Frankie Edgar vs. Gray Maynard... OH GOD

[Turd Ferguson]

Last night we might have seen the end of an era as BJ Penn was beaten again by Frankie Edgar. This time though, it was even worse as at least their first encounter was too close to call. Last night, Edgar dismantled BJ Penn in each round, easily taking a 50-45 unanimous decision.

Earlier in the evening, Gray Maynard soundly defeated Kenny Florian, securing a title shot. People argued that Maynard should have had the shot in the first place, considering he beat Frankie Edgar in the first place a couple of years ago. It was very apparent that the UFC wanted nothing to do with a Frankie Edgar vs. Gray Maynard title fight, and why would they?

Sure, both of them are tremendous fighters. Believe me, this has nothing to do with Edgar not deserving to be champion, or Maynard not deserving a title shot. Both of them more than deserve to be in their given position. The problem is that they're just not marketable.

If Florian won and Edgar won last night, that would have been a very interesting fight between two guys who are very similar. It would have had the storyline of Florian's third title shot and how it would be now or never for him.

If it was Penn and Maynard, it wouldn't have been as interesting, but it would have been a new challenger for BJ. Of course, they could have even had a third Edgar/Penn match for a trilogy in case they really didn't want to go through with a Penn/Maynard main event.

With the next title match undoubtedly being Frankie Edgar vs. Gray Maynard... it just doesn't sound exciting. It has to do with personalities. Neither of them have much of a personality that makes a fan want to watch them fight. Gray Maynard could very well be the most boring fighter in the UFC, and the fact that we could be seeing a pay per view headlined by Frankie Edgar and Gray Maynard is horrifying for not only fans, but the UFC itself. It's not a fight many people want to see. The first fight was nothing to write home about, and it was judged 30-27 in all three rounds for Gray Maynard. Who wants to watch a fight where it's inevitable Gray Maynard will walk out with the belt? I sure as hell wouldn't.

I really don't know where BJ or Kenny go from here. I think BJ makes the jump to Welterweight. There's nothing else he can accomplish at Lightweight and he can't beat Frankie Edgar. Kenny is basically a gatekeeper for the top of the division now. He chokes when it counts. He can't win the title, and he couldn't win in front of his home crowd.

Sure, you'll have Evan Dunham and George Sotiropoulos making their claim for the title next. The issue with those guys is once again, they're great fighters, but they really don't have personalities. Each division has multiple fighters with personalities that get you to care about them. It seems that the lightweights with the most personality are Shinya Aoki and Gilbert Melendez, and they're both not in the UFC.

Ben Henderson might be one of the most exciting lightweights under the Zuffa umbrella, and nobody knows about him because he's in the WEC. It's time for the UFC to bring him in against a top lightweight and see if he can do some damage. The lightweight division is suddenly a division that is one of the more boring ones, just because of who is at the top. Gray Maynard is going to wind up beating Frankie Edgar for the title when that fight happens. Chances are, it's going to be the co-main event of a card, because you cannot sell a PPV on that fight. What worries me is that when Maynard does win the title, what the hell is the UFC going to do to take it off of him? A Gray Maynard championship reign is box office poison to the UFC. The only way to combat him being champion is make sure you can stick in a guy who can submit him, and right now, Ben Henderson might be that guy.

I don't know. I really fear for the lightweight division as it might be dominated by Gray Maynard for quite some time now. Nobody wants to see Gray Maynard fight, let alone be champion.

 

[CyDeez]

I agree as far as Maynard Vs. Edgar not being exciting. You never know what will happen though. Could be a huge KO or something that makes people go nuts. But I doubt it LOL...

I don't think it is the end of a particular Era with BJ. Styles make fights and for whatever reason he just can't get a handle on what Edgar is doing. I think if he doesn't move up to Welterweight, he will defeat whoever beats Edgar.

Joe Rogan was right last night about how each fighter's corners were coaching them. Edgar's trainers and what not, were giving him specific direction on what to do. BJ's side was basically shouting at him as a fan would. "Beat that ********er's ass!"

The effort, not only on BJ's part, but also regarding his corner, was pathetic to say the least!

Hopefully Penn can regroup and figure some stuff out. I don't think the answer for him is moving up in weight. Though sometimes I think cutting weight takes a toll on him.

It's weird, I agree with what you said about The Lightweight Division all of a sudden becoming boring. I think most people have considered that the most talented, and exciting weight class in recent years.

But, with the "fall" of BJ in the air, taking a look at what else they have at 155, that can contend for the Title, boring might not even be the word for it. Devastated could probably be used to describe the Title picture right now at Lightweight!

Oh and btw...

Diego Sanchez has all the tools to be at the top. It's a shame what has happened to him as well. Sanchez AND Florian were on fire until meeting Penn. He dismantled them both.

If either one of them would have beat Penn, I don't think we would be saying what we are saying. Edgar and Maynard would probably just be looked at as competitors to one of the above mentioned guy's crown.

Instead, they are now being looked at as the best in the division. Which is a far cry from past talent at 155.

While I think Maynard is a good fighter, I wish Florian would have won the fight. I think he is a little more exciting than Maynard and is more unpredictable in contrast to him. So there would be a little more buzz around Florian, because he is fluent in submissions, as well as striking AND Ground & Pound!

 

[Buffalo Dave]

This match up isn't interesting at all. The only thing good out of it is that Edgar gets a chance to avenge his only loss. While I do believe Edgar is a hell of a lot better than he was the first time he fought Maynard, all he needs to do in the next few months is work heavily on takedown defense and he should be set against Maynard.

