Jumping from heel to face, something only the best can do

[xsKiitz]

The fine art of being a despised and hated heel and making the successful switch to a beloved and adored babyface, even the reverse of this, not everybody can do it and when they can, you know they're a true superstar.

People like CM Punk, Chris Jericho, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Kane, The Rock, Hogan have all had very successful runs as both a face and heel multiple times. Though some have tried but not yet made it (Miz as a face, Del Rio as a heel) but their time may not have come yet. You may say someone like Stone Cold never fully got over as a heel but that's because he was insanely loved by damn near every single fan that being hated was too big of a stretch.

For example The Miz. He's arrogant and whiney, and is doing okay as a face but really shined when he was a heel because his personality is one that can be used to irritate all fans so he's a natural heel. People like Chris Jericho (see; 2012 return) he had every fan in the palm of his hand loving him during his return and simply flipped the switch and everybody hated him. Same with Punk. Goes from being insanely over as a face, and is now doing wonders as a heel.

Bottom line is some people can, and some people can't. The people that can are destined for the main event.
Thoughts?

 

[theBec2101]

I dont think it is something only the best can do. It more if the fans could accept it and if they want to buy it. For example Austin when he turned heel, that was a fail cause he was aready a bad ass that was face so we didnt want it so we didnt buy it. Hogan on the other hand it was so out of the realm that we did want it and we bought in on it it was great. I think it more us then anything. Zack Ryder we like him better as a face and he isnt great. Alberto I dont think he is great so to say but I prefer him face. Santino was a good heel. So I think it depends on us and if we are sold on the storyline and if the person can fit.

 

[jerichoambrosemark]

I fully agree with the Jericho (yea I know my screen name) reference and the CM Punk reference. I have been saying for years that those two men are amazing at just changing from face to heel or viceversa on the drop of a hat and people BELIEVE IT. And like you said xsKiitz, I would really WANT to believe Miz as a face but he just comes off as one of those "My character is a real dick regardless of face or heel". The Hogan moment that was mentioned was great, it was unexcepted that a "hero" could just join a villianus group and be against everyone. This is one of those situations where I hope that history repeats itself in seeing a Cena turn and hopefully joining Shield.

 

[Adalam]

Ok, I've heard people complain before about the huge change in character for guys going Heel to Face when their heel shtick got them cheered to begin with! This is just more proof of the bi-polar nature of the IWC I guess...

At any rate, I agree that jumping from heel to face and vice versa is easier for those who are good at it. Part of that is natural charisma. The rest is working at it. Confidence plays a part too, but you need the first two to really have an effect when your confidence is where it needs to be. Guys like Jericho and Punk couldn't do what they do if they lacked any of the three.

 

[Judah's Lion]

Not everybody can do it and when they can, you know they're a true superstar.

People like CM Punk, Chris Jericho, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Kane, The Rock, Hogan have all had very successful runs as both a face and heel multiple times.

Bottom line is some people can, and some people can't. The people that can are destined for the main event.
Thoughts?

my thoughts are that i both agree and disagree with the above points. this is a really good thread idea and something that i've been thinking about a lot lately in regards to individual superstars and in general.

1. so only the ones that can switch from heel to face and vice versa are true superstars? what about Ricky "the Dragon" Steamboat. he was a face his entire career. was he not a true superstar? what about "Million Dollar Man" Ted Dibiase? he was a heel his entire career. was he not a true superstar?

2. i'm not sure that being able to switch from heel to face is an indicator of true superstardom or even something to aspire to. a common complaint i've observed over the years is superstars switching too often. Kane and Big Show instantly come to mind. and Punk's latest run as a heel has seemed very forced to me. his biggest moments have come from real life tragedies that he's had to use to get heat (Lawler's heart attack and Paul Bearer's passing). his heel run as the Straight Edge Savior and his face turn last year were so organic. his heel turn this time around was so forced for the most part. so again, i'm just not so sure that switching from heel to face is always a good thing or the hallmark of true superstars. sometimes it's just illogical and poor creative writing.

3. this is similar to the first point. in the same way that i disagree that true superstardom is defined by ability to switch from heel to face (Steamboat and Dibiase), i disagree that main event destiny is based upon this ability also. John Cena has lived in the main event for nine consecutive Wrestlemanias. he's been a face the whole time. Kane and Show have been in most or all of those same Manias, and even more, but switched from heel to face as often as they change their socks. Kane has never been in the main event or a World Title match at Mania and Show's only main event time and World Title matches came from being in multiple man matches (fatal fourway at Mania 2000 and triple threat at Mania 25).

i do agree with the OP's foundational idea, though. the better a superstar is -- the more natural charisma they have and the more easily they connect with the audience -- the more natural a switch from heel to face should be. that is, of course assuming, that we want to see said superstar switch from one to the other. there are several superstars that couldn't switch from face to heel because we love them too much, as is the case with Sting, pre-retired HBK and Taker.

 

[xsKiitz]

1. so only the ones that can switch from heel to face and vice versa are true superstars? what about Ricky "the Dragon" Steamboat. he was a face his entire career. was he not a true superstar? what about "Million Dollar Man" Ted Dibiase? he was a heel his entire career. was he not a true superstar?

I didn't mean that you're only a superstar if you can switch between heel/face, Cena and Austin were never (successful) heels but they're still the best of best. I just mean that iffff you can do it then you're clearly very good.

 

[Johnny Q Public]

Granted this is a random post from a realtively new guy. But I think the heel to face turn really only works when you have a quality storyline, consider Hogan turning heel at Bash At The Beach, that literally shocked the wrestling world, if you ever watch the replay the fans pelted the ring with trash. Additionally consider Austin turning face in his match with Bret Hart effectively turning heel, this is one of the few times a double switch actually worked.

Case in point, The Miz, he was the perfect heel arrogant, cocky, self assured, he even had the catch phrases, with his Really?...now he is a face and he kinda seems like a Rock knock off.

I am not sold with Del Rio he is much better as a heel, plus he uses heelish tactics, so there ya go.

Personally I think Cena would do better as a heel, and given the right storyline he could be a major heel, I may be in the minority but his heel character was far more entertaining.

 

[MCMG]

Many average wrestlers have been good/ok as both heel and face. Matt Hardy, Chavo, MVP these knida guys could do both.

The obvious thing is that CM Punk, Jericho, HHH, Orton, Sheamus are so talented that they are the best heels AND the best faces. HHH was the person in my opinion who was the best at it. The contrast between evolution and DX is immense but he led both superbly.

 

[Ovaltine]

This is an interesting thread because while it is to some degree true it is also somewhat flawed. There were people who the fans would not boo no matter what they did. Sting and Ricky Steamboat are proof of this. There are also others that became so respected that they wouldn't get booed either. The Undertaker is proof of this. Ric Flair is proof of this. While Flair and Undertaker could get people to boo them early (and in Flairs case he was still able to do it late) in their careers I am pretty sure that no one would boo them anymore by around 1999. Sometimes people just become so loved by the fans that no matter what they do fans will not allow them to turn heel. Sting clobbered Hogan with a baseball bat in order to turn heel and the audience popped! He came out a few weeks later and clobbered Brian Knobs with a baseball bat and pinned him and the audience popped. Flair was in Evolution and he was cheered. LIke I said some people cannot turn heel no matter what they do.