Roman Reigns: You cant have it both ways

Discussion in 'The Wrestling Archives' started by A11oftheLights, Feb 22, 2016.

  1. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    Firstly I'm a huge reigns fan. I will always believes he cops unfair criticism solely because he's management's pick

    If the fans want to boo Reigns out of the building, whatever that's your choice. But you cant do what the Cleveland crowd did at Fastlane. They booed Reigns, as expected then mid-match start up a chant of "This is awesome" (which it was certainly a good match) and then went back to booing Reigns once he scored the pinfall we were all expecting.

    You've got to decide if Reigns puts on good matches and deserves his position or you hate him and think he's put in favourable situations. Wrestlemania 31, TLC, the raw after TLC and now Fastlane are all brilliant examples that the guy can clearly go in the ring. The crowd wants to pick and choose but I dont think they should, either respect the man or don't. Jumping back and forward is crap
     
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  2. Coco

    Coco Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    No. I can have it both ways. Reigns is a good wrestler. He's capable of holding his own in a big match. I am cold to him. His booking is tone deaf.

    These are not mutually exclusive thoughts. The world is not binary. Grow up.
     
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  3. Aquaman6686

    Aquaman6686 Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    All we've seen is more and more proof that he CAN'T go in the ring. Roman Reigns has proven that he is an absolutely atrocious wrestler. He can't work a match. He's not Braun Strowman bad, but he's not that far off. He's HORRIBLE. Reigns hasn't had a single decent match since going on his own.

    Roman Reigns would be fine as a midcard talent, and nobody would boo him. But Roman Reigns IS NOT OVER AS A MAIN EVENT TALENT. If you think otherwise, you're insane. Fans are not going to accept him as a main event superstar.
     
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  4. Hyorinmaru

    Hyorinmaru Sit Upon The Frozen Heavens
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    If they booed Reigns in the beginning and booed Reigns at the end I'm guessing the cheers were more in response to Lesnar and Ambrose.


    That being said why can't we have it both ways? I enjoy watching Reigns in the ring. He puts on matches I enjoy and has earned a spot in the Main Event 10 times over since last years Royal Rumble.

    On the other hand he has no charisma, can't cut a decent promo and his character and booking as the underdog is laughably unbelievable and stupid.


    He deserves to be in the Main Event yes, I'll argue that til I'm blue in the face. What he doesn't deserve and what I take offense to his him being the Top Face of the company and being shoved down our throats as such.
     
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  5. MERPER

    MERPER Championship Contender

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    I have no problem with Reigns. and I think WWE Universe is foolish.

    With that said, based on social media reaction, maybe the boo's weren't for Reigns specifically but more for WWE and how the main event (and the whole sorry excuse for a PPV) played out?

    What was good about this PPV besides Jericho/Styles? What storylines were built for WrestleMania 32 except Reigns vs. Triple H?

    Zero creative twists, zero cohesive stories, zero surprises. Everyone knew Reigns was going to win since the moment the match was made but it was as bland and straightforward as can be because WWE just doesn't care anymore. They don't care about ratings, or what fans want and they have no competition to make them put forth a compelling product.

    If I was at Fastlane I'd have been boo'ing at the end not because Reigns won, but because I had just wasted my hard-earned money. And if I currently have a Wrestlemania 32 ticket I am livid right now.

    Keep in mind what they just gave people in the go-home PPV before Wrestlemania: 2 women's matches, R-Truth vs Curtis Axel. A "talk show" segment usually reserved for Smackdown, and a match where your "most dangerous stable/face of fear" couldn't get over 3 worthless guys, 2 of which should be retired already.
     
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  6. shooter_mcgavin

    shooter_mcgavin Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    Well you can think something is awesome but not like one of the competitors regardless of the reason you may not like him or her. Maybe the fans were fully invested on Ambrose or Lesnar over Reigns.

    The problem with Reigns though is not because he's a bad wrestler since he can work a match. It's just that fans just haven't connected to him. The problem also is that his character and personality outside kind of makes him an arrogant douchebag. The only top baby face I know that could get away by being an arrogant douchebag was The Rock but how many people have the charisma The Rock has?
     
