Lack of "creativity" on part of WWE Creative.

[AegonTargaryen]

It is certain that the appellation of this thread or the thread itself isn't liable to cause even a semblance of shock let alone cause my fellow IWC members to be aghast.

If you tried to find evidence or reason as to why the WWE "Creative" team lacks creativity or hasn't really reflected it in a faithful and appropriate way for years now, the evidence would be staggering, overwhelming.

Nonetheless, I have a couple of specific instances.

1) I was watching Money In The Bank 2014 and I realized(perhaps on many other occasions than this one) how formulaic the WWE has been since 2010. Matches like MITB, The Elimination Chamber, TLC, and Hell in a Cell are supposed to have a concrete story to back them up. But instead you have these same set of guys competing in either of the MITB matches since 4 yrs, namely:-Kofi Kingston, Jack Swagger, Kane, Christian, Alberto Del Rio ,among others. Well, they did have new talent beginning in 2014-All members of Shield and Bray Wyatt.

But as I watched that match, and the other MITB match featuring the likes of Kingston and Swagger, that's when I realize this:-

Why is the WWE WHC being decided in a Ladder Match with super heavyweights as well as potential main-eventers like Bray Wyatt, Cesaro, and Roman Reigns? Just because it's MITB and because Daniel Bryan happened to drop the championship? Obviously, they'd didn't need 8 men competing in that match and especially not Sheamus and Alberto Del Rio(Because the WWE WHC is a more important title than just the WHC).

This is where lack of creativity on part of the WWE Creative team/Vince Mcmahan comes. How fucking difficult is it for them to come up with something more than just a formulaic PPV with 8 guys thrown in a ladder match year after year?

What they could've done instead was have 4 major superstars compete in a tournament to determine the new WWE WHC. Plain and Clear as sky. They could've had 3 matches involving those 4 superstars- two semi-finals and a final. Even though the wrestling world would be sick to see John Cena and Randy Orton again, they could have two fresh but established/proven maineventers. My choice would be- Rob Van Dam and bring back Chris Jericho. Or if its only going to lead to Orton vs Cena in the final(considering how RVD and Jericho wouldn't win the WWE WHC as part-timers), include and elevate Cesaro. Cesaro vs Cena in the final. Cena wins. The result isn't everything. But creativity.

You would say that they needed "two" MITB ladder matches. Heck, after deducting 4 from 16, there are still 12 men left. I'd only include potential maineventers or future WWE WHCs for the MITB match which would only be 6 men :-Shield members, Bray Wyatt, Cesaro and Sheamus/Alberto Del Rio.
Kane doesn't need to be in a MITB ladder match. Not in 2014. And they could have another ladder match for the IC/US unification or just a solo title. It's not really worth it when guys like Kofi Kingston are included in MITB ladder matches and elimination chambers anyway.

Finally, if you look at the MITB PPV, besides the two ladder matches, it's GARBAGE. It's literally monday night Raw matches on PPV. Two tag-team matches. A Diva match which includes Fandango for 3 minutes. Adam Rose-Damien Sandow(which shouldn't even main event Sunday Night HEAT) that ends under 5 minutes. Rusev vs Big E(Yawn). Isn't the evidence staggering? A tournament for the title and a MITB ladder match, plus another ladder match for the IC title could've saved this PPV. Now I know how right Mark Madden is every time he calls these PPVs "Sunday Night Raw".

2) Another instance of lack of creativity could be when Randy Orton was "handed" the WHC in 2011. (Well yeah he beat Christian on SD post Extreme Rules). It astonishes me to this day how quickly the WWE decided to have Orton win the belt. Couldn't they have waited a month or two? And why did they need to have the match on SD itself and not the PPV? And why was Orton chosen as the contender in the first place? I remember that segment and it included Khali and Mark Henry. Well at least they could've done a battle royal to determine the no 1 contender or maybe a tournament.

I rest my case.

 

[CyberPunk]

WWE creative is not the real problem. The man through whom all the ideas pass, named Vince McMahon, is the problem. He just can't seem to have any consistency in anything he does these days. From HIAC as a PPV brand to Royal Rumble 15 (and I am not talking about the winners etc), the whole storytelling and booking has been in shambles. No doubt they have given some great moments and solid in ring action, but in terms of story, I have no idea what they think.

