WCW Region, Lexington Subregion, First Round: (16) Batista vs. (17) Scott Hall

[Con T.]

Is Dave Batista a bigger deal than Scott Hall? Nope. If you would like evidence, please refer to who will be getting cheered next week at Wrestlemania.






Would you mind using your own comments\ideas instead of cutting & pasting things from profight or Wiki? You are making things look bad for those who actually have wrestling knowledge.

Of course he will... It's the nostalgia pop. We haven't seen Hall on WWE TV since, what, 2003? Of course he will get the bigger pop.

That doesn't make him necessarily a bigger deal... If he were a bigger deal, he'd been given a chance to run with the big strap, and never got it. Dave Batista, on the other hand, had a whole brand built around him, headlined multiple Wrestlemania's, and carried WWE out of the funk that was 03.

I mean, I know you have PWF, but c'mon, you can do better than that.

I knew you would post some type of troll comment to my post and try to be a smartass. Did you missed the whole 2 pages of my comments that I posted previous to this post? Try fucking reading next time before posting stupidity and stop trying to troll for attention to get a response.

Dude... This is already a lost case, and you're only going to hurt your side of the argument. Why not just settle into a new debate... There's unlimited potential in that Muta/Dragon thread.

 

[nightmare]

Of course he will... It's the nostalgia pop. We haven't seen Hall on WWE TV since, what, 2003? Of course he will get the bigger pop.

Why the pop? Because he was a big deal. Nostalgia means there was something of merit we hold fondly in memory.

That doesn't make him necessarily a bigger deal... If he were a bigger deal, he'd been given a chance to run with the big strap, and never got it.

Well we all know that some of the best wrestlers never had a world title. Its what they did without it that makes them great. Plus you have to factor in that even though they were good buddies Nash always made sure he was closer to the belt than Hall. Sometimes politics trumps talent.

Dave Batista, on the other hand, had a whole brand built around him, headlined multiple Wrestlemania's, and carried WWE out of the funk that was 03.

He was a guy who fit Vince's mold & was in the right place during a rocky time. Was it good? Yeah, but nothing special in terms of epic.


While that is better than most get, it isnt exactly revolutionary. Being the first guy on Nitro & part of the original 3 for the NWO is a bigger deal to wrestling nostalgia than losing a belt to Taker at WM or being the guy that ruined the Rumble. When you see 'Best of' compilations or video packages, Hall is on the favorable side of things (NWO stuff, Ladder match, etc)- whereas Batista is mostly shown losing to Cena\Taker, hugging Rey or playing machine guns with his pyro.

 

[ocekit]

Damn, this is difficult for me as I was a big fan of both guys at their respective peaks.

Scott Hall was entertaining, but never held a world title, despite numerous title shots. IIRC Gagne planned to put the AWA title on him, but Hall left before that could happen. He was entertaining on the mic and quite talented in the ring, but no matter where he went he often took a backseat to performers who were either bigger or better.

On the other hand, Batista was a WM main-eventer, multi-time champ and was the guy Smackdown was built around during the brand split. He was pretty much groomed by HHH and Ric Flair to be a champion. Yet he too took a backseat to Cena in the overall grand scheme.

They're around the same size physically if my research is right. Batista at his peak might have the power advantage, but it wouldn't be by much, as Scott Hall was pretty strong himself. Hall could be pretty crafty, though.

I might have to flip a coin for this one.

 

[Bdubbs]

Yes, Batista has more title reigns and has been more relevant over the past few years. Batista also has the size advantage. He's gotten clean wins over some pretty big names during his WWE run.

However, I'm voting for Hall. Why? Because he entertains me more than Batista. Hall had memorable moments whether you look at his WWE or WCW career. He was part of one of the most talked about ladder matches in history, which happened in 1994, 20 years ago! He dropped awesome promos as Razor Ramon, his introductory promos were great when jumping ship to WCW, and his NWO work speaks for itself. Although he didn't have world title runs, his impact on the business will be remembered far longer than what Batista has ever done.

Hall finishes off Big Dave and advances to the 2nd round. Score one for the bad guy!

 

[El Rev sXe]

While it may be the WCW region, Batista has something in his favor that Scott Hall doesn't, main eventing Wrestlemania (and other accolades such as winning the Royal Rumble, beating HHH, Cena and Taker clean at least once, being the face of SD!). Yes, Scott Hall was part of one of the greatest wrestling factions, the NWO, however Batista is exactly the type of guy who would defeat the NWO, like Goldberg did.

Batista bomb for the win.

 

[Bythedockofthebay]

As much as I hate to do this and believe me I do. I'm voting Batista, not for any other reason than I can't see Scott Hall going over Batista while Batista has been main eventing. Batista's career accomplishments make it hard for someone like Hall to go over him. Especially since Hall had all the talent to be one of the best ever.

Winner-Batista after a batista bomb

 

[Richard Blonoff]

Look at that man. Name a man with more swag than Dave Batista. You can't do it. And he doesn't let his style stop him in the ring. He wrestles while wearing his skinny jeans. Scott Hall wrestles with alcoholism. Dave wins.