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  7. ShinChan

    ShinChan Gone. For. Good.

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    The case with Roman Reigns is that They have not built him credible enough to make me cheer him. I have liked him since Shield. He is a powerful brawler and has a par arsenal of moves. He is not good on mic but I can survive the mic problems. WWE is trying to make me cheer him everytime but it feels like forced one. The guy despite a powerful one is given an underdog-esque booking.

    I cant tell surely about what crowd was doing with him. I just know Ambrose and Brock are hugely over and crowd wanted most probably Ambrose to win it. When they did see Reigns winning, there starts the boos.

    I need to say that Reigns need to be built as a dominant silent heel who is just there to destroy people. Once He is an an established heel, then the face turn will really make people cheer him naturally.

    By the way, Did someone noticed the pop Ambrose received when he tried Dirty Deeds on Reigns at RAW? It makes the whole thing clear.

    :devil:
     
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  8. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    FWIW I'm quoting you milenko because your post expresses all the views i expected to get

    They cheered the spots. All of which reigns was heavily involved in. I wouldnt say he carried the match, but he took the heavy beating early then rallied with Ambrose to get rid of Lesnar which lead to the ending sequence. Had reigns just been taken out and Ambrose and Lesnar had a brutal 1v1 match I'd agree with this.

    Because i found it to be ludicrous to praise the bloke on one hand and then shit on him for the exact same thing

    Now this isnt really a complaint, but why does Bray Wyatt get away with being booked poorly from the same section of the crowd. Why is the booking of a wrestler an acceptable excuse to not boo the fuck out of their segments for one but not the other

    How else do you develop a top face when you have none, or the best one you have has just been forced into retirement, one walked out (maybe they could have taken care of him a bit better), another was turned heel before getting injured and the current face of the company is injured/filming some reality show

    Granted that they were pushing him hard before that, but to an extent their hand has been forced
     
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  9. ShinChan

    ShinChan Gone. For. Good.

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    A simple reason. Because he isnot given a rocket push straight to main event. He has great mic-skills to impress the crowd. He is an unique charcter and has a good gimmick. What gimmick does Reigbs have? :suspic:

    :devil:
     
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  10. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    So why not boo the fuck out of whoever beats him. Do the inverse
     
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  11. dirtymonkey22

    dirtymonkey22 Dark Match Jobber

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    the Only Reason I don't like reigns is with him winning all the time makes it hard to suspend my disbelief since I already know Reigns is the guy, its the same reason people dislike Cena . Wresling is about making you think whats going on is real and anything could happen at any time and Anyone from Rey mysterio to brock lesnar can be champ . Right?
    SO whats happening now is everyone knows everything and everyone knows Roman is the guy WWE want to be the new Face of the company,and this ruins the overall show.
    Yes The triple threat was a great match but it was ruined by the mear fact we all knew Roman was going to win and the execution didn't help as well.


    TO MAKE IT SIMPLE I WANT TO SUSPEND MY DISBELIEF !
     
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  12. shafe_41

    shafe_41 DON'T HINDER JINDER

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    First off, the people at events over the last year/18 months or so need to learn what the word "awesome" actually means. Did Fastlane have a solid match or two? Sure it did. But I heard "this is awesome" on two or three different occassions... none of them being awesome. At all. They're good at best. Putting Lesnar through a table? We've seen that how many other times? Not necessarily Lesnar going through it... but someone for that matter. I'd be willing to say some of us have seen it done 150-200 times. If not more. Why does that garner a "this is awesome" chant like... barely halfway through a match? It's dumb. I truly believe it's dumb. True awesomeness is TLC at Mania 17. Angle/HBK at Mania 21. Hogan/Rock at 18. Hell... those guys did it just by looking at each other. Different situation obviously but you get my point. Something awesome should leave you in awe and wonder. Awesome is not three guys putting on an above average match. Because that's exactly what I saw. An above average, business as usual match from three pretty damn good performers (yes, Reigns is a damn good performer). Not a single moment of it left me speechless.

