"Pro life"

[ipswichicon80]

This is not that big in the UK(where I'm from) but from what I understand it's a big thing in the US.

Here are my problems withe "pro life" group. First the name. It's a minipulation and it makes no sense! I mean who isn't pro life?Life is good death is bad,pretty much everyone agrees with this!

Let's look at the most famous "pro life" guy George W Bush.He cut aid to countries that allowed abortion.As Aid is sent to starving people with poor medical care then it's a safe bet people died because of this. Just to repeat thateople died becuase George was "pro life"!Please someone explain to me in what world that makes anything even remotley resembleing common sense!

Also good old George W signed(as govener of Texas) 26 death warrents,including 3 people who were offically ******ed. Whatever your views on capital punishment you must agree that doesn't exactly scream "pro Life" does it? More like before your born I'll protect you but once your born well fuck you!

But that's just semantics(Although btw the way the reason they are "pro life as opposed to being "anti abortion" is a mind trick,if you can't work out why I'll be happy to let you know)

So the matter in hand. If the state found out someone was having a baby with say downs and said to the mother "we order you to have an abortion" The mother would(quite rightly) say "I'm the person who has to raise it not you. So the choice is mine! And sorry you can't have freedom of choice one way and not another.

Also if the "pro lifers" had there way women who had been raped would be fro

forced to give birth to the child of the man who raped them. I'll repeat that women who have been raped would be FORCED to give give birth to the child of the man who raped them. Does this sound resonable to anyone. I'm not saying they shouldn't have a child by a rapeist,but it is only right to give them that choice, as after all we live in a free world. Any thoughts?

 

[HBK-aholic]

If I could make a list of things I hate in the world, 'Pro-life' would be incredibly high on that list. The whole movement, the people in it, I just cannot stand it, and no argument (I've heard all of them) has ever convinced me being pro-life would EVER be a good thing.

They are 'anti-abortion', I love it when they complain about that name. I can understand if someone who is pro-choice dislikes being called 'pro-abortion' as the name implies they're FOR abortions taking place, which isn't true. Many Pro-choicers would never have an abortion themselves but realise that keeping it legal is a necessity, as well as arguably a right for women. One thing the pro-life movement seem to ignore is that pro-choice is also about reducing the amount of abortions that take place, they just assume everyone who supports abortion being legal are murderers.

Regarding rape, it's just one of the many reasons abortion must stay legal, and is a big part of me being pro-choice. A few people in the 'pro-life' movement want to illegalise abortion apart from in the case of rape. This is clearly not possible. For a start, it'd involve the woman going to the police about it - something she may not want to do. It's be impossible because a rape trial takes a lot longer than the few months that would be needed in order to gain an abortion. Then, it'd increase th number of people lying about rape a lot - people who wanted an abortion would just cry rape regardless.

 

[The Legendary 23]

I myself am pro-choice, pro-abortion, or whatever the hell you want to call it. However, this subject doesn't really cause me any distress and while I am certainly not ignorant of it, I just don't pay much heed to the debate. I have heard arguments presented by "pro-lifers" about why abortion is a disgrace to modern humanity and all that. I never really bought into it. I believe that abortion does not cause immense pain to the fetus, as many pro-lifers say.

I guess the reason that I don't pay much attention to the subject is that I trust my moral instincts, and I have a natural inclination to side pro-choice. It just made sense to me when I heard both sides of the argument. I've always been pro-choice. Maybe it's not so much my natural instincts but rather my teenage years. Oh well, either way, it doesn't bother me too much.

 

[Slyfox696]

Let's look at the most famous "pro life" guy George W Bush.He cut aid to countries that allowed abortion.As Aid is sent to starving people with poor medical care then it's a safe bet people died because of this. Just to repeat thateople died becuase George was "pro life"!Please someone explain to me in what world that makes anything even remotley resembleing common sense!

Also good old George W signed(as govener of Texas) 26 death warrents,including 3 people who were offically ******ed. Whatever your views on capital punishment you must agree that doesn't exactly scream "pro Life" does it? More like before your born I'll protect you but once your born well fuck you!

It's a well known fact that, to many Republicans, Pro-Life ends at birth. True story.

As far as the Pro-Life goes, I have no problem with people who are Pro-Life. Good for them, I'm glad they take that view. Personally, I'm a big fan of the Pro-Life argument myself. I believe that if the capabilities exist, and the circumstances are right, then bringing life into this world is a good thing.