 

[JJYanks121]

I think Scott Hall should be automatically eliminated for possibly having the dumbest supporter ever. There's no way I'm going back 3 pages to quote it, but the guy who said Bret Hart jumping from WWF to WCW and being part of the original nWo wouldn't have been a bigger deal made this the easiest decision in the world.

Bret Hart, the guy who just MAIN EVENTED WRESTLEMANIA and then disappeared showing up on Nitro? How is that NOT bigger than Scott freakin Hall?

If that isn't enough, the group he ran with came up too and if that's important, how come Hall didn't get even a short run with the title. Certainly if his buddies got the better part of two full years, he could have gotten a short test with the big belt, no? Or at the very least a real main event shot over freakin Mabel?

Hell, even WCW didn't think he was a big draw. He won a Battle Royale to get a title shot at WW3 in 1997 and that thing was basically ignored. Nobody saw Scott Hall is a big deal, at all. He was part of the wheel, not the guy turning it. Batista was the guy turning it for WWE along with Cena.

There's very few guys that truly get the top spot to run with. Batista is one of them. Hall is not. This one is way too easy.

 

[Papa Pillman]

Both guys were put in tough positions to shine. Hall was never able to overtake his backstage buddies' spots in WWE and was left in the midcard, and upon going to WCW he not only had to continue in Nash's large shadow, he also had to succumb to the massive air-bass playing shadow of the ultimate spotlight hog.

Batista also was gifted with this curse. In Evolution he was paired with his own Hulk Hogan(Flair) and Kevin Nash(HHH) like presences to be outshone by. Not to mention a fellow prospect with possibly more promise and the family pedigree in the business.

But...

While Hall could never rise above the combo of his high profile friends and highly evident demons, Batista parlayed the spotlight provided by the focus he received due to the high profile company his on-screen character was keeping into six world title victories of his own, and a stay as a top 2-3 guy in the company; a level Hall never reached in either WWE or WCW.

Batista gets the nod here as a result.

 

[nightmare]

I dont see how showing a picture of Dave with a tranny helps your case. Plus, Dave Batista has fairy dust stars & a belly button tattoo. -17 points.



You want to talk about swag? This man invented it & its called machismo.

 

[Bernkastel]

How is Scott Hall winning this? The dude's a fat drunk slob that had to be brought down to the ring in a wheelchair. Batista was the #2 guy of the WWE for years. The logic of this community a-fucking-mazes me sometimes.

Tista is not going out to a career mid carder who sometimes got to dance with main event players. The furry should and would be unleashed.

Vote Batista. It's the only sensible thing to do.

 

[Danger Burger]

How is Scott Hall winning this? The dude's a fat drunk slob that had to be brought down to the ring in a wheelchair. Batista was the #2 guy of the WWE for years. The logic of this community a-fucking-mazes me sometimes.

Hold on a minute there, playa...

Surely, if anything this contest is a purely kayfabe event. We don't let Earthquake win on Sumo merits, nor attest that Benoit's willingness to murder gives him the edge. Real life caused wheelchairs for Scot Hall, where as batistas is as legitimate in this context as Big Show being a cry-baby.

I'm not big in either guys favour, but wheelchairs can't be argued in favour of the 'tist' himself.

 

[Y 2 Jake]

This is clearly a popularity contest. Which doesn't bother me. I'll be voting for my favorites in later rounds. Though at least I'll be honest about it. People seem to really dislike Batista. He's percieved as being limited for some reason. Yet everything he does is convincing, unlike Cena who's a golden boy for some on this forum. Each of Hall's runs under different promotions fizzled out precicely because he was one-dimensional. A one-dimensional mid-card player.

 

[Rizza]

This is definitely a pick em match for me. Batista has more accolades for his career, championship wise at least. Scott Hall though is one of my all time favorite wrestlers ever. I just can't vote against him here. Scott was in a era where not everybody got to be a champ, trial runs were far and few and he still was on that main event level without holding the big one. The WCW region here was a deciding factor for me as well, Hall was pretty big deal when he first came in to WCW. Scott in his day had wins over plenty of big names. So it wouldn't be a stretch to me that he goes over Batista here. Maybe not clean, probably by a outside interference from the NWO or something but yea, Scott Hall advances in my opinion.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

There was a time that Batista was the top star in the WWE, or at least the runner up. Razor Ramon was never there. Yes, Hall had a neat catchphrase, a good look with skills to match and was part of one of the biggest angles in professional wrestling, but to be so involved he really didn't get that spotlight Hogan and Nash did.

Batista wins by a hair. And by a hair I mean Scott Hall no-shows due to intoxication.

 

[HBsam31]

As much as I didn't want to, I had to vote Batista. Hall has made a huge impact on the sport, but he was never truly able to get above midcard status as a singles wrestler. Batista is a multi time champion, and basically had a whole show in Smackdown centered around him. Batista should move to the next round.

 

[The Brain]

Smackdown average ratings

Pre- Batista : 3.39
Post -Batista : 2.84

I assume when you say "Post Batista" you actually mean when Batista was there. If not you're saying ratings went down when Batista left or just leaving out the ratings when he was there. Either way this is irrelevant. Smackdown was moved to Friday about a month or two after Batista went there. It's safe to assume the move to Friday, not Batista, was the reason ratings went down.

