Cena Region, East Rutherford Subregion, Second Round: (7) DDP vs. (10) Jerry Lawler

[klunderbunker]

This is a second round match in the Cena Region, East Rutherford Subregion. It is a standard one on one match. It will be held at the Continental Airlines Arena, East Rutherford, New Jersey.

#7. Diamond Dallas Page


Vs.

#10. Jerry Lawler


​

Polls will be open for three days following a one day period for discussion. Voting will be based on who you feel is the greater of the two competitors. Post your reasons for why your pick should win below. Remember that this is non-spam and the most votes in the poll win. Any ties will be broken by the amount of posts of support for each candidate, with one vote per poster.


Also remember that this is a non-spam forum. If you post a response without giving a reason for your selection, it will be penalized for spam and deleted.

 

[Tastycles]

I'm going to go with DDP. Lawler was a fantastic regional star, but DDP was able to make it as a national star against all the odds. A main event player who reached that level when every big money star was hogging the limelight is not something to be ignored.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

I'm going to go with DDP. Lawler was a fantastic regional star, but DDP was able to make it as a national star against all the odds. A main event player who reached that level when every big money star was hogging the limelight is not something to be ignored.

DDP went the hard route to the top but this raises a question; He was part of a company that was national to begin with, so if he goes over, he is a national star. While Lawler was doing broadways every week...EVERY FUCKING WEEK! For years may I add. But in Memphis.

If the roles are reversed, I think Lawler would have reached stardom much greater than DDP's. Lawler was honestly that good.

 

[OYDK]

Frig it, I don't want to vote for Lawler and I was a legit DDP mark growing up, I'm going with straight emotion here. Sorry guys, weak argument I know.

 

[NSL]

I'm going to go with DDP. Lawler was a fantastic regional star, but DDP was able to make it as a national star against all the odds. A main event player who reached that level when every big money star was hogging the limelight is not something to be ignored.

I came in here, knowing I was voting for DDP, and thinking I had an uphill battle ahead of me, and then I see posts like this, and my faith in humanity is restored.

I said it last round: Lawler was HUGE. In Memphis. Yes, he made it to the national stage, but with Andy Kaufman. When he got to WWE, he just wasn't the same. DDP managed to shatter the glass ceiling, and did it at an age where most guys are starting to wind down and put younger guys over.

This would be an excellent match, I think, but DDP wins.

 

[stingray11214]

Look, Page's career was a flash in the pan. Sure, he won the WCW World strap 3 times for a rip roaring total of 28 days. He even lost the belt to David Arquette for Christ's sake! Lawler faced a celebrity as well. And he piledrived Andy Kaufman into the floor. Beat the shit out of him in a legit match as well.

Say what you want about all the lives Page has saved, and it is not only commendable, but laudable as well. However, Lawler was a very solid worker. Unlike Page, Lawler has been a top man EVERYWHERE he went. He won the AWA World strap, The CWA (When that promotion was worth something) World strap, and the USWA Strap so many times that people lost count.

Yes, Page was always in the National companies. But, in how many was he "the man"? If this is what this is about, Lawler should be destroying DDP. As much as DDP is respected in the Wrestling community for all he has done, his accomplishments within the squared circle are Liliputian as compared to Lawler's.

All hail the King! All Hail the King! All Hail the King! Vote for Jerry Lawler.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

You know what, fuck it! Self Hi Five! Battle of Two Faces, in WCW. Lawler comes in as the King of Memphis not the bumbling horny middle aged color guy, DDP in all his mullet glory.

Great match, Lawler bleeds, mounts a comeback goes up for the turnbuckle Punch,

BANG!

1 2 3 DDP.

 

[SD619]

I understand why people would want to vote for DDP. I would probably lean towards DDP if this was a one-off match. But as a match in the middle of a tournament, I have to go for the heel (especially considering that the winner of this match faces Bret/Misawa).

The heel defeats the popular guy, gloats about it, gets the crowd riled up, loses to the bigger baby-face. The crowd gets their moment.

Vote Jerry "The King" Lawler.

 

[NSL]

I'm kind of surprised to see Lawler with the edge here. If you could afford one ticket, to one show, and you had to choose between a show headlined by DDP, or a show headlined Lawler...You're telling me you'd pick the Lawler show?

