Have MVP, Carlito, and Shelton Benjamin been hurt by cultural insensitivity?

[Coco]

Honest question here. Does Vince McMahon or someone within his organization lack the empathy to see where people who aren't white are coming from? Have they mistaken traits they doesn't understand in Carlito and Shelton Benjamin for sloth? Was MVP's "dick doctor" outburst something that should have been tolerated or approached with sensitivity and understanding given the way that prison culture influence MVP? What approaches should WWE take as an organization to make sure its stars aren't penalized for managerial shortcomings in cross-cultural understanding?

As the kids on the internet like to say, discuss.

 

[ABMorales787]

As a puertorican, I can assume that Carlito's problems are in fact laziness. His dad owns a company. That means he has secured work. We are lazy people by nature. Carlito is spoiled. He had it easy on his way in, so he'll want it the same in WWE. As for MVP, I would assume that he really isn't in much of a rush for success. He's hit rock bottom. Now as a mid-carder, that seems like an all time high. I assume.

 

[klunderbunker]

Not at all.

Shelton had one great match in 2005 and that carried him for the rest of his career. MVP is as overrated as anyone ever. I flat out do not get the appeal of this guy. He can talk to an extent but his in ring works leaves something to be desired to put it mildly. Carlito is another guy I've never gotten the point of. He just wasn't that good either. I'd hardly think any of these guys' failures can be attributed to their race but rather their own laziness or general lack of talent.

 

[The New Generation]

I don't think that this has anything to do with race, but just the individual personallity of each person. Saying that Vince should feel different of MVP because he's been to jail and has had his personality change because of it doesn't mean that MVP can get away with certain things that other can. Should McMahon keep it in the back of his mind, maybe, but many other people have been through tough times and when having a job you must leave all personal thing aside and do your job.

Same with Carlito's lazyness, if it has to do with race or not. Riaku says that

As a puertorican, I can assume that Carlito's problems are in fact laziness. His dad owns a company. That means he has secured work. We are lazy people by nature.

so i am unsure if it has to do with his race, but Carlito is infact very lazy. Vince shouldn't change whether or not he should promote or fire a wrestler just because his race or background says that they are lazy. If a wrestler is lazy, he should be fired, and that's what happend. And I personally don't want to see a lazy wrestler, whether or not he is a certain race. Entertainment is entertainment and Carlito just ins't entertaining.

So if Shelton and Carlito are seen as lazy, whether it has to do with their race or not, it shouldn't matter. If McMahon thinks they look sloth, then most people will probably think the same way. I personally think both of the wrestlers look boring in the ring, and maybe McMahon feels the same, as well as MVP. I also feel the same for many other white wrestlers, Mike Knox, David Hart Smith, Dibiase and Drew McIntyre, so this isn't a race issue.

So I don't think anything McMahon has done has been because of race but what he feels the wrestlers in ring performance is like, which all 3 of these people IMO lack good in ring skills.

 

[Coco]

As a puertorican, I can assume that Carlito's problems are in fact laziness... We are lazy people by nature.

If I'm to hold your word up as fact, then wouldn't that mean Carlito was unfairly cast aside for a predisposition that he had no control over? Doesn't that mean mainstream whites are automatically advantaged over Puerto Ricans because of the way they were born? And if this is the case, should Carlito's laziness not been treated the same as that of a white wrestler? Why should Carlito have any less of a chance to succeed because of how he's born? Shouldn't greater efforts been made to accommodate Carlito and make sure that he had the same chance to succeed that a white wrestler would?

 

[Gerald Brisco]

Oh my God.

Unless your accusing all Purtericans of laziness and unwillingess to work hard cultural sensitivity had nothing to do with Carlito's Firing, It was because half the time he was out of ring shape, a bit sloppy and seemed not to really care.

And Prison Culture holds MVP back? Are you being serious?

Cross Cultural Aside your supposed to conduct yourself at a certain way for the chance to be paid as highly and pursue a career which thousands of people wish they had the chance. Simply dismissing Sheltons/MVP's/Carlitos shortcommings as "you dont under-stand where they have been!" Is absolute Senile Rubbish,

 

[tubby91]

OP, yes, in the wrestling business an in shape, clean cut white guy will always be chosen over anyone else.
That's just the way it is, if you want to call it "Cultual Insensitivity", go ahead.
But you might as well also call it "The way it has always been, and the way it always will be".
Oh, and some of your points, such as the whole MVP/Prison Culture thing were just simply ridiculous.