Common sense tells us that these to will most likely put on a snooze fest. I think Dana should know that too, plus neither see to be overly to popular. I believe that when this fight is announced it will be probably the co-main event to either GSP/Koscheck or Silva/Sonnen 2. It would be awfully dumb of them to book this as a headliner.

I agree with you Guy, get Benson Henderson in the UFC. If Pettis is getting the next shot at Henderson, let them fight, after Henderson beats him move his ass right up to the UFC. I think the guy will put the excitement right back into the Lighweight division.

 

[ITurnGirlsGay]

Here's an interesting article discussing the TRUE "greatness of B.J. Penn

It's long been a given that BJ Penn is one of the greatest fighters of all time. We hear it from Mike Goldberg and Joe Rogan every time he fights in the Octagon and he's a multiple time world champion in two weight classes. But after losing two in a row, is it time to reevaluate where Penn stands in the annals of MMA history? Jonathan Snowden, who wrote a book about the history of MMA, thinks so:

The raw numbers stand out like a sore thumb. In title fights, BJ Penn is a pedestrian 5-5-1. For every big fight he wins, he loses one in turn. The true greats of the sport, your Georges St. Pierres, your Matt Hughes, your Frank Shamrocks, your Fedor Emelianenkos, are defined by rising to the occasion. When the fights get tougher, these men only get better. Not so with BJ Penn.

BJ Penn is a front runner. We learned that for the first time against Jens Pulver at UFC 35. Crowned as champion before even stepping into the cage, Penn had no answer for Pulver's heart and determination. When the fight got to the point where it demanded each man expose his very soul to walk away the winner, Penn faltered. Pulver stepped forward. That was the difference.

Sports Illustrated's Josh Gross agrees:

About that "best ever" tag that follows Penn wherever he goes, it needs to be reconsidered. Most talented? Hard to argue he wouldn't qualify. But did he get the most out of his gifts? I don't think so. And you don't need to look further than Penn's career and the choices he made to understand why.

For starters, he was fast-tracked. In just his fourth fight, Penn was given a title shot against Jens Pulver. He lost. There was no grooming the Hawaiian. Then, in his seventh fight, he received another title shot. This time a draw against Caol Uno. Two fights later -- after defeating Takanori Gomi in what remains his biggest win in the lightweight division -- Penn moved up a class to fight top welterweight Matt Hughes. That victory may have been the worst thing that happened to Penn. It fed into an obsession resulting in his multi-weight excursion. Two fights later he was at 185. Next, a bout at light heavyweight versus Lyoto Machida. Back to middleweight and then a return to 170, where he lost consecutively to Georges St. Pierre and Matt Hughes.

http://www.mmamania.com/2010/8/29/1656930/does-frankie-edgar-loss-at-ufc-118

To the thread subject, I think you're right in some regards, Guy, but wrong in others.

Think about it, before Rashad's impressive knockout of Liddell he was considered to be one of the most boring fighters on the planet. Machida was the same way until he knocked out Thiago Silva. Edgar is only one great finish away from fickle ass fans jumping on his bandwagon and saying they loved him the whole time. I picked Edgar both times he fought B.J. because he's had problems with great grapplers. Additionally, Edgar's cardio is insane. He and Guida have out of this world cardio. I knew Penn couldn't hang with that in the later rounds.

 

[Goliath Uterus]

I don't think Maynard will beat Edgar, Edgar has proven himself to be a more then capable fighter at 155. I think Maynard will lose in convincing fashion, then possibly fight Nate Diaz (who mentioned him post fight) in a fight I think he will also lose.

From then on, I think that Edgar will be fed more exciting fighters after he beats Maynard, so I wouldn't be too worried about the Lightweight division, Guy.

 

[Digging4Plunder]

Well, with Edgar and Maynard not being marketable.. you know what you do?

Ring in the new year with Silva/Sonnen and Edgar/Maynard.. two titles.. one night.

It's not as epic with the narrator voice but yeah.. they don't even have to be put with Silva/Sonnen or a title fight for that matter. They can just put them with another good fight. It'll be alright.

 

[jmt225]

I haven't been less excited about a Lightweight Title fight since, well... since never.

For years now the LW Division has been my favorite division in the UFC, and I am just so, so, soo fucking disappointed looking at the top two names headlining it right now.

On one hand, we have an undersized, lucky midget who prances around the octagon like he's Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer in his fights, and on the other we have yet another boring ass wrestler. On top of that, they both have personalities that compares to Braden Walker, so there's absolutely no way they could ever raise the level of interest in this fight with trash talk.

The fact of the matter is, this fight is either going to be 25 minutes of prancing around, or 25 minutes of laying and praying. Definitely going to a decision with these two, and it will be shit, guaranteed.

Thankfully, whoever wins will fucking lose to whoever they fight after that, whether it's Takanori Gomi, George Sotiropoulos, Ben Henderson, Nate Diaz, or even BJ Penn... it doesn't matter (fuck, Joe Lauzon would beat either of these chumps). So, that's at least one thing we have to look forward to.

 

[Tha Wolfpac]

Frankie, Maynard they are indeed excellent fighters. But they are dull and generic, they're like created fighters in UFC Undisputed 2010. Some fighters create a presence and sell themselves but these guys i just dont know, they dont have anything to make me want to watch them and destroy each other.