Houston Region, Third Round: Hardcore: (1) Bret Hart vs. (8) Big Show

Discussion in 'Houston Region' started by klunderbunker, Mar 10, 2011.

?

Who Wins This Match

  1. Bret Hart

  2. Big Show

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. klunderbunker

    klunderbunker Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2007
    Messages:
    17,857
    Likes Received:
    3,359
    The following contest is a third round match in the Houston Region.

    This match takes place in the Astrodome in Houston, Texas.

    [​IMG]

    It is a Hardcore Match.

    Rules: In this contest there are no disqualifications or count-outs. Falls count anywhere in the building and the match ends by pinfall or submission.

    #1 Bret Hart

    [​IMG]

    Vs.

    #8 Big Show

    [​IMG]

    This contest is one fall with a 30 minute time limit. The match will take place in a 16 x 16 ring with no ramp leading to it. Any traditional managers for either competitor will be allowed at ringside.

    As for voting, vote for who you think would win this match based on the criteria you choose. Some suggestions would be (not limited to): in ring ability, overall skill, their level of influence at the highest point in their career, ability to connect with the crowd, experience in major matches or simply personal preference etc.

    The most votes in the voting period wins and in the case of a tie, the most written votes wins. There is one written vote per user, meaning if a poster make ten posts saying Bret should win that will count as a single vote. In the event of a second tie, both men are ELIMINATED, no questions asked. Only winners advance.

    Voting will open in 48 hours and will be open for five days and all posts must be non-spam. You may use the 48 hours to present your cases as to why either competitor should/should not win.​
     
    #1
  2. Tastycles

    Tastycles Turn Bayley heel

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2008
    Messages:
    2,911
    Likes Received:
    1,516
    You know what, I think Big Show would win this. This is one of the few times when the expression "three time Hardcore Champion" holds any relevance. Big Show not only won that title, but he won it in a non bullshit 24/7 fashion, but in an actual match against one of the all time legends of hardcore wrestling in Raven.

    That's not why I'll be voting for him though, though the experience is obviously an influencing factor. My principle reason for picking Show is that when he is at his strongest, he is an absolute beast to get down. Couple this with the fact he has proved capable of performing some pretty big feats in gimmick matches - look no further than him tossing Cena into a search light, though it wasn't even his fight, and I think you have a winner.
     
    #2
  3. shattered dreams

    shattered dreams Hexagonal Hedonist

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2010
    Messages:
    1,522
    Likes Received:
    975
    Certainly seems to favor Big Show. Technical wrestling isn't especially useful in a hardcore match. Being familiar with the environment and capable of absorbing a lot of punishment is. The power behind the blows delivered mean a lot and Show is going to have a big advantage there.
     
    #3
  4. I Suck Ass

    I Suck Ass I survived the Rapture

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    168
    Likes Received:
    175
    As much as I am going to hate doing it, I'm voting for Big Show. Why? Size. Think about it. A chair shot from Bret, who weighs 230-240, will hurt. A chair shot from Big Show? See you next week. Big Show has been a 3-time Hardcore Champion, and Bret has never been classified as "hardcore".

    Big Show gets the win, but only because of the gimmick.
     
    #4
  5. Big Nick Dudley

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2009
    Messages:
    1,958
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    Anyone counting out Bret Hart simply because this is a Hardcore match should think again. Bret has beaten some big bastards in a No DQ setting before: Diesel for the WWF championship at Survivor Series 1995.

    Also, Big Show loses these kinds of matches as often as he wins. If Shane McMahon can find a way to beat the Big Show in this type of match, I'm sure Bret Hart can do the same.

    Bret was known as a technician, but he was also a great brawler. He was a brutal guy, and I think this type of environment would be more beneficial to taking down The Big Show. He kows how get a big man to the ground, and keep him there. He's done it to Kevin Nash, Vader, Sid Vicious, and The Undertaker.

    Bret is far too smart for The Big Show, and has taken down large opponents under similar rules. Bret wins this one.
     
    #5
    The Crock likes this.
  6. The Crock

    The Crock WOO!