 

[ABMorales787]

If I'm to hold your word up as fact, then wouldn't that mean Carlito was unfairly cast aside for a predisposition that he had no control over? Doesn't that mean mainstream whites are automatically advantaged over Puerto Ricans because of the way they were born? And if this is the case, should Carlito's laziness not been treated the same as that of a white wrestler? Why should Carlito have any less of a chance to succeed because of how he's born? Shouldn't greater efforts been made to accommodate Carlito and make sure that he had the same chance to succeed that a white wrestler would?

No. I've seen the guy work before getting to WWE. He had it easy. His development was in WWC. He is everything you would expect from a spoon fed next generation wrestler. I'm not saying he's lazy because he is puertorican. I'm saying he is lazy because he is spoiled just like most of us.

Oh my God.

Unless your accusing all Purtericans of laziness and unwillingess to work hard cultural sensitivity had nothing to do with Carlito's Firing, It was because half the time he was out of ring shape, a bit sloppy and seemed not to really care.

Yup. This is it. Very little interest that he showed. He was given a major chance in '05 and he blew it.

 

[Gerald Brisco]

OP, yes, in the wrestling business an in shape, clean cut white guy will always be chosen over anyone else.
That's just the way it is, if you want to call it "Cultual Insensitivity", go ahead.
But you might as well also call it "The way it has always been, and the way it always will be".
Oh, and some of your points, such as the whole MVP/Prison Culture thing were just simply ridiculous.

I will post a reply because i will be banned without an explination on why the Rock is giving you the "is he really that stupid" look

Dont be silly, people of All Creeds have been faces of companies, Not soo much African Americans because there hasnt really been much Big African Stars apart from Ron Simmons and Booker T but there has been Huge Contributions to the Wrestling Industry from Pacific Islanders Japanese and Latin Stars,

Hell when i started watching wrestling my favourite wrestler was Yokozuna, and he is far from a clean cut white guy

 

[NthDegree23]

I think, in a perfect world, McMahon would push those who are most deserving. If Carlito's laziness (a trait he has regardless of his Puerto Rican descent) holds him back from performing at his best, then he should be held back from the main event. It's about making the most money. Now, I'm not saying that the right person always get pushed, but I think granting special privileges to people because they're from different cultures is just as racist as holding them back for the same reason.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Not in the least in my opinion.

Carlito is someone that has got talent and has been misused at times. However, Carlito has shown himself to be lazy and there are times when you look at him and you just get the feeling he just didn't give a shit.

MVP just isn't all that good to begin with. Often times, his matches are slow, clumsy and he just seems to drag on a lot. I think he'd be much better off as a heel but I haven't seen anything overly remarkable out of him. I just think he's a limited wrestler whose limits are showing.

Shelton Benjamin is someone that just couldn't really get over the hump. The time when he was most over in the company is when he and Charlie Haas were part of Team Angle, and a lot of that was due to the fact that Kurt Angle was in the picture. Benjamin had feuds and wins over guys like Triple H, Chris Jericho and RVD and was given a number of high profile title runs. He was just never able to sustain interest in what he was doing. He last title run was with the United States Championship, he held it for about 6 months and nobody really gave a damn. He was athletic as all get out, but had the personality of an expired jar of mayonaise.

I know that it's tempting to lay all the blame on management sometimes but it's not always the fault of the brass. Sometimes, you've just got wrestlers that simply aren't as good as they're hyped, some don't have the drive and some just don't have the It factor.

 

[gd]

I don't think cultural insensitivity has anything to do with Shelton not being able to talk at all. Or with him being geneally underwhelming. It doesn't have anything to do with MVP being atrocious in the ring either. It doesn't have anything to do with Carlito sucking either.

These guys just flat out aren't that good, regardless of their race. It may have played a small part in it, but if they were actually worth anything, they would've gotten to where they were supposed to be.

 

[CuddleBuns84]

I don't think these guys were hurt by anything but themselves. Shelton Benjamin had Triple H job to him twice in 2004. Then an amazing IC title run. Then what happen? Yea he had the goofy mama Benjamin storyline, but he was teamed with Flair, and that couldn't work for him. Great ring abilities can get you far, don't get me wrong, but lack of Mic Skills, and charming personality, won't have make you become a big star.

