**MERGED** CM Punk heel turn? (Keep it in here!!!!)

[RawIsJericho]

I think Punk is much better as a heel, but marky me as a CM Punk "Best in the World" fan, I couldn't care less about what he did to the Rock, I'm just happy he kept the title.

Come next week when the Rock is gone, I couldn't care less how we reached this conclusion, I'll be happy that Punk is the champ, that he got past Cena with the briefcase, and I'm sure most of the other people who chant CM PUNK CM PUNK CM PUNK probably feel the same way.

If you really want to turn Punk heel again, you're going to have to do a whole lot worse than that. Punk has a huge fan base now, and a large part of that fan base comes from the fact that he is the "anti Cena", he is the alternative to Cena, the guy that if you don't like Cena, if you're sick of Cena, you cheer for Punk instead. Again, nothing has changed in this regard, and unless Punk goes back to telling us we are all pathetic and weak minded slaves to alcohol or whatever, nothing much is going to change that. Unless the Rock is actually around for a while, he is the one the crowd loves enough to say "well actually Punk fuck you, ROCKY".

 

[AndThat'sTheBottomLine]

I, like some people, am not convinced that this is a full fledged heel turn. Definitely looked like it at first but either way you slice it whether Punk turns heel or just goes tweener, it'll still be interesting to watch and will be highly entertaining. I look forward to next week now and it's all because of Punk.

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

One of the most anticipated nights in wrestling history has come to an end. Great moments, great stuff, but there's one thing that has let everybody in complete shock: CM Punk's heel turn.

Although an unexpected turn that almost nobody show it coming, it was the right one. The reasons? Many.

First of all CM Punk freshening his character. Over the last two months people have started complaining about CM Punk becoming stale, turning "PG", becoming Super Cena 2.0, becoming SOFT. Punk needs that long one-year reign in order to secure himself in the main-event scene. But how do you do that, but still keep him interesting? Turn him heel.
I believe that by nex month, If Punk had stayed face, people would start turning on him. Just like they did with Cena in 2006. WWE knew that, so they took action at the right time. They are protecting their future and CM Punk's future as the potential top babyface.

Second reason, The Rock. I bet my head that just because The Rock "challenged" CM Punk last night for the title by next week, half of the arena would be booing CM Punk? Why? Because he went toe to toe with The Rock. At this point, Rock could beat up a grandma by using a baby and people would still love him, no matter what. With that being said people would turn on his opponent, whoever that is, even CM Punk.

Third reason, WWE isn't in need of strong babyfaces, WWE is in need of strong heels. CM Punk has been the WWE Champion for 248 days. Right now he is the man. The first strong heel since Randy Orton and maybe the best heel since the glorious days of World Heavyweight Champion Triple H.
CM Punk as a heel is his "zenith". It's were he thrives.

Last but not least, the potential match against Stone Cold Steve Austin at Wrestlemania and an alliance with Heyman. I always wondered, how could the babyface CM Punk face Stone Cold at Wrestlemania without getting booed out of the arena? Here's the answer. He will be booed because that's his role, not because the fans have picked Austin over him. And yeah, an alliance with Paul Heyman and Brock Lesnar. I see it happening right now. It's what he said last year, he is a Heyman guy. THIS is going to be interesting.

So there you go.

I'd like to hear your thougths on this subject.

 

[Mustang Sally]

In my opinion, Punk didnt turn heel, i think his going back to an anti-hero like someone posted before.

That's possible, but the events of last night certainly point the way to a full-fledged, guaranteed-not-to-tarnish turn to the dark side. It's not as if there was a question about it: Cena did the honorable thing last Monday by refusing to turn in the briefcase and attack Punk after Big Show had incapacitated him. In direct contrast, Punk took the easy way out and allowed Big Show to do his dirty work for him. Yes, Punk seemed conflicted in wondering whether to pin the unconscious Cena......but he did it anyway.

Presuming Punk has fully entered the realm of "heeldom," it will be interesting to see how long he can hold the title. He can now turn his "Voice of the Voiceless" routine into a bully pulpit, much as he did with the Straight Edge Society. That's a return to the old ways I would welcome.

 

[Mike1411]

Think you nailed it not really anything to add hopefully people on this site can shut up moaning about Punk now, they said he was stale and boring well they've got the change they asked for.

 

[The Eighties]

Shitty idea, Punk was the only top face alternative to Cena no matter how hard WWE try to shove Sheamus at us. All this will end up as is Punk will job to Rock and we'll get a rematch of the very mediocre Cena vs Rock match from last year, as "once in a lifetime" becomes redundant.

