Jumping ship has lost it's shock value

[The Con Volt]

Hey guys. So today, I got to thinking about the differences between the original monday night wars and the current "war" we are experiencing right now. And correct me if I'm wrong, but the best aspect of the 90's war was seeing wrestlers jump ship to the other company. At least it was for me. Now only months into the new war we have already seen our fair share of ship jumping. Anderson, Hardy, Kendrick, etc. But the question I have for you guys is this. Has the WWE taken all of the excitement out of this aspect with the 90 day non-compete clause? I believe they have. When news hit that Anderson got fired from WWE, everybody automatically thought that he would for sure jump ship to TNA. Which in my opinion, would have been much more exciting (and damaging to WWE) if it had been the following week as opposed to a half a year later. Hardy's jump was still a relative shocker considering he had us believe that he didn't want to wrestle for awhile. I remember reading a couple of hours before the show on Jan. 4th that he was backstage with Shannon Moore and I think most of us just assumed that he was gonna visit his buddies like Chris Parks(Abyss), AJ and Angle and low and behold, he's now with TNA. RVD's debut might as well have been advertised all week with Hogan doing the thumbs on camera in a radio interview, and the Spike TV tweet.

But I am sure there will be many more jumps to come if TNA continues to do monday nights. And that brings me to a second question: Is there anyone currently working for the WWE who's jump to TNA could be a legitimate game changer? Realistically, I my myself am going to say no, because half of what you have to gain from a jump is pure shock value which I believe 9 times out of 10 is going to be ruined both by the non-compete clause and dirt sheets.(Guilty as charged BTW.) So the other 50% of a jump which is all TNA can rely on is the wrestler's star power. With that said, I will now list a few WWE superstars (some realistic, others not) whose star power may or may not be a "game changer." I will rate their star power and likeliness to jump ship on a 5 point scale

The Big Show
Now as far as I know, Paul Wight has always been happy with his place in the WWE as a whole. And rightfully so. In his years with the company, he has won the WWE championship twice, and is always believable as a huge threat when Vince throws him into the M.E. So therefore, his ratings are:

Star Power: 4/5

Likeliness: 1/5

Carlito
In his near 6 year history with the WWE, Carlito has been a multi-time tag and 2nd tier champion, but the title most ppl associate Carlito with is the "Billy Gunn Award." For those of you unfamiliar with the term, it's the IWC's way of describing a wrestler who just doesn't give a damn about their place in the company. And for that, his ratings are:

Star Power: 2/5

Likeliness: 4/5

John Cena
Whether you like him or not as a TNA fan,( Or WWE fan for that matter) one cannot ignore the fact that John Cena jumping to TNA would be FUCKING HUGE. He has the biggest fan base in the WWE, is reliable, and lets face it, the ladies love him. But if there was ever a company man, It's John Cena.

Star Power: 5.5/5 seriously

Likeliness:.0000001/5 (never say never)

The Miz
If I were making this post half a year ago, the ratings I'm gonna give him would have been vastly different. But in half a year, The Miz has gone from a "who cares" superstar to an almost certain future world champ. Great on the stick, and improving in the ring, The Miz has proven his place in the WWE.

Star Power: 3/5

Likeliness: 2/5

Randy Orton
HAAAAHAAAA. You wish

Star Power: 5/5

Likeliness: .0000001/5

Batista
This one is a little tougher. One would think automatically NO considering his legit feud with AJ, but lets not forget the facts that A) He and Ric Flair are legitimate buddies B) He's the kind of guy who truly sees dollar signs. That being said, Batista is a company man ( or perhaps WWE is a Batista company, if you catch my drift.) And he is very comfortable with his place and pay I would assume.

Star Power: 5/5

Likeliness: an apprehensive 3/5

Chris Jericho
Yet again, you wish. I'm not even gonna rate this.

