Are the "best" movies TRULY the best?

[Dagger Dias]

Ever since Avatar broke Titanic's record for highest grossing film of all time, I have become fascinated by how much money each movie makes. Once a week I check on the list of highest grossing films (both 2010 and everything). Here, as of September 14th 2010, is the list of the top 50 of all time.

Spoiler

1 Avatar $2,766,062,778
2 Titanic $1,843,201,268
3 The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King $1,119,110,941
4 Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest $1,066,179,725
5 Toy Story 3 $1,042,219,427
6 Alice in Wonderland $1,024,298,922
7 The Dark Knight $1,001,921,825
8 Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone $974,733,550
9 Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End $960,996,492
10 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix $938,212,738
11 Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince $933,959,197
12 The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers $925,282,504
13 Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace $924,317,558
14 Shrek 2 $919,838,758
15 Jurassic Park Universal Studios $914,691,118
16 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire $895,921,036
17 Spider-Man 3 $890,871,626
18 Ice Age: Dawn of the Dinosaurs $886,686,280 2009
19 Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets $878,643,482
20 The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring $870,761,744
21 Finding Nemo $867,893,978
22 Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith $848,754,768
23 Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen $836,297,228
24 Spider-Man $821,708,551
25 Independence Day $817,400,891
26 Shrek the Third $798,958,162
27 Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban $795,634,070
28 E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial $792,910,554
29 Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull $786,636,033
30 The Lion King $783,841,776
31 Spider-Man 2 $783,766,341
32 Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope $775,398,007
33 2012 $769,304,749
34 The Da Vinci Code $758,239,851
35 The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe$745,011,272
36 The Matrix Reloaded $742,128,461
37 Up $731,338,164
38 Inception $731,223,176 2010
39 Shrek Forever After $726,399,850
40 The Twilight Saga: New Moon $709,711,008
41 Transformers $709,709,780
42 Forrest Gump $677,387,716
43 The Sixth Sense $672,806,292
44 The Twilight Saga: Eclipse $672,498,560
45 Ice Age: The Meltdown $655,388,158
46 Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl $654,264,015
47 Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones $649,398,328
48 Kung Fu Panda $631,744,560
49 The Incredibles $631,442,092
50 Hancock $624,386,746

Now then.... Looking at that list, something comes to mind. "How did THAT make the list!?". I challenge you to go through all 50 of those movies, without asking that question a single time. Well? My thoughts exactly. Why is it that some movies, which are terrible, still end up making far much more money than movies that were superior to them? Some people, such as my wife, feel that Avatar should not be at the top. Others might have issues with other movies being on the list at all. One of mine is Alice in Wonderland.... How did THAT make more money than The Dark Knight? Better movies deserve to make more money.

Here's the other issue. Movies that make more money, go down in history looking better than they actually were, due to how successful they were. Was "Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull" the best in its series? Absolutely not, but it was the most successful financially.

The question I ask is this.... do you think it's fair that better movies sometimes don't make much money, compared to some financially successful movies that are complete utter crap and don't deserve to be included in the "best of all time" listing? I personally wish that the movies that are better in quality ranked higher on the list, but unfortunately that does not appear to be the case due to the fact that bad movies end up doing better than good movies, more often than not.

What are your thoughts on this issue?

 

[Eck]

You are completly right. I was looking at all of thoughs movies when one thing caught my eye... Shrek the Third. How in the hell did that get on the top 50 greatest movies!!?? That movie was crap! And alot of thoughs movies are the same way. The better movies should be up past thoughs. Like Titanic should still be 1st still. Dark Knight higher too (that one is up for debate with people on here but still.) most of these movies would be at the bottom of my list when it comes to quality. Every once in a while you will see a great movie do well financly and thats good. They deserve it but when you have crap like Shrek the Third on there. I can think of another 50 movies that are better then that but I digress.

 

[The Raven's Epitaph]

Ha, Dagger.. as soon as I saw the title of this thread I instantly thought "Avatar" and thought of how I'd word it, so here you go.

I don't believe that just because somebody says it's the best movie, doesn't mean it actually is the best movie. Everybody has their opinions and you can't please everybody right? I saw Avatar in 3D at the Cinema with a few mates and thought it was really good. It was deffenitly something new to the movie world...yeah it took about half an hour to actually get into the proper plot after the opening sequence, but it was still a good flick.

However, a few weeks later my Dad rented it from Blockbusters so Him and my Mum could watch it, they hadn't seen it before at this point; I watched it with them cos' I didn't really have a whole lot else to do. I didn't think it was as good the second time round. I was actually quite bored. Surely if people are saying that Avatar is the "best movie ever" then surely I shouldn't have become bored watching it?

Just my opinion though..not sure about everybody else.

 

[Attitude]

Looking at the list there are definately those that don't deserve to be on there. Some of the best AREN'T the best. I could think of several movies that deserve to be on the best movies list. But obviously the list you have is based on how much money it made. Which isn't always an accurate way to base how good a movie is.

Think about it Twilight is on there and made bunches of money. It was called one of the best movies. However think about all the Teens that go to see the movie.

Think about Finding Nemo, The Incredibles, and Shrek. Those brought in a bunch of money because all the kiddos and their parents went to see it.

So it's not always accurate in finding the truly best movies out there. There are low budget movies, that probably didn't make that much money that turned out to be truly great movies. One that comes to mind is Slumdog Millionare. This movie IMO is better than half of the movies on there. Didn't get on there because it didn't make enough money obviously.

 

[Mitch Henessey]

It's not fair, but the majority of movies on this list are movies that people love to see.

