WWE Region, Fourth Round, 3 Stages Of Hell: (2) Shawn Michaels vs (3) John Cena

[Daniel]

Cena going over HBK will be worse than punk going over hart.really?

I'm not totally sure what this means. Does it mean that you think Punk going over Hart was ridiculous. If so, that's the most intelligent thing in this post.

just because he's face of the company doesnt mean he gets the pie.

Actually, it does in this case.

He'll manage to get at best one fall and then what.

He'll get another one. Duh.

HBK has beaten the biggest names in buisness.Who has Cena beaten?huh?

HBK, for one. Then there's Orton, Triple H, Batista, Kurt Angle, Brock Lesnar, Chris Jericho, CM Punk, Rey Mysterio, Edge, The Big Show, Kane, The Great Khali and The Undertaker.

So basically anyone who's anyone.

HBK was in the company when the show's ratings were 7-8,cena's get hardly 3's.

Oh, you just had to walk into this one.

People give too much credence to ratings as it is (forgetting that the bottom line is profit). But this statement is just wrong in every way.

Let's say Raw's ratings peak occurred in 1999 (where these 7s and 8s that you speak occasionally occurred). HBK was only occasionally around that year, and was NOT an in-ring performer. If you want to look at the ratings for the year when HBK was on top in the WWE Raw (let's say 1995/6) the ratings were almost exclusively in the 2s. And this is when there were LESS channels.

Yes. Next.

Cena lost a match to a visitor of 8yrs where HBK won EC when no one thought he'd be the same after his injury.

So? Cena lost to The Rock. HBK would've lost in that situation too. The difference is, though, that HBK would never have been put in that position. Because he was never a really big draw.

Vote goes to HBK.

And isn't that just a little silly.

 

[nightmare]

Biggest names in the business?

Has HBK beat Hogan? No.

Has HBK beat Austin? No.

Give me some big names.

Dont pretend HBK hasnt beaten big names just because he hasnt won against Austin or Hogan- Cena hasnt beat them either. This is HBK we are speaking of, not DB, Owen, Perfect or other great stars the IWC loves to death but werent as spectacular as many build them up to be.


Big names HBK has beaten:

HHH (street fight, EC and others)
Orton
Edge (even in a street fight)
Cena
Angle
Jericho
Big Show
Kane (in No DQ matches as well)
JBL
Batista
Flair (yeah, that Ric Flair)
Undertaker (yeah that guy, in a casket match and HIAC)
Vader
Nash (no holds barred and cage)
Bret Hart (at WM...)
Yokozuna
Brittish Bulldog


Do I need to go on? Because that sounds like a nice list of big names to me.



Cena is huge. Big name, big draw. Unfortunately HBK is no slouch. Anyone remember what it sounds like when he comes out? The crowd goes apeshit. Many more one sided crowd responses than Cena's split reaction every week.


Just because he is facing Cena you people are going to forget\ignore just how big of a deal HBK is? This is the Show-stopper, the Main Event, Mr. Wrestlemania, the Heart Break Kid- Shawn Michaels!



No matter how tough, strong and quick Cena may be- In a split second, a blink of the eye- it all wont matter. HBK has made a career out of winning matches with Sweet Chin Music when his opponent underestimates him or thinks he is beaten. The move that can be hit seemingly out of nowhere, just when Shawn is dead in the water- BAM! Lights out.



This will be a brawl. Flat out. No fancy flips or chain wrestling needed. The fact that both men can take a huge amount of punishment and dish it out just as well will proves this will be great. My above post showing a pretty sound scenario seems to give HBK the last fall and win. I just dont see anyone coming to the aid of Cena, but I do see DX giving the assist to HBK.
I really think HBK would squeak out a win in the first fall. That causes a frustrated Cena to beat on HBK in the cell with no help from the outside. Unfortunately for Cena, when that cage rises- he has a few problems waiting for him. That gives HBK a breather while HHH\Chyna do some work.

As I stated above:


I think that once the cage is raised HHH would rush in to attack Cena while HBK is recovering and Chyna would set up the ladder and try to get HBK on his feet. Cena mounts a superhero comeback on HHH and lays him out. Chyna and HBK beat on Cena for a minute and she holds up Cena while HBK goes for the SCM. Unfortunately Cena ducks and HBK kicks Chyna in the face. He has a staredown with Cena and they go at it like 2 wild dogs. Cena hits the AA and goes up the ladder.


