Does Vince McMahon have as much control over the WWE as he used to?

[It's...Baylariat!]

I ask this for numerous reasons. From the errors from Michael Cole and Jerry Lawler to the wrestlers being animated when something doesn't go right and doing that in front of the cameras. It seems as if Vince has lost some of the control he's had backstage.

With the influx of newer wrestlers being near the main event and guys like Sheamus and McIntyre being champions, it seems to me that Vince is being more influenced from outside sources than he used to be. Or he's just passive about what goes on his shows. So is there any merit to this argument? Is Vince losing his control over the WWE bit by bit, or his Vince simply being more open minded about his product?

 

[The Doctor]

I don't really get how Randy Orton having a bad attitude or Cole being an idiot has anything to do with Vince McMahon's control of the WWE. Perhaps it's because I'm a newer fan and therefore do not understand all the small nuances yet.

I believe Cole and King messing up is a combination of the people behind the headset (It is said to be McMahon himself though I'm sure someone helps) and their own memories failing them.

For Randy Orton blowing up at Kofi or Ted or whoever, that's just a wrestler being unprofessional instead of trying his best to move along, finish the match, and forget about it.

And as for the new champions, it's an admirable attempt to build new stars who will carry the company in the future. I doubt Vince ever said backstage to lock everyone in their spots and not let anyone move up. In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, he once blew up at creative and asked why new stars weren't being built.

Maybe Vince has less control over WWE, but I don't think those are really the ways to tell.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

I don't really get how Randy Orton having a bad attitude or Cole being an idiot has anything to do with Vince McMahon's control of the WWE. Perhaps it's because I'm a newer fan and therefore do not understand all the small nuances yet.

There you go. See back in the day, outbursts like that would result in at least a suspension or possible firing. Orton's not above reproach, and his actions going unpunished the next week show me that Vince has loosened up quite a bit. Or he's simply letting things go that he normally wouldn't have.

I believe Cole and King messing up is a combination of the people behind the headset (It is said to be McMahon himself though I'm sure someone helps) and their own memories failing them.

They don't get fed EVERY line. Some they have to come up with as the action goes along. Spoiling an ending by simply not being able to think for yourself is something I find funny. Cole's never been good and this shows. He may go down as the worst commentator in wrestling history. No passion, nothing. When Vince has to tell you EVERY line, you've got a problem. And that botch is on Cole. Think for yourself every once in a while.

For Randy Orton blowing up at Kofi or Ted or whoever, that's just a wrestler being unprofessional instead of trying his best to move along, finish the match, and forget about it.

NO, that's breaking the fourth wall. And that's grounds for being suspended back in the day. Vince has loosened up and to me, this is the tell tale sign of that. No way should anyone not be punished for breaking kayfabe live. Even if it's entertainment, doing that looks real stupid and unprofessional as you said.

And as for the new champions, it's an admirable attempt to build new stars who will carry the company in the future. I doubt Vince ever said backstage to lock everyone in their spots and not let anyone move up. In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, he once blew up at creative and asked why new stars weren't being built.

True, but the stars that are being built aren't who Vince would envision. Swagger, Morrision, and Miz are people in Vince's image, and other than Miz, have gone to the wayside. Sheamus and McIntyre are products of HHH's influence on Vince. Which is what I think we're seeing on Raw. More HHH and less Vince.

Maybe Vince has less control over WWE, but I don't think those are really the ways to tell.

Oh there are other signs. The guest host concept is a lazy way of not having another GM character to have to write for. Plus the hot/cold concept with certain wrestlers isn't a Vince thing. Henry was getting a great response from the crowd. Then all of a sudden, he's jobbing now. It's silly. Swagger, MVP, and others are products of Vince or the writing team not focusing on building them up. It's a simple case of not caring as much about the product as a whole, and only worrying about a few pieces in the puzzle.

