Can Bray Wyatt have a Hall of Fame career without titles?

[Memory Horizon]

I don't consider myself a history buff. That's your disclaimer.

I look at Bray Wyatt, what he's done and what he wants to do. He wants to end Cena's legacy, he wants to simply destroy Daniel Bryan, he wants to bring down the machine. Alright, cool.

Where do titles factor into this? It doesn't seem like he needs them. It doesn't even seem like he WANTS them. He just wants to watch things burn.

Bray may quit WWE after WrestleMania. He might become permanently injured in 6 months. But, excluding that, can Bray go a 10, 20 year career without ever winning a title, and go without needing them? HBK and Taker didn't need them toward the end of their careers, but they had already held them prior to this.

Can Bray sidestep titles altogether, and simply be Bray Wyatt, the eater of worlds, and just have personal feuds throughout, become good enough to not need the titles to add anything to his character, and call it a career?

Or does he simply need the WWE Title/IC title/Tag Title, simply because that's what the wrestlers aspire to?

 

[L@RISANO]

I don't consider myself a history buff. That's your disclaimer.

I look at Bray Wyatt, what he's done and what he wants to do. He wants to end Cena's legacy, he wants to simply destroy Daniel Bryan, he wants to bring down the machine. Alright, cool.

Where do titles factor into this? It doesn't seem like he needs them. It doesn't even seem like he WANTS them. He just wants to watch things burn.

Bray may quit WWE after WrestleMania. He might become permanently injured in 6 months. But, excluding that, can Bray go a 10, 20 year career without ever winning a title, and go without needing them? HBK and Taker didn't need them toward the end of their careers, but they had already held them prior to this.

Can Bray sidestep titles altogether, and simply be Bray Wyatt, the eater of worlds, and just have personal feuds throughout, become good enough to not need the titles to add anything to his character, and call it a career?

Or does he simply need the WWE Title/IC title/Tag Title, simply because that's what the wrestlers aspire to?

Firstly; Good topic.

To the first question; I think it can be done but only depending on who his rivals are. Obviously Taker hasnt been a Title magnet or in the title scene at all times but he did add value to it when he was.

Similarly Bray will probably have to step into the title scene at some point(Main title), because especially at present, there are very few viable opponents for him to destroy considering that he has beaten DB and iss now facing Cena.
With Punk gone, it leaves Orton and Batista amongst the full timers with the shield and a few other still WIP. Then there is the Few part timers available.

Eventually, perhaps sooner rather than later the Main Event scene will come calling.

As for aspiring to titles...Windham Rotunda probably does I am sure...

 

[MCMG]

It's an interesting question. A wrestler can definitely be in the Hall of Fame without being champ; however, being a World Champ (late WCW aside) means you should automatically be in the HoF.

I can't imagine Bray carrying the title around and I'm not sure it fits his character. It's just a belt and he is above that. I'm sure he will win the title at some point in his career. He has already shown his quality and he can only improve.

Bray can have a Hall of Fame career without winning the big one. Having fantastic matches and feuds as well as continuing his great promos will allow him to stand out. My only question is can he keep this gimmick interesting for an entire career. Another 10-15 years of this is something difficult to envisage.

 

[L@RISANO]

It's an interesting question. A wrestler can definitely be in the Hall of Fame without being champ; however, being a World Champ (late WCW aside) means you should automatically be in the HoF.

I can't imagine Bray carrying the title around and I'm not sure it fits his character. It's just a belt and he is above that. I'm sure he will win the title at some point in his career. He has already shown his quality and he can only improve.

Bray can have a Hall of Fame career without winning the big one. Having fantastic matches and feuds as well as continuing his great promos will allow him to stand out. My only question is can he keep this gimmick interesting for an entire career. Another 10-15 years of this is something difficult to envisage.

Agreed.

I think if he can make this gimmick work and stay relevant in the upper card for 5 years in this current environment, then that will count as a huge achievement, lMO.

 

[Mustang Sally]

While the man who plays Bray Wyatt might earn a spot in the Hall of Fame for the work he does over a career, I don't think the character he's portraying now is going to get it for him, because it's something he can play for only so long.....and no longer.