Case in point, the recent Stardust turn. While the story they tried to play was solid and interesting, the execution was, meh. And what has been the pay off? Have they just put this story on the backburner? Why is suddenly Stardust in the IC title picture? And if Stardust is there, why not Goldust? Another exhibit is our own Roman Reigns. I mean, I cannot believe that the man who'll main event Mania doesn't come out when his Mania rival is in the ring, smirking while his manager trash talks him and his family. Where is the story? Why is Reigns not getting in face of Lesnar? What happened to the whole confrontation? What's the delay?

I guess you get my point.

 

[L@RISANO]

WWE creative is not the real problem. The man through whom all the ideas pass, named Vince McMahon, is the problem. He just can't seem to have any consistency in anything he does these days. From HIAC as a PPV brand to Royal Rumble 15 (and I am not talking about the winners etc), the whole storytelling and booking has been in shambles. No doubt they have given some great moments and solid in ring action, but in terms of story, I have no idea what they think.

Case in point, the recent Stardust turn. While the story they tried to play was solid and interesting, the execution was, meh. And what has been the pay off? Have they just put this story on the backburner? Why is suddenly Stardust in the IC title picture? And if Stardust is there, why not Goldust? Another exhibit is our own Roman Reigns. I mean, I cannot believe that the man who'll main event Mania doesn't come out when his Mania rival is in the ring, smirking while his manager trash talks him and his family. Where is the story? Why is Reigns not getting in face of Lesnar? What happened to the whole confrontation? What's the delay?

I guess you get my point.

Could have just referenced Reigns entire Singles run since his return from injury... he was a BadAss bent on taking out the Authority after Seth became the sell-out post-Payback... yet, Vince the genius decided to change that "Man of Few Words BadAss" into a FairyTale Teller who smiled and paired him off with the Big Show and sent him into a Rumble which....


I think you get my point.


There is a distinct lack of Storyline continuity in the WWE today, and thus, we have a Mania with a great Match card on paper, but the most crap build I have ever seen in my lifetime as a WWE fan.

 

[Kamala316]

"Creative's" monthly 'plan' for as long as I can remember:

Sunday: PPV "X"
Week 1: Recap of PPV "X", PPV "X" rematches
Weeks 2+3: Comedy/filler matches, tag teams wrestle in singles matches, singles competitors team up in random tag matches
Week 4: Lots of talk (i.e - in-ring talk show, contract signing, sit down interview w/Cole, etc.), random filler matches thrown together for PPV "Y", all matches end in DQ.
Sunday: PPV "Y"

Eat, sleep, yawn, repeat. Also, the WWE roster is in desperate need of some cost-cutting housekeeping. Maybe some hungry talent from NXT will help others step up their game. Thoughts?

 

[Headman]

It is certain that the appellation of this thread or the thread itself isn't liable to cause even a semblance of shock let alone cause my fellow IWC members to be aghast.

If you tried to find evidence or reason as to why the WWE "Creative" team lacks creativity or hasn't really reflected it in a faithful and appropriate way for years now, the evidence would be staggering, overwhelming.

Nonetheless, I have a couple of specific instances.

1) I was watching Money In The Bank 2014 and I realized(perhaps on many other occasions than this one) how formulaic the WWE has been since 2010. Matches like MITB, The Elimination Chamber, TLC, and Hell in a Cell are supposed to have a concrete story to back them up. But instead you have these same set of guys competing in either of the MITB matches since 4 yrs, namely:-Kofi Kingston, Jack Swagger, Kane, Christian, Alberto Del Rio ,among others. Well, they did have new talent beginning in 2014-All members of Shield and Bray Wyatt.

But as I watched that match, and the other MITB match featuring the likes of Kingston and Swagger, that's when I realize this:-

Why is the WWE WHC being decided in a Ladder Match with super heavyweights as well as potential main-eventers like Bray Wyatt, Cesaro, and Roman Reigns? Just because it's MITB and because Daniel Bryan happened to drop the championship? Obviously, they'd didn't need 8 men competing in that match and especially not Sheamus and Alberto Del Rio(Because the WWE WHC is a more important title than just the WHC).

This is where lack of creativity on part of the WWE Creative team/Vince Mcmahan comes. How fucking difficult is it for them to come up with something more than just a formulaic PPV with 8 guys thrown in a ladder match year after year?