I almost stopped watching when HBK retired, 1000 Raw's seems like just as good a landmark, especially with TNA in a good place right now.

 

[rge2010]

Shitty idea, Punk was the only top face alternative to Cena no matter how hard WWE try to shove Sheamus at us. All this will end up as is Punk will job to Rock and we'll get a rematch of the very mediocre Cena vs Rock match from last year, as "once in a lifetime" becomes redundant.

I almost stopped watching when HBK retired, 1000 Raw's seems like just as good a landmark, especially with TNA in a good place right now.

'job to Rock'...you mean lose to Rock but a fued with Rock will benefit Punk no matter what. It will elevate him.

'once in a lifetime'...who says it will be Rock vs Cena II? I think thats the obvious route but WWE could swerve. Also, 'once in a lifetime' still applies. Rock vs Cena in the Rocks 'home town' and the 'comeback match' was a once in a lifetime experience never to be repeated.

 

[Mike1411]

Does anyone think Punk will revert back to This Fire Burns now he is turning heel? He used Cult of Personality as a heel theme in ROH so it will work fine but just wondering to what extent of a change we will see from Punk. Personally I wouldn't mind either just wondering everyone else's thoughts.

 

[Ryberg]

Trust me it was a heel turn. The moment he got over his conflict and went for the pin was the heel turn. It was furthered by how he was about to leave Cena alone for the Big Show (as a face Punk previously would of been on the attack no matter how badly he was about to get his ass kicked). Then he returned to the ring and attacked The Rock.

I don't like it but that is a heel turn. There is an obvious easy story to go along with it, Blame Rocky for overshadowing him. Cena will come out and be like "you didn't save me". Big Show will come out and attack Cena. Cena will get the upper hand only to have Punk cheap shot Cena. Thus the triple threat at Summerslam is made official.

That's how i assume it will go down.

Also when Cena stood by and watched the Rock, you didn't have Lawler telling everyone Cena is a heel. It's a heel turn because you can't have three baby faces in the title picture. Unfortunately WWE is never going to make Cena the heel.

WWE ratings are down and I have to ask which do you think will make ratings go up?

1) Punk being heelish again?
2) Cena going heel for the first time?

Ask Hogan which set the world on fire and put WCW on the map beating WWE RAW.

In all honesty the WWE 1000 RAW was mediocre at best with the worst GM in history being named.

 

[rge2010]

Also when Cena stood by and watched the Rock, you didn't have Lawler telling everyone Cena is a heel. It's a heel turn because you can't have three baby faces in the title picture. Unfortunately WWE is never going to make Cena the heel.

WWE ratings are down and I have to ask which do you think will make ratings go up?

1) Punk being heelish again?
2) Cena going heel for the first time?

Ask Hogan which set the world on fire and put WCW back on the map beating WWE RAW finally.

Cena going heel isn't worth the ratings going up a few points every week. Cena going heel means loss of merchandise sales and a drop in PPV buys. He is the company guy....giving him a credible tweener like Punk who is also very popular to fued with = ratings.

The Hogan thing was a different era. It wasnt this era. We need to stop comparing.

 

[Ryberg]

Cena going heel isn't worth the ratings going up a few points every week. Cena going heel means loss of merchandise sales and a drop in PPV buys. He is the company guy....giving him a credible tweener like Punk who is also very popular to fued with = ratings.

The Hogan thing was a different era. It wasnt this era. We need to stop comparing.

He is the company guy ONLY because WWE wants it that way. I would bet ANY PERSON who got the push he gets would be the next company guy. Everyone is replaceable from HHH to Ryder. But as George Steele said Cena is nothing special and there are 10000 ones just like him out there.

Different era? Come on people bought up NWO crap. I remember walking into stores and you'd see people in NWO hats or shirts. It worked then because it was a shock and it would work now. So your "loss of merchandise sales" is wrong. PPV buy rates? Cena has main evented RAW and PPVs, and rating aren't exactly stellar. And don't say they'd be worse if he went heel. You and the non-heel wanting Cena's don't know that. If it didn't work, then you have him wake up in a hospital bed wondering what's going on.LOL VKM.

People think Punk's good guy act is stale I get it as I love heel Punk. I've loved Punk before he was in WWE. But Cena is 1000000 more stale then Punk.

 

[rge2010]

He is the company guy ONLY because WWE wants it that way. I would bet ANY PERSON who got the push he gets would be the next company guy. Everyone is replaceable from HHH to Ryder. But as George Steele said Cena is nothing special and there are 10000 ones just like him out there.