However, the problem I have is when the Pro-Life people try to force THEIR values onto other. It's fine to be Pro-Life, but if someone else is Pro-Choice, or even of the much smaller community of Pro-Abortion, then that is their right as well. I'm not going to try and argue that you shouldn't be Pro-Life, so don't tell me that I can't be Pro-Choice. That's my biggest complaint.

Finally, I would like people to be aware of the other position on Abortion. It is an extremely well-thought out point of view, and while the idea may seem out there at first, we should possibly give it a chance.

Link: http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=regressive

 

[Loveless]

Interesting topic, badly written.
My opinion is basically fuck the pro-lifers. They have absolutely no grounds to interfere in someone else's life and especially not when it comes to having children. Seriously, fuck them, right in the ear and then shove a bible up their arse if they happen to have one handy (and it's quite likely they will have).
Let's make something clear, I'm not pro-abortion. Having witnessed one I can tell you it's horrific and deeply upsetting and yet I STILL believe it's an absolute necessity, a necessary evil if you like. You cannot force someone to have a child, you just can't. It's basically assault.
What I would say is the current 24 week limit in this country is too long. If you're going to do it, you do it quick. I'm totally against causing suffering that can be avoided.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

I find the Pro-Choice argument amusing. It's simply, "It's my choice! I can make my own decision!". Which nobody is arguing but the point Pro-Lifers are making is that your choice is wrong. Everything is a choice, but somethings people choose to do fall under the category of illegal.

Having a baby is an inconvenience, nobody's arguing that. But if my neighbor's blasting music at 3am and I have to work the next day, I can't just go shoot him in the head. That would be murder which falls under the category of illegal. Would it be my choice to go kill him so I could sleep? Of course, nobody forced me to do that. It was my choice.

Let's say we even want to get more extreme with the analogy. Say, my dad rapes me and beats my mom everyday and one day I've had enough and choose to kill him. My choice of murder, whether deserved or not, would get me arrested.

So, if those two situations are wrong in the eyes of the law, why isn't abortion? It's taking away a life because it would be an inconvenience. That's the point. Nobody is arguing whether or not it's a woman's choice. It certainly is.

And what about the father's? They don't get a choice? It's as much their child's as the mother's.

And as far as rape is concerned, not to be crass but as the expression goes: shit happens. If you don't want the kid, give it up for adoption. Are you really that selfish that you can't carry a child for less than a year? That's the Pro-Life stance.

"What an irony that a society confronted with plastic bags filled with the remains of aborted babies should be more concerned about the problem of recycling the plastic." - Winifred Egan

 

[HBK-aholic]

I find the Pro-Choice argument amusing. It's simply, It's my choice! I can make my own decision!". Which nobody is arguing but the point Pro-Lifers are making is that your choice is wrong. Everything is a choice, but somethings people choose to do fall under the category of illegal.

Yay, pro-life scum. No, YOU believe the choice is wrong. I don't. Millions of other people don't. What makes YOUR view superior to mine? Oh that's right, nothing. If you don't like abortion, don't have one. It's really very simple.

Having a baby is an inconvenience, nobody's arguing that. But if my neighbor's blasting music at 3am and I have to work the next day, I can't just go shoot him in the head. That would be murder which falls under the category of illegal. Would it be my choice to go kill him so I could sleep? Of course, nobody forced me to do that. It was my choice.

Murder is illegal. Is abortion? I didn't think so.

Let's say we even want to get more extreme with the analogy. Say, my dad rapes me and beats my mom everyday and one day I've had enough and choose to kill him. My choice of murder, whether deserved or not, would get me arrested.

See my abve point. If abortion was illegal and someone performed one, THEN they're in the wrong. Abortion is legal and available, choosing to have one is not wrong.

So, if those two situations are wrong in the eyes of the law, why isn't abortion? It's taking away a life because it would be an inconvenience. That's the point. Nobody is arguing whether or not it's a woman's choice. It certainly is.

It's the womans choice, yet you want to take that away? You seem like a great person.

And what about the father's? They don't get a choice? It's as much their child's as the mother's.

They should definitely be consulted about the decision. However, they can't control what the woman does with her body. Then can have the final say when they carry the child.

