"Anti-fans" Which Is It?

[ttdg]

Let me preface this with an explanation of the term I came up with "anti-fans". These are people who enjoy or think it is cool booing the faces and cheering the heels. I believe everyone has the right to cheer and boo who every you want. I remember going to a live event and when Chris Jericho came out, a heel at the time" I said out loud "obligatory boo". I was a fan of his but I knew he was a "bad guy" so I went along. Anyways here it what I want to know: during the Punk Cena match last night I heard the chant "you can't wrestle" obviously meant for Cena but then minutes later the same people chanted "this is awesome". Which is it?

 

[Nate DaMac]

Kind of a mess there, bud. Coherency is your friend.

To answer your question that you didn't really ask at all, anyone who chants "You can't wrestle." at John Cena is a buffoon. John Cena is the absolute best in the world, bar none. Likewise, if anyone chants "You can't wrestle" at CM Punk, they would also be a buffoon.

You can call them anti-fans, or smarks, or whatever nickname you want to give them. I call them, "Stupid Fans." Anyone who still chants that ridiculous shit is stupid. Period.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

Let me preface this with an explanation of the term I came up with "anti-fans". These are people who enjoy or think it is cool booing the faces and cheering the heels. I believe everyone has the right to cheer and boo who every you want. I remember going to a live event and when Chris Jericho came out, a heel at the time" I said out loud "obligatory boo". I was a fan of his but I knew he was a "bad guy" so I went along. Anyways here it what I want to know: during the Punk Cena match last night I heard the chant "you can't wrestle" obviously meant for Cena but then minutes later the same people chanted "this is awesome". Which is it?

You actually yelled out at a live show "obligatory boo" when Jericho came out? Uh yeah... I don't think you believe people have the right to boo and cheer who they want if you're doing stuff like that. I'd hate sitting behind you at a show. You remind me of these clowns that sat in front of me at a Smackdown taping years ago. They spent the whole show yelling out what rating they thought each flipping moment of the show would get, and talking about who would get home to post their spoilers first. Me and the guy I went with ended up watching the rest of the show from the arenas lounge because of smart fans that had to let everyone around them know how smart they were... instead of you know... just shutting the fuck up and enjoying the show.

To answer what I guess is your question though... it doesn't matter. They chanted 'this is awesome' because Punk and Cena were putting on a great show and they appreciated it. They were chanting 'you can't wrestle' because the smarts love doing shit like that. Cena can look sloppy as hell in the ring at times, and it's hard to believe some of his offense... but the one thing no one should ever take away from him is that the guy knows how to tell a story in that ring.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

In my opinion, these are examples of ultimately what's ruining wrestling, if anything is actually ruining wrestling.

Comparatively speaking, pro wrestling hasn't changed all that much over the course of the past 30 years. Sure there have been new matches added, new stars, improvements in technology, different styles and all that. But what I mean is that, at its core, it's still pretty much the same. What's changed are some of the fans, namely the smarks.

To hear people chant "you can't wrestle" to John Cena makes me shake my head at their stupidlity. I know John Cena isn't some sort of technical dynamo out there but he doesn't have to be. This is pro wrestling, not the Olympics. Cena makes tons of money for WWE, his matches are often quite good as are his feuds and he CONSTANTLY is able to keep fans interested in whatever he's involved in. That is what makes someone a true star in pro wrestling. I've said it before lots of times: if you're someone that can't make the fans invest their time in you enough to care about you, then it doesn't matter how good you look. It doesn't matter how handsome you are or how incredible your body looks. Doesn't matter what sort of athlete you are. Doesn't matter what technical skills you have. All of those things are great assets to have, but they come at a far distant second to making fans care about you one way or the other.

One problem a lot of smarks have in my eyes is that they're move marks. They think that you're a great wrestler if you're someone that has a lot of flashy looking offense. For instance, I've heard people say that Hardy vs. Angle earlier this year was the best match of the year because of the high risk moves they took. While they did have a great match, it takes sooooooooooo much more than that to ultimately get it done.