CM Punk
Pretty unlikely considering his statements about Hogan running TNA months ago. And the fact that he's pretty much the only wrestler than TNA missed the boat on BIG TIME. But WWE might have made a mistake with his punishment over the John Cena/ Wardrobe comment. So It's not completely inconceivable

Star Power: 4/5

Likeliness: 2/5

Matt Hardy
Let me just say that unless he wins MITB this year,(unlikely) I downright EXPECT him to jump ship at some point.

Star Power: a generous 4/5

Likeliness: 5/5

And there you have it. Feel free to chime in.

Adversely, do you think any TNA stars jumping ship could be a game changer? I know TNA would dead in the water if they lost any of the following guys: AJ, Abyss, Angle. Coincidentally all "A" names, I know.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

I don't think the 90-day compete clause is the main reason why all the shock factor has been taken out of "jumping ship". I think the shock factor is gone because there isn't a big name in WWE who would even dream of going to TNA. John Cena would never go to TNA because he's pretty much WWE's #1 guy. CM Punk wouldn't go to TNA because he's the #2 heel in the entire company, and considering what's currently going on with Orton, he might be the #1 heel in WWE soon enough. Also, there's no chance guys like Triple H,HBK,Big Show, and Undertaker would got TNA because they are 100% loyal to Vince.

AJ Styles might make a splash in WWE......he might. I think he would do good on Smackdown, have a couple of good runs with the IC title, and have some awesome moments in MITB matches, but would he get near the World Heavyweight Championship, probably not. There's a chance he could have a shot or two at the title, but I don't think he would ever win it.

Again, I don't think the 90-day compete clause has a lot to do with the shock factor being gone. A lot of it has to do with the fact that all of the top guys in WWE would never go to TNA because it just wouldn't make sense. Sure, guys like Cena, Big Show, Punk or Orton would make a splash in TNA, but it will NEVER happen.

 

[shattered dreams]

At this time no superhuge name is going to jump ship ... probably. You have to say probably because circumstances can change quickly and Jeff hardy has set a precedent. If TNA grows then we could see bigger names bouncing around. Main reason that happened back in the day was that they were similar in size and stature, which is not the case here.

As far as being a "gamechanger," why is it only big names that can do this? Austin was maybe the quintessential gamechanger other than Hogan and Austin was hardly a name when he went to wwe. Maybe the shocking debut is less likely than back then but the misused young superstar that blossoms on teh other side is still alive and well.

 

[The Con Volt]

I don't think the 90-day compete clause is the main reason why all the shock factor has been taken out of "jumping ship". I think the shock factor is gone because there isn't a big name in WWE who would even dream of going to TNA. John Cena would never go to TNA because he's pretty much WWE's #1 guy. CM Punk wouldn't go to TNA because he's the #2 heel in the entire company, and considering what's currently going on with Orton, he might be the #1 heel in WWE soon enough. Also, there's no chance guys like Triple H,HBK,Big Show, and Undertaker would got TNA because they are 100% loyal to Vince.

AJ Styles might make a splash in WWE......he might. I think he would do good on Smackdown, have a couple of good runs with the IC title, and have some awesome moments in MITB matches, but would he get near the World Heavyweight Championship, probably not. There's a chance he could have a shot or two at the title, but I don't think he would ever win it.

Again, I don't think the 90-day compete clause has a lot to do with the shock factor being gone. A lot of it has to do with the fact that all of the top guys in WWE would never go to TNA because it just wouldn't make sense. Sure, guys like Cena, Big Show, Punk or Orton would make a splash in TNA, but it will NEVER happen.

I agree with your post, but I think you might have misunderstood the question somehow. How is it that the top guys who PROBABLY wouldn't go to TNA take away from the shock value of those who DO go? You have me confused with that one. The question isn't who would or wouldn't go, it's if when the guys who DO go, does it even matter because 9 times out of 10, we know in advance now-a-days. Like when Rick Rude appeared on both shows on the same night due to RAW's tape-delay. Not that Rick Rude in that point of his career is what I would consider a major "get" by any means, but it was still shocking how he was on both shows on the same night. Which truly cannot happen for a WWE star to TNA. And because why? The 90-day clause.