And as far as rape is concerned, not to be crass but as the expression goes: shit happens. If you don't want the kid, give it up for adoption. Are you really that selfish that you can't carry a child for less than a year? That's the Pro-Life stance.

You say that last sentence as if it's a good thing - this paragraph is one of the worst things I've ever heard a pro-lifer say. You know what, go out, get raped, fall pregnant, THEN tell me your stance on it.

 

[Loveless]

I find the Pro-Choice argument amusing. It's simply, It's my choice! I can make my own decision!". Which nobody is arguing but the point Pro-Lifers are making is that your choice is wrong. Everything is a choice, but somethings people choose to do fall under the category of illegal.

My choice is wrong? Well firstly, who the fuck are you to tell me what's right or wrong and on what grounds do you assume this moral righteousness.
As it happens I've already mentioned that I don't like abortion, infact I distinctly dislike it but some things aren't a simple case of right or wrong, in this case I'd say it's wrong or wronger.

Having a baby is an inconvenience, nobody's arguing that. But if my neighbor's blasting music at 3am and I have to work the next day, I can't just go shoot him in the head. That would be murder which falls under the category of illegal. Would it be my choice to go kill him so I could sleep? Of course, nobody forced me to do that. It was my choice.

An inconvenience? Losing your car keys when you've got to go to work is an inconvenience, having a child you don't want goes so far beyond that I can't even compare.

Let's say we even want to get more extreme with the analogy. Say, my dad rapes me and beats my mom everyday and one day I've had enough and choose to kill him. My choice of murder, whether deserved or not, would get me arrested.

It might get you arrested but there's a fair chance you'd get away with it if you had those good reasons.

So, if those two situations are wrong in the eyes of the law, why isn't abortion? It's taking away a life because it would be an inconvenience. That's the point. Nobody is arguing whether or not it's a woman's choice. It certainly is.

Good question, why is abortion legal when murder isn't? Well the answer is because abortion isn't murder in legal terms as it's not killing a person, it's killing something that, if unwanted, is essentially a parasite that's making you sick, will cause you extreme pain and will be with you for the rest of your life.

And what about the father's? They don't get a choice? It's as much their child's as the mother's.

Yeah it's not fair but it is how it needs to be. The father shouldn't force the female to have the child, anymore than the law should. You can argue your case until the cows come home, in the end it's the woman's choice and it can't ever be any other way.

And as far as rape is concerned, not to be crass but as the expression goes: shit happens. If you don't want the kid, give it up for adoption. Are you really that selfish that you can't carry a child for less than a year? That's the Pro-Life stance.

I hope you don't take this personally but had you said that to my face I would have had to hit you. I have to assume you're male and under 20 because you're just not getting what a big deal pregnancy or rape is. I don't want to get into the details of what happened to my ex again but she wasn't ready to have a baby at 12 and I'd say she still isn't 15 years later because of how it was conceived. Only a guy could claim it's selfish to carry a rape baby to full-term. Unbelievable


"What an irony that a society confronted with plastic bags filled with the remains of aborted babies should be more concerned about the problem of recycling the plastic." - Winifred Egan

To quote you, shit happens. Sometimes there's not a nice option available.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

Again, any response from a Pro-Choicer is: "It's my choice! Who are you to say it's wrong!". Who am I? I'm an American and have freedom of speech. If you don't think taking away a life you created is wrong, fine. Shout it to the rooftops but don't tell other people their opinion is "stupid". Murder should either be illegal or it shouldn't. If some **** can kill her unborn child because she doesn't want to get fat, I should be able to kill my boss for making me work late.

 

[Loveless]

Again, any response from a Pro-Choicer is: "It's my choice! Who are you to say it's wrong!". Who am I? I'm an American and have freedom of speech. If you don't think taking away a life you created is wrong, fine. Shout it to the rooftops but don't tell other people their opinion is "stupid". Murder should either be illegal or it shouldn't. If some **** can kill her unborn child because she doesn't want to get fat, I should be able to kill my boss for making me work late.

* Sighs *

1. I didn't say it wasn't wrong, infact I said the opposite

2. Don't really care if you're American and you have freedom of speech, this is an argument and I'm telling you you're niave, seeing this in black and white and have no moral authority to force your views on someone else. Thats MY freedom of speech working right there

3. You're generalising and I'm concerned about your apparent hatred of women.. and your boss.

4. It's not murder, in the same way taking anti-biotics to kill a virus isn't.

Your move

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

and have no moral authority to force your views on someone else.