If that kind of stuff is all it took, then guys like Amazing Red, most the guys in TNA's X Division over the past decade, Shelton Benjamin and others would be the biggest stars pro wrestling has ever seen.

 

[ProWrestlingFan]

Its not that Cena doesn't know how to wrestle, its just that WWE allows him to use a limited moveset by which many fans get upset and they chant you can't wrestle so that he changes his moveset but its not upto him, its upto WWE. And People can chant whatever they want to chant. John Cena doesn't have a problem with people chanting "You can't wrestle" to him, Why do you have?

In my opinion, these are examples of ultimately what's ruining wrestling, if anything is actually ruining wrestling.

Comparatively speaking, pro wrestling hasn't changed all that much over the course of the past 30 years. Sure there have been new matches added, new stars, improvements in technology, different styles and all that. But what I mean is that, at its core, it's still pretty much the same. What's changed are some of the fans, namely the smarks.

To hear people chant "you can't wrestle" to John Cena makes me shake my head at their stupidlity. I know John Cena isn't some sort of technical dynamo out there but he doesn't have to be. This is pro wrestling, not the Olympics. Cena makes tons of money for WWE, his matches are often quite good as are his feuds and he CONSTANTLY is able to keep fans interested in whatever he's involved in. That is what makes someone a true star in pro wrestling. I've said it before lots of times: if you're someone that can't make the fans invest their time in you enough to care about you, then it doesn't matter how good you look. It doesn't matter how handsome you are or how incredible your body looks. Doesn't matter what sort of athlete you are. Doesn't matter what technical skills you have. All of those things are great assets to have, but they come at a far distant second to making fans care about you one way or the other.

One problem a lot of smarks have in my eyes is that they're move marks. They think that you're a great wrestler if you're someone that has a lot of flashy looking offense. For instance, I've heard people say that Hardy vs. Angle earlier this year was the best match of the year because of the high risk moves they took. While they did have a great match, it takes sooooooooooo much more than that to ultimately get it done.

If that kind of stuff is all it took, then guys like Amazing Red, most the guys in TNA's X Division over the past decade, Shelton Benjamin and others would be the biggest stars pro wrestling has ever seen.

Pro-Wrestling is scripted. If WWE would have pushed anybody like they have pushed John Cena, anybody can be a big star. Its not that difficult. And you are calling other's smark while being a member of an Internet dirtsheet forum? You are a smark too, dude.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

I'm not sure if the same people chanting, "You can't wrestle" are the same people that were chanting "This is awesome". With 15,000 people, there tends to be differing opinions. At the same time there are people who just like to be a part of a chant.

I get the Cena animosity but the angry smarks are not helping their cause by expressing their displeasure. It shows WWE that Cena touvhes an emotional side to those fans as well as the Cena marks and it makes the Cena marks that much more rabid in their appreciation for Cena.

"Let's go Cena!" would not last as long and be as loud without "Cena sucks!"

 

[DetectiveZelix]

Fans BUY tickets to go to there show to have a good time. for some a good time mans staying quiet like me I dont make any noise just like to watch and enjoy. For others its cheerin faces an booing heels out of instinct or guilt or to feel like they are pleasing the WWE. To fans of these days they cheer for who they like or who they feel arent being used right or given the opportunity which is why Cena is booed. people feel he is limited and its annoying as he's been around for years and the face of the company forever and never really changes it up only in big matches or when trying to prove the fans wrong like last night. Pubk has a great arsenal of moves that he often varies up and tries new things like last night. Fans know Cena can wrestle but he appears limited so to encourage him to change it up they chant shit like that...but its simply the fans having fun. Hell ECW fans would chant all kinds of shit but it just makes it fun to be there and be vocal and interactive. As for the This is awesome chant. Perhaps they enjoyed something incredible in the match like all the suspenseful kickouts of finishers....I mean fans will have fun as is their right. They paid their ticket. Even Cena approves it..cus hes taking thier money