Just about that time HHH slides in with a chair, whacks Cena and he falls from the ladder. HHH hits a pedigree on Cena and pulls Shawn to his feet helping him up the ladder.


It makes sense. Even if Cena tries to wear out Shawn with the STF then climbs the ladder, what makes you think someone wont wrap a chair over Cena's head while he has Shawn locked in?


This match will be brutal for both men, but the assistance from DX would be just too much for Cena to win the last fall.

 

[Cmills005]

I'm sorry, anyone saying someone else is an idiot for thinking one way or another on this one is kidding themselves. Two huge names with amazing careers with a match that fits them both. An argument can easily be made for either.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Big names HBK has beaten:

HHH (street fight, EC and others)

Cena made HHH tap.

Orton

Cena beat him in an Iron Man and I Quit match

Edge (even in a street fight)

Cena made him tap at the Royal Rumble and beat him in Edge's own match in Edge's own hometown.

Angle

So has Cena.

Jericho

Jericho is Cena's bitch.

Big Show

Shawn has never pinned Big Show who is also Bitch #2

Kane (in No DQ matches as well)

Cena just beat him three months ago.

JBL

Bitch #3

Batista

Cena beat him three straight times.

Flair (yeah, that Ric Flair)

Old Man Flair. You're sure going strong.

Undertaker (yeah that guy, in a casket match and HIAC)

Cena's beaten him too.

Just because he is facing Cena you people are going to forget\ignore just how big of a deal HBK is? This is the Show-stopper, the Main Event, Mr. Wrestlemania, the Heart Break Kid- Shawn Michaels!

I haven't forgotten. I just think Cena is better.

 

[Loveless]

There's 1 simple fact here

42 year old, broken back HBK beat 29 year old John Cena in his prime,CLEAN.

You can argue buyrates, whats best for business, who is stronger, who has more big wins, it doesn't matter. HBK past his best beat Cena, it's a fact.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

There's 1 simple fact here

42 year old, broken back HBK beat 29 year old John Cena in his prime,CLEAN.

You can argue buyrates, whats best for business, who is stronger, who has more big wins, it doesn't matter. HBK past his best beat Cena, it's a fact.

Bullshit.

Every year, I hear how Shawn Michaels is Mr. Wrestlemania, Showstopper, blah, blah. I've been told that the man has had great matches after 2002. He's had some after 2007, I've been told. So what exactly in your mind defines prime? If Shawn was past his prime, then he wouldn't continue to have great matches. He would have lost a step, would he not? I guess HHH, Batista, Jericho, Edge, and Angle are chumps because they lost to a HBK with a broken back. Fuck off with that.

 

[Daniel]

Cena is huge. Big name, big draw. Unfortunately HBK is no slouch. Anyone remember what it sounds like when he comes out? The crowd goes apeshit. Many more one sided crowd responses than Cena's split reaction every week.

I hope you're not saying that HBK was more over than John Cena is. Otherwise I may have to annoy Cmills005 and call you an idiot.

Just because he is facing Cena you people are going to forget\ignore just how big of a deal HBK is? This is the Show-stopper, the Main Event, Mr. Wrestlemania, the Heart Break Kid- Shawn Michaels!

Nicknames are a cute way of disguising HBK's relative lack of success.

No matter how tough, strong and quick Cena may be- In a split second, a blink of the eye- it all wont matter. HBK has made a career out of winning matches with Sweet Chin Music when his opponent underestimates him or thinks he is beaten. The move that can be hit seemingly out of nowhere, just when Shawn is dead in the water- BAM! Lights out.

Super fucking Cena. You can't complain about John Cena for his seemingly impossible comebacks, and then forget about it once it doesn't benefit you. We're talking about a guy who is hated by almost half the audience because of his resilience. The guy who was DDT'd on concrete, and then beat two guys. You want incredible comebacks? Cena's your man.

This will be a brawl. Flat out. No fancy flips or chain wrestling needed. The fact that both men can take a huge amount of punishment and dish it out just as well will proves this will be great. My above post showing a pretty sound scenario seems to give HBK the last fall and win. I just dont see anyone coming to the aid of Cena, but I do see DX giving the assist to HBK.
I really think HBK would squeak out a win in the first fall. That causes a frustrated Cena to beat on HBK in the cell with no help from the outside. Unfortunately for Cena, when that cage rises- he has a few problems waiting for him. That gives HBK a breather while HHH\Chyna do some work.