I'd much rather go to the show where the crowd is alive, the match is energetic, and you know you're going to get an exciting match. I'll be the first to admit that Lawler was a great heel, but his matches were all about stalling and hitting the piledriver. I'm personally much more interested in the exciting match with the out-of-nowhere Diamond Cutter.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

DDP isn't half the performer Lawler is, he's not half the draw Lawler is, he's not half the anything Lawler is. I don't hate DDP but let's be honest here what has DDP done that can even come close to what Lawler has accomplished in his career? Yeah that's what I thought too.

DDP is alright, he had a killer feud with Savage, he was a good #3 guy in the fight against the nWo but that's not enough to take down a guy who carried a promotion on his back for years on end. Most of DDP's highlights came when WCW was in the toilet (or at least going down the drain) and he doesn't have enough substance as a performer to win this.

 

[Khalifa]

I'm kind of surprised to see Lawler with the edge here. If you could afford one ticket, to one show, and you had to choose between a show headlined by DDP, or a show headlined Lawler...You're telling me you'd pick the Lawler show?

That's interesting. I would definitely would rather see Page, mainly because he is one of the best faces from WCW. In the end though I have gone with Lawler based on his in ring skills. DDP isn't bad in the ring but he has a CM Punk thing going were all his moves just look weak. Lawler looked menacing in every promotion he went to. I think if he wasn't a commentator we would have much more respect for Lawler as a wrestler. Not that we (everyone) don't now but we would have more.

Also this might sound stupid but he is still rocking up to Memphis Grizzly games and getting the crowd going there, which just goes to show how much of an impact he has had just there. I know this ain't Memphis but I love what SD619 said that and I could see the heel going over here only to lose to the bigger baby face next.

 

[NSL]

DDP isn't half the performer Lawler is, he's not half the draw Lawler is, he's not half the anything Lawler is. I don't hate DDP but let's be honest here what has DDP done that can even come close to what Lawler has accomplished in his career? Yeah that's what I thought too.

DDP wasn't a draw? So, WCW getting guest appearances by all those sports guys, Jay Leno, David Arquette...that didn't have anything to do with him? I'm not saying they were all necessarily good angles, or good appearances, but he wasn't the one writing the angles. He was just the name bringing them in.

DDP is alright, he had a killer feud with Savage, he was a good #3 guy in the fight against the nWo but that's not enough to take down a guy who carried a promotion on his back for years on end. Most of DDP's highlights came when WCW was in the toilet (or at least going down the drain) and he doesn't have enough substance as a performer to win this.

#3? Behind Goldberg and..........who? And it's not like being the 2nd guy behind Goldberg was such a bad thing, since he was hotter than any wrestler in the era not named Stone Cold. And I'd argue that DDP's highlights came before the company went in the toilet, because he was hardly a featured guy once Nash and then Russo took over booking in late '98 until the end.

 

[NSL]

DDP isn't bad in the ring but he has a CM Punk thing going were all his moves just look weak.

Weaker than a falling punch off the second rope? A move that worked for Lawler, and no one else since?

And no matter how "weak" their base offense looks, the GTS and Diamond Cutter are both solid moves, and I can't remember many instances where it took more than one Diamond Cutter to end a match.

 

[Khalifa]

Weaker than a falling punch off the second rope? A move that worked for Lawler, and no one else since?

And no matter how "weak" their base offense looks, the GTS and Diamond Cutter are both solid moves, and I can't remember many instances where it took more than one Diamond Cutter to end a match.

Yeah true. The Diamond Cutter and GTS are good moves, but their punches, clothes lines etc is just something a have a bit of a pet hate against. I really like DDP. He was one of my favorites from WCW but I just can't vote for him as his WWE run was nothing to brag about and his WCW run was very short. Well not that short but nothing really happened till about 94. I will admit as well his work wasn't nearly as good during WCWs dying days as it was before the 2000's. All that is probably attributed to booking and the idiots that owned WCW but still I can only say what I saw.

I honestly don't care who wins this match and both have a good argument. I just have The King edging out DDP.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

DDP wasn't a draw? So, WCW getting guest appearances by all those sports guys, Jay Leno, David Arquette...that didn't have anything to do with him? I'm not saying they were all necessarily good angles, or good appearances, but he wasn't the one writing the angles. He was just the name bringing them in.