    Joined:
    May 19, 2010
    Messages:
    1,506
    Likes Received:
    2,292
    I'll have to agree with Nick here. Not only is Bret the smarter man, but he isn't a slouch in Hardcore matches either. I can see Bret doing fairly well in this match. His No DQ Match against Stone Cold, No DQ vs Diesel, his Hardcore match in WCW against Sting. He can hold his own here, no doubt. As long as he can use his agility to survive Big Show's initial onslaught, he can start to tear the big man down and eventually win this match. Hart, obviously the better technician in this match, will be able to work some of his moves once he tears Show down. He's intelligent enough to take his legs out from underneath him, or at least use some chair shots to beat Show down. I can see Hart getting out of this, but it won't be easy.
     
    #6
  7. Slyfox696

    Slyfox696 Excellence of Execution

    Joined:
    May 23, 2007
    Messages:
    2,384
    Likes Received:
    2,408
    Oh, so because weapons can be used, suddenly the ability to defeat another wrestler goes away? That's just stupid. Hardcore matches =/= best wrestler to swing a barb-wire bat.

    The Big Show is obviously a big man and dominating. But I don't think that just because there are weapons, that means Big Show automatically wins. Wrestling ability doesn't quit being an issue just because there are weapons. The ability to work is just as important as it is in a regular match, and to say otherwise is stupid.

    Bret wins this, simply because he's better. Big Show is underrated as a worker, but Bret's simply better.
     
    #7
    Hollywood Naitch likes this.
  8. The Brain

    The Brain King Of The Ring

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2009
    Messages:
    2,579
    Likes Received:
    1,666
    Survivor Series 95 immediately came to mind when I saw this match. Bret has proven he can beat a far bigger man in a streetfight. For as much as he is known as a great technical wrestler, Bret could certainly handle himself in a fight. He is one of the smartest wrestlers there ever was and knows how to take advantage of any situation. I'm sure he would easily find a way to beat The Big Show.
     
    #8
  9. Hollywood Naitch

    Hollywood Naitch The current reigning and defending

    Joined:
    May 27, 2010
    Messages:
    5,099
    Likes Received:
    3,003
    I think Sly nailed in with this post. The extra damage caused by any weapon shots would indeed be to Show's advantage but if Bret could pick apart the big mans legs, he would not be going out of the ring to pick up any weapons.

    Bret has the desire, heart and resilience to take a few shots from Show. He isnt some mid-card jobber who would be crushed by Show, this is Bret freakin' Hart we are talking about, one of the all time greats.

    Hart can swing a chair too, we saw that at WM against Vince. If he can avoid taking too much punishment from Big Show, and connect with a chair shot or two to the Show's knees, taking him off his feet, Bret has the technical know how to get the victory with a submission.
     
    #9
  10. Alastor

    Alastor Championship Contender

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2010
    Messages:
    637
    Likes Received:
    277
    If anything, a Hardcore match actually benefits the smaller wrestler because he is able to minimize the power difference. In a normal match, Bret Hart will not be able to handle Big Show's strength, but a chair is a decent equalizer. Instead of constant chop blocks to the knees to bring the big man down, Hart can utilize the easier and more devastating chair shots. Show can use weapons as well to beat the crap out of Bret, but he is going to receive much more damage too. I believe Bret Hart is capable of taking much more beating than Show to outlast him and win in a hardcore match.
     
    #10
  11. Hulk Hogan's Brother

    Hulk Hogan's Brother Stop asking me what I'm gonna do!!!

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,837
    Likes Received:
    809
    If anyone thinks that Bret is merely a technician and not suited to wrestling in hardcore matches then I think you know nothing about pro wrestling. Bret has wrestled in a number of hardcore matches in his career and has won the majority of them. From my knowledge I do know that he has victories over Kevin Nash and Stone Cold Steve Austin, two guys who bring their A+ game to hardcore matches.

    As for this match Hart has won against a bigger opponent in a hardcore setting before( Diesel in 1995) and Show has lost to smaller opponents in a hardcore setting many a time most notably against Shane Mcmahon.

    So yeah vote Hart!!!
     
    #11
  12. Unsold Bacon

    Unsold Bacon Shucky Ducky Quack Quack

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    249
    Likes Received:
    174
    No doubt Big Show would win this.

    big Show could destroy anybody in hardcore rules and when he is facing Bret who wrestled in a different era where hardcore isn't as vicious as it is today Big Show would smack Bret 'Hitman' Hart with all the weapons he could. Show wins easily.
     