What they could've done instead was have 4 major superstars compete in a tournament to determine the new WWE WHC. Plain and Clear as sky. They could've had 3 matches involving those 4 superstars- two semi-finals and a final. Even though the wrestling world would be sick to see John Cena and Randy Orton again, they could have two fresh but established/proven maineventers. My choice would be- Rob Van Dam and bring back Chris Jericho. Or if its only going to lead to Orton vs Cena in the final(considering how RVD and Jericho wouldn't win the WWE WHC as part-timers), include and elevate Cesaro. Cesaro vs Cena in the final. Cena wins. The result isn't everything. But creativity.

You would say that they needed "two" MITB ladder matches. Heck, after deducting 4 from 16, there are still 12 men left. I'd only include potential maineventers or future WWE WHCs for the MITB match which would only be 6 men :-Shield members, Bray Wyatt, Cesaro and Sheamus/Alberto Del Rio.
Kane doesn't need to be in a MITB ladder match. Not in 2014. And they could have another ladder match for the IC/US unification or just a solo title. It's not really worth it when guys like Kofi Kingston are included in MITB ladder matches and elimination chambers anyway.

Finally, if you look at the MITB PPV, besides the two ladder matches, it's GARBAGE. It's literally monday night Raw matches on PPV. Two tag-team matches. A Diva match which includes Fandango for 3 minutes. Adam Rose-Damien Sandow(which shouldn't even main event Sunday Night HEAT) that ends under 5 minutes. Rusev vs Big E(Yawn). Isn't the evidence staggering? A tournament for the title and a MITB ladder match, plus another ladder match for the IC title could've saved this PPV. Now I know how right Mark Madden is every time he calls these PPVs "Sunday Night Raw".

2) Another instance of lack of creativity could be when Randy Orton was "handed" the WHC in 2011. (Well yeah he beat Christian on SD post Extreme Rules). It astonishes me to this day how quickly the WWE decided to have Orton win the belt. Couldn't they have waited a month or two? And why did they need to have the match on SD itself and not the PPV? And why was Orton chosen as the contender in the first place? I remember that segment and it included Khali and Mark Henry. Well at least they could've done a battle royal to determine the no 1 contender or maybe a tournament.

I rest my case.

lol you sound like Simon from Alvin and the Chipmunks when you type. Anywhoooo....

In some cases, yes it seems like the WWE plays it very safe creatively. I don't know how much longer they're going to be able to book using the "If it ain't broke don't fix it." mentality, but I sure hope they see the iceberg before they hit it.

A couple of your points seemed kind of nitpicky though. I mean, the way the title was decided at MITB? It's the freaking gimmick match of the ppv. There's no need to muddy up the concept with a tournament or anything like that. If the title were vacant in January it would be decided in the Royal Rumble match. Is that not creative?

And to answer your question as to why they rushed to put the belt on Orton in 2011 without drawing it out? It's most likely because the Smackdown live tour draws better with a champion on the card. If they drew it out for two months it may have helped the television product but the idea of attending a house show for the B-brand with no world championship on the card doesn't sound very tempting. I think that's more of a business decision than a creative blunder.

The issue at hand is yes, the booking seems lazy. But not every bad idea or rushed idea for that matter is the result of a lack of creativity. Sometimes the needs just trump the art.

 

[AegonTargaryen]

Another exhibit is our own Roman Reigns. I mean, I cannot believe that the man who'll main event Mania doesn't come out when his Mania rival is in the ring, smirking while his manager trash talks him and his family. Where is the story? Why is Reigns not getting in face of Lesnar? What happened to the whole confrontation? What's the delay?

Well yeah. I don't want to rant about the "lack of creativity" or an awful build when it comes to this year's Wrestlemania(primarily because two separate threads have been devoted to it and there is a sort of a consensus that the WWE hasn't done much at all for this year's WM besides throwing up a few matches involving part-timers). Sting, doesn't appear. Undertaker, doesn't appear. Brock Lesnar, hasn't shown his face for months and just shows up once and they don't even have a Brock-Reigns confrontation(at least a verbal one).

I've been watching Wrestlemania build up since 2005, week after week, anticipating, and I've never seen a buildup such as this year's . At least last year's Daniel Bryan and Authority/Orton/Batista storyline was brilliant.

 

[Kodo Sawaki]

Why is the WWE WHC being decided in a Ladder Match with super heavyweights as well as potential main-eventers like Bray Wyatt, Cesaro, and Roman Reigns?

Just more excitment I guess. And having multiple guys there means more exposure to guys like Roman or Wyatt even if they dont win.

It astonishes me to this day how quickly the WWE decided to have Orton win the belt. Couldn't they have waited a month or two?