There are millions of people out there who just want to be entertained when they watch a movie, so they love to see the flashy fight scenes, cool special effects, and your typical generic Hollywood blockbuster story. Transformers Revenge Of The Fallen is a prime example of this. You had the lovable main character, Shia LaBeouf, the hot girl, Megan Fox, and Michael Bay made sure to go mad with plenty of explosions and over the top fight scenes here. Revenge Of The Fallen gets shit on by a lot of critics, but guess what, this movie managed to rake in a TON of money at the box office. I can still remember the massive lines for this film.

You'll never see films like The Hurt Locker, Gangs Of New York, The Departed, District 9, or No Country For Old Men on this list. These films don't fit the criteria for your typical Hollywood blockbuster film. Films like Transformers, Jurassic Park, and 2012 will always be on this list because these are the type of movies that draw people to theaters, and they sell DVDs.

 

[INDYjon22]

Mitch said it pretty well. The movies that primarily make up that list are summer blockbusters. Movies that are made with the sole purpose of making large sums of money. The story and acting is not as much a concern as it is for those movies that are truly considered the greatest films. The Godfather is far superior to any of those films, but based on the time it was released and the fact that it wasn't filled with tits and explosions already hinders it when it comes to making money. The fact that a movie makes hundreds of millions of dollars does not make it an all time great film, it just makes it a great popcorn flick.

 

[SorgFamily]

You also have to account for inflation in which case these are not the highest grossing films of all-time. I mean they made the most money at first glance but definitely not when adjusted for inflation. In that list Avatar is at #14.

1. Gone With the Wind
2. Star Wars
3. The Sound of Music
4. E.T.
5. The Ten Commandments

http://boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm

 

[LitasRevenge79]

I definitely think this is a great thread. I mean, just because it made a crapload of money, I don't think it deserves to be called "THE BEST" just looking at this list alone, I really didn't see the appeal in Avatar. I tried to watch it and turned it off about an hour into it. I'm sorry if I offend those who do like it. I also seriously think its about what's being released at the right time, and the technology behind the movie that's being released. You consider with some of the movies, like Shrek 3D, and Avatar, and Alice in Wonderland the newer tech like Imax, and the 3D revolution can also increase the ticket sales and can contribute to an higher profit margin and then you wonder why you see maybe better made (storyline wise...) at the middle or bottom of the list. I would say in my opinion, that Titanic was probably still deserving of the top of the list. But I would say given the times at which certain movies were released like Gone With The Wind, Casablanca, I'm surprised those are considered in BEST movies...you look at what they were like for their time as well.

 

[Whatsinaname696]

first off thank you Sorg for the inflation cuz that's a big factor too, that being said, the best movie of all time is what you consider it to be, I would have Army of Darkness on my top 50.... gonna go out on a limb and say it wouldn't be in many peoples top 50.... or that half have ever even fucking seen it, so yeah there's a ton of problems with what's considered great, but we have internet now, we have threads, blogs, we all have a way to get our opinion out and so a lot more chance to find someone or something we trust, which evens the playing field quite a bit for the initiated... for the uninitiated who take the sales word, or the critics word, or don't trust even their own judgement to take a chance on a movie that looks good to them... then they get what they deserve, I may very well LOVE Twilight, but I'll never know cuz my gut tells me... "I love vampires... the souless, womanizing (then turn the bitch), bloodsucking, transform into wolves and bats, accented, abominations of humanity vampires" my gut also tells me "wow a touchy feely drama movie featuring "flaming" vampires and werewolves... aren't vampires spose to die when they burst into flames?" gotta trust your gut, and people you trust and not give a shit bout what POS rakes in the most money... and if your movie happens to be one of the ones that rakes in a lot of moolah, awesome, means more people saw it and are likely to be able to chat about it or watch it with you, if you even care to

 

[benny02]

One can't say Best movies are truly best for some movies are made with soul intent of working out it's commercial value. While some true marvel pieces of art and performance lags behind in churning money.

 

[Save Me Y2J]

These are not the "best" movies . This is just a list of the highest grossing movies. Well, highest grossing also tells us that they are the best but business wise. The fact they have grossed so much is that huge amount of money has been spent in their production too. No producer wants to spend so much money and get nothing in reward. Producers dont give a damn about the critics, they just want to earn the money, which infact is the right thing. So, for the return of the money they spent on it, and above all the profit to be gained, they need to over-promote the movie. They promote it in such a way that people actually become curios to see as what's so special about this movie as it claims. Its all about star power and promotion as well as reputation. That's why all Harry Potter movies are in there. That's why a fuck film like Alice in Wonderland is on the 6th spot because it had the starpower of Johnny Depp. The Dark Knight is in there because of the curiosity generated after Heath Ledger's death. Toy Story is there because it deserves and it was the first animated film for which Tom Hanks lend its voice. Two things worked for Toy Story . 1. Tom Hanks 2. Animation . So , as we may conclude, Grossing is based on the amount of curiosity generated through publicity.

 

[Gabbo]

As above really. Best is a relative term. For a production studio best does mean money. They would look at these films as the best films to release.

For a film fan, I wouldn't give that list a second glance. For the past year of my life I've been making my way through the IMDb Top 250. It's not a perfect list but it's alot more accurate than working from the grossing. It's introduced me to alot of films, actors and directors I would never have stumbled across on my own.

So yeah, just because a film panders to the lowest common denominator and thereby attracts the largest audience it's no guarantee of quality.

 

[TwistofRKO]

I don't understand what you are asking, or saying. Of course nobody considers that list to be the list for best movies. Look at all the sequels on that list, when one film establishes a connection with an audience, they'll be more likely to see it's second part. And most sequels suck. Most of the great films are topics that aren't overly explored, or done to death. And many films on there are for kids and cult followings. Tell me The Departed or No Country For Old Men isn't as good as something like Harry Potter or Attack of the Clones. Or show me a chart depicting how many parents will take their kids to go see Shutter Island when something like Alice in Wonderland is out.