That's what laws are, kid. It's forcing people to abide by what the government deems right and wrong. I can't kill my boss because the government says it's morally wrong. The Pro-Life point of view is that abortion should also fall under that category.

 

[HBK-aholic]

Again, any response from a Pro-Choicer is: "It's my choice! Who are you to say it's wrong!". Who am I? I'm an American and have freedom of speech. If you don't think taking away a life you created is wrong, fine. Shout it to the rooftops but don't tell other people their opinion is "stupid".

Oh this is irony and hypocrisy at it's finest. This is pro-life for you. It's not people who are pro-choice who tell you what to do or think, it's people that are pro-life. If you're pro-choice you believe people should be able to CHOOSE what's best for them. If you're pro-life you think you're opinion is better than everyones, and that's why abortion should be illegal. It's the pro-life movement that forces their views onto everyone else.

Murder should either be illegal or it shouldn't.

Abortion is NOT murder, there's actually no logical way to think it is. Murder is nothing but a legal term. Legally, abortion is not murder.

If some **** can kill her unborn child because she doesn't want to get fat, I should be able to kill my boss for making me work late.

I'd love to live in the world you live in, where everything is good and the only abortions that happen are by '****s' who 'don't want to get fat'. Move into the real world for Gods sake.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

It's the pro-life movement that forces their views onto everyone else.

The view that killing babes is wrong? Yes, the pro-life movement does want to force that on everyone. I don't think anyone who's Pro-Life would deny that. Just like PETA wants to force the view that killing animals is wrong, except it's about humans. Crazy, I know.

Abortion is NOT murder, there's actually no logical way to think it is. Murder is nothing but a legal term. Legally, abortion is not murder.

One definition of murder is To put an end to; destroy. So yes, abortion IS murder. Buy a dictionary.

I'd love to live in the world you live in, where everything is good and the only abortions that happen are by '****s' who 'don't want to get fat'. Move into the real world for Gods sake.

When did I say those are the only abortions that happen? I really don't care what the reason is. There's no excuse for it.

 

[HBK-aholic]

The view that killing babes is wrong?

No one denies killing babies is wrong. That's why we're talking about aborting fetuses.

Yes, the pro-life movement does want to force that on everyone. I don't think anyone who's Pro-Life would deny that. Just like PETA wants to force the view that killing animals is wrong, except it's about humans. Crazy, I know.

Do you know what's wrong? Wanting so much control over a woman you can decide what she does with her own body when it concerns you in no way. Believing pregnancy is simply an 'inconvenience' is wrong. Believeing woman who don't want to carry a baby concieved via rape is selfish - that's wrong.

One definition of murder is To put an end to; destroy. So yes, abortion IS murder. Buy a dictionary.

Let me know the next time a woman is convicted of murder for having an abortion will you?

When did I say those are the only abortions that happen? I really don't care what the reason is. There's no excuse for it.

No excuse? Okay, how about not being able to afford a child? How about having a disabled child you look after 24/7, which you wouldn't be able to do if you were pregnant? How about you were forced into the sex? How about if that was by a family member? How about if you're going to die if you continue with the pregnancy? Enough there for you?

 

[Loveless]

That's what laws are, kid. It's forcing people to abide by what the government deems right and wrong. I can't kill my boss because the government says it's morally wrong. The Pro-Life point of view is that abortion should also fall under that category.

Laws are moral authority? So abortion being legal means it's morally right? I think what you're talking about it is a particular dogma and it's not the point of view of the majority, therefore it's not morality. Morality is decided by the majority and evidently your morality is not the governments.
I understand that the Pro-lifers believe it should fall under that category but I've yet to hear a good reason why it should. All you have to argue with is your own morality, which is narrow sighted, oversimplified and not relevant to anyone who doesn't believe in it.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

No one denies killing babies is wrong. That's why we're talking about aborting fetuses.

Again, a dictionary would really come in handy for you. One definition of "baby" is a human fetus. So you just admitted abortion IS wrong. You're not really helping your case here.

Do you know what's wrong? Wanting so much control over a woman you can decide what she does with her own body

But a woman can control what she does to the person inside her? Yeah...makes perfect sense.

Let me know the next time a woman is convicted of murder for having an abortion will you?