As I stated above:


I think that once the cage is raised HHH would rush in to attack Cena while HBK is recovering and Chyna would set up the ladder and try to get HBK on his feet. Cena mounts a superhero comeback on HHH and lays him out. Chyna and HBK beat on Cena for a minute and she holds up Cena while HBK goes for the SCM. Unfortunately Cena ducks and HBK kicks Chyna in the face. He has a staredown with Cena and they go at it like 2 wild dogs. Cena hits the AA and goes up the ladder.


Just about that time HHH slides in with a chair, whacks Cena and he falls from the ladder. HHH hits a pedigree on Cena and pulls Shawn to his feet helping him up the ladder.


It makes sense. Even if Cena tries to wear out Shawn with the STF then climbs the ladder, what makes you think someone wont wrap a chair over Cena's head while he has Shawn locked in?


This match will be brutal for both men, but the assistance from DX would be just too much for Cena to win the last fall.

The opening post states "voting will be based on who you feel is the greater of the two competitors". Not "voting will be based on convoluted situations which may or may not happen and that are only brought up because it's the only conceivable way an IWC favourite like HBK can beat John Cena twice in one night".

 

[Loveless]

Bullshit.

Every year, I hear how Shawn Michaels is Mr. Wrestlemania, Showstopper, blah, blah. I've been told that the man has had great matches after 2002. He's had some after 2007, I've been told. So what exactly in your mind defines prime? If Shawn was past his prime, then he wouldn't continue to have great matches. He would have lost a step, would he not? I guess HHH, Batista, Jericho, Edge, and Angle are chumps because they lost to a HBK with a broken back. Fuck off with that.

Illogical nonsense
Firstly even past his prime he was still the best on the roster and putting on the best matches.
Secondly, his prime was before he broke his back (naturally). He was quicker, more durable, more vicious. However good people think he was in his second run, he was slightly better in his first.

Whatever you deem HBK's prime, he beat Cena during his.

 

[nightmare]

I hope you're not saying that HBK was more over than John Cena is. Otherwise I may have to annoy Cmills005 and call you an idiot.

Well call me what you want, but my ears work and I sure hear the crowd pop huge for HBK. In fact, his pops come from the entire fn crowd. Much more of a pop then half a crowd trying to drown out the other half booing the shit out of Cena.

Nicknames are a cute way of disguising HBK's relative lack of success.

He has some memorable nicknames from respect earned through having great success beating some pretty big talent. It is warranted because he earned them. Relative lack of success? I think the HOF, Vince, the IWC and millions of fans across the world say he had plenty of success. If you are using the fact he has put people over during his later years against him- then your an idiot. That is how the business works. You build up a great career, win lots of titles and put younger talent over before you leave. Cena will eventually do the same, just like everyone else.

Super fucking Cena. You can't complain about John Cena for his seemingly impossible comebacks, and then forget about it once it doesn't benefit you. We're talking about a guy who is hated by almost half the audience because of his resilience. The guy who was DDT'd on concrete, and then beat two guys. You want incredible comebacks? Cena's your man.

Well, I never complained about his ability to comeback like a champ nor have I dismissed it or hate him because of it. I stated the fact that HBK is known for that as well, using a lightning quick move that even 'Super' Cena has been taken out with. Both have legit merit to mount a great comeback after being considered down and out.

The opening post states "voting will be based on who you feel is the greater of the two competitors". Not "voting will be based on convoluted situations which may or may not happen and that are only brought up because it's the only conceivable way an IWC favourite like HBK can beat John Cena twice in one night".

Rules state vote how you see fit on criteria you choose. Many vote for numerous reasons including stupid things like mic skill or amount of gold belts on the fireplace mantle. I choose to vote on ability to win. I take into account the talent of both men, factor in the past wins relevant to the match, and then the paramaters of the rules the match takes place under. That scenario plays out just fine.


I dont doubt either man in this match. Both have legit merits and huge wins to their name. Unfortunately for Cena, the match allows outside interference. That gives a big advantage to HBK. History tells us that when a guy has friends, they come to the rescue in tough situations. HBK is in a tough situation here and has help. KB has stated before that only managers\valets\stables can be used in these situations. You cant just say a random person runs in to save the day. The DX factor is relevant here just as it was so many times in the past. They helped Shawn then and would likely do so now.


My scenario seems fitting and something that would likely play out similar if this were in a RL PPV match. Sorry you dont agree, but Im not asking you to. Vote how you want.