    #12
  13. Coco

    Coco Mid-Card Championship Winner

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,250
    Likes Received:
    2,754
    This is odd. So because this is a hardcore match, some people are willing to overlook Bret Hart's winning record against the likes of Diesel, Undertaker, and Bam Bam Bigelow? Come on, guys. Hart can handle big guys and he can handle no disqualification matches. Survivor Series '95 anyone? He tied Diesel to the ring post and had his way with him. He survived a massive table bump and went on to end Diesel's year long run as champion. Bret knows how to handle these situations and is frankly a massive overachiever in some respects. Big Show, on the other hand, is a massive underachiever. The choice is clear as day. Bret fucking Hart, bitches.
     
    #13
    Big Nick Dudley and SavageTaker like this.
  14. Nate DaMac

    Nate DaMac Fuck erbody but me

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2009
    Messages:
    2,548
    Likes Received:
    2,611
    If anything, I think the fact that it's a Hardcore match neutralizes the size of Big Show. I honestly just don't get what everyone has been talking about. The Big Show going over Bret Hart? Not in this lifetime. Hart has beaten Taker, Yoko, and Diesel. He's beaten them all clean at that. If you're adding weapons into the equation, it's just going to make for an easier night for Hart in my opinion.
     
    #14
  15. Megadeth

    Megadeth AKA Asm92784

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    205
    Likes Received:
    29
    There is no chance the Big Show would beat Bret here. Others have already pointed out Bret has never struggled against big men. Bret was even able to pick up and slam the 450lb Vader with relative ease in a match on Raw. And again as others have pointed out, Bret has won several high profile No DQ matches. The Big Show, tends to struggle in High profile matches, and I just don't see any way that Hart would loose here.
     
    #15
  16. UltimateHitman

    UltimateHitman Old School Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2010
    Messages:
    386
    Likes Received:
    165
    I agree. I don't see how people see Show against Bret here and say "Holy fucking shit, this'd be a massacre!"

    Bret has beaten Stone Cold. Stone Cold has beaten Show. Hence, Bret beats Show.

    Show has been beaten by Swagger, Kofi, MVP, Rob Van Dam, Christian, DDP, and even been wrestled to a draw by R-Truth. Read: R fucking Truth. Now ask yourself if Bret could beat these guys. Answer: Yes.

    This match should not really be close. I even see Bret giving Show the around the ringpost figure 4 to keep his legs incapacitated.

    Yup.
     
    #16
  17. SavageTaker

    SavageTaker Everybody Has A Price!

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,097
    Likes Received:
    591
    That is terrible logic to use. If that were the case then I could say Zach Gowen can beat The Undertaker since Brock beat 'Taker and Gowen beat Brock. Not all wrestlers are equal so you can't say because so and so beat so and so then they could beat so and so. Get what I'm saying?

    Anyways, I'm giving my vote to the master of the Sharpshooter , Bret Hart. Bret has faced big guys before (Yokozuna) and has been able to beat them and almost made Yokozuna tap out before interference occured. So I don't think he'd have any problem locking in the sharpshooter on Show. Furthermore, Hart has absolutely no problem with being hardcore. Steve Austin and Hart's submision match immediately springs to mind when I think of Hart being hardcore. Lastly, Hart is a quicker, better and much smarter wrestler than Show so I don't see him losing a match against him at all.
     
    #17
  18. Muffin Top Merkley

    Muffin Top Merkley Be a man!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    547
    Likes Received:
    485
    While Hart hasn't beaten a man the size of Big Show, he has beaten plenty of bigger and tougher men than compared to himself.

    This is a hardcore match, and not a 'first person to hit his opponent with a weapon wins 'match, so Bret could very well use weapons and his enviroment to break down The Big Show long enough to lock in the Sharpshooter.

    It might take multiple attempts, but Bret will outsmart Show and advance to the next round.
     
