Is this the new formula of creating strong, over faces?

[CyberPunk]

So, I've been thinking about the most over stars in WWE in recent times. No, not the part time acts, but the active, full time roster. Punk, Bryan, Ziggler, Ambrose come to my mind. There's no doubt they are all very talented individuals in one or other way. Either they are strong on mic, or are excellent inside the ring, or a little bit of both. But is that enough? Does that contribute to their overness? So, I decided to observe a little more closely. And the pattern I saw was something you might have observed yourself. Yes, they all have this notion attached to them that the WWE machine doesn't really believe in them.

If you look at the last 5 years, who have been the most over stars? And what made them popular? Punk was cutting excellent promos well before summer of Punk, but it was his scathing pipebomb against the machine about him being held back that immediately made him a fan favorite, even though he was a heel at that time. Look at Bryan. He was putting on excellent matches for a long time. But his storyline against authority during which people genuinely believed that he's being held back and may never become champion contributed to his overwhelming popularity. Look at Ziggler at Survivor Series. Another example of where people believe that he is being held back and is not getting what he deserves and suddenly, he's in the limelight.

I am not saying that they weren't popular before because they were. But when people start believing that their favorite superstar is not getting their just reward, they start backing them even more. Look at Damien Mizdow/Sandow. He has always been good on mic and inside the ring. But his stunt double shtick, while is nothing more than comedy, is not only entertaining, but also makes people think of him as someone who's not getting what he deserves. In turn, we see him getting strong reaction everytime he's on screen.

So my question is:

Is this the new way of creating strong, over faces? Of course, you still need talent, and shall have entertainment value. But doesn't it seem that any superstar who is seemingly held back gets even more crowd support? There are examples on the opposite side of the spectrum as well. As soon as it seems that the machine is backing someone, or as we say, 'shoving someone down our throat,' people seem to turn on that guy. See Roman Reigns. We don't know the final plans for WM 31, but because he's backed to be the guy who might not only main event WM 31, but also take the title from Lesnar, their are already many people who are turning against him.

So just to reiterate, is the notion of not having management's backing contributes to a superstar's popularity? Do I make sense when I say this? Is this the new formula?

Discuss.

 

[HurriKane]

Its genius when you think about it, if this is the case Cesaro should be back where he should be soon. I'm hoping Vince's comments about Cesaro will cause the fans to get behind him even more. I doubt it will be as big as Daniel Bryan. But hey like you said its worked for Ziggler, Bryan, and CM Punk. Its going really well with Sandow, let's just hope the same happens for Cesaro soon.

 

[jack knife bad guy]

All of the guys were also independent stars, giving them much-needed years of experience. Giant arenas, lack of stars and an abundance of green wrestlers was a big part for the lacking product. . Creative? Well some take longer than others. . I agree with what you said. We don't even blame the writers, bc we believe they are getting held back. . Good job wwe for recognizing this And you. . Ziggler might not have been an independent star but he was a project of the system. . Spirit squad haha. But Cena edge Orton was forced down our throats for 5 years if not more and what ever but we were ready for something new. . Reality era?

 

[Navi]

The fans will always rally around the underdog. If there is someone they like and feel they aren't getting what due them, then that's what happens. We saw it happen with Bryan and the Yes Movement. Although I don't believe for one minute this wasn't a grand plan right from the top. We were just led to believe that it wasn't.

The fans got behind Reigns and Ambrose because of what happened to them with Rollins. The Shield were one of the best acts in the business until the Rollins sell out. Ambrose was booked perfectly as the guy going after the sell out and having the Authority stop him at almost every turn. Reigns on the other hand was supposed to go after the rest of the Authority but that didn't really happen, and he was seen as not caring about the Shield anymore. I think that's why the fans have started to turn against him.

The best thing they could do for Reigns on his return is to make him an underdog again. Get the fans back on his side. Maybe a feud with Rollins will help that happen, but Reigns has to lose and he has to lose a lot.

So to the OP, yes you're right, the fans will back the guy who has no-one else left to back him. That's how you get a great face and that's the way to keep them on top.