 

[The Brain]

This one goes to Cena. I am aware that Michaels beat Cena on Raw in 2007. Let’s not forget that Cena beat Michaels at WM23 just about a month earlier. On the bigger stage with more at stake it was Cena that got the win. This is going to come down to the ladder match since these types of matches always go to the third fall. Michaels hasn’t done very well in ladder matches. In fact one of his ladder match losses was the third fall of a three stages of hell match.

Factor in where this match is being held and it's clear that HBK gets the "dream" win over a less than popular Cena to leave the crowd happy.

It's not on a par, especially as Cena then failed to win the title. Secondly I remember him being booed out of the building, and this was against HHH, hardly a fan favourite either.

We're talking about the same building that HBK got booed out of during his first world title run, right? I think we can call the venue a neutral site.

My big question is what do we define as Cena's "prime" are we saying when he won his first title against JBL? His over year long reign that only ended due to injury? Super Cena we have had after his return from pectoral injury? or The post Rock Wrestlemania Match Cena? I feel that these are all different Cena's for HBK to face

It's all part of his prime. Cena has been on top since 2005. His prime started seven years ago and is still going.

There's 1 simple fact here

42 year old, broken back HBK beat 29 year old John Cena in his prime,CLEAN.

You can argue buyrates, whats best for business, who is stronger, who has more big wins, it doesn't matter. HBK past his best beat Cena, it's a fact.

So you're saying HBK was past his prime in 2007? What about his match of the year in 2008? And 2009? And 2010? Cena beat Mr. WrestleMania at WrestleMania while both were in their prime.

Cena going over HBK will be worse than punk going over hart.really?just because he's face of the company doesnt mean he gets the pie.He'll manage to get at best one fall and then what.HBK has beaten the biggest names in buisness.Who has Cena beaten?huh? HBK was in the company when the show's ratings were 7-8,cena's get hardly 3's. Cena lost a match to a visitor of 8yrs where HBK won EC when no one thought he'd be the same after his injury. Vote goes to HBK.

You're going to bring ratings into this? Really? If you want to do that you should get the facts straight. Michaels is often blamed for the low ratings of 1995-1997. It wasn't until Michaels left that ratings went up. It was Austin, McMahon, and Rock responsible for the higher ratings, not Michaels.

I am a huge Michaels fan but if we're being honest he simply would not beat Cena here.

 

[JJYanks121]

When HBK is put into big matches, he loses. That's really the simplest common denominator in this. If there's one match to settle a score with a guy on equal or greater plane than Michaels, he loses. Let's start with his Wrestlemania record to prove this:

His first BIG Wrestlemania match was Wrestlemania 10 to unify the IC belt against Razor Ramon. He became famous because of this match.........and lost.

Wrestlemania 11 he was in the title match........and lost.

Wrestlemania 12 was the one he got put over by Hart 1-0 in an Iron man match. Good for him..........and then ratings tanked.

Wrestlemania 13 was supposed to be the return match where HBK lost to Bret..........and he bitched out.

Wrestlemania 14 he drew Stone Cold..........and lost.

When he came back he beat Jericho at Mania so a victory there. Yay?

Wrestlemania 20 he was just there and didn't take the fall so not really relevant.

Wrestlemania 21 to Angle.......he lost.

Wrestlemania 22 he beat Vince. Yay?

Wrestlemania 23 he got John Cena for the title.........and tapped out.

Wrestlemania 24 he retired a 57 year old Ric Flair.

Wrestlemania 25 and 26 he of course lost to Undertaker.

So, he beat Bret, Jericho, Vince, and Flair but lost to Razor, Diesel, Austin, Angle, Cena, and Taker.

Let's remove Flair since he's 57 and it was a retirement match and argue that only Bret is on Shawn's level. Jericho isn't and Vince is an owner who got zero offense in on Shawn in the match. Every time Shawn draws someone as big as him or bigger, he loses. Cena is a bigger star than HBK (not a debatable point) so conceivably he loses.

Let's go even further though. This match is in the WWE region so it's booked by Vince McMahon. Both men were handpicked to be the "face of the company" by Vince himself. One flopped while the other succeeded big time. One almost bankrupted the company while the other has brought it to new heights financially. Which one do you think he's putting over in a big match? Cena again.

Other than Shawn being "great in ring" and "exciting", which mind you Cena is very underrated in this regard as far as big matches go, Shawn's got nothing on Cena. Cena's the bigger draw, the bigger star, all that stuff. Now, for the stipulation.

