Does The Ultimate Fighter cheapen MMA?

[Father:_Polley]

Given the very limited amount of MMA I actually pay attention to, I'm more interested in knowing peoples feelings on this who are into it in a big way.

In my view, TUF is a little bit of a cheap gimmick on the part of UFC, as it introduces MMA in a way that draws in the reality television obsession that seems to be taking over.

Yes, the fights are real, but the winner is luring in casual fans to follow their favourite in future UFC PPVs.

Add to that, how much good do the guys who win really do. I know the likes of Serra, Bispeng and Griffen are big names in MMA, but really what have the others done? And is reality television the best way to find a future MMA legend?

Discuss

 

[jmt225]

Well, in my opinion, MMA is as popular as it is today because of The Ultimate Fighter. Don't get me wrong, with or without the show, the UFC would still be doing good business, but not nearly as good as they're currently doing I don’t think.

Dana White has said time and time again the Forrest Griffin/Stephan Bonner fight from TUF Season 1 finale is the most important fight in MMA history, and I have to agree. It's one of the most exciting fights ever, and MILLIONS of people got calls from friends and family telling them to change the channel to Spike TV and watch this unbelievable fight. That brought UFC to the main stream.

What TUF also does is show the fighters behind the scenes and gives them a good rep. Before the show, MMA was looked down upon because everyone figured all the fighters were nothing but thugs and buffoons, but now... they all get to see these guys as the intelligent, kind people they are. Fighters’ images have been completely revamped because of the show and that's very important for the UFC's success.

Now, with that said, I don't think the show is going to last another three years without some serious changes. However, when TUF is done for, I don’t think people are going to look at it and say, "That was bad for MMA". Because the fact is, business and image wise, it's the best thing that has ever happened to the sport.

 

[footman645]

I watch most of the UFC events except for The Ultimate Fighter. I also can't get past the reality television feel of it. That being said, it is the reason that the UFC is so popular, and the UFC is the reason MMA is so popular. So, if it weren't for The Ultimate Fighter, there would be so few MMA fans that we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

 

[Slim Pickns]

The Ultimate Fighter show brought in a whole new demographic of fan to the sport. For that, I loved the show. However, the way the show has gone since then is what pisses me off.

Its advertised as nothing more than street brawls and bloodfests in an attempt to get moronic people to tune in every week then spend $40.00 on an overhyped PPV featuring these subpar fighters. The UFC will use a whole season to hype up a PPV, it will receive decent buys, but the idiot fans will not continue to buy until the next show. For that, I think they need to go back to the drawing board on this one.

Matt Serra was successful before the show (the season he was on was The Comeback, where UFC veterans competed for a title shot), but other than Griffin, all who have tried have failed against top competition. The worst part is that Dana White and Joe Silva will protect their investment and cheapen a legit sport by giving them shit opponents to beat on. Compare this to if the MLB and Bud Selig gave the Red Sox and Yankees the easiest schedules and playoff runs just because they are the biggest markets.

 

[jmt225]

Matt Serra was successful before the show (the season he was on was The Comeback, where UFC veterans competed for a title shot), but other than Griffin, all who have tried have failed against top competition. The worst part is that Dana White and Joe Silva will protect their investment and cheapen a legit sport by giving them shit opponents to beat on.

Hmmm.. not sure how much I agree with this. Rashad Evans has fought against some tough guys and looked well. Not to mention he's fighting Liddell very soon. Jardine has already beaten Liddell, and also holds a win over Griffin. Diego Sanchez has done great since the show, disregarding two fights where he had very liable excuses for his bad performances. Kenny Florian is doing great. Leben is alright. Bisping I'm sure will continue doing well in the Middleweight Division. Matt Hamill, I strongly believe has a successful future. I have much faith that Nate Diaz will be the Lightweight Champion some day. Matt Danzig has been very impressive so far and has a big fight against Clay Guida coming up, which has the potential to be a Fight of the Year Candidate. And Amir and CB Dollaway both look to be the real deal.

The Ultimate Fighter thus far has brought us some great and very entertaining fighters. Like I said in my first post, I'm not sure how long that will last, but I don't have a problem with how Dana and Co. have handle the show and fighters at this point.

 

[tfs706]

I was never into MMA really i watched some of the original PPVs when i was high school and thought it was cool but never really got into it until season 7 of the Ultimate Fighter

To me i felt like i could watch fights on the internet and it would be the same thing to me because i dont know anything about these people so i have no invested interest

TUF gave me some character development and allowed me to find people i liked and people i didnt so then i watch the PPV or Spike TV event for the guys i know fight and learn more about other guys i dont know

So TUF was kind of my gateway drug to the MMA world

 

[klunderbunker]

Without being a fan of MMA, I would say that it does. MMA consists of basically the toughest best fighters in the world. The thing is, would they have gotten the exposure, the training, the facilities or anything else without this show? Difficult to say. These people may never have gotten a shot at a tryout before, but because of the show they can. It was part of the problem I had with Tough ENough. Guys like Miz who had never wrestled before got onto the show and are now in WWE. Wrestlers that work their whole lives with the dream of being on Raw can't make it because they didn't get lucky. Its the same principle here. I think it does cheapen it a bit yes.