If I am not mistaken, that was the time when they had plan for Orton to be the face of Smackdown brand. So it probably made sense to them at the moment.

But yes, they do lack creative in some points they are making. For example, you want Reigns to look good in the eyes of the crowd but you pair him with Big Show instead of maybe get onto Shield storyline and make him and Ambrose go after Rollins and Authority because that would acctually produce some kind of good pops for Reigns overall.

 

[AegonTargaryen]

lol you sound like Simon from Alvin and the Chipmunks when you type. Anywhoooo.... .

What the hell? I don't see even a semblance of a parallel between my typing/speaking/diction and some cartoon show/animation character which I'd never have known of had it not been cited here, so gruesomely I might add.

A couple of your points seemed kind of nitpicky though. I mean, the way the title was decided at MITB? It's the freaking gimmick match of the ppv. There's no need to muddy up the concept with a tournament or anything like that. If the title were vacant in January it would be decided in the Royal Rumble match. Is that not creative?

You've missed my entire point. It's not for nothing that I tend to elaborate so much before creating a thread just to eliminate the room for ambiguities. I had explicitly stated that one of the reasons WWE creative team has been "lacking" or otherwise has been failing to demonstrate creativity is because of PPVs like this. Throw 8 man in two matches and that's it. Does Kofi Kingston even deserve to be in matches like MITB and Elimination Chamber? He's a jobber/midcarder for life at best.

And the WWE did have the option of having just one MITB match for a change- the one which should've had just 6 superstars- who actually have the potential to become WWE WHC- and not someone like Kofi Kingston or Jack Swagger. (Thank the good Lord they did not insert R-truth). Fact is, Daniel Bryan or any wrestler surrendering a World Championship is a unique situation which occurs once every couple of years. My contention was not that the MITB PPV should be done away with but how the WWE creative team has gotten accustomed to throwing 8 guys in this match, or 6 guys in the Elimination Chamber, or two wrestlers in HIAC just because it's become somewhat of a formula now. And I suggested an alternate proposal, something which the "Creative team" hasn't done nor can do. That's where the 4-men tournament comes.

And to answer your question as to why they rushed to put the belt on Orton in 2011 without drawing it out? It's most likely because the Smackdown live tour draws better with a champion on the card. If they drew it out for two months it may have helped the television product but the idea of attending a house show for the B-brand with no world championship on the card doesn't sound very tempting. I think that's more of a business decision than a creative blunder.
.

Who said there wouldn't be a world champion for two months on SD? Christian was the World champion. Once again, you misinterpret me. Instead of giving it away to Orton, which obviously was a decision made by the "Creative", have Orton chase it and earn it. The Christian heel-turn could've deferred for 2 months. But obviously, writing a complex and long-winded storyline takes "creativity". Giving Orton the belt because he happens to be John Cena # 2 doesn't.

Another instance is how for YEARS whenever John Cena got injured and returned within 2-4 months, they would immediately have him return to a PPV and win the WHC. Survivor Series 2008 when he won it from Jericho. Night Of Champions(?) in 2013 when he won it from Alberto Del Rio. Had the WWE not treated Cena like he was supposed to win all the damn time for YEARS , we wouldn't have loathed him so much and he wouldn't have had to "beg" so ludicrously for a US title match against Rusev.

 

[Cats Pajamas]

I don't know if this is necessarily the point you're trying to make, but something needs to be done about the scripts these guys are reading on camera. Roman Reigns quoting Sylvester the Cat was a cry for help from the Creative Team. If that's what you're going to give Rome for material than why bother sending him to acting classes? You may as well send him out to the ring to make fart noises with his armpits into the microphone.

I think they're operating under the belief that loyal fans are going to watch the show regardless of how crappy it is.

What the hell? I don't see even a semblance of a parallel between my typing/speaking/diction and some cartoon show/animation character which I'd never have known of had it not been cited here, so gruesomely I might add.

Wait, did you not hear The Chipmunks version of "Achy Breaky Heart" a gajillion times when you were a kid? Holy shit... you wanna talk about gruesome? I heard that was one of the songs they used to play in the background while they waterboarded terrorists.

 

[Headman]

What the hell? I don't see even a semblance of a parallel between my typing/speaking/diction and some cartoon show/animation character which I'd never have known of had it not been cited here, so gruesomely I might add.