A street fight is Cena's thing. He's a brawler. He'd have the advantage in that. Same with a cage match but lets assume Shawn escapes somehow. I mean, no match like this has ever gone only 2 falls. While I know people will say "ladder match and Shawn in the last part means Shawn wins because he's known for it", think again. He's got quite a bit going against him. Firstly, Shawn rarely wins ladder matches. He bumps like crazy and makes the other guy look good (that's his career btw, not being a winner), but he loses. Secondly, HBK is a great athlete and even with the fuck beat out of him would be able to go here. If you doubt that Cena would have energy especially after having the advantage in the first parts, you're stupid. Very few of this generation are athletic specimens like Cena and he's shown every time he's had to that he can go for a long, long time without getting tired. He'd have the energy to climb a ladder and he'd do it to win.

There's no argument in any sense for Shawn to win. He'll do what he does best here and that's bump around and make John Cena look good, but ultimately he will lose in the end. That's big match Shawn for ya. John looks like a million bucks and wins here.

 

[nightmare]

Well if we are focusing so much on losses then why does no one bring up the list of people Cena has lost to early on as well as in his prime? Because that isnt a big factor here. So HBK has beaten some of the best and also lost as well. So has Cena. He lost most recently to Punk (nowhere near HBK prime level) and he lost to The Rock at WM (Rock was nowhere near at his best). All that proves is both men win and both men lose, it can happen anywhere against anyone.


Show me something that proves that HBK wouldnt win here. Not who he lost against in the past, not who Cena has beaten in the past or how many people clap during entrances and especially not who gets more ratings. Cena beat HBK when he was past his prime, yet HBK has beaten Cena during his. Who cares what show it was on, or where it took place. A win is a win. All that shows is that both have what it takes and can beat eachother. Cena can beat an old HBK, but can he beat HBK at his best? Maybe, maybe not. HBK, far from his best, has beaten Cena in his prime. So why cant HBK do just the same again if he was in tip top shape?


Now show me what would stop any member of DX (especially HHH and Chyna) from helping Shawn. Yep they are allowed to do so. What backup does Cena have? The occasional run in from Team Token (Truth\Kofi)? Maybe Cena's dad? Santino? Ryder? Even if they were allowed, who cares? They are all non factors against DX.


So why exactly would HBK lose this with the help of DX? Oh, yeah- Its Super Cena. Well he is good but not immortal nor undefeated.

 

[Stormtrooper]

This to me comes down to the Ladder match. I can see them splitting the first 2 falls, with either man getting the edge in either bout.

So it comes down to the Ladder Match. That means I give the edge to HBK right? NO! Cena has the edge, and here's why.

Shawn Michaels made a name for himself in Ladder matches. That's true. However, he made a name for himself LOSING Ladder Matches. He LOST to Razor Ramon. He LOST to Triple H (in the 3rd fall of this very match-type). He LOST to Chris Jericho.

John Cena WINS ladder matches. Arguably his biggest Non-Mania win during his run with the Gold was a TLC victory over Edge (TLC is identical to ladder matches, just different in name) in Edge's hometown.

Couple his ladder match success with his ability to pin Mr. WrestleMania Shawn Michaels clean at WrestleMania (23), and John Cena wins this rather easily.

 

[Davi323]

I voted for Cena, but I am not very happy about it. This was an incredibly difficult match to predict, and I really like both guys. I hate that I had to vote against HBK in any match, but in this kind of match, think Cena is just more physical, more capable of punishing HBK. But its damn close. This would be a match for the ages.

 

[Dan E. Inferno]

Shawn Michaels happens to be my favourite wrestler of all time, but I feel Cena is the correct choice here. Although HBK did beat Cena on RAW and therefore proved he can beat Cena, Cena beat HBK at Wrestlemania and therefore proved he beat Michaels. So they're both capable of beating each other. Fair enough. Except one match was to hype a Backlash fatal four way and tease a title change at Backlash. The other, the one Cena won, was the main event of Wrestlemania for the WWE championship. I believe Cena holds an advantage in big match situations and I believe Cena would win this match two falls to one.

 

[Daniel]

Well call me what you want, but my ears work and I sure hear the crowd pop huge for HBK. In fact, his pops come from the entire fn crowd. Much more of a pop then half a crowd trying to drown out the other half booing the shit out of Cena.