Carlito's debut was a win over John Cena for the US championship. He was a decent feud to start of his career. Then get traded to raw, and won the IC title off of Shelton Benjamin. He had a great start, and had a good feud with Orton as a face. He as well had a great debut.

As for MVP, he really hasn't worked on his character since the Hardy feud. He as well had a great debut. The highest paid Smackdown wrestler never really got the crowd reaction. I mean he is decent at mid-card, but that's all he can do. Unless NXT gets changed to something else, and he can main-event it, there is really not much he can do.

As for people saying cultural insensitivity for these guys, I say boo to you. You can't have lazy people doing less, and getting more. It doesn't work that way. You can work smarter not harder. But these guys never worked smarter. They failed to achieved nothing left said. For people with that theory of cultural insensitivity, put yourself in the shoes of these bosses. Your in a production based business, and these guys aren't producing. What do you do?

 

[The Damieon Humber]

Can you really blame these 3 for being less than good in their careers with the E? Or can you blame creative for not giving them the ball like Sheamus, Miz, and other white characters that have came in. MVP was a great heel and the longest running US champ. What happened? Kinda just lost steam. Is that HIS fault, or creative? Shelton....we know he's great in ring. But barely being seen on ECW was not his fault. Feuding with Abraham Washington will kill anybodies career. Did he ask for Momma Benjamin? I doubt it. Isn't that creative's fault? For a long, long, long, time I've said Vince McMahon does not like black people. He tolerates them. DWAYNE DON'T COUNT. HE'S SAMOAN! AND HE'S DAD'S PART CANADIAN EH! Anywho.....i really don't know what to say about Carlito. I mean he was fair in ring imo, but he couldn't get over the top either. What, creative couldn't turn him in to a lying cheating stealing Mexican? I've been seeing this for a long time now, and wish i was wrong. But the proof is in the pudding. Mark Henry been the WSM for 20 yrs, and only been in less than 5 main events. Big Show ain't that damn special on mic but he stays in the ME picture when not being carried by Y2J and Miz and other tag partners. You mean to tell me that Mark Henry ain't good enough to be carried by Jack Swagger? You don't think its Lil black kids in America that look up to Cena instead of Lebron. OK thats much, but they're out there. Its almost like black baseball players trying to get black kids to play baseball. We would want someone to look up too thats our same race. The world is already culturally bias. Maybe Lil Tron seeing a black WWE champion will get him to wrestle at school instead of doing what an average urban youth would do. Well anyway, retorting my original point, maybe MVP, Carlito, and Shelton plays a little part in the way their career is going, i.e lacking mic skills and more polished in ring, but they damn sure don't have creatives back

 

[El AlcoHALLic]

Not at all. Carlito pissed off the WWE on a few occasions. Plus he isn't really as over as he once was. Maybe if he actually did something the fans to give him a strong reaction either Face or Heel wise he may still have a job.

Shelty B can't cut a promo. You need to be able to speak in wrestling these days.There's just no getting around that. He had some great matches in 04-05 and you could sense that they wanted him to step up his game and get to the next level. He just didn't.

MVP is a Unique case. He may be being held back because of his past. Linda is running for a Republican seat and having an Ex Con as the face of your company isn't exactly great PR. She's going to get slammed from all sides about Steroids, wrestlers deaths etc so why compound the problem? Purely speculation on my part though.

MVP doesn't really do anything special in the ring. He just kinda slides into whatever midcard role he's given and gets a decent pop or decent heat. I dunno maybe they just haven't placed him in the right angle yet.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

I don't think so.

Carlito started with a bang, and he did a good job with the "Caribbean cool" heel gimmick, but he was very mediocre and boring for the past 3 or 4 years.

MVP is one of the most overrated wrestlers in WWE. His matches are nothing special, and his work as a heel was good, but not as great as some people make it out to be. Also, MVP has only had 2 good feuds during his tenure in WWE. One with Matt Hardy, and one with Chris Benoit. Other than that, he really hasn't been involved in anything worth remembering.

I was of fan of Shelton's, but he just wasn't main event material. Benjamin couldn't cut a decent promo to save his life, and despite the numerous chances WWE gave him, he just wasn't able to break through.