Was he the draw Jerry Lawler was? That's the point! I never said he's not a draw I said he's not half the draw Lawler was and that's absolutely true, he wasn't. Andy Kaufman was a bigger deal than David Arquette was and the other 2 guys Hogan was involved, so was Dennis Rodman which is the reason DDP brought The Mailman in the first place. DDP has admitted he brought Malone in for that reason as he was friends with him. As for Leno, do you think Jay Leno would've worked with DDP if Hogan wasn't involved? Conversely if Leno worked with Goldberg or Sting instead of DDP do you think he would've had a problem with it? Of course not because of how big a name Hogan is.

#3? Behind Goldberg and..........who? And it's not like being the 2nd guy behind Goldberg was such a bad thing, since he was hotter than any wrestler in the era not named Stone Cold. And I'd argue that DDP's highlights came before the company went in the toilet, because he was hardly a featured guy once Nash and then Russo took over booking in late '98 until the end.

Nash and Sting is a good place to start but it really doesn't matter, even if he was #2 he wasn't #1 for years on end like Lawler was and when he did become a top face it was long after WCW's heyday. At the end of the day it's not about if DDP was good, it's about if he's better than Lawler, which he isn't.

 

[NSL]

He was one of my favorites from WCW but I just can't vote for him as his WWE run was nothing to brag about and his WCW run was very short. Well not that short but nothing really happened till about 94. I will admit as well his work wasn't nearly as good during WCWs dying days as it was before the 2000's. All that is probably attributed to booking and the idiots that owned WCW but still I can only say what I saw.

I'll admit his WWE run could have been done better, but he did get to work a program with The Undertaker, so it's not like it was a total loss on his end.

And WCW closed up shop in March '01. The dying days were the 2000s. He was a main guy for over 2 years before that. There was a time when the only people not affiliated with some form of the nWo were Goldberg and DDP. It's not a coincidence that he was one of the two chosen to stand alone.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

Voting is close, so I will throw my support behind Lawler. All those cool things that NSL mentioned DDP doing by drawing in celebrities, Lawler did is first with Kaufman.

You can say Lawler was only a draw in the bubble of Memphis, but Memphis was a huge wrestling town in its prime. And Lawler beat everyone that came to Memphis. His moveset may have been limited, but it was effective, and on the mic he definitely had the gift of gab, and to me that trumps beating second rate player in WCW's dying days.

Come at me NSL.

 

[nightmare]

Lawler was definitely the bigger star. DDP had his time to shine & while it was good while WCW was on fire, it was nothing compared to what Lawler meant in Memphis during the promotions heyday. He was the man & for longer than DDP. See Page was never really considered to be the #1 star regardless of face or heel alignment. Hogan, Hall, Nash, Flair, Sting, Savage & Goldberg in my opinion were all more over during that time than Page was. So, DDP cannot really be thought of to have the same status as Lawler did.


Give the man credit for being pretty good & having an awesome move, but he was not on the same level. Lawler is so popular in Memphis that the hierarchy of fame there goes Elvis 1, Lawler 2. Jerry has become a joke over time due to his terrible jokes on commentary & various personal issues, but that should not discredit how badass he was in his day.


Vote for Page if you like him better, or because the Diamond Cutter is a better move, but dont lie to yourself by saying he was more popular than Lawler. Just isnt true. Jerry should win this.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

I'm kind of surprised to see Lawler with the edge here. If you could afford one ticket, to one show, and you had to choose between a show headlined by DDP, or a show headlined Lawler...You're telling me you'd pick the Lawler show?

I'd much rather go to the show where the crowd is alive, the match is energetic, and you know you're going to get an exciting match. I'll be the first to admit that Lawler was a great heel, but his matches were all about stalling and hitting the piledriver. I'm personally much more interested in the exciting match with the out-of-nowhere Diamond Cutter.

I'd buy the ticket to see Lawler every single time.

You're selling Lawler far short if you say that his matches weren't exciting. The guy was THE star of the same region for decades. It never got old too. Not too many people are capable of doing that, or ever accomplished that. And you don't do that by not being able to generate 'excitement'.