Cheers, boos - they're all the same.

He has some memorable nicknames from respect earned through having great success beating some pretty big talent. It is warranted because he earned them. Relative lack of success? I think the HOF, Vince, the IWC and millions of fans across the world say he had plenty of success. If you are using the fact he has put people over during his later years against him- then your an idiot. That is how the business works. You build up a great career, win lots of titles and put younger talent over before you leave. Cena will eventually do the same, just like everyone else.

I use the term "relative lack of success" because it's completely accurate. HBK hasn't been as successful as Cena. And I'm not just talking post-2002. In his prime, he wasn't a big draw and was dropped as soon as Stone Cold came along. You can call him what you want, but compared to Cena (so, y'know, relatively), HBK hasn't been that successful.

Well, I never complained about his ability to comeback like a champ nor have I dismissed it or hate him because of it. I stated the fact that HBK is known for that as well, using a lightning quick move that even 'Super' Cena has been taken out with. Both have legit merit to mount a great comeback after being considered down and out.

Uh huh. But it's fair to say that Cena is the guy when it comes to making a comeback. It's his thing. It's not HBK's. Just because Michaels has an strike finisher, it doesn't mean that he wins this match. Cena's AA can come out of nowhere too. I've already given the SummerSlam/Nexus example, right? One of the most ridiculous comebacks in history.

Rules state vote how you see fit on criteria you choose. Many vote for numerous reasons including stupid things like mic skill or amount of gold belts on the fireplace mantle. I choose to vote on ability to win. I take into account the talent of both men, factor in the past wins relevant to the match, and then the paramaters of the rules the match takes place under. That scenario plays out just fine.

Wait, wait, wait. Wait. You're not going on success? That's just bizarre. Success is a great indicator of how good a wrestler is.

I dont doubt either man in this match. Both have legit merits and huge wins to their name. Unfortunately for Cena, the match allows outside interference. That gives a big advantage to HBK. History tells us that when a guy has friends, they come to the rescue in tough situations. HBK is in a tough situation here and has help. KB has stated before that only managers\valets\stables can be used in these situations. You cant just say a random person runs in to save the day. The DX factor is relevant here just as it was so many times in the past. They helped Shawn then and would likely do so now.

My scenario seems fitting and something that would likely play out similar if this were in a RL PPV match. Sorry you dont agree, but Im not asking you to. Vote how you want.

My point was that you've offered lttle to no reasons why HBK should win, and have instead resorted to creating a complex fantasy scenario. Sure, because of DX interference, HBK could win. It doesn't mean that he should win.

 

[Lion's Sacrifice]

In this type of match up, Cena is the obvious favorite.

The first fall is where Cena will win this match up. He may not win the fall, but he will dish out enough punishment that HBK will not be able to overcome. The street fight rules heavily favor Cena. I just cannot see how HBK would be able to overcome the punishment that Cens will throw at him. We've seen Cena go through many people in atmospheres like this one. Ranging from I Quit matches to anything goes Iron Man matches. This fall goes to Cena.

As for the second fall, Cena will continue to punish Michaels. I can see Michaels winning this by escaping the cage. However, Cena will continue to punish Michaels throughout. The cage favors Cena once again, but as I said, I can see HBK pulling this one out, barely.

By the time the Ladder Match comes around HBK will be done. Yes, he's got amazing endurance, as can be seen from his Iron Man match with Hart, but Cena has the same endurance. Cena's Iron Man match was anything goes, he took more punishment from Orton than HBK did from Hart. Adding to the fact, that Cena's first experience with a ladder type match was a TLC match with Edge. Who he was able to hand his first defeat in to. Cena is able to climb the ladder after he throws HBK off the ladder or an AA through an announce table.

On top of the last gimmick match that I can recall Michaels winning was against Vince at Wrestlemania 22. The only gimmick matches I can think of that HBK has won off the top of my head would be, the first HIAC (inference by Kane.). The ladder match rematch against Razor. Casket match against Taker. The sweet fight against Triple H, then Elinimation Chamber in 2002. and the match against McMahon. Compare that with Cena. Four I Quit match victories, a TLC win, an anything Goes Iron Man victory over Orton. An extreme rules win over Lesnar, and one over Sabu if I'm not mistaken. I'm not saying Cena hasn't lost his fair share, nor am i taking anything away from Michaels, but this style of match favors Cena.

 

[FitFinlay4Life]

I've went with HBK because I believe he has a great trump card up his sleeve...