 

[cult_of_icecream_bar]

There are no anti-fans,smarks.Everyone is a fan.Just because everyone likes some guy doesn't mean you've got to like him as well.Here's the thing,if i buy a ticket to a show,i have every right to boo or cheer anyone i like.I still boo ziggler because i don't like him.Hell a fan may like santino's ring work but hate CM Punk or Daniel bryan.He has every right not to like them.Not liking a popular wrestler doesn't make you stupid or smart.On a sidenote,i know cena can wrestle with the very best.

 

[IT Factor]

It is dumbfounding for anyone to judge another fan and term them anything. "Anti-fans, smart fans, or smarks". The common denominator in all of that is that everyone is a fan. I think alot of fans nowadays with the internet tend to forget that. Everyone has the right to cheer or boo whomever they choose without the thought of what other fans may think about it. I certainly do not care what anyone thinks about my views on wrestling or anything else I post here.

I will conceed this much though: there are the idiot fans that are exceptions to this rule. The idiots who talk about things as if they know more than the people in the know actually do. The same fans who dwell on ratings and other trivial parts of wrestling related things such as whom can spoil the shows first are just exceptions that make the rest of us fans look moronic as a whole. But as for whom people choose to reject or embrace isn't of any consequence to me nor should it be for any other fans. Everyone has that certain superstar we hate for our own reasons and those whom we mark out for reguardless of what others think. Trying to analyze that is precisely what is wrong with the state of wrestling as a business these days. Too much analyzation of what is happening and not enough enjoying of what is in front of us.

 

[Nate DaMac]

Its not that Cena doesn't know how to wrestle, its just that WWE allows him to use a limited moveset by which many fans get upset and they chant you can't wrestle so that he changes his moveset but its not upto him, its upto WWE. And People can chant whatever they want to chant. John Cena doesn't have a problem with people chanting "You can't wrestle" to him, Why do you have?

As if to prove my point. If you're still saying today, in 20-fucking-12, that John Cena has a limited move-set, you're stupid. For one, only stupid people care how many moves a person does. Most of all, HE USES A TON OF DIFFERENT MOVES.

Pro-Wrestling is scripted. If WWE would have pushed anybody like they have pushed John Cena, anybody can be a big star. Its not that difficult.

Oh, so that's why Sheamus and Randy Orton became huge crossover stars too, huh? Oh wait, they didn't. This is a load of bullshit. If it was really that easy to do, TNA would be a blip on WWE's radar.

Ladies and gentlemen, a prime example of a "Stupid Fan." Congratulations.

 

[Raito]

In my opinion, these are examples of ultimately what's ruining wrestling, if anything is actually ruining wrestling.
What's changed are some of the fans, namely the smarks.

To hear people chant "you can't wrestle" to John Cena makes me shake my head at their stupidlity. I know John Cena isn't some sort of technical dynamo out there but he doesn't have to be. This is pro wrestling, not the Olympics. Cena makes tons of money for WWE, his matches are often quite good as are his feuds and he CONSTANTLY is able to keep fans interested in whatever he's involved in. That is what makes someone a true star in pro wrestling. I've said it before lots of times: if you're someone that can't make the fans invest their time in you enough to care about you, then it doesn't matter how good you look. It doesn't matter how handsome you are or how incredible your body looks. Doesn't matter what sort of athlete you are. Doesn't matter what technical skills you have. All of those things are great assets to have, but they come at a far distant second to making fans care about you one way or the other.

Cena is not constantly able to keep people interested. I didnt care about his Programs over the last 20 months with: R-Truth, John L, Big Show, Kane, Del Rio, Miz, -- Need I go on? And for the record I cared about Big show in the title pic, and I care about Kane now. Cena is no entertainment god. All these programs I didnt like were in the main event of a show that I do like. I like to finish the show to make sure I dont miss anything, so I watch. You make lemonade sometimes, doesnt mean you want it.