So if the law changes someday and abortion does become illegal, you'll change your stance? Then you'll be pro-life because that's what the government says you should be? Do you not have a mind of your own? Seriously, how old are you?

No excuse? Okay, how about not being able to afford a child? How about having a disabled child you look after 24/7, which you wouldn't be able to do if you were pregnant? How about you were forced into the sex? How about if that was by a family member? How about if you're going to die if you continue with the pregnancy? Enough there for you?

Adoption covers most of those (do I need to give you the definition of that too?). The only one where you should have a choice is if a medical doctor told you that you could die if you kept the child and that's quite rare. But anyway, I'll give you that one so take that as a victory and stop talking because you just keep digging your hole deeper.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

Laws are moral authority? So abortion being legal means it's morally right? I think what you're talking about it is a particular dogma and it's not the point of view of the majority, therefore it's not morality. Morality is decided by the majority and evidently your morality is not the governments.
I understand that the Pro-lifers believe it should fall under that category but I've yet to hear a good reason why it should. All you have to argue with is your own morality, which is narrow sighted, oversimplified and not relevant to anyone who doesn't believe in it.

So again, what you're saying is that if the law did change and abortion was made illegal you would change your stance because the government told you too? You can't form your own opinions? Why do you want "choice" so bad if you need to be told what to believe? Is this really how most Pro-Choicers feel? Because that just doesn't make any sense.

 

[Loveless]

The view that killing babes is wrong? Yes, the pro-life movement does want to force that on everyone. I don't think anyone who's Pro-Life would deny that. Just like PETA wants to force the view that killing animals is wrong, except it's about humans. Crazy, I know.

I'm going to keep repeating this until you stop bracketing this into right or wrong.

We do not believe that abortion is right!

Do you understand this? We're not going around telling people to kill their children (which is kind of what you're doing in reverse). This is not a right or wrong argument. This is a wrong or wronger argument and we're saying "Hey, it's your choice and we're not going to condemn you for it like some righteous prick"
The other way to look at this (and it's the best way to do it) is to simply say, it's not a child or a person. Legally is isn't and they have no rights of protection until 24 weeks (something I think is too long).

One definition of murder is To put an end to; destroy. So yes, abortion IS murder. Buy a dictionary.

Buy a dictionary and look up Legal Definition. Murder is a legal definition and abortion isn't included in it.

When did I say those are the only abortions that happen? I really don't care what the reason is. There's no excuse for it.

There are plenty of reasons not to have a child. Inability to look after it, risk to your own health, risk to the childs health. Those 3 cover a lot of issues but yeah, you go ahead and ignore with with one blanket statement and nothing to back it up with.

 

[HBK-aholic]

Again, a dictionary would really come in handy for you. One definition of "baby" is a human fetus. So you just admitted abortion IS wrong. You're not really helping your case here.

LOL, I'm perfectly aware of the technical definitions some dictionaries use thank you. Note how I said some dictionaries. For example, dictionary.com gives 'human fetus' as a definition of baby. The Merriam-Webster and Oxford dictionaries, however, do not.

I'm also perfectly aware of the way the pro-life movement abuses that definition to imply that pro-choicers actively want to go out and kill babies. See the emotive language they use to attempt getting the point across?

But a woman can control what she does to the person inside her? Yeah...makes perfect sense.

When that fetus is viable, it can have rights. Until then, it's the womans choice because it's her body. It's simple, really.

So if the law changes someday and abortion does become illegal, you'll change your stance? Then you'll be pro-life because that's what the government says you should be? Do you not have a mind of your own? Seriously, how old are you?

Old enough to know more than you, it seems. However, you're clearly not smart enough to follow the conversation, so allow me to recap. You tried to tell me abortion was murder. Now, if abortion was murder, it'd be punishable by law, bcause murder is illegal. None of my personal opinion in there, just the truth.

Adoption covers most of those (do I need to give you the definition of that too?).

You're the one who's trying to tell me abortion is murder hon.

Now, let me explain why adoption isn't always feasible. Firstly, thinkabout how many abortions are carried out each year, Where are all those extra children going to go? Are you going to adopt one?

Secondly, pregnancy itself is expensive, what if you can't afford the care you need? The clothes etc?

Thirdly, how does adoption explain the scenario of looking after a disabled child at the same time you're pregnant? Any idea how much some people are dependant on their parents?