Different era? Come on people bought up NWO crap. I remember walking into stores and you'd see people in NWO hats or shirts. It worked then because it was a shock and it would work now. So your "loss of merchandise sales" is wrong. PPV buy rates? Cena has main evented RAW and PPVs, and rating aren't exactly stellar. And don't say they'd be worse if he went heel. You and the non-heel wanting Cena's don't know that. If it didn't work, then you have him wake up in a hospital bed wondering what's going on.LOL VKM.

People think Punk's good guy act is stale I get it as I love heel Punk. I've loved Punk before he was in WWE. But Cena is 1000000 more stale then Punk.

Cena is extremely special. He is one of the biggest name ever to enter Pro Wrestling. Sure WWE have built him up, but they also built up Rock, Hogan and Austin (Austin was a failure in WCW). Cena isnt the greatest in ring performer to ever grace the squared circle, but he oozes charisma and the kids buy into this. Maybe John Cena the performers are '10 a penny' but what about John Cena the person? The guy who does talk show after talk show to promote WWE. or the guy who has made numerous make a wishes? He is a PR dream. I aint no Cena fan either, I simply respect him for what he does. For every George Steele comment there is a Chris Jericho or Bret Hart comment.

Different era was the attitude era, we now have a different era in terms of programming, competition, even technology. You will never get those 6-7 ratings again. John Cena as a heel couldnt do half the stuff Hogan did with the NWO. Sure it would be interesting to see but its bad for business until someone makes the step up. Who in WWE could do acheive what Cena has? You said anyone could? Please do not say Dolph Ziggler!!!

Cena is there to appeal more to the kids. Are they bored by him? Dont think so. Kids love repetition. And Cena is 10000 more marketable than Punk. FACT.

 

[NC Wrestling Nut]

I think this is great punk is a great heel and if wwe knows what the fans want they will keep punk successful as a champion heel thank god for this heel turn this makes me happy for three hours of raw

 

[Ryberg]

Cena is extremely special. He is one of the biggest name ever to enter Pro Wrestling. Sure WWE have built him up, but they also built up Rock, Hogan and Austin (Austin was a failure in WCW). Cena isnt the greatest in ring performer to ever grace the squared circle, but he oozes charisma and the kids buy into this. Maybe John Cena the performers are '10 a penny' but what about John Cena the person? The guy who does talk show after talk show to promote WWE. or the guy who has made numerous make a wishes? He is a PR dream. I aint no Cena fan either, I simply respect him for what he does. For every George Steele comment there is a Chris Jericho or Bret Hart comment.

Different era was the attitude era, we now have a different era in terms of programming, competition, even technology. You will never get those 6-7 ratings again. John Cena as a heel couldnt do half the stuff Hogan did with the NWO. Sure it would be interesting to see but its bad for business until someone makes the step up. Who in WWE could do acheive what Cena has? You said anyone could? Please do not say Dolph Ziggler!!!

Cena is there to appeal more to the kids. Are they bored by him? Dont think so. Kids love repetition. And Cena is 10000 more marketable than Punk. FACT.

HHH was a WCW failure also. But when you get pushed to hell like Austin, Cena, and HHH of course you're going to be huge. I am not taking anything away from Cena the PR person. I don't know him as a person but there are a lot of negative things out there about him as a PERSON! I won't judge as I don't know. LOL well of Chris Jericho or Bret Hart make nice comments' they're on the WWE payroll.

OH GOD NO I HATE ZIGGLER AND CODY! Two sooo overrated WWE talents. I am not saying a name, I am just saying ANYONE with the push Cena got his career would be in the same position. And facts are also that Cena is the main face of PPVs and RAW and yet ratings are STILL DOWN! So that also says a lot, he's stale. I loved when the had the Cena sucks Let's go Cena stuff last night, when they panned to the crowd almost no one was saying anything, hmmmmm!

 

[Radical]

CM Punk heel turn is basically what they had to do but it still doesn't make things better.

I personally can't stand CM Punk's ring attire. Is he going swimming or does he actually want to fight someone? Most ridiculous trend in Pro Wrestling ever is wearing designer briefs to appear more professional instead of dressing the part. What kind of punk attire is trunks? Shorts, jeans, or full tights (that at least give the impression of pants) always make more sense. I'm so tired of the mentality that "all you need is trunks and wrestlings boots' to make it. No, I think an entire well-crafted gimmick is important. Entrance, character-appropriate ring attire, persona and move set are all part of it. That's why Cena is better than Punk and always will be until Punk changes.

CM Punk heel turn is hilarious. WWE is like "Oh wow, all our champions are faces and they have buried all the top contending heels, how do we create a believable top heel champion? Oh, just TURN the current face champion heel." ... yep, that's what they did.