We've seen Mark Calaway play the Undertaker for over 20 years; that's a gimmick that has staying power because it's relatively easy to stay in character and remain the same forever. We're watching John Cena play.....well, John Cena. It's a long-lasting portrayal because he's playing himself; his ring persona is his own and all he has to do is be him.

I can't see Bray Wyatt being Bray Wyatt for more than a couple of years; it's a gimmick that's here now, but will wear on us after awhile. How long can he stick with it?

As for titles, the entire Bray persona doesn't need them; he wouldn't have any interest in titles. He has his own agenda, a lot of which probably hasn't been revealed to us yet. What is he really after? The guy seems to be ruled by forces incomprehensible to anyone but himself and his two buddies; I'd like to see how they would incorporate these guys holding title belts to lord over the heads of other wrestlers.

No, I don't see titles for Bray, at least not as a goal; maybe he wins a couple in the course of doing business, but he won't hold them for long because they're not what he's about.

And no Hall of Fame, either.....in a few years, the character of Bray Wyatt will be a memory....and Windham Rotunda will hopefully have moved on to other successful gimmicks.

 

[Pedigree1]

Very good points on here.. Bray can absolutely be in the HOF without winning any titles.. Hell Jake the Snake did it,KoKo B Ware of all people did that. That one still boggles my mind. Bray is hell-bent on destroying all the legends right now,any title at this point would be meaningless for him. He is above all that non-sense as titles go.

For the long term though im not too sure if his character will remain fresh enough for him to play long term. It can only if he does one thing IMO.. That is to stay in character even when the cameras are not rolling. Like the undertaker has done for over 20 years. People will and have bought into Bray,and im sure he is constantly in character. SO yes,long term he can be in the HOF without winning any titles.

 

[HBK89Bill]

I get what you guys are saying, but it isn't possible. I realize how unique and different it would be, but really think about it. Imagine this character going from wrestler to wrestler trying to "burn" them over and over again. No titles, only the goals. Unfortunately, no one in the history of the wrestling business could get away with that over a decade or more.

The other thing is we are talking about NO titles ever right? No IC, US, Tag team, or World Champ right? So that means every Rumble, Chamber, Mania, MTIB, etc would never have Wyatt as the man who wins any match of real historical or important value. He'd stay in the same spot for his career and eventually people would grow tired of the gimmick no matter how great he is at it. For example, Johnny Depp has the most popular pirate character ever, but if that was all he did, wouldn't you get tired of him?

 

[Blade]

While the man who plays Bray Wyatt might earn a spot in the Hall of Fame for the work he does over a career, I don't think the character he's portraying now is going to get it for him, because it's something he can play for only so long.....and no longer.

We've seen Mark Calaway play the Undertaker for over 20 years; that's a gimmick that has staying power because it's relatively easy to stay in character and remain the same forever. We're watching John Cena play.....well, John Cena. It's a long-lasting portrayal because he's playing himself; his ring persona is his own and all he has to do is be him.

I can't see Bray Wyatt being Bray Wyatt for more than a couple of years; it's a gimmick that's here now, but will wear on us after awhile. How long can he stick with it?

As for titles, the entire Bray persona doesn't need them; he wouldn't have any interest in titles. He has his own agenda, a lot of which probably hasn't been revealed to us yet. What is he really after? The guy seems to be ruled by forces incomprehensible to anyone but himself and his two buddies; I'd like to see how they would incorporate these guys holding title belts to lord over the heads of other wrestlers.

No, I don't see titles for Bray, at least not as a goal; maybe he wins a couple in the course of doing business, but he won't hold them for long because they're not what he's about.

And no Hall of Fame, either.....in a few years, the character of Bray Wyatt will be a memory....and Windham Rotunda will hopefully have moved on to other successful gimmicks.

I usually agree with you, Sally, but why does Bray Wyatt need to be a temporary gimmick?

I see Wyatt more like Kane than Undertaker. Kane was mysterious, scary, had a backstory that none of us really knew about, but all of us were curious about. There was genuine depth in there, unlike the Undertaker character. And that's the beauty of the Wyatt gimmick, the fact that they've kept the origins of his character so under wraps, means they can get so much mileage out of it. It's a character that can evolve and change to stay fresh.