You've missed my entire point. It's not for nothing that I tend to elaborate so much before creating a thread just to eliminate the room for ambiguities. I had explicitly stated that one of the reasons WWE creative team has been "lacking" or otherwise has been failing to demonstrate creativity is because of PPVs like this. Throw 8 man in two matches and that's it. Does Kofi Kingston even deserve to be in matches like MITB and Elimination Chamber? He's a jobber/midcarder for life at best.

And the WWE did have the option of having just one MITB match for a change- the one which should've had just 6 superstars- who actually have the potential to become WWE WHC- and not someone like Kofi Kingston or Jack Swagger. (Thank the good Lord they did not insert R-truth). Fact is, Daniel Bryan or any wrestler surrendering a World Championship is a unique situation which occurs once every couple of years. My contention was not that the MITB PPV should be done away with but how the WWE creative team has gotten accustomed to throwing 8 guys in this match, or 6 guys in the Elimination Chamber, or two wrestlers in HIAC just because it's become somewhat of a formula now. And I suggested an alternate proposal, something which the "Creative team" hasn't done nor can do. That's where the 4-men tournament comes.



Who said there wouldn't be a world champion for two months on SD? Christian was the World champion. Once again, you misinterpret me. Instead of giving it away to Orton, which obviously was a decision made by the "Creative", have Orton chase it and earn it. The Christian heel-turn could've deferred for 2 months. But obviously, writing a complex and long-winded storyline takes "creativity". Giving Orton the belt because he happens to be John Cena # 2 doesn't.

Another instance is how for YEARS whenever John Cena got injured and returned within 2-4 months, they would immediately have him return to a PPV and win the WHC. Survivor Series 2008 when he won it from Jericho. Night Of Champions(?) in 2013 when he won it from Alberto Del Rio. Had the WWE not treated Cena like he was supposed to win all the damn time for YEARS , we wouldn't have loathed him so much and he wouldn't have had to "beg" so ludicrously for a US title match against Rusev.

Ok, stop for a minute. Have you ever noticed how novels aren't written the way you type, yet stereo instructions are? And how much do people hate reading stereo instructions? Oh well, gotta love internet gimmicks.

What you proposed is essentially the same thing as a tournament. It's another gimmick on what is already a gimmick ppv. There's no lack of creativity to use the match the ppv is named after to decide a new champion. Especially when there are traditionally two mitb matches. You are grasping at straws here.

As for the 2011 championship issue. You're right, I read it as you saying the title was vacant and put on Orton which wasn't the case. But my answer probably isn't too far from what they were thinking. They put the belt on the guy who they think draws so their SD shows wouldn't be headlined by the CLB. I guess the main reason I misunderstood what you were saying is because I don't see your point. All I'm hearing is arm chair booking that isn't very good either.

 

[Headman]

I don't know if this is necessarily the point you're trying to make, but something needs to be done about the scripts these guys are reading on camera. Roman Reigns quoting Sylvester the Cat was a cry for help from the Creative Team. If that's what you're going to give Rome for material than why bother sending him to acting classes? You may as well send him out to the ring to make fart noises with his armpits into the microphone.

I think they're operating under the belief that loyal fans are going to watch the show regardless of how crappy it is.



Wait, did you not hear The Chipmunks version of "Achy Breaky Heart" a gajillion times when you were a kid? Holy shit... you wanna talk about gruesome? I heard that was one of the songs they used to play in the background while they waterboarded terrorists.

That promo was awful, but if you noticed after a couple weeks Reign's stopped cutting promos like that. They saw the backlash and adjusted. Yet for whatever reason I still see some people use it as a knock on Reigns as if it's somehow relevant to what's going on now. I know that's not what you're doing. You're pointing out that as long as Mcmahon is the filter, goofy stuff like that is going to find it's way onto our television sets. We can't really do much about that, but at least they tend to change direction to some extent when it goes wrong. If not by who they push, at least in the way they're presented.

 

[Navi]

I don't know if this is necessarily the point you're trying to make, but something needs to be done about the scripts these guys are reading on camera. Roman Reigns quoting Sylvester the Cat was a cry for help from the Creative Team. If that's what you're going to give Rome for material than why bother sending him to acting classes? You may as well send him out to the ring to make fart noises with his armpits into the microphone.

To tell you the truth, making fart noises with his armpits might have gone over better. Toilet humour always does.

The problem with creative nowadays is they have no friggin clue how to be creative. There are too many cooks in the kitchen, and the head chef Vince McMahon is out to lunch (no pun intended). Until we get someone, HHH in there who understands today's fans it will stay the same and it's what we're stuck with.