Now on the other hand, a wrestler from TNA could conceivably appear on both shows in the same night thanks to TNA's tape delay. Not that WWE really wants anyone from TNA besides Abyss.(allegedly)

 

[Mitch Henessey]

I agree with your post, but I think you might have misunderstood the question somehow. How is it that the top guys who PROBABLY wouldn't go to TNA take away from the shock value of those who DO go? You have me confused with that one. The question isn't who would or wouldn't go, it's if when the guys who DO go, does it even matter because 9 times out of 10, we know in advance now-a-days. Like when Rick Rude appeared on both shows on the same night due to RAW's tape-delay. Not that Rick Rude in that point of his career is what I would consider a major "get" by any means, but it was still shocking how he was on both shows on the same night. Which truly cannot happen for a WWE star to TNA. And because why? The 90-day clause.

Now on the other hand, a wrestler from TNA could conceivably appear on both shows in the same night thanks to TNA's tape delay. Not that WWE really wants anyone from TNA besides Abyss.(allegedly)

The reason why I mentioned the top guys is because we all know guys like Cena,Taker, Orton, Triple H, Punk, etc. would never go to TNA. All of those guys are either VERY loyal to Vince McMahon or they're in a very good position in the #1 company. These guys and a select few more are the only ones who could make a real splash in TNA. There would be no reason at all for them to jump ship to TNA, and if you take away all of those big names, then who else on the WWE roster could make a splash in TNA? Zack Ryder? Carlito? or Ezekiel Jackson? I don't believe any of those guys would make a big splash in TNA, and possibly lure a significant amount of viewers away from WWE. Besides all of the big names on the WWE roster who would never go to TNA, there's really nobody left who could have a impact(no pun intended) in TNA.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Well I dunno, I think that the 90 day no compete clause does throw a monkeywrench into the shock value of jumping ship. Let's just say that Triple H did leave the WWE, it'd be all over the internet within a matter of minutes and there'd immediately be "Triple H is going to TNA" buzz. Now, imagine if Triple H was on Raw one Monday and then just suddenly, out of nowhere, showed up on iMPACT! the very next week. That would be shocking, that would be a big deal. However, the fact that he couldn't show up in TNA for 3 months after leaving the WWE puts a significant cramp in the shock value. Sure, it would be an exciting thing for to show up in TNA, but to show up suddenly and unannounced before the internet rumor mill started up? It would be a complete mark out moment for just about anyone, even for fans that don't particularly like Triple H.

However, I do agree with the fact that there really isn't any huge names that are left that will jump ship to TNA and make waves. Triple H will never leave the WWE, HBK will always be loyal as will the Undertaker, John Cena and Randy Orton. And, it really wouldn't be that big of a deal in the minds of some if someone like AJ Styles came to the WWE. After all, the WWE will not acknowledge the existence of TNA on any of its programs and AJ Styles isn't a huge draw by any degree. It'd be a devestating blow to TNA and Vince McMahon would probably consider it a personal victory, but the WWE would have to acknowledge TNA's existence in order for the full effect.

 

[WWE Manster03]

I think the biggest reason that jumping ship has lost its shock value doesn't really have much to do with the no compete clause. Alot of times when someone leaves, they will do an injury angle or something like that, and then they magically show up on another show. The real culprits are us, the IWC. When Jeff left WWE, immediately the talk started that he would go to TNA. Same with Anderson. When Christian left TNA, it was all over that he was going to WWE. Jericho coming back was reported 2 months before. Edge coming back at the Rumble was announced as probable online 3 weeks before. See what I'm getting at? If the IWC would have been what it is today, would the Outsiders angle in WCW of worked? Would Luger showing up in the Mall of America on the first live Nitro of been news? No because they played it up as "OMG WTF are they doing here?" Hall alluded to WWE invading by saying " you know who I am, but you don't know why I'm here". That would NEVER work today. So I think they only way it could work is if someone off the radar for a few months suddenly showed up somewhere. Goldberg is negotiating with WWE right now, and if he wouldn't of announced it despite the feelings most have for him it would of been a big deal for him to show up unnannounced. Remember when The Rock used to randomly pop in on Monday night Raw to help Eugene/Foley? Nobody knew he was coming in, and that gave us a shock value we don't see anymore. Social networking sites and the IWC have ruined the shock value,not the no compete clause.