Sure Lawler matches didn't have out-of-nowhere Diamond Cutters. They just had to get by with suspense, drama, excellent story telling, mayhem, highs that left the viewer on cloud 9, and lows that felt like the pits of despair.

Apparently that wasn't for everyone.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Does anyone but me remember that year that Daniel Bryan almost went over Lawler in the first round of this tournament? Lawler only won by one point and that was before Bryan's major run. It was even before Bryan beat Cena at Summer Slam. Now some of you same people are saying that DDP would lose to Lawler? I love this tournament.

I'm going with DDP. I know how over the King was, in Memphis! Seriously, that's it. He was majorly over in Memphis. Sure he had somewhat successful runs in other places, but they were all regional places.

DDP, on the other hand, was able to make it to the top with people like Sting, Hogan, Flair, Nash, Hall, Hart, Goldberg, Luger, etc on the card and at an older age no less. DDP worked his ass off and became one of WCWs biggest stars on a roster full of stars. If we take late 90s/early 00s DDP and put him up against 70s/80s Lawler, I'm confident DDP would go over.

Vote DDP.

 

[tdmoon]

I'm seeing a lot of people dismissing Lawler because of Memphis. It isn't like he was over only in one city; the CWA was based in Tennessee but was very popular in Kentucky, Indiana, and Arkansas as well. This was a thriving territory that had a loyal and large fan base for decades and featured some of the best wrestlers in the world. If you are going to downplay his accomplishments because of the region, you may as well do the same for all of the ECW wrestlers as their territory wasn't much bigger.

Also seeing people assuming he would work as a heel. Lawler does the rulebreaker bit as well as anyone but is also extremely charismatic as a face, which is why people in the area see him as a legend.

Lawler also has a world title to his credit. Before you disregard it because the AWA was in its death throes, consider that he beat Curt Hennig for the title and was a fighting champion, defending the strap in different promotions. Being the title holder also led to a program with Kerry Von Erich, where Lawler was a face in Tennessee and a heel in Texas; a precursor to the highly-regarded Bret Hart angle where he was cheered in Canada and booed in the US.

Lawler isn't the joke you guys have been seeing at the announce table the last several years. Look up some old matches and it will blow you away how massively popular he was in a thriving and innovative territory. The King has beaten nearly everyone who is anyone in the time he has been around-names like Hogan, Savage, Bockwinkel, Andre, Rude, Von Erich, Hennig, Hawk and Animal- and would beat DDP here.

 

[The Brain]

Does anyone but me remember that year that Daniel Bryan almost went over Lawler in the first round of this tournament?

My guess is you are the only one that specifically remembers a first round result from three years ago that has absolutely nothing to do with this match.

I'm going with DDP. I know how over the King was, in Memphis! Seriously, that's it. He was majorly over in Memphis. Sure he had somewhat successful runs in other places, but they were all regional places.

Wrestling was a regional business in Lawler's prime. Most guys were regional in those days. Lawler was one of the most successful ones. He was a Memphis legend that was big enough to unifiy the AWA & WCCW titles.

DDP, on the other hand, was able to make it to the top with people like Sting, Hogan, Flair, Nash, Hall, Hart, Goldberg, Luger, etc on the card and at an older age no less. DDP worked his ass off and became one of WCWs biggest stars on a roster full of stars.

A roster full of stars? Kind of, I guess. All those guys were under contract but by the time DDP won his first world title in 1999 those guys with their guaranteed contracts and creative control didn't bother to show up to work half the time. I don't care if WCW was on national tv every week. In 1999 WCW became so bad I'd say any regional title Lawler held was at least as important as the WCW title was. Even then Page only managed to hold it for 29 days spread out over three reigns.

DDP had a nice career and deserves credit for his significant improvement so late in his career. Really though he only had two or three good years to the two or three good decades Lawler had.

 

[Bernkastel]

Jerry Lawler may have been largely a regional star, but he was still far more popular and achieved way more than DDP ever did. An innovator of the early hardcore style and whose matches emphasized the entertainment value of pro wrestling, a man that became nationally recognized thanks to his feud with Andy Kaufman, is not losing to a man that once played the Undertaker's wife stalker.

Vote Jerry Lawler.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

My guess is you are the only one that specifically remembers a first round result from three years ago that has absolutely nothing to do with this match.



