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Will any todays PG Era Wreslter ever break in TOP 10 Greatest Wrestler of All Time?
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Kodo Sawaki
Championship Contender
Cena is allready there, Orton maybe, Bryan will be there maybe also. Punk tarnished it with leaving but if he stayed he would maybe be there. Lesnar with his current achievments will be remembered greatly eventhough as parttimer talent. From "new guys" Reigns or Rollins maybe, depending how their carreer go. So plenty of guys have chance. At the end its just goes by individual likes so its just difference of opinions...
Rock transcended wrestling by leaving wrestling. The others did so while their main job was wrestling. THAT is why it's not even close.
Anyway, aside from Cena, I don't think anyone of this era deserves that honor. Interchangeable pieces for the most part.
And Macho Man did not get elevated because he died. Just shows how you guys only know what is fed to you. Try doing some research since you claim you're so passionate about this stuff.
BaconBits
WZ Czar of Steaks
The Rock was in major motion picture releases before he left wrestling. Movies that did way, way better at the box office than anything Hogan or anybody else has ever done.
And I never said Macho Man got elevated because he died. I know that's bullshit.
Cena will definitely get a spot but for the others? I am not really sure. To be honest, the only wrestler that I like who's not a part of the attitude era is CM Punk before he left. Maybe if Punk didn't left last year, he can secure a spot being one of the greatest of all time. I'm just really hard to please and the new generation of wrestlers doesn't have that "magic" the charisma that when you see them, you will instantly like them.
hulkamaniac85
Dark Match Jobber
Some of the responses in this thread are insane. I can't believe some people are arguing that it is HARDER to get over in the sport these days than in the past, are you kidding me? With all the exposure that a truly talented star could utilize? There's no way in the world it is harder to get over, it is certainly much easier if a person utilizes all the outlets they have (social media, the internet, tv, house shows, ppvs,so on...) The thing is, it takes talent to transcend the business and very few people are capable of doing that at anytime. A true top 10 list has to be a list of people that would be big at any time period and any era. These are the 10 names that I would argue are the most likely to fit that criteria in WWE history (there's definitely more than 10 throughout history though; Also, im taking it from a strictly WWE point of view, because that's the impact I am most familiar with, so while Flair would certainly be much much higher in a list of all time greats throughout every wrestling promotion, in WWE he's just not on that Mt. Rushmore).
1. Hogan - Any argument for anyone else is absurd (with the exception of Bruno, there can be a debate there, but that is literally it. Those 2 are the majors, everyone else is a league and a half below them)
2. Bruno - Same as above
3. The Rock - The Rock is the next biggest star after those 2. He has left for hollywood, and come back multiple times, and continues to bring excitement and interest to the sport everytime he comes and goes.
4. Steve Austin - Austin I was never a fan of, but he definitely deserves to be up here in the top 5. Drew huge, and was massively talented. He does get overrated though in my opinion when people put him ahead of The Rock or Bruno, or on the same scale as Hogan.
5. Andre - As far as impact in wrestling overall, I would put Andre ahead of Austin, and maybe even with The Rock, but looking at strictly his WWE career and his impact just in that promotion, he's a minuscule bit behind Austin I would say.
6. The Undertaker - Taker was a huge draw for basically 20+ years. Andre Junior more or less.
7. Macho Man - Anyone who tries to discredit the impact the Macho Man had in the WWE is insane. People saying he was only there a short time and didn't have an impact is on something. The man had 5 HUGE wrestlemania runs (Steamboat at 3, Champ at 4, Main Eventing a second year in a row with Hogan at 5, career match with Warrior at 7, Champ match with Flair at 8) Just because WWE hasn't talked about him in years doesn't eliminate his impact, and i hate revisionist history like this. Austin by my count had 5 WM matches of importance, so Savage is on that level (obviously not the same draw, but freaking give the man the credit he deserves as a top 10 star in WWE history)
Now here's where the drop off hits
8. John Cena - I started to try to think of who to put here, and it really has to be Cena. He's someone I could understand people wanting to move up one spot in front of Macho Man because he has been the top guy for so long, but that's certainly as high as he can be justified, because the industry has been down during the entire length of his reign at the top, He really doesn't have a true "classic" match at Wrestlemania, and I do not feel that if all things equal, and industry red hot, that Cena would get above anyone on that top 7 list. Sounds like I'm knocking him but I am definitely not, I think Cena is a great star, and really the only person on the WWE Roster right now that I think will be someone who has done enough to be considered a legit Legend.
9. HBK - HBK is a little bit overrated I think sometimes. He has some great matches after he came out of retirement, and he's always been a talented wrestler, but not really much of a draw. He's someone though that I feel could have got over in any era, regardless of how the industry was doing.
10. Triple H - This was a tough choice. I think it's Triple H because he has consistently been important to the WWE for so long, and had the ability to be a star in any era, but just not positive about this pick.