I mean, was Kane ever supposed to be more than another notch in Undertaker's Wrestlemania belt? I know that the streak wasn't a big deal back then, but plenty of people had been built up just for the Undertaker to take them down. And it seemed at the time like that was Kane's fate, until Kane got over huge. And he stuck around because Glenn Jacobs and WWE helped evolve and change the Kane character. They gave him friends, they let him talk. They created the difficult on again/off again relationship with his brother. They took off his mask, made him the Devil's Favourite Demon, then made him Corporate Kane. Kane was never amazing inside the ring, but Jacobs is so talented at evolving and adapting as he needed to.

And that's why Bray has real longevity. We can see the talent that Rotunda has, and how tapped into the character he is. The character has so much mystery, so much depth that he can change and evolve as he sees fit. He can turn face. He can get turned on by Harper and Rowan. He can start converting other members of the roster. Create a stable. Maybe, one day, Bray Wyatt will be clean shaven, wearing a suit and working for Triple H. Maybe that sounds insane, but wouldn't it have been insane to think Kane would ever wear a suit 15 years ago?

As for the OP, I think it's entirely possible to have a HoF career without ever winning or needing World Titles. I mean, if Undertaker had never won the World Title, would it make him any less deserving of being in the Hall of Fame considering all he's done? You can make an impact and change the world of wrestling without winning World Titles. It's very rare, and very difficult, but not impossible.

 

[Papa Pillman]

While the man who plays Bray Wyatt might earn a spot in the Hall of Fame for the work he does over a career, I don't think the character he's portraying now is going to get it for him, because it's something he can play for only so long.....and no longer.

We've seen Mark Calaway play the Undertaker for over 20 years; that's a gimmick that has staying power because it's relatively easy to stay in character and remain the same forever.

I hear what you're saying here Sally, and its not illogical. But...

Don't you think people said the same things about the Undertaker gimmick in the early days? Do you think people in the early 90s realistically thought they'd be seeing "The Deadman" in 2014?

I remember when Kane debuted. I know it was the same deal. People still clearly remembered Isaac Yankem and Fake Diesel. Everyone thought Kane would be another typical temporary Glenn Jacobs vehicle. A talented guy strapped with another gimmick without staying power. We all saw what happened there.

No gimmick is "destined" to lose steam. The gimmick can last for as long as the performer himself(and to some degree the writers, who can ruin a gimmick with bad booking) can keep it relevant.

This persona is Rotunda's baby. He brings Bray Wyatt to life in a way that is captivating. I trust that he will find ways to mature the character, which could go in so many directions, hell that could even mean the anti-machine and even clouded almost anti-illuminati type messages become clearer and less esoterically presented at times so people can better understand his messages. It could mean that the cult-leader aspects are played up more, Maybe Windham has 50 other ideas for places to go with the character that we could never project. The thing is as long as he embraces the character, which I doubt will ever change; and as long as he can continue to cut compelling promos, which I doubt will ever change; he can take the Bray Wyatt character on for as long as he wants.

What Taker and Kane were able to do is progress and tweak the characters enough to keep them relevant, tread through any periods of staleness, and always eventually steer the gimmick back to something more resembling its roots. I think that Bray Wyatt is a good enough and complex enough character, and the man playing him is a talented and dedicated enough performer, to make the gimmick last in that same fashion. And I hope to be proven right.

 

[FanSince99]

Great post and I have been thinking the same thing since Bray started cutting more promos lately.

I believe he can definitely be in the HOF without many title reigns or memorable ones. As everyone has mentioned is kind of like the Undertaker gimmick, Taker has always been a challenger and around the title picture but to me at least has never had a memorable title run. Taker is remembered for his matches, feuds, and to an extent his mic work.

If Bray an follow a similar path just being a viable title contender and serve as a transitional champion he will defiantly be in the HOF. There is a lot to be done to the Wyatt character, maybe add sister Abigail, take away Rowan and Harper and bring in new guys, bring in someone who has a history with the family that got away. There is just so much that can be done with the character if it gets the opportunity that can make it more exciting than just having a few title reigns.

Again great topic and happy to see so many people actually agree, that means Rotunda is putting in some great work already.

 

[Kidpolean]

I don't consider myself a history buff. That's your disclaimer.

