Georg Hackenschmidt Vs. Frank Gotch

[Shadowmancer]

This is possibly the most important event in the History of Pro Wrestling. And on the 3rd of April is the Centenary of this historic event. Where Frank Gotch wins the title from Hackenschmidt (Great Name there) This is possibly the most Important event in Pro Wrestling because this was back when it was for a large part legit and they were "Hookers" and if needed actually attempted to injure their opponent to guarantee victory.

Hackenschmidt held the title and remained undefeated until he squared off against Frank Gotch on April 3, 1908 at Chicago's Dexter Park Pavilion. Hackenschmidt was favored to win, but he submitted to Gotch after 2 grueling hours to an ankle lock submission; It has been alleged that Gotch used illegal techniques in the match to defeat Hackenschmidt, which included oiling up his body, rubbing oil into Hack's eyes, scratching, gouging and hitting. At one time, Gotch also punched Hackenschmidt on the nose.

Two hours this was the old school stuff. But the allegations of illegal tactics seem to be a forerunner of the Heel tactics that we all know and love. But Two hours. I would like to see a Current Wrestler try and do that for one match. This match set Gotch up for the second longest holding of a World Heavyweight title ever. Bruno Sammartino is the only one that has beaten Gotch for time as champ in one reign.

And before you try and argue that some Hogan event is more important. Without this Hogan, Flair, Andre or Brody probably would never have a Pro Wrestling to work in at least as we know it.

 

[HBK-aholic]

Two hour really is something. Wow. You've seen Cena and Michaels go for an hour, but after seeing them at the end, never would they have been able to do that. And they're 2 of the biggest stars the WWE has at the moment.

I had never actually heard of this match before. And yep I love the guys name. Seriously, hearing people trying to say that would be great. But I don't like the idea of this type of wrestling. Wrestling is supposed to be fun. Actually trying to cause physical harm to your opponent in order to get a victor doesn't seem fun. And the fact illegal moves are being brought into it kind of proves watching it nowadays would be a whole lot better.

 

[Ultramantis]

Hackenschmidt vs Gotch! I haven't seen this in ages. This match is obviously of huge historical value and a great throwback to the days when Wrestling was real. Without doing any research it was the 1920s when wrestling became worked right? Of course there has still been Wrestling similar in style to this up until recently in the form of Bushido & UWF. Sometimes its fun to take Wrestling back to its roots instead of the form its now taken.

 

[MattButcher]

Was it this match or the rematch that Gotch supposedly bribed Ad Santel to tear up Hackenschmidt's leg in training. While I agree that the use of dodgy tactics in a legit shoot is less than honorable, there's something about it that speaks to the roughneck, carny origins of the sport.

Either way, it's a great anniversary and we're fortunate that varying individuals labored to keep the memory and spirit of that match alive for so long.

 

[klunderbunker]

I've heard a lot of this match before and it really is the most important match in history. I very well could be wrong, but I believe this was the forerunner to the NWA title. If that's the case, without this match there wouldn't be an AWA, NWA, or WWE to spin out of it. As for the match itself, 2 hours is absolutely amazing. The longest match i've ever heard of was an indy match that went 90 minutes. 2 hours for a single match that I've never heard of the crowd being bored with is truly remarkable.

 

[MattButcher]

This title was only a kayfabe forerunner to the NWA title. There were at least two NWA titles being defended around the country until the 40s (not sure on the date), and then the National Wrestling Alliance and the National Wrestling Association unified with Thesz as their champ.

Promotions have always touted their lineage to this match, but it's tenuous at best. The cool thing is that they preserved the memory of the match by doing so.

 

[Ultramantis]

As for the match itself, 2 hours is absolutely amazing. The longest match i've ever heard of was an indy match that went 90 minutes. 2 hours for a single match that I've never heard of the crowd being bored with is truly remarkable.

Back then most matches went that length of time. This was part of the reason wrestling became worked, the guys could make the same money without getting as hurt in shorter matches that could feature more action.

 

[Mugatunow]

I would love to see guys like Samoa Joe or Kurt Angle attempt a two hour throwdown. I think a lot of dispute about who's a good worker could be solved through this idea. If Triple H really is the best of all time, then he could go two hours. I would love to see this match, to see how Gotch and "the other guy" handle each for two hours.

 

[DeadmanXB]

No way is anybody going for 2 hours nowadays. Even if they did, it would bore the fans to death. You have to remember, in 1908, a guy could clamp on a hold for a whole match without changing. There is no way the fans of today would stand for that.
At that time wrestling was the biggest sport in America, if not the world.Gotch changed all that with two matches, and it has never been the same since. I guess we are better off with what we have today, but I hope nobody respects Gotch for what he did. Hell, I don't even understand why he is remembered at all.

 

[Shadowmancer]

Wait then why the hell do you watch Wrestling. The NWA, TNA, WCW, AWA and WWE titles all can claim roots back in this title. This match made a real world champ in Gotch. Who cares if they won't do it now. This was back when the "Sport" was more or less Shoot. Ever heard of a style called Catch. This is one of the main proponents of this style. It set records for the number of people in a single place in Wrestling that wasn't broken until the 70's at the very earliest. Wrestling was dying slowly at that time as well this rejeuvenated it. Then it started to die again and then Ed Lewis, Billy Sandow, and Toots Mondt created a promotion similar to what we see today but still based in the Shoot catch style of the time. It slowly died and then the Original Gorgeous George came along and revitalised it again leading to the style we know today of Faces and Heels. It is the nature of the Beast that is Pro Wrestling. But saying that Frank Gotch and Georg Hackenschmidt shouldn't be remembered for their contributions to modern Pro Wrestling is perhaps the stupidist thing I have ever seen on this forum.

 

[DeadmanXB]

I am not saying that noone should remember Hackenschmidt, just that Gotch ruined the sport. As I said, at the time, wrestling was the biggest sport in the world, and Gotch almost single-handedly ruined its credibility. That is why he should be forgotten.
BTW, I watch wrestling to be entertained, and honestly I would be bored to death watching a 2 hour headlock. I'm willing to bet that 90 percent of modern fans would be too.

 

[Mugatunow]

I am not saying that noone should remember Hackenschmidt, just that Gotch ruined the sport. As I said, at the time, wrestling was the biggest sport in the world, and Gotch almost single-handedly ruined its credibility. That is why he should be forgotten.
BTW, I watch wrestling to be entertained, and honestly I would be bored to death watching a 2 hour headlock. I'm willing to bet that 90 percent of modern fans would be too.

No one is saying we would want to watch an older type of 2 hour match, I would much rather see Kurt angle and Samoa Joe put on their kind of match for 2 hours than the headlock thing. I hope you don't think that all wrestling matches are like that today. Also, it's almost irrelevant if Gotch almost ruined the crediblity of wrestling. He did, that little cheater Gotch. Hogan did this too, and everyone loves him (I don't). If anyone wants my logic on Hogan ruining wrestling, visit the Private messaging. You know what though, I think your wish has been granted, because the average fan doesn't even know who we're talking about.