 

[The Doctor]

OK, now that you've explained it a little, I kind of agree with you. I'm sure there is a lot of backstage influence from wrestlers like Triple H, The Undertaker, and Shawn Michaels, wrestlers who are veterans and have been around the block. I'm also sure that main event guys have some influence. They're the top of the company, after all, and people who draw may have some ideas on what or who will also draw.

Plus, ever since Vince explained that it was all staged, there has been less of a need for kayfabe. Whether this is good or bad is another topic (One that I'm sure you've already made). Heck, they even incorporate some real-life signs into kayfabe, like the "X" that referees throw up when a wrestler is legitimately hurt.

On top of all that, Vince is getting old. He probably acknowledges the fact that he may not know exactly what's best and is therefore more open to suggestions, especially ones from his son-in-law. I'm not trying to bring up the fact that Triple H is "sleeping with the boss' daughter" in a negative way, just that he is a veteran, a top draw, AND a family member, and so has three things that would make a guy sit down and listen.

The guest host concept is because of executive and network meddling, and a cheap way to get ratings.

I'm not so sure Sheamus is all that different from Vince's idea of a champion. He's really big. When I saw him live I was taken aback. And Henry was only getting a great response when he squashed Orton. After a few shows, his pops sadly died down. Shame, too, because I wouldn't have minded seeing him pushed.

As for Randy Orton not getting suspended...would YOU suspend one of your top guys for having an emotional outburst that could be explained as his character?

 

[Greenlight13]

I don't think it's a case of him LOSING control, because WWE is his personal empire and he'll fire every last employee before someone takes power from him. It's possible that he's intentionally laying off a little because he's getting on a bit. Or maybe it's possible he isn't the horrific stubborn demon he's painted as. Maybe it's possible that Cole and Lawler are a horrible combination and even screaming in their ears doesn't help. Maybe he recognises that we need new stars and is creating them in the same way that he created the current crop.

I personally don't think the most successful figure in the history of wrestling actually has no clue what's good for business, so the new talent is in fact his idea and the errors are just down to the announcers themselves.

 

[classicviolence]

From what I read of WWE and the inner workings is that Vince has a Nazi type control over the company. Everything from what the announcers say, wrestler promos and pushes and TV sketches he has his hands in.

Vince is known to be a pain on creative and known for being very narrow minded when he has an idea of what he wants to see. (Example ECW December to Dismember)

Sure HBK and HHH have influence and Vince occasionally listens to them (EX. HBK DVD where Vince confirms this) It is all up to if Vince sees and idea of being beneficial to him and his pockets.

Shane is said to be more like Vince in this regard doing things rashly and being narrow minded on certain issues, where as Steph is more docile and rational about things.

 

[Dan E. Inferno]

Sheamus and McIntyre are products of HHH's influence on Vince. Which is what I think we're seeing on Raw. More HHH and less Vince.

I think you've sort of hit the nail on the head with this comment. I think Vince still has as much control as he wants on the WWE, but he is allowing more ideas from other people. It could be that he is being more open minded about the product or it could be a case that HHH is making himself heard more. It's not just HHH I'm sure but also Shawn Michaels, Undertaker and even Randy Orton. My reasoning behind this is simply things I have read on this website and various others, so it depends what you read and what you choose to believe.

Apparantly, when the Santina thing was going on last year, HHH and HBK were annoyed but the stupid and mostly unfunny skits and were trying to do something about it. I'm not saying they're the reason for the end of that gimmick, but they could have had something to do with it. Also, there were rumours of Orton having some part in Kennedy's firing and it's believed that McCool's push was down to the Undertaker. My point being that the wrestlers themselves seem to be having an influence in the control of the business. I know wrestlers have always had this influence, for example, HHH has for many years, but perhaps it's becoming more relevant and happening more often. I don't think this is Vince losing control though, this is him just listening to ideas and ultimately doing what HE wants.