For those of you who love thea idea of Sheamus going back to heel. Get ready. He won't even have to drop the title to do so.

3 hour Raws and longer title runs are going to hurt the WWE a lot more than it will help them. CM Punk is basically guaranteed now to be champion until January and perhaps longer. Wow, so exciting.

 

[Vanderhook]

Thank goodness. I hate CM Punk as a face, but as a heel he's one of my favorites. This recent CM Punk face routine wasn't as bad as he was 2008, but man was he getting stale for me. I felt like he lost all of his edge from MITB 2011. I was even rooting for Cena last night just because I hate face CM Punk so much

Face CM Punk (like most faces these days) completely sucks ass.

 

[Da Prophet]

If you can't be the number one face why not be the number one heel? I like the move to switch Punk around and make him a heel. It's different and after the year long good guy run seeing Punk as a bad guy should be fun. It'll most likely cause him to work with Cena which will provide some great stuff once Big Show rolls out of the way and back onto Smackdown where he belongs.

I'm very see Punk vs. Cena once again after this heel turn kicks into gear. It'll be the most entertaining them in the WWE because of the two great workers.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

The more I think on it, I'm not sure that Punk will actually be a heel. I see him being more of a tweener, similar to this time last year. Punk's popularity soared during his feud with Cena and no matter how hard WWE tried, they couldn't get fans to hate him. WWE might try and go a similar route here and just mostly keep Punk with the way he is but bring back that edgy/scarcastic aspect that he displayed last year.

It'll be interesting to hear his reasons on Raw next week. I think WWE will go with an aspect of Punk not liking the idea that some think he's been overshadowed by Cena and The Rock, like Big Show hinted at last week on Raw during their promo segment. I also think they'll use this storyline to introduce the new WWE Championship belt as Show also mentioned that the title Punk is carrying is the spinner belt that Cena designed. Punk will want to show that he's every bit on the same level as Rock or Cena, at least that's where I'm guessing they're going with this.

 

[The Tay]

to quote punk "do i have everybody's attention now?"

Obviously Cm punk is standing up for himself. For god sake his match with Jericho should have been the main event @ Wrestlemania. Not rock v
cena. Cm punk is the WWE champion. He must be treated with respect. The only worthy Champion of this stupid era of wrestling is Cm Punk. Since Rock came back he has been just been given opportunites. But I have love and respect for the rock. Cm punk feels he has been shown no respect and feel rock is again stealing his spotlight.

Honestly Punk was never was really a heel or a face. Punk would drop a pipe bomb on ANYONE! Face or heel. It never really made a difference. People started liking Punk more because of that whole telling John Laurinaitis off thing. So I wouldn't excatly say he turned heel

CM Punk is a oppurtunistic son of bitch lol that's how he's always been. That's why he is the Best In The World!

 

[TLK]

Not sure how people didn't like the heel turn. It was phenomenal and made PERFECT sense. It played so well off of Punk/Cena from MiTB 2011 that I actually applaud the writers. Remember last year when Vince/Johnny got involved at the end of Cena/Punk to ensure a Cena victory so Punk didn't leave with the title? Cena made the conscious decision not to win that way, and it cost him the match. Punk, on the other hand, cares too much about the title and decided to take the easy way out.

Someone in another thread likened the heel turn to Anakin Skywalker's methodical heel turn. He was conflicted between doing what was right (being a Jedi) and what was wrong (joining the Sith). Ultimately, he decided to do what was wrong because it meant saving Padme. Punk decided to capitolize on Show's interference because it meant saving his title. His character has come full circle since last year's match with Cena. It's refreshing to see someone care that much about the title, even if it means betraying the fans and his "good guy" persona. I thought it was phenomenally done.

Also, taking out The Rock made perfect sense not only because of what had happened earlier in the night with Rocky calling out Punk @ RR 2013, but also because of the visible animosity Punk has shown Dwayne over the past year. The promos will be great, and I don't really foresee Punk being a full-fledged heel, as he will still be cheered by men/hardcore fans as he was before turning face last year. Great stuff.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

The more I think on it, I'm not sure that Punk will actually be a heel. I see him being more of a tweener, similar to this time last year.

Difference between this year and last - Punk wasn't being an underhanded, cowardly heel. He was being just that last night. Can't be a coward tweener, it doesn't work.

I think this works out beautifully.

1. Punk can hold the title until Royal Rumble. Why? It's really not the same title reign. He's playing a different character, so to me (and most fans), that's something new. Punk holding the title as a heel won't resemble Punk holding the title as a babyface. Fact. No need for the title to change hands before he drops it to The Rock (setting up Rock vs. Cena II, and hopefully Punk vs. Austin at WM29).