Wrestling was a regional business in Lawler's prime. Most guys were regional in those days. Lawler was one of the most successful ones. He was a Memphis legend that was big enough to unifiy the AWA & WCCW titles.



A roster full of stars? Kind of, I guess. All those guys were under contract but by the time DDP won his first world title in 1999 those guys with their guaranteed contracts and creative control didn't bother to show up to work half the time. I don't care if WCW was on national tv every week. In 1999 WCW became so bad I'd say any regional title Lawler held was at least as important as the WCW title was. Even then Page only managed to hold it for 29 days spread out over three reigns.

DDP had a nice career and deserves credit for his significant improvement so late in his career. Really though he only had two or three good years to the two or three good decades Lawler had.

So much this.

Between 96-98 DDP was actually very good. I won't take anything away from that.

But between about 75-90, Lawler was amazingly good. Like seriously, near best in the business, so good that everyone went out of their way to get the chance to work with him good.

It's actually a little unfortunate that most fans nowadays remember him as a wrestler most from his WWF run. He was in his mid-40's by the time he showed up in the WWF, and was past his prime.

Still that should say something. A middle aged, past his prime Lawler still worked one of the most memorable programs of that year with Bret Hart. That should give those who weren't privileged enough to have witnessed him in his prime an idea of how good he actually was at his peak.

There are some similarities between these guys ironically enough. I remember when the DDP/Savage feud won feud of the year in PWI, and being surprised by that at first. It wasn't the highest profile feud, but the intensity was off the charts, and both men did an amazing job with it. The first thing I remember thinking of, is this is like Lawler and Jarrett versus the Moondogs winning feud of the year. Or Lawler versus Idol and Rich. Feuds that didn't have the highest profiles, but were just so much better than anything else around.

Then there's the fact that DDP was the go to face for WCW whenever they had a celebrity that needed a partner. And of course, the fact that Lawler did the celebrity thing with Kaufman years before it became the thing to do (and still did it better than anyone since imo... seriously, go watch Kaufman/Lawler on Youtube. Now!)

The similarities make this an interesting matchup, but at the end of the day, I don't know how anyone can ignore how much more important Lawler was to history, and how much longer he was such an important part of history... unless the only thing they care to know about Lawler is that he got his dentist to wrestle before he remembered he was really the Undertakers brother, and that he used to really love puppies. And if that's the case... I'm sorry. There is SO MUCH you're missing. So much.

 

[SSJPhenom]

My guess is you are the only one that specifically remembers a first round result from three years ago that has absolutely nothing to do with this match.



Wrestling was a regional business in Lawler's prime. Most guys were regional in those days. Lawler was one of the most successful ones. He was a Memphis legend that was big enough to unifiy the AWA & WCCW titles.



A roster full of stars? Kind of, I guess. All those guys were under contract but by the time DDP won his first world title in 1999 those guys with their guaranteed contracts and creative control didn't bother to show up to work half the time. I don't care if WCW was on national tv every week. In 1999 WCW became so bad I'd say any regional title Lawler held was at least as important as the WCW title was. Even then Page only managed to hold it for 29 days spread out over three reigns.

DDP had a nice career and deserves credit for his significant improvement so late in his career. Really though he only had two or three good years to the two or three good decades Lawler had.

Look, I respect Lawler, I really do and I am well versed in wrestling history, I really am, but what has me voting Page is the respect and admiration for him to be able to get over in a time in WCW when new stars just weren't being made. Aside from Goldberg. You're right, DDP won his first title when WCW was on the decline, there's no doubt about that, however, he first got over with the fans while WCW was still kicking WWEs ass with his feud with Savage and who can forget the Tonight Show stuff or the Dennis Rodman/Hogan vs DDP/Malone stuff? I'm saying Page worked his ass off and he made it and he became one of WCWs "big boys" who played. That's why I'm voting for him. DDP was a bigger national star.

Also, the only reason I brought up that match from a previous tournament was because I wanted to see just how subjective the voting really is for this thing. A lot of people arguing against DDP argued against King when he was against Bryan and they're doing the same thing to Graham. It's funny is all. It was the 2013 tournament. I went back and looked.

Anyways, vote DDP.