    I like Reigns. I don't get the hate. I think it's just the trendy thing to do. Reigns is deserving of a main event spot. I could even argue that almost every fan in every building at one point has thought the same damn thing. Rumble '14. I was present in Pittsburgh and when it was down to Reigns and Batista, the place went insane for Reigns. Every. Damn. Person. And I truly doubt it started and ended in that arena. People at home were holding on to hope Batista was going to be the one to go over that rope. Point being... a place isn't going to cheer that loud for a guy that would just be "the lesser of two evils." You aren't. So don't even pretend you would get that into a guy just because he wasn't Batista. So when Reigns was the guy left standing, you all KNEW he was the hand-picked guy. Fast forward to Payback that year. The night before Rollins turned. Shield/Evolution. There was a point in the match Reigns/HHH were face to face circling each other. Reigns was still the handpicked guy. You all knew he was the handpicked guy because he was the guy toe to toe with Batista at the end of the Rumble 4-5 months prior. As Reigns and HHH stared each other down, crowd was going absolutely apeshit. You all wanted it. Every. Last. One of you. Since then... nothing has changed about Reigns and his ring work. Literally nothing. Maybe a little nuance here and there... but nothing major. So the argument that Reigns can't hold his own in a match is totally void. If Reigns was truly that awful in the ring, nobody would have ever cheered the guy at any point in his career. You wouldn't. So don't pretend otherwise. And the night Reigns snapped and went nuts after the TLC match. The world loved him destroying HHH. The world loved him getting the belt off Sheamus. So again... why would you cheer that loudly for a guy winning the title... just because again... he's the lesser of two evils. That should be a "meh" moment for all the smarks out there. But Reigns had you eating out of his hand that night. And the icing on that cake... IT WAS IN PHILLY. THE SAME GD BUILDING THAT BOOED HIM TO DEATH AT THE RUMBLE EARLIER THAT YEAR.

    Is Reigns booking a little underwhelming? Of course it is. But that's not his fault. The silent underdog for someone that's supposed be this huge badass doesn't translate. I get it. Sure there's parallels to Bryan's booking from a few years ago. But every single wrestling angle from here on out isn't going to be an original one. That's almost impossible. Everything in the world isn't original. It's never going to be.

    So I get what the OP is saying. It's like going to school and talking about how lame playing Call of Duty is in front of all your friends because you don't want to be ridiculed... then run home and plop your ass in front of the PS4 and play it for hours when nobody is watching. Except in this case... every Mf'er in the building is watching because they're cheering Reigns at the EXACT same time you are and don't want to be in the unpopular minority. Yet you cheer Reigns at the Rumble in 14, at Payback 14, boo him at the Rumble in 15, cheer him after TLC ends, cheer him the night after TLC, boo him at the Rumble in 16, etc... And who knows what else in between. The proof is there whether you like it or not.
     
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  13. shafe_41

    shafe_41 DON'T HINDER JINDER

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    You can very easily. Get off wrestling news sites and you won't read that "Reigns is a guy that Vince likes." Boom. Done. Disbelief suspended. If sites for backstage news and discussion were around in the mid 80's, they would say "Hogan is a guy Vince really likes." Early-mid 90's, they'd say "Diesel, Brett, and Shawn are guys Vince really likes." Mid-Late 90's, "Austin, Rock, and HHH are guys Vince really likes." You get the picture.

    Like the OP said, with Cena, Rollins, Bryan, Orton all out due to injury... their hand is sort of forced right now.
     
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  14. Khalifa

    Khalifa Where it at doe?

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    I'm sorry but I'm going to have to disagree. If you put Big Show in a cool spot then he will get cheers as well, for that time. We still all know how the fans will react to Big Show in any other moment that isn't a cool spot. You could do it with anybody in fact and unless they are full blown heel then the fans will cheer. What is wrong with the audience enjoying something they don't see, like Brock ales bar getting power bombed through two announce tables.