As I'm sure everyone will agree this would be a 2-1 either way and, although I'd personally believe Shawn would have the advantage in a Ladder Match, John's TLC win over Edge might suggest otherwise.

Where I think Shawn ultimately has the advantage is that I'd pick DX HBK as being his prime version which means that he has Hunter, Chyna and Rick Rude at his disposal at the key moment to delay John and let the Showstopper cheat his way into the next round.

 

[Bernkastel]

I voted for Shawn Michaels, not because I like him more or because I think he'll win, it's because he's more than a dozen votes down behind Cena. I think the poll should be closer than that considering the caliber of both these guys. As a pro wrestler I think the only real edge that Cena has over Michaels was that he was a bigger draw for a longer period of time. Both are excellent workers, and had phenomenal matches with myriads of different opponents.

This was a HARD match for me to call; I was initially not going to vote at all, so I'll say that I flipped a coin and I voted for Michaels. This match should be close either way... however, I don't think either one of these guys can/or will beat Hogan next round. I don't think there's going to be much love loss to whomever loses.

 

[D-Man]

John Cena is one of the toughest men to ever enter a wrestling ring. He has taken more punishment and has risen from more adversity in brutal match types than anyone I can think of. And he's already defeated HBK in a one-on-one match during a time period when HBK was still pretty hot. I see no possible way that HBK could win here.

Cena for me.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

Cena takes this one. It'll make it three falls, and a ladder match could favor HBK, but Cena would have HBK beaten so badly by that time, the advantage would be rendered moot. I don't care for either wrestler mind you. And think both of them are overrated in their reputations, but in an actual match, where HBK was still main eventing Wrestlemania and was still in the main event in a lot of matches on TV during their feud, Cena won quite a bit.

And in this match, it simply favors Cena more.


HBK's time's up, the time is NOW NOW!

 

[Silly Willy Nilly Vanilly in the Milly]

This match is the best on the tournament that I've seen so far.
Very difficult, but I would have to go with HBK in the end.
I love both men, and they'd really take it over their limits, but the Showstopper would take this one home.
Anyone remember Armageddon 2002 World Title match?
This memory is probably THE reason I pick HBK; though he didn't win, he really took it to HHH.
With that experience, Cena would end up losing; close, but no cigar.
Vote Shawn Michaels, 2-1.

 

[Lion's Sacrifice]

Anyone remember Armageddon 2002 World Title match?
This memory is probably THE reason I pick HBK; though he didn't win, he really took it to HHH.
With that experience, Cena would end up losing; close, but no cigar.
Vote Shawn Michaels, 2-1.

So you're basing your vote off of a match that HBK lost? How does that work?

Just because HBK has been in the match and has experience in that environment does not mean that he's going to win the match up. Take the example of Cena's TLC match with Edge. This was Edge's match. He'd been in involved in multiple times and he'd never lost. Yet, Cena walked in and beat him (in his hometown no less). Even with interference from Lita. In this type of match, it all comes down to how much punishment you can take and dish out. Cena can take more, and dish out more than Shawn will be able to. Both the street fight and cage match favor Cena. The last fall is a match that Shawn does not have a good track record in.

 

[Loveless]

In this type of match, it all comes down to how much punishment you can take and dish out. Cena can take more, and dish out more than Shawn will be able to.

This? This is bullshit from someone under 20. HBK pre-98 was legendary for taking an utter pounding and still managing to win. That guy could take more than Cena could ever dish out and if you don't believe me, go watch HIAC with Taker.

 

[Lion's Sacrifice]

This? This is bullshit from someone under 20. HBK pre-98 was legendary for taking an utter pounding and still managing to win. That guy could take more than Cena could ever dish out and if you don't believe me, go watch HIAC with Taker.

I'm not denying that he can't take punishment. I'm saying he's not going to be able to climb a ladder after the amount of punishment Cena will give out. After the HIAC with Taker, Shawn crawled over to cover him. He didn't have to climb a ladder. That's the point. Shawn may be able to take a great deal of punishment. I.E. His matches with Taker, and Triple H. Not to mention his first couple of ladder matches.

Cena is one of the best at taking punishment and then dishing more out. The point I was trying to make is Cena will be able to take more of a beating and then turn around and give it right back. Go back and watch his first I Quit match. Go and watch his Iron man match. Re-watch his match from Extreme Rules. Hell any Cena match. There's a reason he's called Super Cena.