Fourtly, are you going to be the person to explain to a woman who's just been forced into sex that you're forcing her into carrying that rapists baby for 9 months? I know if anyone told me that I'd have knocked them down to the floor.

The only one where you should have a choice is if a medical doctor told you that you could die if you kept the child and that's quite rare. But anyway, I'll give you that one so take that as a victory and stop talking because you just keep digging your hole deeper.

See, there are instances you think abortion would be okay.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

I'm going to keep repeating this until you stop bracketing this into right or wrong.

We do not believe that abortion is right!

I understand that. What I don't understand is how a person who doesn't believe in something can support it.

Buy a dictionary and look up Legal Definition. Murder is a legal definition and abortion isn't included in it.

Murder is a word. It doesn't have to only be used in a legal sense. You can't tell people not to use a word because it makes your point of view look bad. Sorry.

 

[Loveless]

So again, what you're saying is that if the law did change and abortion was made illegal you would change your stance because the government told you too? You can't form your own opinions? Why do you want "choice" so bad if you need to be told what to believe? Is this really how most Pro-Choicers feel? Because that just doesn't make any sense.

You see the ? that means it was a question, not a statement. I was asking you, seeing as that was what you seemed to be inferring.
If the law changed I'd find myself in your position and I couldn't claim morality as my own, if that wasn't the view of majority. I'd simply be you, arguing against the law. The difference is I wouldn't be using morality alone to argue my case, like you're doing.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

Ok, I think I got it now Pro-Choice stance is:

Murder of babies is ok because it's not currently against the law in the US.

It also depends on how you phrase it. If you're pregnent and you go to the doctor and say "Can you please murder my baby?", that makes it seem wrong. But if you say "I was raped, can you please lawfully abort the fetus that has taken residence in MY body?" That makes it seem fine and dandy.

It's like if you have a conjoined twin. You can kill him/her because it's attached to YOUR body and it's YOUR choice.

It's like when you try and kill yourself. That's fine because it's YOUR choice. They don't put you in a hospital against your will or anything. It's YOUR body.

Wait...

 

[Loveless]

I understand that. What I don't understand is how a person who doesn't believe in something can support it.

Ah now we're getting somewhere. Explain please what you mean when you say "a person who doesn't believe in something can support it" I assume that person would be me and I think I know what you're getting at, but I'd like to hear you explain it.

Murder is a word. It doesn't have to only be used in a legal sense. You can't tell people not to use a word because it makes your point of view look bad. Sorry.

Murder is a legal term, killing is the term you're after. Like the difference between shooting a person in the head or turning off a life support machine

Murder - Illegal
Abortion - Legal

Abortion is not illegal, therefore it's not murder.

 

[ShockTheMonkey223]

Ah now we're getting somewhere. Explain please what you mean when you say "a person who doesn't believe in something can support it" I assume that person would be me and I think I know what you're getting at, but I'd like to hear you explain it.

I really don't know how to be any more clear...

Murder is a legal term, killing is the term you're after.

No it's not.

Dictionary.com

 

[Loveless]

Ok, I think I got it now Pro-Choice stance is:

Murder of babies is ok because it's not currently against the law in the US.

It's OK because it's the lesser of two evils. We're not arguing based on law but our own logic, compassion and common sense.
And again, they're not babies and it's not murder.

It also depends on how you phrase it. If you're pregnent and you go to the doctor and say "Can you please murder my baby?", that makes it seem wrong. But if you say "I was raped, can you please lawfully abort the fetus that has taken residence in MY body?" That makes it seem fine and dandy.

Wrong! Wrong! Why do you keep arguing that word when we're not even arguing it? It's like you've nothing else to argue with!
Whichever way you ask for an abortion, I don't care. I don't see what you're getting at. Whatever gets you through the night.

It's like if you have a conjoined twin. You can kill him/her because it's attached to YOUR body and it's YOUR choice.

Totally different argument. Conjoined twin is an equal, it's born and has rights, it's not being looked after. Stupid argument

It's like when you try and kill yourself. That's fine because it's YOUR choice. They don't put you in a hospital against your will or anything. It's YOUR body.

Wait...

It's their job to look after you when you're not capable of looking after yourself. So many people try to kill themselves in their darkest moments, that doesn't necessarily mean they're thinking clearly and most don't actually want to kill themselves at all. That's why you get taken into hospital. I've seen far too many instances of this for my liking.