As for the fans ruining wrestling, I see where you are coming from but i must disagree again. Negative chants are meant to get under the performers skin, and the good performers like Cena actually encourage it. In fact "You can't wrestle" is just another in a long line of negative chants that the peformer may not have wanted, but encourage for showmanship.

Lance Storm - Fans didnt call him boring because they thought he was boring(even if they did). They did it because Stone Cold told them to.

Christian - CLB, he would cover his ears and jump up and down.

D-bry - Yes/No. Yeah they all hate him sure.

Kurt Angle - Fans knew Kurt Angle didn't suck, but the way he reacted to those chants was so perfect that even years later as a babyface they would tell him he sucked on the way to the ring

John Cena - Cena was rushed into the ME. It didnt show so much on SD against JBL. But once he came to RAW and was put into programs with people like Christian, Jericho and Kurt Angle, it showed that he couldnt wrestle, at least not like they could wrestle. And when the fans told him about it, his face would go flush red and he would look like he was going to cry and made the chant just as fun as the Kurt Angle you suck chant.

Wrestling encourages the audience to heckle, and most people who chant you cant wrestle at Cena these days know he can, and knows he can entertain.

But if you're trying to blame millions over the world for booing a guy who has been consistently booed for 7 years instead of just, I dunno.... blaming the company for not just making a babyface who people actually like? Then no, I can't understand where you're coming from.

 

[justinept]

So because the fans at one point were chanting “You can’t wrestle” … and then 10 minutes a “This is awesome” chant broke out, you think the crowd was confused? Have you never heard the “Let’s go Cena” … “Cena Sucks” chants? It IS possible for half the crowd to chant one thing and then for the half of the crowd to chant something completely different.


The only part of this thread that has been of any interest to me is the sub-conversation going on regarding Cena. I’ve come to the conclusion that if you like Cena, you must be under the age of 12 ... but if you don't like Cena, then you're just a stupid internet smark that wants to see a million moves in a match.

Enough already. There are plenty of reasons to like Cena and plenty to dislike him. In addition, the usage of the words "mark" and "smark" irritates the hell out of me. What the hell is a "smark" anyway? A smart mark? You "smarks" classify yourselves as marks that realize wrestling is scripted ... as if that's some kind of badge of honor. Anyone over the age of 10 realizes wrestling is a work. In truth, you’re all nothing but marks - I'm a mark, too. It's not a dirty word. It just means we enjoy the product, that we get emotionally invested in the angles and the characters, and that we're willing to spend our money on the product. If you’re not a mark, then why in the hell would you be posting on an internet message board to discuss the product? It sure sounds like you’ve made that emotional investment to me.

You know who the biggest marks are? The ones that can’t figure out why Cena wins, why he stays on top or why he headlines every pay-per view. The answers to those questions are simple … because wrestling is a business and John Cena is the most profitable piece of that business. Does it matter if he can’t wrestle? No.

To the other side of the argument, Cena supporters need to stop attacking Cena haters. There’s a good reason a lot of people don’t like him, or chant that he can’t wrestle. It’s because Cena is a shtick guy, and a lot of people aren’t a fan of that shtick. It has nothing to do with his move set … it has EVERYTHING to do with the psychology in his matches. He starts out on fire. He slips on a banana and loses control. He then gets beaten up for a finite amount of time before making his big comeback and ultimately winning. That’s 99% of John Cena matches. Personally, I’m not entertained by that shtick – I also wasn’t entertained by it when Hogan used the same formula in the 80’s. I’ve never been much for the guy that doesn’t sell, the wrestler that gets the crap beaten out of him for 25 minutes but then finds the energy to sprint around the ring like the match never happened. I’m a much bigger fan of someone like CM Punk who – after being put in the STF – appeared unable to put any weight on his left for the remainder of the match. I’m entertained by that level of realism. I’m not entertained by Cena’s idealistic preaching and unshakable moral compass or his “never give up” message. I can see why some people enjoy his Superman/Tebow persona, but that’s not for everyone.