 

[MR K]

I think with Reigns they need to give us a reason to care, the shield broke up and Reigns got the shit beat out of him by Rollins and basically didn't do anything about it for months. He was made to look like superman in the multi man matches he was booked in but he literally has 2 moves. The 1 on 1 with Orton really exposed how bad he is in the ring. I know there are rumours of WWE wanting this guy to be the next big thing but I think they need to let him go back to chasing a mid card title, let the fans go on a journey with him like they have done with every other top tier talent.

I don't understand how WWE think that pushing a guy straight to the top works. That always ends in failure. See Del Rio, Seamus and Swagger as examples. The fans didnt care/dont care for these guys.

Now take every other top talent ever in WWE, They all have one thing in common, they had a solid mid card run, won a mid card title, gave the fans a reason to care about them then were pushed to the top. It didnt matter if it was the under dog story the OP has rightfully brought up, which has worked so well in the modern era, or it was a heel,face turn or a memorable promo. Every other top tier talent in the WWE has got over, not by being pushed straight to the top but by having a slow burn and getting over organically. THe most frustrating thing about it is that if the writers paid any attention to their OWN BLOODY NETWORK and went back and watched what worked we wouldnt have Cena as the ONLY true main eventer.

 

[MC_Live]

It's actually a pretty good way to look at it. And it's not even that new. Wrestling fans have had a long history of cheering for guys they're not supposed to. Sure Punk, Bryan, Ziggler and the others are recent examples. But how bout Mick Foley? He was never supposed to be a WWE guy. He's a three time WWE Champion. Steve Austin was supposed to be The Ring Master. He was supposed to be the mat technician, not "The Guy". The real measure of a superstar is talent. If you're good, people will like you. If you're good enough, everyone will like you, and the company will have no choice but to push those people.

 

[chuckmdubya]

The entirety of Pro Wrestling has been re-hashing this same storyline from 1997. When Vince and Austin did it, it was new and fresh, it was the man vs the boss, the system. I realize that OP is saying that this is a little different, that fans believe the "holding back" is not kayfabe. But still it is losing it's flare. The addition of the boss was great for wrestling and re-popularized it, but it may be time for a new overriding theme in top tier talent storylines. They have all had to face the Boss and their soldiers for almost 20 years now. A new way of thinking could once again cause WWE to grow exponentially in fan base.

 

[The Mattitude Era]

I think this is a little bit different from the Vince vs Austin days. I think what makes this format so successful is the element of realism. Although we all know it's fake, we always seem to be more interested and invested when they portray a real-life thing. Daniel Bryan not getting his props was something that seemed, and in fact probably was, real. Same with CM Punk and his pipe bomb. We've been complaining for years of Ziggler not getting his push, so they've worked that into the storyline (albeit not explicitly), and it's been working great.

Also, we shouldn't underestimate that it's the wrestlers themselves who make these storylines work. From CM Punk and Daniel Bryan, to Triple H and Stephanie.

 

[BillAlfonsos_Whistle]

Good thread.
For the time being this seems like the new stale go-to method of creating a face. They haven't been able to move past the Vince vs. Austin ratings/perfection since it happened. They have tried to establish so many different forms of the "corporate threat" even after the Austin/McMahon feud went stale. The Corporate Ministry says it all.


The writers are lazy hacks that can't come up with anything else and you rarely get a guy who deviates from the plant like Punk. Those moves don't pay off very well for many. He was the exception. If they were smart they'd use the "Brock Lesnar doesn't care about WWE/Wrestling" angle to give someone a massive face push coming up. Make it about a real tangible heel wrestler, not some nonsense power structure story line. Want Ziggler or Reigns fully over? Have him call out, feud, and upset the beast incarnate at Wrestlemania to bring the title back where it belongs...to the WWE universe.

 

[enviousdominous]

Survival of the spontaneously fortunate.

You can be great according to the storyline and in recognition of your abilities in the ring, and still not be great in the imagination of the average fan. Getting to the point where fans envision your greatest moments years before they've come to fruition is the key to Stone Cold, Shawn Michaels or Daniel Bryan status. Making that happen for the fans isn't a matter of going by the numbers and granting them all the passion you can offer, you have to hit upon a common but potentially fleeting fad.