    The fact that they are booing is because, like you stated in your first sentence, is he is managements pick and the fact that they aren't even trying to hide it. I don't agree that the fans should dictate the show but they have given WWE every reason to cheer for anyone going against Reigns. Yet WWE still is giving us Reigns. Most people hear said exactly what would happen to Reigns Since Rollins injury and it has all happened (when everyone found out about the rumble change people also guessed that). Is that such a bad thing? Well considering WWE tried the same thing last year and it didn't work out then I would say yes. He got over with Bray when he wasn't near the title. After that it was the same process.

    So I think it's a bit unfair to say you can't boo Reigns if you like his spots. Pretty much saying that about Cena too.
     
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  15. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    This is pretty much what I think on the issue, it's worded better because I couldnt be too bothered to type it all out. The case against as to why Reigns shouldnt be the top guy doesnt hold for me when you look at all these moments that shafe has pointed out above
     
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  16. mancini999

    mancini999 Dark Match Winner

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    He gets mores boos than the authority, and that's not good heading into mania. The this is awesome chant has nothing to do with if a guy is over or even if the match is good. People like to chant and the this is awesome is so over done it rarely is chanted in a spot that deserves it.
     
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  17. dirtymonkey22

    dirtymonkey22 Dark Match Jobber

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    SUre I can get off of the sites but that doesn't change the predicable booking Seriously ! Any champ on the card tag teams included should NEVER NEVER NEVER have a 1 0n 1 non title match of anykind but we see it all the time and guess what they lose every time. it's the same reason WhY nxt is so good they tell a good story I care about Zayn I care about Baily I care about Balor and thats because everyone can be champs at any moment Appolo crews can win the belt I'm excited to see Askua vs Baily why good booking.

    LETS BE HONEST THEY BOOK ROMAN LIKE SHIT .
    the finish of tonights match killed the match not because of Roman winning but because of the no-sell of 3 chair shots , at rumble they take roman out of the ring by pulling him under then let him sit in the back and get some coffee, theres been a few shows were the crowd has chanted Romans sleeping because he was. WWE has only made roman look strong once and that was at last years mania but since he looks like that kids who will join a game at the end then brag they only won because of him
     
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  18. Navi

    Navi With the safety off!!

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    I'm a Reigns fan as well but I'm meh with last night's ending. I really wanted Ambrose to win. Not just because I like him as well, but just to change it up a little.

    We've had the last almost 2 years of the Roman Reigns bandwagon, and the wheels have come off so many times it's unbelievable but they just keep going with it. I don't give a damm if he's management's pick, he's not everyone else's pick, and they are tired of it as well.

    Reigns has a great look, one which I might add got him mainly to where he is today. Even without the family connections, he would have made it in the WWE. The problem is though, you can't fall back on your looks forever and yes the guy has come a long way in the last two years but he's had too. And that is the crux of the issue.

    They started pushing him when he wasn't all that great. Forget his mic skills, they were pretty much nonexistent, ring work was marginal but he's got that look that Vince loves. So he was put over other wrestlers who had much more experience and the skill set because of his looks. Can he go in the ring, sure, but so can a lot of others. Vince has said no one goes for the brass ring, well I disagree I really think Ambrose has been killing it lately, and he has been used mainly as a sidekick.

    You know what just do one better, forget trying to get Reigns over with the majority of the crowd, if it hasn't happened by now, it's not going too. Put him in the main event at Mania, we all knew it was going to happen anyway, let him have his Mania moment. Ignore the fans, what do they know really. Let Vince run the company as he sees fit.

    I'm just tired of the does he or does he know deserve to be the face of the WWE. The men in charge think so and that's all that matters, I'm apathetic to the whole thing now.
     
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  19. Dave

    Dave Administrator
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    Uh, yeah, I can..

    No one is doubting that Romania Reigns is capable of having a good match. Actually, the main event of WrestleMania last year was a very good match. In fact, it was one of the most exciting matches of last year for my money. The way that Leonard hit Romania with everything, only for Roman to rally back and take the Beast down and get the crowd going? That was awesome! I think everyone bought into it and how it was presented because it was a great match.

    That said, had Roman actually won the match, there would have been so much booing for him because of the way HE was presented. And there in lies the difference. Most wrestlers are capable of putting on good matches given the right time and the right opponent. But not everyone is going to be a fan favourite and the fans can choose to boo whoever they like. It's like saying that Kevin Owens is not able to have a "this is awesome" chant because people are supposed to boo him.