Anyways though, that is my very long top 10 list lol. When i started i thought it would be very easy to fill out a list of the top 10, but it wasn't as simple as I had hoped. I also think arguments could be made on that bottom part to move in people like Superstar Billy Graham, CM Punk, who had huge impacts on the federation, but who's time at the top were quite short compared to others.
As far as the actual topic, who can break into that top 10, nobody from this era really. The only possibility would be Lesnar if he stuck around after Wrestlemania and continued on as champion, and stayed with the WWE for an extended period (at least several more years). Then I think he would be someone who could be looked at as a top 10 WWE superstar as far as his impact, talent, and all the rest. He's it though. I love Daniel Bryan, but he's not close to this list, and would have to go on a Cena type run for a very very long time to get there. Orton has been an alright star for awhile now, but honestly has there ever been anyone tuning in to see Orton? Has he done anything that really warrants being on the top 10? Maybe I am just too anti him I suppose, but he seems incredibly lacking to me. He would have to be drastically reinvented and put on a super run to get there and crack the top 20 in my eyes.
Sorry about this incredibly long post lol. Over and out now.
1. Hogan - Any argument for anyone else is absurd (with the exception of Bruno, there can be a debate there, but that is literally it. Those 2 are the majors, everyone else is a league and a half below them)
2. Bruno - Same as above
3. The Rock - The Rock is the next biggest star after those 2. He has left for hollywood, and come back multiple times, and continues to bring excitement and interest to the sport everytime he comes and goes.
4. Steve Austin - Austin I was never a fan of, but he definitely deserves to be up here in the top 5. Drew huge, and was massively talented. He does get overrated though in my opinion when people put him ahead of The Rock or Bruno, or on the same scale as Hogan.
5. Andre - As far as impact in wrestling overall, I would put Andre ahead of Austin, and maybe even with The Rock, but looking at strictly his WWE career and his impact just in that promotion, he's a minuscule bit behind Austin I would say.
6. The Undertaker - Taker was a huge draw for basically 20+ years. Andre Junior more or less.
7. Macho Man - Anyone who tries to discredit the impact the Macho Man had in the WWE is insane. People saying he was only there a short time and didn't have an impact is on something. The man had 5 HUGE wrestlemania runs (Steamboat at 3, Champ at 4, Main Eventing a second year in a row with Hogan at 5, career match with Warrior at 7, Champ match with Flair at 8) Just because WWE hasn't talked about him in years doesn't eliminate his impact, and i hate revisionist history like this. Austin by my count had 5 WM matches of importance, so Savage is on that level (obviously not the same draw, but freaking give the man the credit he deserves as a top 10 star in WWE history)
Now here's where the drop off hits
8. John Cena - I started to try to think of who to put here, and it really has to be Cena. He's someone I could understand people wanting to move up one spot in front of Macho Man because he has been the top guy for so long, but that's certainly as high as he can be justified, because the industry has been down during the entire length of his reign at the top, He really doesn't have a true "classic" match at Wrestlemania, and I do not feel that if all things equal, and industry red hot, that Cena would get above anyone on that top 7 list. Sounds like I'm knocking him but I am definitely not, I think Cena is a great star, and really the only person on the WWE Roster right now that I think will be someone who has done enough to be considered a legit Legend.
9. HBK - HBK is a little bit overrated I think sometimes. He has some great matches after he came out of retirement, and he's always been a talented wrestler, but not really much of a draw. He's someone though that I feel could have got over in any era, regardless of how the industry was doing.
10. Triple H - This was a tough choice. I think it's Triple H because he has consistently been important to the WWE for so long, and had the ability to be a star in any era, but just not positive about this pick.
Anyways though, that is my very long top 10 list lol. When i started i thought it would be very easy to fill out a list of the top 10, but it wasn't as simple as I had hoped. I also think arguments could be made on that bottom part to move in people like Superstar Billy Graham, CM Punk, who had huge impacts on the federation, but who's time at the top were quite short compared to others.
As far as the actual topic, who can break into that top 10, nobody from this era really. The only possibility would be Lesnar if he stuck around after Wrestlemania and continued on as champion, and stayed with the WWE for an extended period (at least several more years). Then I think he would be someone who could be looked at as a top 10 WWE superstar as far as his impact, talent, and all the rest. He's it though. I love Daniel Bryan, but he's not close to this list, and would have to go on a Cena type run for a very very long time to get there. Orton has been an alright star for awhile now, but honestly has there ever been anyone tuning in to see Orton? Has he done anything that really warrants being on the top 10? Maybe I am just too anti him I suppose, but he seems incredibly lacking to me. He would have to be drastically reinvented and put on a super run to get there and crack the top 20 in my eyes.
Sorry about this incredibly long post lol. Over and out now.