One point where his control could be questioned is incidents like Orton/Kofi where the fourth wall seems to come down and I believe this is a case of Vince having the disadvantage in terms of leverage. Vince needs Orton on TV so Orton will not be punished whereas a talent lower down the food chain would have been. Once again, this isn't necessarily Vince losing control as surely he has always been more leniant to his bigger stars.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

the reality is that Vince does not have full control of WWE anymore... its a publicly traded company... so he now has to answer to others. In the past it was Vince's cash only on the line, thus he had a lot more say... Add to that the shareholders would not like to hear stories of corporate bullying of the like that came out in the 90's in WWE... so Vince arguably has had to mellow out somewhat...

Another part of it is that he clearly now feels Stephanie can do a lot of what he used to have to, he has a good team of trusted agents who have all been "through the system". with guys like DiBiase, Arn, Steamboat all putting your matches together and Steph running the creative end... he doesn't need such an iron grip.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

the reality is that Vince does not have full control of WWE anymore... its a publicly traded company... so he now has to answer to others.

Well yes and no. Vince, Linda, and Stephanie hold 70% of the company's economic interest and approximately 96% of the voting power. Shane used to have stock in the company and I'm not sure what's happened there. Maybe he cashed it in? While the WWE is a publicly traded company, the McMahon family owns most of the WWE shares and has virtually all the voting power. So, when it all boils down to it, Vince probably still has near ultimate control over the WWE. So, potentially anybody can own a piece of the WWE but the McMahons have control ultimately over which direction the company goes in.

As to the subject at hand, it's possible that Vince is loosening up his iron fist a little bit. Stranger things have happened I suppose. Vince is doing some things that he probably would not have done in the past. For instance, Vince has cut a couple of promos on Raw with aspects of a shoot directed towards the IWC. The first one he ranted about how fans wanted it all, they wanted younger, faster, stronger, and so on and so forth and still complained no matter what. He did another one that Sidious started a thread about a week or two after the first one in which he also kind of shot down the IWC without directly referencing them. A few years ago, Vince probably wouldn't have done that.

 

[Davi323]

"Back in the day", there weren't internet smarks reporting on everything that happens...you didn't know anything other than what they deliberately wanted you to know. "Back in the day", you didn't know if some wrestler blew up at another wrestler backstage, because there wasn't someone hanging around quickly emailing it to some wrestling news site.

 

[Wald]

If anything I'd say he has more control than ever before

The main problem we all point out with new wrestlers is that everything is scripted for them so they don't get to show their own personality. Couple that with Vince's big man preference and in ten years the WWE will be filled with people he trained and controlled 100%.

As for Orton blowing up, well he just has a bad attitude. Mickie James doing likewise to Gail Kim was a symptom of James' disillusionment with her own career at this point if you ask me.

Cole and Lawler have been steadily getting worse for years, having someone berate them over their headset during a live show has probably left them a bag of nerves so that's where the mistakes come from

 

[Jeffingb3oh3]

There is only one real way to take a look at this.

Vince is aging, and with aging comes a time where you're mentality is not the same. The way you think isn't the same. Vince will always have a say in what goes on in the WWE. Since, it is his product, bar none. I honestly think that he is having people that he knows will help make his company be as successful as it has been for all these years help him out on making the final decisions with things though. But, there are only three people that will forever hold any kind of signifigant power, and that's Triple H, Shawn Michaels, and Vince himself.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

Like a couple others said, I would argue that Vince now has more control than ever before. And the problem is that when someone gets older in their life, they feel they are losing control over things. Vince has always been a control freak, and with him getting older, I can put myself in his mind and can forsee him with the business changing, he feels he is losing control of it, when in the past, he always was able to maintain that control.

Hence, you see him lashing out at Internet fans, having reports of very erratic behavior backstage while constantly changing his mind, feeding lines to all of his commentators to make sure they say everything he dictates, approving every single script of every single show each and every week, etc.

The man won't give his daughter any authority over Creative Writing, because he is the one who must be the one to control it all.

And that is another reason why Vince is so obsessed with his appearance and physique, because the bigger and stronger he is, the more he feels he has control. And obviously that stems from his childhood with his abusive step-father.

I feel he has more control over the WWE then he ever has before, despite the ever-changing environment, and unfortunately, I don't think that is necessarily a good thing.