2. Punk is better as a heel. Let me rephrase - Punk is better as a whining, sniveling, cowardly heel. He's funnier. Honestly, outside of hearing everyone cheer for him and chant his name, what has been great about Punk's face turn post-HHH being involved last fall? Nothing. Is that Punk's fault? No, because no one is being booked above Cena. It's not happening.

I'm a huge Randy Orton mark. When he returns, he's probably going to be a babyface. However, at this point, it's clear no one is taking Cena's spot, or even coming close to doing so. With that being said, what's the point of being the #2 babyface? Fuck all that. Turn these guys heel, for now at least.

 

[Wald]

This is best for all concerned. The Voice of the Voiceless angle following Summerslam was so poor that Punk remained as over as he was going into that PPV. Think about that.

CM Punk remained at the same level with the entire WWE machine behind him as he did when they actively screwed up his pushes. Sure he got a few kids to cheer for him until Cena would come out but that's it.

Doing this and setting up an eventual title loss is best for Punk, best for Rock, best for WWE and best for Wrestlemania

 

[Owen 3:16 says I just stole your Slammy!!]

I love Punks heel turn. It gives him and his character new blood. Punk is great as a heel and can play the perfect asshole! I would be looking forward to the Punk/Rock feud, maybe Punk will be associated with Lesnar and Heyman and that would be entertaining. I'm glade that Cena did not win the belt, I'm so sick of him and his goody two shoes gimmick bullshit. I'll forever be a fan and support Punk.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

I really like the heel Punk and I think it's probably what is best for everyone. I like Punk but I was starting to get a little bored with his title reign. This is for sure going to set up Cena vs. Punk at Summer Slam with The Rock as Special Guest Referee. The real question is, is it going to be Punk vs. Rock for the belt at the Rumble or are they trying to distract us? Who else is big enough to main event with the Rock? The only other person I can see is Randy Orton or Jericho.

 

[IT Factor]

This heel turn came not a moment too soon. Punk was becoming too routine as a face and they did kinda already built the grievance that Punk was being overshadowed by other big names[remember Eve saying that a few weeks back?]. This does alot of things to setup future big things;

1}Punk vs. The Rock; That match will be epic. Punk did refrence The Rock in his infamous pipebomb promo last year and this plays into that perfectly. That's probably the biggest match Punk will have had since becoming WWE Champion[if he's still champion at that point in time]. Whether the title is on the line or not, this match will happen. Having it for the WWE Title will be just a bonus on top of a great feud. My only concern is that Rock won't be around enough to make this as big as it should be.

2}Punk vs. Austin; WWE have avoided it because of various extenuiating circumstances. Austin isn't available being the biggest one of them. Punk vs. Stone Cold is a dream match that pretty much writes itself. If WWE creative cannot book this, they all need to be fired. The cocky straight-edge heel vs. the alcoholic rebel. This should happen, it needs to happen. Can you imagine how Punk's legacy would be cemented working with both Austin & The Rock? He'd be doing something that even guys like Cena & Orton haven't done and that's major. It would be a huge drawing PPV just because it's the clashing of generations.

3}The return of pipebombs; Although WWE could've done this at any point, having a heel CM Punk do them makes it more interesting. As a face, you can't really complain without it kind of making you seem heelish. Whining is primarily a heel tactic. I can't wait to hear Punk's explanation for the turn. I'm pretty sure it will be along the lines of being overlooked as champion, overshadowed by other stars, not being the main event, etc. Punk is just naturally better as a heel and I just hope his in-ring work doesn't get toned down because of it[like it did last time]. Can't he be a cowardly heel and still wrestle? He can still use cheap tactics to pull off victories, but, he does need to keep wrestling to prove he's the best.

4}A possible connection with Paul Heyman & CM Punk; Punk has stated he's a Paul Heyman guy. Both have said they'd love to work together in the future. Aligning CM Punk, Brock Lesnar, and Paul Heyman would be the biggest alliance in WWE in decades. Hopefully, that would mean more appearances by Lesnar but I'm not banking on it. Hell, I'd even love to see Daniel Bryan align with these guys too. Adding Bryan ensures that Punk would have a consistent partner in the event that Lesnar cannot tag with him when he doesn't appear.

All of these things make for a much more interesting CM Punk and WWE in general. The buzz around this will no doubt improve the quality of WWE television and I am actually hyped to see how this unfolds. Which hasn't happened since the last CM Punk buzz last year.