I look at Bray Wyatt, what he's done and what he wants to do. He wants to end Cena's legacy, he wants to simply destroy Daniel Bryan, he wants to bring down the machine. Alright, cool.

Where do titles factor into this? It doesn't seem like he needs them. It doesn't even seem like he WANTS them. He just wants to watch things burn.

Bray may quit WWE after WrestleMania. He might become permanently injured in 6 months. But, excluding that, can Bray go a 10, 20 year career without ever winning a title, and go without needing them? HBK and Taker didn't need them toward the end of their careers, but they had already held them prior to this.

Can Bray sidestep titles altogether, and simply be Bray Wyatt, the eater of worlds, and just have personal feuds throughout, become good enough to not need the titles to add anything to his character, and call it a career?

Or does he simply need the WWE Title/IC title/Tag Title, simply because that's what the wrestlers aspire to?

I not sure why you needed to add Bray Wyatt to this question. You could have just said can anyone be a hall of famer without winning titles.

My question to you is...Can Bray Wyatt be on the main roster for one freakin year before we start talking about his hall of fame legacy?

We have no clue what will happen to Bray...he may get hurt, he may decide he doesnt want to wrestle, hell he may get released...we dont know.

He is entertaining but Im sick of seeing threads like this and that stupid one comparing him to Undertaker.

 

[Ryan1234567890]

One man that I can easily compare to Bray Wyatt that has never one a title in WWE and will be a Hall of Famer is Jake "The Snake" Roberts. Jake was the Jake "The Snake" Roberts character his whole career. He didn't change too much, just tweaked his character a bit when he was face or heel. Jake was an excellent wrestler with great mic skills. Did he need a title to get over and get into the Hall of Fame? Absolutely not. Don't be surprised if Jake is the devil that makes Bray Wyatt do what he does....

 

[A11oftheLights]

What if he just won it and destroyed the belt declaring symbols of a world he sees as pointless or something?

That way the WWE can bring in a new belt when he loses, gives bray a 'title run' but still enhances the character

 

[CrucifiedRaven]

The Undertaker didn't hold a title for five years from 1992 - 1997. I know he won the World Championship very early on in his career, but it was a short reign. The point is, as long as Bray Wyatt is consistently booked in feuds with top guys, he won't need titles.

Undertaker was always the second main event. No matter what he was doing or who he was wrestling (Yokozuna, Mabel, Fake Undertaker, King Kong Bundy), he was always given a prominent storyline or feud and a top spot on the card. I don't even think he started going back after the title until 1996. Kane, another "supernatural" character did the same thing. He had a 1 day reign early on in his career (the character's career), and then was rarely involved again with titles, especially the major ones.

So, I think Bray can follow a similar path having already worked with Kane, Bryan, The Shield and now Cena. If they consistently book Bray this way... then the answer is yes, I think he can have a HoF career without titles. Though, it wouldn't hurt to put the title on him at some point. I mean, it sure would make for interesting television, wouldn't it?

 

[JJ15776]

A few things.

Firstly, to the people bringing up a The Undertaker...he's played three distinctly different characters under that name. He's been the "deadman" for like half the time he's been in the WWE. So let's leave his name out of it when we're talking about people who have lasted a long time with one gimmick or similar gimmicks.

Secondly, there's two different questions here. The first is, can a person make it into the HOF without winning a title? And the answer to that is an easy and emphatic yes. People have mentioned Jake Roberts, and Jimmy Snuka is another that has already shown it can be done. So if that's your question, it's simple.

But if you're asking if Bray Wyatt can make the HOF...obviously, anything is possible, but I would say the odds are against him. I would say the odds are against anybody making the HOF at the point in their career where Wyatt is currently. Lots of guys come on strong and get super over real early, and then fade just as quickly. In the grand scheme in things, he's accomplished exactly jack squat. Let's see how he's doing come WrestleMania 31, I think we'll have a better idea of his staying power then.

 

[Bambambigganose]

The Wyatt family will have to expand. Bray needs to brainwash more "recruits" and build a group that is out to "take the machine" down. Bray and his family need to wage war on the wwe.

As the family grows and their war on wwe expands subplots would emerge with players being recruited/defecting. It cant be the three of them. Group needs to expand to 8-12 members including females

 

[THTRobtaylor]

Heres the thing, the Undertaker was never a HOF (of course there wasn't one till 96) level talent until he was well into his WWE run.

