Gotta love the GOP...and by "love", I mean "laugh at"

[Slyfox696]

Republican Ted Cruz of Texas was still on the Senate floor talking Wednesday-- a dramatic step in defense of his high profile and controversial plan to prevent any funding for Obamacare.

"I intend to speak in support of defunding Obamacare until I am no longer able to stand," he said

Tuesday. "All across this country, Americans are suffering because of Obamacare. Obamacare isn't working."

...

Cruz's comments were not -- in and of themselves -- a filibuster, a practice made famous by Jimmy Stewart in the 1939 movie "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington," when Senate business was brought to a halt through one lengthy, uninterrupted speech.

They were, however, part of an ongoing attempted filibuster by some Senate conservatives. Cruz and a few others in the Republican caucus are trying to prevent the Senate from taking up the government funding bill passed last week by the GOP-controlled House of Representatives.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/25/politics/shutdown-showdown/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

So, just to recap...

GOP Senator Ted Cruz is standing up as part of a filibuster by the GOP to prevent the Senate from taking up a GOP-lead funding bill, which defunded Obamacare, originating from the GOP-lead House of Representatives, because Ted Cruz and other Republicans want to defund Obamacare. Ted Cruz and other Republicans are actively standing up and filibustering their own party's bill, a bill they support, a bill which does what they want to see done.


And this is why they are called the obstructionist party.

 

[Davi323]

Half-truth. Yes, he is stalling a GOP sponsored House Bill in the Senate. But, you left out WHY he is doing so. As soon as he stops talking, and it proceeds to a vote, the Democratic majority in the Senate will promptly amend the bill to put the Obamacare funding back in. THAT is what Cruz is trying to delay. It has nothing to do with what the House Republicans did, and everything to do with what the Senate Democrats will do. But, don't let the truth get in the way of a good story.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

It's hard for me to understanding how there can be so many people in Texas that support these actions to the point this guy could ever get re-elected. There is a federal government shutdown looming and this guy is grandstanding against something that was put in place four years ago. The fight is over, if it is the shitstorm that conservatives have made it out to be it will fail. Are conservatives the ones who want things to succeed or fail? They have no patience, if I really wanted conservatism to succeed and think this is such a bad program I'd stay opposed but let it fail. When it fails it would make conservatism look so good and probably win me the executive office. Right now they are making themselves look like children.

This is one of the reasons why WWE has an anti-bullying campaign. I guarantee this guy was bullied and teased tremendously as a child and he is now showing the arrested development effects.

 

[Slyfox696]

Half-truth. Yes, he is stalling a GOP sponsored House Bill in the Senate. But, you left out WHY he is doing so. As soon as he stops talking, and it proceeds to a vote, the Democratic majority in the Senate will promptly amend the bill to put the Obamacare funding back in. THAT is what Cruz is trying to delay. It has nothing to do with what the House Republicans did, and everything to do with what the Senate Democrats will do. But, don't let the truth get in the way of a good story.

So...what you're saying is Cruz is standing up and talking for no reason, since it doesn't matter what he'll do, the Democrats will amend the bill?

So not only is Cruz part of a filibuster against a bill they support, his filibuster has absolutely no purpose? And this is supposed to make us NOT laugh at him?

this guy is grandstanding

And...that's the real reason behind this.

 

[Davi323]

Basically, yeah. I don't agree with it, I do think it is just for show... but you painted it as Cruz vs. House GOP, and that wasn't accurate. Also, since Senate procedural rules will force him to end, its not even really a filabuster, just a really long winded speech. A filabuster can't be ended the way this can. Now, if this were an actual filabuster, and he could somehow delay the vote past Monday morning when the budget is due, thus threatening a shutdown, it might have actually had a purpose. But to do it when he did it served no point other than to stall the inevitable for a day.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I'm not an ultra left wing type of person who automatically condemns everything that Republicans do, though I'd be lying if I said I supported most of their stances. There are MAJOR flaws in both the Republican & Democrat parties and there probably always will be.

This grandstanding from Ted Cruz is a prime example of such a flaw in which our elected officials are more interested in promoting & securing their own hype rather than work towards making improvements. As to GSB's question of "Are conservatives the ones who want things to succeed or fail?", the answer seems to depend on whether or not a Democrat is in the White House a good deal of the time. Whenever a Democrat is in the White House, it's common to see Republicans making such stances and doing whatever is possible to undermine any & all initiatives. It doesn't really matter so much if said initiatives are good or bad than because the initiatives are those of a Democrat. Beginning during the 2008 election, I kept hearing little snippets from pundits & even ordinary people referring to the Republican Party as the Party of No and there's some genuine truth to it. More often than not, Republicans will vehemently oppose initiatives of Democrats on principal, even sometimes outright refusing to work on compromising.

I agree that if conservatives feel Obamacare is truly such a bad program, they should stand back and watch it fall flat on its face. If that happens, it's only going to strengthen the Republicans when the next elections roll around. Conservative politics as a whole has become so stagnant that the resulted in fighting between more mainstream Republicans and Tea Party Republicans has only weakened the conservative movement as a whole. Ted Cruz's comments are just the latest example of it.