    #18
  19. Mr. Artistic guy

    Mr. Artistic guy Better Off This Way

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    948
    Likes Received:
    1,033
    I'm going to try make the case for Show here, I think people are flirting with Bret's "intelligent" wrestling style are forgetting that very little of it would come into play in this match. After what point is there in having gimmick matches if they don't affect the thought processes of the people voting. I'd likely have voted Bret here in a straight-up match but this environment in my eyes truly does favour the big man.

    Now first off to cast off a few of the cobwebs lying in people's heads. Did Shane McMahon beat Show clean? I know in the context of the match winning clean isn't necessary at all but if you watch again, as I just did, you'll see it took the interference of no less than 4 men and one woman to get show off his feet, and the only way they could keep him there was by shoving a huge speaker onto his leg and have a guy stand on it. Now Bret Hart at his most dastardly around 97 when he patrolled with the neo-Hart Foundation group was still not really known for having people interfere on his behalf, his whole personality was being the best there ever was and proving it by beating guys clean. Case and point:

    [YOUTUBE]kpiN2ZRD-Gk[/YOUTUBE]

    Not a single stable member even comes out for Bret until HBK comes out, only then to negate any influence he has on the preceding match. Bret would almost certainly not have anyone to interfere on his behalf so the Shane example isn't wholly applicable.


    Ok so now that that's sorted. It has already been mentioned that Bret has never faced a guy as big as the Big Show. How does he then approach this match, with typically Bret tactics? He almost wasn't able to lock the sharpshooter on yokozuna, although he didn't have much trouble with Diesel. Show's legs are a combination of the two, it's very [possible that he wouldn't be able to lock in the hold to keep Show down.

    In the end in my mind's eye it comes down to this. Both men could win, Bret has his cunning and determination at his disposal and Show has his brute force and toughness. I'm just imagining what it would take for Bret to beat Show here, a lot of work on the legs and use of a chair or some other foreign object most likely. That's a lot of effort and there is no guarantee it would work, it's taking for granted that Show doesn't just reverse the momentum during this and undo all Bret's hard work. And for Show to win, one single connection. If Show gets one clean connection to the head with the chair in this match even at half force Bret would be loopy enough for Show to come in and destroy him, either another chair shot(s) or power bomb or knock-out punch.

    Bret could win this but the chance that a single clean connection with a weapon eludes Big Show for this entire match is too slim to me. Big Show wins on probability.
     
    #19
  20. IrishCanadian25

    IrishCanadian25 Going on 10 years with WrestleZone

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
    Messages:
    6,092
    Likes Received:
    1,532
    This sums it up really well.

    Bret Hart, for all of his well earned reputation as a technical wrestler, was a tough sumbitch. Coco's invocation of Survivor Series '95 is a good call. And one could argue thatr Diesel at that point in time was better equipped to defeat Bret than Paul Wight ever has been at any point in his career. And I'm a Paul Wight guy, too.

    Bret had a magnificent record against bigger men, is among the most resourceful wrestlers I've ever seen, and knows his way around a Hardcore match.

    Also, unlike some other SHW's like Diesel and Vader, Paul Wight did have a tendency to get winded after a while. He lacked the endurance some of the great SHW's of all time did, such as Bam Bam Bigelow and the two big men mentioned above. At King of the Ring ('93 I think) Bret handled wrestling two prior matches and faced a fresh Bam Bam, got hit with a chair and contended with outside interference from Luna Vachon. He eventually beat Bigelow with a Victory Roll.

    This is a match where, despite a hardcore atmosphere, pinfalls and submissions count. Bret is one of the all time greats at earning pinfalls and submission victories. He could certainly wear down Paul Wight and earn the win here.
     
    #20
  21. hatehabsforever

    hatehabsforever Moderator
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2007
    Messages:
    2,066
    Likes Received:
    1,648
    Bret Hart takes this one over the Big Show. Sure, Show is a huge man, but Bret is more than capable as a hardcore competitor. He is smarter, faster, and quite simply, better. Show will probably drag this one on for a while, but in the end, the Excellence of Execution is simply the better man. I really like the Big Show and I think he is incredibly underrated as a general rule of thumb. But he is not the best there is, the best there was, or the best there ever will be. Hart will get down and dirty with Big Show, he will bring his own brand of hardcore violence, and in the end, he will emerge triumphant over the bigger but lesser man.
     
    #21

Share This Page

monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"