I give a little slack to WWE creative in that they could potentially give us a character who would have hit all of our happy buttons a month ago, but we're all suddenly malcontent due to a separate circumstance and find ourselves rejecting the idea of being expected to like anything.

The internet is very unforgiving when it comes to personal matters that harm the image of a given persona. To remain a good guy in the hearts of pro-wrestling fans you have to live that disposition every waking minute of your life while also abiding by an unspoken and ever-evolving set of locker-room by-laws.

I see Dolph as finally owning our imaginations in the same way as other top stars. Bad News Barrett is so good at being bad that it's nearly impossible to boo him. Bray Wyatt is played by a guy who has earned the right to go off-script at will, and with the right feud can capture our hearts. Naomi seems poised to become the WWE's apology for ever using Nikki Bella as a serious character.

I think the future is bright for the WWE.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

It is not new but it seems like the best way to get fans to rally harder for certain guys in these days of discussing disbelief. I'm certain the Mean Gene Insider Hotline had some bullet points to hit help make it seem some guys were not getting their due to get people rallied. I remember BS stories thrown around about how Vince (or some higher ups) didn't think Cena would amount to much (but he overcame and proved them wrong blah blah). Now do you really believe that? It is all a part of the show. The smarks are the marks some of the time.

Don't get me wrong, there is usually some truth in the statements but that is because there has to be in order really play on people's emotions. In Cesaro's case, he absolutely has issues. His accent may as well be a speech impediment on American television. While it worked for Schwarzenegger, Cesaro is not so unique or special in pro wrestling to say "I'll be back" for the fans to take notice. Vince's comment was to light a fire under Cesaro and/or Cesaro's fans to make a statement.

 

[BestWrestlingOpinions]

You definitely make some valid points. Not being given what you deserve is a good reason to back someone up. But to me, the biggest thing is that the fans are sheep. Let's take Punk for example. He was a decent Superstar back in 2009-2010, he was drawing heat, but nothing over the top. Then, his pipebomb started and the hardcore fans (mostly IWC) started chanting for him because reasons. Then, his thing spread all over the internet, which means more fans got to know stuff about Punk and started backing him up. Then the kids followed suit because they are sheep and will cheer whoever they are told. That's how it goes.

It can even start with a smarky crowd. Check Daniel Bryan. International crowds (Canadian, British) etc, appreciate talent, and respected Bryan. Him losing the title the way he did at WM28 caused some sort of "riot" if you wanna call it that, this is why the fans started chanting YES on Raw the next night. And it caught on, because people are sheep and followed suit, since they wanted to be a part of this whole thing.

Getting crowd reactions is what mostly will get you to the top. If you connect to the crowd, you will get on top. Bryan made it there because of that (but the crowd interaction started because of some "smarter fans" saw how good he is). Same for Punk, fans wanted to see him because he connected to them. On the other hand, see Del Rio. The guy is tremendous in the ring, but he just couldn't connect to the crowd, and if he wasn't appealing to the Mexican crowd, he wouldn't be given Rumble wins, MitB, WHC/WWE titles etc.

 

[kadroan]

Its genius when you think about it, if this is the case Cesaro should be back where he should be soon. I'm hoping Vince's comments about Cesaro will cause the fans to get behind him even more. I doubt it will be as big as Daniel Bryan. But hey like you said its worked for Ziggler, Bryan, and CM Punk. Its going really well with Sandow, let's just hope the same happens for Cesaro soon.

That would be great if it works out for Cesaro. I'm not sure how long his latest gig with tagging with Tyson Kidd is going to last but I'm sure he's going to make the most of it, help elevate the tag team division like he did with Jack Swagger.

Bryan won the tag titles with Kane after losing the WHC to Sheamus and failing to win the WWE Championship from Punk, then chased the WWE Championship. Maybe the same could happen with Cesaro.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

WWE knows that a large portion of their audience at this point follows online. They know their fans think the guys (Triple H, Vince etc) have these horrible personalities. So they use it to their advantage.

It's not a new way to get someone over. It's the same shit it's always been. Blue collar guy being held back by the man. The IWC is just too arrogant to think the WWE does this kind of thing on purpose (Wrestlemania season Daniel Bryan was an obvious use of this).