Ric Flair won 16 titles by wrestling for over 3 decades in different territories.

Batista was handed 6 titles in 4 years.

How did Flair win titles but Batista was handed titles? Were the outcomes of Flair's matches not predetermined?

Jeff Jarrett won the WCW title 5 times? Would you consider him a bigger success than Scott Hall?

Pretty close. Jarrett did beat Razor for the IC title.

Backstage politics.

Why are Hulk Hogan, Kevin Nash, and Triple H made out to be the devil when it comes to backstage politics but Hall always gets a free pass? Wasn't Hall the guy that had it in his contract that he always had to be the highest paid wrestler for WCW? That really hurt the company when Bret Hart became available while Hall was off tv falling down drunk somewhere.

Ratings went from 2.7 a week before to 3.2 after Scott Hall debuted on Nitro. Hall's drawing power alone was just fine.

Because a lot of fans honestly thought the WWF sent Razor to WCW for a real life invasion. Yes, even The British Bulldog would have caused a spike under those circumstances. He would have been able to sustain that spike and I doubt Hall would have either once the fans realized he was actually under contract with WCW. Hogan's heel turn is what kept the ratings up.

[/QUOTE]

Also if you want to compare career stats:

• Batista had a total of 346 matches in WWE
  Win = 204 (58.96%), Loss = 122 (35.26%), Draw = 20 (5.78%)
  
  
• Scott Hall wrestled 192 matches in WWF
  Win = 149 (77.60%), Loss = 36 (18.75%), Draw = 7 (3.65%)
  
  
• Scott Hall wrestled 146 matches in WCW
  Win = 73 (50.00%), Loss = 58 (39.73%), Draw = 15 (10.27%)
  
  Combined 338 matches
  Win = 222 (65.68%) Loss = 94 (27.81%) Draw= 22 (6.50%)
  

Scott Hall had a better win/loss percentage compared to Batista.

It was a different time when Hall was in the WWF. A lot of those wins are over jobbers like Brian Costello and Tony DeVito. Batista never wrestled guys like that.


I know I just spent a lot of time picking apart an argument in favor of Scott Hall but this match is actually pretty close. I think Batista deserves to move on and I'm voting for him but it wouldn't bother me too much if Hall did advance. Batista was more consistent and the better performer in big matches. I can easily picture Batista beating Hall. Hall beating Batista is a little harder to envision.

 

[FunKay the Inevitable]

Scott Hall. Great talent. Hall of Famer, sure. Better than Batista...eh, no. Look, Hall is a major player in the history books. Founding father of the nWo, legendary ladder match with Shawn Michaels and so on. He however doesn't have the cold, hard, factual success of Batista. Multiple world title reigns, main event(s) of WrestleMania. Victories over the likes of Triple H, John Cena, The Undertaker etc... Batista is a bigger deal, maybe a manufactured one, but a bigger deal none-the-less.

 

[Thriller Ant]

Batista wins this.

Scott Hall was good to very good throughout his career, but he was never the major player like Batista was. Sure, he was in the first ladder match with Shawn, but Shawn is the one remembered for it and focused on in the highlight reels. Sure, he was one of the original members of the nWo, but he was by far the least successful of the three.

Batista has done just about everything in WWE and is a bonafide main event star. Hall is good, but he was never that good.

 

[enviousdominous]

Smackdown average ratings

Pre- Batista : 3.39
Post -Batista : 2.84

I assume when you say "Post Batista" you actually mean when Batista was there.

I've seen the "You must spread more rep around before giving it to Brain again" message a lot these days. I just imagined Bobby Heenan correcting Gorilla Monsoon in that exchange, priceless.

I have to vote now? Shit.

You know what, I don't hate Batista. I can't hate a guy who has his kind of sense of humor. He looks like just a big dumb arrogant roid-head who doesn't take any of his opponents seriously, because he's that damn good at playing one of those. He plays the part splendidly, and then he actually puts on a great match for a guy of his stature. He sells better than any other endomorph in pro-wrestling that I've ever seen, he berates his opponents on the mic as is expected by the jeering crowd and then he does a damn good job of making them look good enough to beat him.

I've seen plenty of work from both men, and for me it comes down to who I respect more. Batista came back to the ring showing off a more humble version of himself and is actually making me WANT to see him perform, and Scott Hall has figuratively (I hope only figuratively) pissed on the fan's expectation that he would actually show up to an event when he'd already been paid in advance to be there. I absolutely loved Scott Hall in AWA, WCW, WWF and WCW again. I have no doubt that half the people who voted for Batista in this also donated money toward Scott Hall's hip surgery.

Vote Batista.

 

[GI Cake]

I was about to vote for Batista, but after seeing EnviousDominous's stance on the matter I will need to abstain from voting. We need to discuss different elements in this matchup and the vibe that WCW has compared to the WWE. Hall was super over in WCW and would be accepted with open arms from the WCW fans while Batista could be booed because fuck you it's my opinion.