 

[BDiddy]

I registered here just to comment on this topic after reading a bunch more. Much better than some of the "other" so called forums Ive read.

Anyway, jumping ship isnt going to matter because if my memory serves me correctly, the REAL ship jumpers were Nash and Hall to WCW and Benoit, Saturn, Melinko Guerrero, Big Show and Y2J Chris Jericho to WWF. Luger to WCW might have been bigger than I remember but I wasnt watching then. Rick Rude to WCW was weird simply because he was in 2 places at once. Forget the fact that Bischoff only made 2 huge signings and Luger and Rude were sort of like WTF moments. There is key similarity between ALL of these guys that hasnt been mentioned at all is that NONE of them actually "jumped ship" by the standards of the current talent Ive seen discussed here. What I mean is that none of these guys had contracts with their previous employers. Hall and Nash werent released by Vinnie Mac. They worked their contract out with WCW before their WWF contracts were up. Vince KNEW where they were going. Luger and Rude were working night to night with no contracts. Radiclz, Y2J, Big Show all were the same. They choose not to resign with WCW and move to WWF. They didnt "jump ship." They simply went to a different company. All the talent mentioned in this thread is under contract. The only way out is to agree to your release which gets you the 90 day or to simply not resign when your contract expires.

I dont think Vinnie Mac has a no compete clause for when your contract simply expires. Im pretty sure that is not legal and I dont think he can have one. Vince can control if he releases you, because technically, you are agreeing to your release because he is obviously paying you for those 90 days. Vince cant fire you and then say oh by the way 90 day no compete. The reason that no compete is there is because the released talent agreed to it with the "mutual" release. Its in both in Vince's favor and the released talent's favor to agree to the release. From Vince's side he gets his no compete and for the talent, he gets a payment for agreeing to the 90 day.

I dont expect ANYBODY who can shake things up to jump ship to TNA. Cena is under lock and key as is Orton. Triple H? Maybe if he cheats on Stephie. Undertaker is finished. He is calling it a career soon and so is HBK. Neither of those guys is Hogan or Flair. They have their financial situation sorted out and their family life sorted as well. Flair has like 7 ex-wives and Hogan... Well we all know Hogan. Who else could go? Doesnt really matter because Vince learned his lesson from the last time. He learned to lock up talent. Even if someone does just let their contract expire to become a free agent in the truest sense of the word, Vince will use the IWC to his advantage and tell the world that so and so was offered a contract and declined. Then its blatantly obvious whats going on. Vince was burned by his own actions in thinking that Hall and Nash just wanted a paycheck at WCW. He wont let it happen again, 90 day no compete or not.

Part of what made the Monday Night Wars so huge was that Vince didnt and couldnt anticipate that the nWo was going to blow up like it did. His previous experience with releasing top stars in Hogan, Savage and Flair was that they would run down to Atlanta for some of Billionaire Ted's money. He had no idea that the nWo was coming and the monster that it would become. Razor and Diesel would be household names today, not Hall and Nash if he could have predicted the future.

So I think that you wont see any huge suprise jumps because of the IWC and Vince's ability to manipulate information in it and because he learned his lesson. Never under estimate your competition. This is why TNA cant "beat" WWE. The second they start to gain momentum, Vince will smack them right back down. He isnt going to let them become competition like WCW. He will let them exist and put on a show. Its a great place for him to get talent from and its a great place for his extra or old talent to go. He tried to coexist with WCW and for a while they did just that. But when Bischoff fired that first shot... Man Vince came right back at him. Vinnie Mac managed to best Easy E with a live show only every other week! You can draw parallels to TNA=WWF and WWE=WCW, but Vince won this war once. He will do it again. Sure it took him years, but he still did it. WCW's rise was due to a perfect storm of everything. And Easy E doesnt have that this time. Vince wont give him the pieces.