 

[ProWrestlingFan]

Oh, so that's why Sheamus and Randy Orton became huge crossover stars too, huh? Oh wait, they didn't. This is a load of bullshit. If it was really that easy to do, TNA would be a blip on WWE's radar.

That is bullshit. Sheamus has just been pushed as a babyface since 2011 and Randy Orton has always been a heel till 2010 whereas John Cena has been pushed as the super babyface since 2005 (7 years).

You are blindly in love with John Cena so you have to defend him no matter what. Keep it up.

 

[InsomniaMusic]

John Cena character can't wrestle He's a brawler type character with basic move set. Not really technical at all.

And John Cena is very basic in his moveset and it gets boring for me as a long standing wrestler to know what's coming when. But I understand his character and I'm not the target market for his character

 

[boywithbluehanger]

It seems most of you are missing the point of the OP when he used "anti-fan" as a new term. He's not passing judgment by it but rather saying you're going against the traditional "cheer for the babyface, boo the heel" reaction that is obviously desired by the writers of the storylines. I didn't take that as trying to bash anyone's decision to go against the grain whether or not its a fan's true intent. I think people just get too sensitive about how others perceive their decision to support certain guys. For example, I liked MVP when he was around but I would come on the boards and would often see someone ragging on him. It didn't make me feel the need to rush to his defense nor defend myself for finding him entertaining. And that kind of "da fuck are you??..." attitude seems to be missing when it comes to both fans and anti-fans alike.

Call me naive but when people are chanting in a positive light for the heel, I usually think its because they admire the man behind the character - the actor. They want to show their support for him because they have this fear that if they fall in line booing with the rest of the marks, the heel might get lost in the shuffle with the past heel obstacles that have come and gone. But if you cheer for the heel and show strong support, chances are that the creative team will recognize his fanbase and do more with him. It doesn't hurt that its also a lot of fun to bait a little bit of antagonism whilst a part of the live crowd.

 

[BigSexy The IndyKiller]

The thing that gets me about all of it is that by cheering the heels, chances are, a face turn is not far behind, which usually is followed by boos. It's highly unlikely that Vince will change that format any time soon. In which case, if you don't like a face, show no reaction at all. If you love a heel, boo the shit out of him to show just how over he is... Some of the greatest heels of all time were boo'd out of every building, and had shit thrown at them all of the time. Guess what. They continued to receive their push. People that complain about Orton being boring as a face seem to forget that their cheers for him as a heel made him face. The same actually goes for Cena, Sheamus, and a few others. It's just my opinion based on 30+ years of watching wrestling, but turns are normally based on reaction of the crowd.

 

[BigSexy The IndyKiller]

No, I'm trying to provide some insight for those who seem to be confused as to how things work and have worked forever. You're complaining and making noise for no reason because Vince isn't changing the format any time soon. This isn't ECW, and the Attitude Era isn't returning any time soon. Those were the only instances where that type of stuff was appreciated by the masses. IJS, you can continue the trend, just don't complain when things remain the same.

 

[DetectiveZelix]

I understnad what you are saying. But the fans are suppsed to make the stars. I understand that we cheer heels that will eventually turn face but why do they have to be so bland after turning face?. Believe me if Orton kept punting people and kept his sadistic attitude after turning face we'd still cheer him but no he starts smiling, doing jumpin jacks and talking even more like an idiot...Same with Cena and most faces...it just doesnt make any sense. Austin, Rock, Kane, Taker and so on all seem to be the same as faces they just did the same shit to heels what they used to do to faces....