 

[Kasey]

I'm kind of torn on this. Yes, they've "discovered" some decent talent on TUF. But for every Forrest Griffin, there is a Lodune Sincaid. I do think that the concept has been bled to death, though. As of late...I can't fucking stand it because whichever two guys are coaching are removed from competition and their respective division (and more importantly it's belt) are held hostage until the completion of the fucking show. That irritates me to high heaven.

I wanted to see Nogueira defend his title against anyone (least of all Frank Mir's out of shape ass) in September...but instead it'll be near the end of the year before Minotauro fights (or even early next year...hoo-fucking-ray!). Same scenario with Griffin/Rampage. 10 months off? Are you fucking kidding me? There should be three defenses per year or a title should be stripped from someone. I'm not saying that each fighter should be worked to death...but Dana and Joe like to spread shit out WAY too long so as not to impede the programming schedule. Meh.

Also, as much as people will advocate that the show has helped the image of fighters...THAT'S BULLSHIT. The show is geared to cause stir-crazy behavior and shithead antics that always make the air. They're all locked in a house for eight weeks without any sort of entertainment except to train and get on each other's nerves. This way, they become restless and in some cases brawl illegally (Marlon Sims?), play pranks (Koscheck and Bobby Southworth), kick holes in doors (Leben), roll around like a monkey (Griffin), cause a scene at a casino revealing a serious alcohol problem (Jesse Taylor), or even shit in their roomies' toilet tank (Koppenhaver). Then Dana gets to come in and give a stern lecture like some righteous parent when he's the one pulling the strings that makes these guys go nuts and act like shitheads in the first place.

Lately, the show has become more of a fucking hindrance than a help. The ratings it gets (even for new episodes) don't validate it's existence or the problems in the UFC's divisions, rankings, and title matchups that it inevitably causes.

 

[Y 2 Jake]

While I could argue more negatives for the show than positives. I can say that TUF at least gives non-hardcore fans a couple of names that they know on the undercard. As your casual fan to name the best pound for pound fighter in the world, or somebody off The Ultimate Fighter. The answer wouldn't be Fedor Emelianenko. So long as they aren't pushed beyone their ability, and are nothing more than filler I see them as a great addition to the roster. It's when you get main events like Bisping vs. Legen that you should be pissed.

 

[Slim Pickns]

Hmmm.. not sure how much I agree with this. Rashad Evans has fought against some tough guys and looked well. Not to mention he's fighting Liddell very soon. Jardine has already beaten Liddell, and also holds a win over Griffin. Diego Sanchez has done great since the show, disregarding two fights where he had very liable excuses for his bad performances. Kenny Florian is doing great. Leben is alright. Bisping I'm sure will continue doing well in the Middleweight Division. Matt Hamill, I strongly believe has a successful future. I have much faith that Nate Diaz will be the Lightweight Champion some day. Matt Danzig has been very impressive so far and has a big fight against Clay Guida coming up, which has the potential to be a Fight of the Year Candidate. And Amir and CB Dollaway both look to be the real deal.

The Ultimate Fighter thus far has brought us some great and very entertaining fighters. Like I said in my first post, I'm not sure how long that will last, but I don't have a problem with how Dana and Co. have handle the show and fighters at this point.

Everything you said is true, but doesn't prove me wrong. I said all have failed against top competition. Rashad had a draw with Tito where he was lucky Tito broke a rule and got a point deducted or he would have easily lost by decision. Bisping lost to Evans and should have lost to Hammil. I'll give you the Jardine one since he decisively beat Chuck, though his quick loss to Houston Alexander cancels that out. The rest of the guys you brought up haven't even faced anyone near the top of their divisions.

 

[jmt225]

It was part of the problem I had with Tough ENough. Guys like Miz who had never wrestled before got onto the show and are now in WWE. Wrestlers that work their whole lives with the dream of being on Raw can't make it because they didn't get lucky. Its the same principle here. I think it does cheapen it a bit yes.

Miz wrestled on the indies well before he tried out for Tough Enough.

Also, I wasn't a huge fan of Tough Enough either, but if it wasn't for that show, John Morrison probably would've never made his way into the company. That alone makes the show a success, in my opinion. Also, Miz is pretty awesome as well and if it weren't for his unfortunate cancer, Matt Cappotelli I strongly believe would've been great, too. While Tough Enough wasn't very satisfying to watch, it did give us some great wrestlers to watch, just like The Ultimate Fighters gives us great Mix Martial Artists to watch.

The rest of the guys you brought up haven't even faced anyone near the top of their divisions.

That's not true, man. Bisping and Evans, you have valid points about. However, Kenny Florian just beat Roger Huerta, who was in line for a title shot most likely had he won that fight. And also, Diego Sanchez has victories over Nick Diaz and Karo Parisyan, both very good fighters.

Moreover, Nate Diaz and Mac Danzig haven't had their shots yet, but they will eventually and once they do, I don't think they'll be a disappointment. Both are the real deal, in my opinion. And like I said in my second post, I really think Amir and Dollaway have bright futures as well. We'll just have to wait and see, but you have to admit that it's fun following these guys we get to know so well because of the show. You don't usually get those kinds of opportunities with most fighters. They’re just there with a two minute description of their journey to the octagon. But with these guys, we get to witness their journey first hand and it makes for great television.