    As has been demonstrated to you, OP, the two are not mutually exclusive. Stop trying to defend the decisions of the WWE because it falls in line with one of your favourites.
     
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  20. Jack-Hammer

    Jack-Hammer YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!
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    Generally speaking, as some have pointed out, yes fans can have it both ways because, in this particular instance, Reigns was involved in a match featuring two highly popular wrestlers.

    Lesnar is booked as this beast and while I agree that it gets kind of old, it's a formula that works because fans are hanging on every move he makes. Dean Ambrose has the personality and told more of a story with his mannerisms and antics during the match than Reigns and Lesnar combined with their entire approach. Reigns was booked, again, to look like Superman and that's really what so many fans have a problem with; they're tired of seeing the classic John Cena approach to building top guys because they don't find it interesting. It's compounded by the fact that even though they look like they're going in a John Cena inspired direction with Reigns, Reigns is no John Cena; whether it's in the ring, on the mic, as a character or displaying personality, Cena is light years ahead of Roman Reigns and people can see it.

    I agree that Reigns can hold his own in a match, he's pretty decent inside the ring, but I just don't believe the guy is a main eventer because he has no personality or charisma to speak of. His personality is limited to a few mannerisms when he performs a few of his signature moves and that's pretty much it.

    I like Reigns, I genuinely do, but I see him as somebody that's being pushed to a level that's beyond his overall ability. I don't blame the guy for that. I mean, let's face it, ANY wrestler will take a main event spot if it's offered to them regardless of whether or not they themselves think they have the skills; it'd be ridiculous if Hornswoggle was put into the main event, he'd know it as well as anyone, but he'd take the opportunity to be there. Vince simply will not wrap his head around the fact that it's a new day with fans who have a different mind set.
     
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  21. A11oftheLights

    A11oftheLights Getting Noticed By Management

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    Not defending their decisions at all. The way reigns has been booked has been inconsistent (at best) but the guy was getting insane pops with the shield, even when the other two weren't around. Has gotten pops since, why they dont continue down that path is beyond me
     
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  22. Mac

    Mac Pre-Show Stalwart

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    Reigns is a solid wrestler and the cheers were for Ambrose and Lesnar. Fans are booing because he's being forced on to us despite most of us not wanting him.
     
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  23. Rayne

    Rayne Sally Section

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    I'm always amused by these threads that pop up every six months or so, where people insist that the problem isn't the product, but it's that the customers are refusing to buy it like they're supposed to. Special props to the "well if the Internet didn't exist" guy who jumped in.
     
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  24. Dave

    Dave Administrator
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    I agree. But this all stems from the Royal Rumble last year. For me, that was when it became clear that Roman was the horse that the WWE would be riding all the way to the bank. This was at a time when Daniel Bryan was the most over face in the entire company. The same Daniel Bryan that was eliminated unceremoniously from the same Rumble. The real problem is that the WWE are not listening to their fans. If they did, the WWE would be far more successful at building new stars. All of the best stars have been naturally occurring and haven't needed the massive pish from the WWE that Roman has had. It's counter productive.
     
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  25. George Steele's Barber

    George Steele's Barber Advertise Here $9.95/month

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    Some fans liked the main event match last night but didn't like the finish/result. They may have been disturbed by the quality of the PPV overall. The 'This is Awesome' fans may not all be the same as the 'Booing' fans. Really the two events are mostly mutually exclusive.

    But the truth is that most people don't care that a guy can put on or has been in 'good' matches. There are a lot of guys that can put on good matches. They want to be emotionally invested in a guy. Roman Reigns hasn't done much to get fans emotionally invested. He's Mike O'Malley in a world of Hillary's and Bernie's or John Kasich in a world of Donald's and Ted's. It's not fair but it is reality.

    I think fans are stupid to 'Boo'. They are better off being quiet and dismissive. They are best off walking away and not coming back until they hear that they are getting what they want.

    Then again, wrestling fans are so stupid they think they got Daniel Bryan in to the main event of WM 30.
     
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