Kodo Sawaki
Championship Contender
Other then
- Being only active member of the roster beside Cena to be in 60 minutes "Iron Man" match
-Having whole "Age of Orton"
-"Legend killer" persona
-Big Wrestlemania angles like when he literally destroyed whole Mcmahons family
-Being WWEs first WWE World Heavyweight Champion
-Being part of one of most dominating fraction ever in "Evolution"
-Youngest champion WWE ever had
and many other achievments he accomplished.
Not saying he is top 10 of all time but he is at least top 20.
hulkamaniac85
Dark Match Jobber
Other then
- Being only active member of the roster beside Cena to be in 60 minutes "Iron Man" match
-Having whole "Age of Orton"
-"Legend killer" persona
-Big Wrestlemania angles like when he literally destroyed whole Mcmahons family
-Being WWEs first WWE World Heavyweight Champion
-Being part of one of most dominating fraction ever in "Evolution"
-Youngest champion WWE ever had
and many other achievments he accomplished.
Not saying he is top 10 of all time but he is at least top 20.
Yea actually having thought about it I would agree, but definitely the bottom part of the top 20. I think I do underrate him a bit just because I find him so boring personally. When he first came around he was pretty cool, but now it seems like he's been the same character for FOREVER and hasn't gone anywhere at all. That could be said for a lot of people I know, but it just seems really exaggerated with him (imo anyways).
The tough thing is with a list like this too is it's impossible to overstate the impact that veterans like Billy Graham, Pedro Morales, Rocca, and countless others had, and really some of them should probably be in that top 10, but I just don't know enough about them. I think my frustration and the whole reason i posted the other night was because of some people saying guys like Savage didn't belong in the top 10, which is just insane and mind bogglying to me.
MrMojoRisin
Championship Contender
No Sting, HHH, and HBK is bigger than Macho Man.
Macho Man got overrated when he died. Happens to all people, music, artist etc.
Sting, HHH and HBK are all bigger than Macho Man. Macho Mans career was pretty short in WWF. And then he went to WCW, he was always second fiddle at most, and for very short period of time.
And Macho Man didn't have any fanbase in WCW like the others. Like Sting, HHH, HBK. People didn't care that much.
And after 1999 he wasn't relevant. He barely had a fanbase, but got rated first when he died.
And the award for the dumbest post I've ever seen goes to this.
The guy was considered by his peers, fans, critics... pretty much everyone and anyone to be one of the absolute best. He's not 'overrated' because he died. If anything, he became criminally underrated because he left the public eye.
Savage was easily one of the 10 best of all time, and absolutely better than either Triple H or Sting. I put him above HBK too, but that's just personal preference. I could understand arguments going the other way.
You know nothing of Randy Savage. Please educate yourself before you write any more.
How Cena didn't crack the original list is beyond me.
I think if given a chance to be what he is in NXT, Kevin Owens may be the next big thing. The dude is just different, you want to compare him to Brock Lesnar because of the dominant character but he is so much more than that..
Brock Lesnar would've cracked the list had he not left WWE for the first time. Had he been with the WWE even until 2009/2010 then I think he could've been top 5.
I think if given a chance to be what he is in NXT, Kevin Owens may be the next big thing. The dude is just different, you want to compare him to Brock Lesnar because of the dominant character but he is so much more than that..
Brock Lesnar would've cracked the list had he not left WWE for the first time. Had he been with the WWE even until 2009/2010 then I think he could've been top 5.
Cena is a star, in the WORST wrestling Era.
Being number 1 under the worst era, doesn't make you great. It just make you just number 1 for that period of time - but not in all time great list.
The Sychopath
Dark Match Jobber
Cena is already in the top 10. To suggest otherwise is just having a bias against him. He's one of the biggest draws in wrestling history so he's definitely already in the top 10.
FlairFan2003
Mid-Card Championship Winner
No Sting, HHH, and HBK is bigger than Macho Man.
Macho Man got overrated when he died. Happens to all people, music, artist etc.
Sting, HHH and HBK are all bigger than Macho Man. Macho Mans career was pretty short in WWF. And then he went to WCW, he was always second fiddle at most, and for very short period of time.
And Macho Man didn't have any fanbase in WCW like the others. Like Sting, HHH, HBK. People didn't care that much.
And after 1999 he wasn't relevant. He barely had a fanbase, but got rated first when he died.
Savage was arguably the second biggest star in WWE in 1980s behind Hogan, just ahead of an ageing near his career's end Andre.
In the biggest decade of wrestling popularity, Hogan was clearly #1 nationwide and Flair a less decisive #2 with Savage, Andre, and Dusty Rhodes all close behind - Savage was successful as a draw as champion when Hogan was on hiatus (unlike Ultimate Warrior who did not live up to expectations during a lengthy, year long title run) and he was primarily responsible alongside Hogan, Flair, & Sting for WCW's mid 90s revival that made them relevant with WWE nationally again for the first time since 1990-91 (before Flair left and the company nearly collapsed).