I don't think what happened to Benjamin and Carlito had anything to do with cultural insensitivity. They just weren't that good, and as far as MVP goes, he's just very, very overrated.

 

[StuartJolly]

Get a grip. Clearly it is not. Cant you see that these three wrestlers didnt have what it took to be top level wrestlers ?? So many people just badly want to put the blame on peoples skin colour because it is an easy way out. Shelton, Carlito nor MVP were the full package and thats what WWE needs. The full package. Granted many of the time the WWE gets it wrong but these three guys clearly dont have what it takes and it isnt that hard to understand that. Why dont you bring up people like Roddy Piper or Ted DiBiase Sr ?? They were never World Champs and they were probably more skilled(from their time) than all of the wrestlers you mentioned. But because someone is not white it is automatically a reason for them being discriminated against. What about Rey, what about Lashley ?? Do you just ingnore the people you want to and remeber the reasons against the majority so it seems like they are being mistreated. Its not like you had 3 valid people who should have been used better, you used 3 people that people know quite clearly why they didnt make it to the top. MVP could never get over enough, Shelton Benjamin couldnt cut a good promo and Carlito didnt have the right attitude.

 

[twiztid jay]

I just feel that Carlito and Shelton Benjamin got lazy because wwe never gave them anything to do.. so why not be lazy you're still going to get the same paycheck.. Carlito and them lost passion because they always got pushed to the side. Shelton is a great athlete and could still put on a great match, mic skills wasen't the best, but they were working on in in (wwe/ECW) but then just dropped the ball.. Carlito won the U.S. Title on Smackdown on his debut, and then won the IC Title on RAW on his debut there, they could have carried that around and gave him a more respectful run, plus spitting apples in peoples face, he could have been a main heel by now if they had carried him the right way.. I mean Sheamus, and all them come out of nowhere, and less than a year later they are wwe champ.. wtf sheamus and them are they lazy ones and only got there spot because being friends with triple h and them.. they just never gave carlito and shelton the chances they should have gotten.. I didn't mind seeing the world's greatest tag team, but nope had to break them up, same for as the colons, but had to break them up, just to reunite them and then release carlito. i don't think it has nothing to do with race, i just think that wwe is stupid now and was the same people in the same shit constantly, and that's why the product has gone downhill since.. never let the good wrestlers be anybody, and put the crappy ones on tv and give them a push wtf. like i was saying i would much rather see Shelton fight Carlito anyday, but instead you get 15 rematches between cena and batista.. yay.. makes me sick...that's just my opinion, but i think this is why the wwe sucks today..and the reason half the people don't watch wrestling anymore...

jay...

 

[Lif3h4cker]

Well, I wouldn't go as far as to say Shelton benjamin was lazy, but more underwhelmed with other things, the reason he got released was quite far from laziness, not only is he trying to finish up college atm, but he is also said to be considering a deal with tna. But as far as his ring skills go, he could've outwrestled guys like sheamus, john cena on a given day. He just couldn't cut a promo to save his life

 

[sTyLnK]

IMO it looked like Carlito was burnt out. So while it sucks that he was fired, maybe this is a blessing in disguise for him. Maybe down the road when he gets some things sorted out that passion will come back?

 

[Hawkeye]

I don't think cultural sensitivity has anything to do with it.Carlito got busted one too many times with drugs.3/4 of the roster's been busted AT LEAST once, and they all pulled it together.MVP has made it very far considering his background,and just because you're on a lower part of the card doesn't mean you can't make an impact on viewers,and everyone can't be superstar face of the company anyway so there's that.Shelton Benjamin IMO just didn't even try.He got a win over HHH and then fell flat and got released.The fact of the matter is,there aren't many black main eventers is because there aren't enough black superstars to begin with,but the ones that are there are certainly well known.

 

[Lady Sheamus]

In shades, I can understand someone wanting to keep their head down and just do their job, especially in WWE, given the nature of its politics. Also, I can get an idea of the great amount of pressure they have to be under, and the fact that quite possibly over time they could become disheartened and the situation becomes as the aforementioned. I think that it doesn't have to be about cultural insensitivity seeing as that would be insulting in itself (meaning they did not succeed due to some aspect of their culture rather than other legitimate reasons).