kind of situation. No no no. He was buried. He was so hopelessly cast down, losing every single PPV match he ever participated in. No one has more big-match losses than this man. No one. They couldn't even let him go over Mark Henry at Mania 29. WTF.

In all actuality, he could have been just relegated back to the upper mid-card and continued his momentum there. Nope. Vince destroyed him. Say what you want about Vince being 'high' on him, but he has irreparably ruined Ryback. They made him a joke. Ryback is at a point now (especially with the whole Cryback thing) that I don't even think a 6 month vacation/reboot will save him. That means that there might be only one thing left for him...contractual release. I don't know about you, but if I like a guy as a wrestler and want to see him to good things, I certainly don't treat him like that.

I read an article not too long ago about Good Ol' JR 'dispelling' the talk about why people are/are not pushed. It may be JR (legitimately one of my favorite people in the industry and one of my inspirations for wanting to be a part of it) who said that stuff, but I don't believe it. He said it was all about things like: "Some people just don't have 'it'", "Some people just don't work hard enough", and other things too. My problem with this thesis is that there are some WRESTLERS who work for that company who have 55-gallon drums of 'it' and who bust their asses night in and night out, "paying their dues", and still end up languishing in obscurity for all their troubles.

Ryback was a prime case for this. And you know something, there's something I believe in more than what anybody writing an article can presume to tell me - the fans. The proverbial 'asses in seats'. The people who paid money to be in those arenas night after night. Listen to their reactions to things sometime. We as fans are the measuring stick of what's good to us and what isn't. We always have been. The 'E' forgot that and now their ratings are actually declining and I'm pretty sure things may or may not be slowing down in others areas as well. I don't know, maybe it's just me. Maybe I'm just old school.

A lot of really good talent gets released yearly. Some get released for legit problems like causing scenes on airplane trips and drug problems and other issues. My problem is that some people get released simply because the 'E' just doesn't have anything for them to do. No stories to participate in. I fear that's what's in store for Ryback.

At the end of the day, these guys are just men and women trying to hold down a job and support a family like you or me. Vince's 'creative A.D.D.' comes at the costs of those jobs. That's something that, as a blue-collar man myself, pisses me off. This is made even worse by the 'monopoly', meaning there's not many other places where these guys can take their craft and there skill. It's tragic and I hope it doesn't happen to Ryback. That guy deserves a title run, at least one good one.

Sorry that was a long rant, but it needed to be said. Just something I'm tired of seeing. Maybe Ryback is the guy Vince isn't seeing money in.
 
Vince can take at least some of the blame if it really is Ryback he is refering to. This summer has been done backwards following WM29 as far as the title picture goes. For whatever reason, The Rock not doing Extreme RUles as he was supposedly supposed to do, and with Punk taking time off, they throw Ryback into the title picture fresh off of a loss to Mark Henry at WM. Follow that up with what I perceive to be THEEE worst heel turn in recent memory, who would buy in to RYback or this feud. Certainly not I. I could at that point care less for him as I couldnt buy into him as heel as they were trying to push down our throats. Instead they should have had Henry come off his clean win as the already established monster heel challenge Cena. Have Ryback contnue to work as a face while slowly teasing a heel turn which they could have done at this point making his turn more meaningful. I know some of u will dislike the idea due to the recent success of the "retirement" angle but come on, after MITB Henry isnt walking out the champ anyway. A well played out Ryback turn could have been as successful if done correctly. Instead they sacrificed his development just to fill a void AGAIN. Im not even a RYback fan dont get me wrong. I,too, dont see mega bucks written on his forehead but I could see a successful run/feud with him if built a lot better. nothing too long term I guess
 
I was liking the Ryback program until they constantly buried him now it's hard to buy into it. Now they're going to a whiny program with Chris Jerico, come on WWE haven't you killed him enough? Only way he is going to be relevant again is if he destroys Chris, maybe have an angel that he injured him as he's about to leave to go tour with Fozzy again, like they did with Ziggler and making him lose his contract to help get Ziggler over.
 
Yeah, he definitely wasn't talking about Zack Ryder. He doesn't even know Ryder exists, so stop building the guy up. No one cares about Zack Ryder, least of all Vince McMahon. Certainly not enough to talk with Shawn Michaels about him.

I have no idea who he was talking about, but Ryback is a likely candidate. If Vince feels this way, he has no one to blame but himself (and his writing/creative staff, but he controls them).

Ryback never stood a chance, same with CM Punk and Randy Orton. All of them are too close to Cena in age, and Cena's not going anywhere. The only way to make any of those guys a huge deal is for them to surpass Cena, and that's not happening.

Ryback may have what it takes, but he'll never get the chance. These guys cannot be booked stronger than John Cena because he's nowhere near done. That's the real problem for guys like Ryback. Wrong place, wrong time.
 
Ryback is a better face than heel. it does not help that at no point has he been the favorite to beat cena. so when ryback loses their is no surprise. this cena main event feud is just too predictable right now.
 
Ryback is a better face than heel. it does not help that at no point has he been the favorite to beat cena. so when ryback loses their is no surprise. this cena main event feud is just too predictable right now.

It really depends n how Ryback is portrayed as a heel. The problem with Ryback as a heel is that he is made to look beatable in the eyes of the fans. If I was to look at his recent feud with Cena the problem is Cena was allowed to go over in that feud. It's Ryback's first run as a heel (outside being Skipp Sheffield) and with his size and physique he should have gone over his first feud as a heel (a reason why Khali went over Taker the first time around though I am not saying Khali = Ryback because Ryback has more talent).

Of course maybe the WWE does not want to make Ryback champion. If so fine, but then It would have better if he feuded with The Miz for the IC Instead and look dominant as the IC Champion. Book him to give a reason for fans to hate him maybe destroy guys like Kofi, Sinn Cara, or Kane.
 

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