Just because Savage chose to stay away from the spotlight post 2000 doesn't mean he didn't have a fan base. He could have made millions if he would have re joined WWE like Hogan & Flair & Nash did post WCW but he chose not too. That was a personal choice not a WWE decisssion.
As for stars of the PG era really does Cena count ??? Technically the PG era starts in 2008 with WrestleMania 24, WWE bans all blood right before the PPV and starts eliminating or strongly cutting down on language in promos. Cena was already a multi time champion at that point, his feud with Edge (maybe his greatest rival) had already come & gone. He was a product of The Ruthless Agression Era (post Attitude) alongside Batista & Randy Orton and a few others of lesser note. He is definitely not a creation of the PG era didn't attain his top status during that era either. Brett Hart was a product of the Hulka-Mania 80s Wrestling Boom but he didn't achieve his highest level of notoriety till the New Generation & Monday Night Wars (aka NWO & Attitude) eras a decade later. Flair & Hogan were major stars in the heyday of the territory era that achieved much greater success in the 80s. That is not the case for Cena.
Now Cena has been a big (maybe the biggest) attraction during the PG era, alongside CM Punk & more recently D. Bryan, but he is holdover from the previous era. This is comparable to Hogan, Flair, & Savage who all were ranked in the Top 10 for the decade of the 1990s by Pro Wrestling Illustrated while it was noted they were the only wrestlers who also Ranked In The Top 10 during the decade of the 80s.
Can any of them crack the Top 10 All Time..... that's pretty tough with Hogan (biggest attraction all time in industry history, #1 1980s, Top 10 1990s, centerpiece of the 80s Wrestling Boom & the 90s WCW Revival), Flair (longest tenured main eventer all time, #2 1980s, Top 10 1990s, several high profile feuds and matches well into the 2000s, greatest longevity as a top tier performer maybe ever), Sammartino (the man they built the WWE around with his seven year title reign, literally the greatest "Face Of The Company" any company has ever had), Harley Race (dominated nearly 15 years of main events between NWA & WWE and carried the NWA during a highly profitable 1970s, easy Top 5 1970s), Steve Austin (at his height as big if not bigger than Hogan or Flair ever were, the face of The Attitude Era, biggest post Hogan-Flair era SuperStar in all of US Wrestling), the aforementioned Savage & Andre... and we haven't even discussed the great careers of Rhodes, HHH, Brett Hart, Nick Bockwinkle, Buddy Rogers, Lou Thesz, Sting, Terry Funk....
Im not sure Cena is in the Top 20 let alone the The Top 10 and at the end of the day he isn't a PG era guy anyway he's a Ruthless Aggression Era holdover who found comparable success to his original era in the next one. Everyone else is too new or not established enough to be able to say.
FlairFan2003
Mid-Card Championship Winner
So Flair isn't listed post 1985 ??? This looks more like the Best Of Sunday Night Heat than Pro Wrestling
boywithbluehanger
I have to poop.
If Cena isn't one of the top 10 greatest of all time, then what was it all for?
What was the point of having him compete his entire main-event career with the WWE as a babyface?
What was the point of all of the video game covers, posters, marquee matches, successful match results, records broken, commercials, and TV spots?
When people speak of the greatest of all time, they're usually not speaking about in-ring ability. They're usually speaking of popularity. I think that most people in the west from ages 5-40 that know anything of pop culture in the last 5 years, at least have a passing knowledge of who John Cena is now. He's the most consistently popular figure in modern wrestling and he's elicited most of the loudest responses in the past 10 years.
Even as someone who hates that he's THE ONLY 5+YEAR MAIN EVENT WRESTLER TO REMAIN A BABYFACE SINCE THE GOLDEN AGE, even I can see that Cena is top 10 material. Hell he probably has more matches, more records broken, more national/international popularity, and more prominence than 5 guys on that list.
What was the point of having him compete his entire main-event career with the WWE as a babyface?
What was the point of all of the video game covers, posters, marquee matches, successful match results, records broken, commercials, and TV spots?
When people speak of the greatest of all time, they're usually not speaking about in-ring ability. They're usually speaking of popularity. I think that most people in the west from ages 5-40 that know anything of pop culture in the last 5 years, at least have a passing knowledge of who John Cena is now. He's the most consistently popular figure in modern wrestling and he's elicited most of the loudest responses in the past 10 years.
Even as someone who hates that he's THE ONLY 5+YEAR MAIN EVENT WRESTLER TO REMAIN A BABYFACE SINCE THE GOLDEN AGE, even I can see that Cena is top 10 material. Hell he probably has more matches, more records broken, more national/international popularity, and more prominence than 5 guys on that list.
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