For the first 6-7 years, Taker was exclusively facing "monsters" and booked against lesser in-ring opposition, but larger than him in stature. This got him through a period but it was when the late Mabel broke his eye socket they realised they had to change it up. Mark Calloway's real talent wasn't the Deadman persona, but the ability to soak up knowledge and experience rapidly when he finally got to work with the Foley's, the Austin's, The Bret Hart's and Shawn Michael's as they realised they had to protect him if he was going to have longevity and Monster of the Month wasn't going to wash any longer...

Taker exponentially improved as a worker in an 18 month period into what we now consider legendary/HOF worthy because of this. When Taker won the title in 97, it wasn't his first belt but it felt like it because he had grown into the role of the top man.

In Wyatt, they are not taking the same approach as with Taker, they have thrown him in not only with the big names, but also the experienced, best workers from day one and like Taker he is seemingly able to improve after every match... Let's look at it, he's wrestled barely 6 major matches but 3 of them have been match of the night and some even match of the year contenders.

WWE seems to have learned a lesson from Taker's handling and is applying it to Bray sooner. Will he win a title, probably and I can see it being "disrespected"or left hanging from his rocking chair that it's a trinket to him... great for Wyatt, perhaps bad for the belt... He is like Jake, Bossman and early Undertaker a guy who wouldn't "look right" with a belt. Anyone with a physical gimmick/object would struggle.

Imagine Jake with the belt in 89-90, where would Damien fit in alongside parading a belt pre and post match... it wouldn't. Same for Wyatt, he has the lantern and his chair, the mechanics of giving the belt it's proper and required showings would ruin the aura... Unless the belt has a sheeps head on it... in which case go right ahead...

It's far more likely that Wyatt would let another Family member be "the paper champion"... I mean just sake of argument... What if on Sunday both Kane AND Bryan turn out to be still Wyatts? and Daniel Wyatt is the champion? Bringing down the machine indeed.

At the end of the day Windham Rotunda is barely 3 years into his career proper so it's a little early to start saying HOF or not... BUT the talent already displayed in creating, moulding and maximising momentum despite injuries on top of his well above average ring skill mean he is arguably a safer bet than ANY of the other NXT alumni of recent years at the same stage.

 

[totallylegitleaks]

Absolutely he can. However, I see him and the Wyatt gimmick winning at least one major title. You could easily have a Wyatt Family v. McMahon / HHH feud where Wyatt wins the title simply to dismantle / destroy it. It'd fit his "tear down the machine" motto well. If you were captivating, the fans loved you, and you were in the WWE for a solid 5-10+ years you'll end up in the HoF regardless of title reigns. I just don't see Bray Wyatt ending up without some title reign within the next year, let alone his entire career. He's just too good right now.

 

[chicagokmc]

People, don't forget that the Undertaker hasn't stayed in the same gimmick for this entire length of time. There was a point, like it or not, where he ditched the deadman gimmick and became the American Bad-Ass on his bike. It helped things, gave us a fresh take on the guy and then when he transformed once again to the Dead Man (including RIP Bearer) everyone popped like crazy.

I think a lot of people here are being prisoners of this long moment we've had of the Wyatt family gimmick. I say that because it hasn't been a year yet at the big league level and we're already assuming he can be HOF. His gimmick's fun now, trust me when he is a face (and to have longevity he'll have to bounce between heel/face) it isn't that interesting. Look at the Shield now that they are faces, they're taking beatdowns at the hands of the New Age Outlaws. Point is as a face, you have to be more vulnerable and that goes against everything the Wyatt gimmick seems to be. It's a great gimmick, but can he even get 5 more years out of it? I doubt it and I don't trust him with any other gimmicks, been there done that "Husky Harris". Somebody brought up Jake the Snake, no he didn't win titles but he had longevity he wasn't just a 1-2 year wonder (and when he was a face, he was still using the snake but the gimmick was nowhere near the same as jake as a heel). Let's just see what Bray does and how long he does it.

 

[kadroan]

It's too early to tell. I'd have to see how long he last in the WWE. He definitely have potential. He's been putting on good matches, getting a reaction from the fans and he's in one of the bigger matches at WM.