You have to understand that. That's why we are vocal..tyronf to create the next star....Because WWE sure the hell isnt

 

[BigSexy The IndyKiller]

I guess my answer would be that faces only did that during the Attitude Era and in ECW or other "Extreme" promotions. Prior to then, there weren't even very many "tweeners" either. Hate to break it down to you, but that's a part of the whole face/heel dynamic. Faces fight for the good cause while heels do heel things to get the crowd to boo them.

 

[TheCrusher]

Most, but definitely not all, of the fans who hate "babyfaces" are teenage boys and young men who like to act out against things they are told to like. It's part of becoming your own person. You don't want to be told who to like and who not to like. So, when a character who is always virtuous comes out, and you know you're supposed to love him, you feel like you should hate him. It's kind of a natural reaction. On some level, the babyface is almost designed for them to hate. These fans are simply forming their own opinions about what they like, and they get to do that. They are consumers in the wrestling marketplace and deserve to be part of things as much as everyone else.

If they're particularly obnoxious about it, then they're just a particularly obnoxious subset of one group of fans. I've been seated behind particularly obnoxious subsets of the fans who are supporting the faces as well. I remember going to an old AWA match and listening to the family ahead of me shout really, really stupid insults at the Iron Sheik for half an hour. Most recently, I went to a match where a group of tweenie girls squealed over Cena so bad that I thought their high-pitched noises were going to melt my brain from the inside out. I didn't know humans could make that sound. I kind of understand the young guys who hate boy bands a little better now.

I mostly mark for faces nowadays, because I watch the shows with a nine-year-old. It's fun for him, and I enjoy it. I'll even boo heels I secretly love. Who you cheer for isn't what make you obnoxious. It's how you cheer that makes you obnoxious. There were even a couple young adult guys cheering for heels that turned around and playfully went back and forth with my kids, making the show more fun for the kids.

 

[TheCrusher]

I understnad what you are saying. But the fans are suppsed to make the stars. I understand that we cheer heels that will eventually turn face but why do they have to be so bland after turning face?. Believe me if Orton kept punting people and kept his sadistic attitude after turning face we'd still cheer him but no he starts smiling, doing jumpin jacks and talking even more like an idiot...Same with Cena and most faces...it just doesnt make any sense. Austin, Rock, Kane, Taker and so on all seem to be the same as faces they just did the same shit to heels what they used to do to faces....

You have to understand that. That's why we are vocal..tyronf to create the next star....Because WWE sure the hell isnt

I agree with some of what you're saying here. I don't love the way the WWE is packaging their upper card faces nowadays. Not because they aren't violent enough, though, but because they are--as you said--kind of bland. There are elements of the Attitude Era faces that can be lifted without breaking the PG barrier. DX, Austin, Los Guerreros, E & C, even Angle had moments when they were defying the powers that be with more than just speeches in the ring. There were a lot of backstage and outside the arena pranks and dirty tricks that could still be employed without making the face seem overly violent or "just as bad as the heels."

Done wrong, these make the face too silly for the upper card, but the occasional beer truck or milk truck or cement truck might really do the faces a ton of good. I guess I'm saying the WWE needs more trucks.

 

[DetectiveZelix]

I guess my answer would be that faces only did that during the Attitude Era and in ECW or other "Extreme" promotions. Prior to then, there weren't even very many "tweeners" either. Hate to break it down to you, but that's a part of the whole face/heel dynamic. Faces fight for the good cause while heels do heel things to get the crowd to boo them.

And theres nothing wrong with Good fighting evil...but does it have to be so boring..not just the attitude era brought us the cool characters...hell before the attitude era we had Undertaker, Jake the Snake, Big Bossman, Dibease and more. The point if these characters, heel or face were interesting and did alot of the same stuff as both

Like any rich character as a face would be glorious like Ric Flair, face or heel always bragged about himself and styling and profiling. Bam Bam Bigelow was always dominating despite being face or heel. Shawn Michaels had style as a face but got really pompous as heel but later on becoming a face ans still pompous but a little more fighter spirit. Hell, Hulk Hogan himself even made a good guy awesome, he was huge as hell, represented the country, fought against a slew of opponents to "defend" it and was just larger than life.