 

[Slyfox696]

Basically, yeah. I don't agree with it, I do think it is just for show... but you painted it as Cruz vs. House GOP

I thought I painted it as the absurdity of the Republican party.

Now, if this were an actual filabuster, and he could somehow delay the vote past Monday morning when the budget is due, thus threatening a shutdown, it might have actually had a purpose.

And there's no way Ted Cruz/Republicans would filibuster to the point of government shutdown, because it would turn the wrath of America on them. This is clearly about Cruz doing what Rand Paul did and put his name and face before the cameras for a possible presidential run. And there's no way Cruz could ever be President if he filibustered until a government shutdown.

 

[Davi323]

On that I agree. They tried that in 1995 or 96, and it certainly didn't help them in that election cycle. However, the threat of a shutdown might have been enough to accomplish something, even if everyone knows its probably a bluff. This is probably a lost cause for Republicans at this point. If the GOP can regain the Senate, then they might actually get something done...but by that time Obamacare will be implimented, and much harder to get rid of. I think Obamacare is going to do worlds of harm to the economy, but I am resigned to the thought that it is too late to prevent it.

 

[ecwsux~!]

The GOP is ridiculously daft, the fact that presidential candidates have to pander to the far right loonies who have taken the party hostage and then comes election time they have to flip flop over every issue because they'd have to sell their soul to win the damn primaries is ridiculous. Honestly the fact that they couldn't beat Obama who wasn't a very strong incumbent is beyond me. And this petty style of politics where they're offering no alternative to obamacare isn't helping because it shows they have no long term plans.

 

[Alastor]

I read somewhere that the real reason high level Republicans are so against Obamacare or universal healthcare being introduced by the Democrats is due to voters demographics. Who stands to benefit the most from the initiative? Contrary to GOP propaganda, it is middle aged white males in middle-class families. Those same demographic also votes overwhelmingly Republican. If the Democrats actually passed a bill that helped these voters long term, it would be election suicide in the long term for the Republicans if a high percentage of these voters decided to switch to the Democrats.

That is why they are against any initiative by the Democrats to introduce any Healthcare reforms even though their own proposals are similar in nature or that most of their voters would benefit. It is to survive in elections.

 

[Slyfox696]

I read somewhere that the real reason high level Republicans are so against Obamacare or universal healthcare being introduced by the Democrats is due to voters demographics. Who stands to benefit the most from the initiative? Contrary to GOP propaganda, it is middle aged white males in middle-class families. Those same demographic also votes overwhelmingly Republican. If the Democrats actually passed a bill that helped these voters long term, it would be election suicide in the long term for the Republicans if a high percentage of these voters decided to switch to the Democrats.

That is why they are against any initiative by the Democrats to introduce any Healthcare reforms even though their own proposals are similar in nature or that most of their voters would benefit. It is to survive in elections.

That could make sense, but I'm not sure if I'd say middle age and middle class white people stand to benefit the most.

 

[Alastor]

Because many of them are working uninsured or something. Not really 100% clear on that. And also any universal healthcare initiative would mean the voters would appreciate bigger government involvement which runs against GOP usual campaigning soundbite for smaller government.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Basically the GOP has been taken over by far right lunatics who appeal to a handful of town drunks in rural America. These are very vocal, illiterate, scary people but they appeal to them.

Obamacare is working. It's not perfect, but people are going to like it. The GOP stupidly tried to coin "Obamacare" as a derogatory term but Obama embraced it. Now what will likely be a very popular and successful program will have the name of someone they hate attached to it forever even though it's similar to romneycare and a draft the heritage foundation made in the 90s. In other words, this could be a symbol of bipartisanship largely influenced by republican ideas. Instead the GOPs knee jerk reaction to spread misinformation and hate anything Obama does has chopped their balls off.

So what so they do? Well, they stall and hope they win a senate majority. How do they do this? They bitch, throw a fit, have a non filibuster that they call a filibuster, and piss everyone off even dividing their own party. Basically killing their chances.

It's hilarious. The sad thing is that these Baggers will win a lot of the same districts due to gerrymandering and the fact that these rural districts with tea party representatives are fucking morons. I had a guy argue with me with these words "socialized healthcare does t work in Europe, why will obamacare work here?" (Obamacare isn't socialized healthcare or really at all resembling a European system).

 

[Remix]

Also, socialised healthcare does work in Europe. In fact, it makes healthcare cheaper. There's a reason Simvastatin in the UK is a tenth (or three thousandth if you're in hospital) of the price in the states.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Also, socialised healthcare does work in Europe. In fact, it makes healthcare cheaper. There's a reason Simvastatin in the UK is a tenth (or three thousandth if you're in hospital) of the price in the states.

But that's a bad word here. Even though technically our infrastructure, schools, police, and fire are "socialized". Don't tell them that though, it's been that way their whole life so they don't mind it.

What I think is funny is that you can take out "obamacare" and replace it with "social security" or "Medicare" and you can look through history and see almost the same sentences verbatim from other conservatives throughout history.