I don't like Kevin Nash's snark comments in that one interview but I can agree with characters being larger than life, we need that, especially from faces because they're so bland. And heels are not much better but in a way they're cooler because at least most of them speak the truth while the heroes try to blind you with euphemisms and optimistic everything...I dont know I gues I'm being critical but I havent seen one face turn actually play out right and stay interesting and sooner than later, Dolph will turn face and all of a suddenly stop showing off...will get a 5 moves of doom list and no longer even try to be versatile. I'm not bashing the product just stating an obvious truth to why we fans have become so rebellious

 

[BigSexy The IndyKiller]

On that note I agree with you. I guess we just have different views on how to address it. To me, silence speaks VOLUMES when it comes to showing disapproval to characters. I just feel that when the see that characters are getting NO reaction, then they may begin to take notice. They seem to see it now as any reaction is a good reaction....

 

[HBsam31]

Fans BUY tickets to go to there show to have a good time. for some a good time mans staying quiet like me I dont make any noise just like to watch and enjoy. For others its cheerin faces an booing heels out of instinct or guilt or to feel like they are pleasing the WWE. To fans of these days they cheer for who they like or who they feel arent being used right or given the opportunity which is why Cena is booed. people feel he is limited and its annoying as he's been around for years and the face of the company forever and never really changes it up only in big matches or when trying to prove the fans wrong like last night. Pubk has a great arsenal of moves that he often varies up and tries new things like last night. Fans know Cena can wrestle but he appears limited so to encourage him to change it up they chant shit like that...but its simply the fans having fun. Hell ECW fans would chant all kinds of shit but it just makes it fun to be there and be vocal and interactive. As for the This is awesome chant. Perhaps they enjoyed something incredible in the match like all the suspenseful kickouts of finishers....I mean fans will have fun as is their right. They paid their ticket. Even Cena approves it..cus hes taking thier money

I tend to agree with this. I don't like what a lot of the people are chanting, but they paid their ticket, and should be able to enjoy the show as they see fit. The only exception would be if they were interfering with someone else's good time. I, like the poster above prefer to sit at an event and just enjoy. I do not make much noise at all, but I do enjoy hearing others chant. I would guess the fans that were chanting "you can't wrestle" were different fans than were cheering "this is awesome". The way people enjoy wrestling has changed a bit, and it looks like we will have to deal with it.

 

[Nate DaMac]

That is bullshit. Sheamus has just been pushed as a babyface since 2011 and Randy Orton has always been a heel till 2010 whereas John Cena has been pushed as the super babyface since 2005 (7 years).

Cena's been pushed as a babyface for 7 years, correct. It didn't take him 7 years to become to top face in the company though, did it?

I'm not saying that they don't try and handpick who they want to become their top stars. Sometimes it works (The Rock, Kurt Angle) Sometimes it works but it doesn't pan out as well as they'd hoped (Randy Orton, Sheamus so far,) and sometimes they fail miserably (Drew McIntyre, Vladimir Kozlov, countless others.) However, the large majority of big names become big names because the fans decide that "This is my guy" despite what the WWE may be doing with them. It happened with Steve Austin, Jeff Hardy, Punk, and yes, even John Cena. It didn't appear that they just decided that Cena was the guy, he got massively over because the fans were impressed with his charisma. Of course he got pushed after that, and it worked at every turn so they never stopped pushing him.

You are blindly in love with John Cena so you have to defend him no matter what. Keep it up.

Jesus Christ, man. Children these days still rely on the same tactics they used in Junior High. Your juvenile attempts to question my sexuality may work on your High School friends, but I'm quite comfortable with mine. Besides, I would gladly make love to John Cena. At that level it's not even about gay or straight, it's art.