Rock Region, Minneapolis Subregion, First Round:(11)Ultimate Warrior vs.(22)Sami Zayn

[klunderbunker]

This is a first round match in the Rock Region, Minneapolis Subregion. It is a standard one on one match. It will be held at the Target Center in Minneapolis, Minnesota.

#11. Ultimate Warrior

Vs.

#22. Sami Zayn

​

Polls will be open for three days following a one day period for discussion. Voting will be based on who you feel is the greater of the two competitors. Post your reasons for why your pick should win below. Remember that this is non-spam and the most votes in the poll win. Any ties will be broken by the amount of posts of support for each candidate, with one vote per poster.

Also remember that this is a non-spam forum. If you post a response without giving a reason for your selection, it will be penalized for spam and deleted.

 

[SSJPhenom]

If you're not Rick Rude or Macho Man in these early rounds against Warrior, you're f'd in the A. Warrior never lost blah blah blah was as big a draw as Hogan blah blah blah shook the ring ropes blah blah blah.

Vote Warrior

 

[Uncle Sam]

The Ultimate Warrior is a joke. The Ultimate Warrior is what your friends think pro wrestling is - a steroid-enhanced weirdo in make-up yelling nonsense before a three-minute match consisting of the most phony-looking fake fighting that's ever been seen. Warrior's "skills" are thus: 1) being very, very muscular and 2) terrible promos.

The Ultimate Warrior wasn't like his contemporaries: "Macho Man" Randy Savage, an exceptional athlete with an incredible personality and a silver tongue; Hulk Hogan, a skilled entertainer who could read a crowd like a book and adapt to change time and time again; Sting, who was all of that. The Ultimate Warrior was a one trick pony. The Ultimate Warrior was one year. The Ultimate Warrior, if one is to be brutally honest, was one match.

In 1996, upon Ultimate Warrior's "triumphant" return, Vince McMahon was astute enough to realise this and feed him nought but the most cowardly of heel jobbers, your Hunter Hearst Helmsleys and your Goldusts. Even amongst the wreckage that was Shawn Michaels' WWE championship reign, Vince McMahon saw Warrior for what he was: a fun sideshow.

As history has taught us, WCW was run by people who were anything but astute. What worked for a few months in 1990 was bound to work eight years later. Only no, wrestling moves quickly - too quickly for someone with one string to their bow and a tank of gas that lasts three minutes. Those who do remember what followed wish they didn't.

Say what you will about Sami Zayn in Warrior's era - he'd at least not stick out amongst the Mr. Perfects, the Bret Harts and the Ricky Steamboats. The Ultimate Warrior would be eaten alive in Sami Zayn's era. The monsters in Sami Zayn's era have versatility. The monsters in Sami Zayn's era have cardio. The monsters in Sami Zayn's era complain about the skinny guy who does all the flips, draws all the crowds, sells all the t-shirts and who is going over in the main event.

The Ultimate Warrior is lucky he came along when muscles were appreciated more than athleticism and when yelling was more appreciated than good storytelling - and even then he was a flash in the pan. In the ring with Sami Zayn, a dynamic, resilient, charismatic twenty-first century wrestler, he wouldn't last five minutes. As per usual.

 

[Dave]

I'll be voting for Sami Zayn in this match. As Sam correctly pointed out, Warrior was a flash in the pan that probably went a little bit further than he perhaps should have. But there is no denying the legacy that he has in the world of professional wrestling. But that's not enough to win him a match against someone who can actually wrestle. Zayn is a warrior, just like The Ultimate Warrior. He had a great knack of rising up against the very best and playing the ultimate underdog perfectly well. With his skill and his talent, he could go over The Ultimate Warrior.

And that's why I'll be voting for him.

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

Obviosuly Warrior is going to get this round and it will quite possibly be a squash. But, man I feel bad for Zayn getting knocked out so easily.

Warrior was a huge draw, for as long as he lasted, but it makes me wonder: would Ultimate Warrior work in 2016? How times change. I'm sure that a gimmick like Ultimate Warrior would get booed out of every arena. No wrestling skills, some gruelsome mic skills . He's something like Ryback. Then again, Zayn would never get past the job scene in Warrior's era..

However I can't downplay Warrior's achievements. He was one of the top 3 draws of the Golden Era (Hogan, Savage, Warrior) and that means a lot. But I wonder, how did that guy get soooo over?

 

[tdmoon]

I am not a fan of The Ultimate Warrior. Never was. He wins this easily.

Warrior didn't have a good move-set, stamina, or longevity. But for about a three year period he was near or at the top of the entire wrestling world. Zayn has spent his career in the independents and has about a year time in a major federation. Neither man has a long stretch of time in the highest levels, but Warrior has much more. Warrior even has some territory success, with a Texas Heavyweight championship and a tag title reign.

Zayn has won some regional titles and the NXT title. Warrior has two IC belts and a World Heavyweight title reign. Ultimate Warrior has the clear advantage in championship success.

The Ultimate Warrior has beaten Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Andre the Giant, the Undertaker, Curt Hennig, Rick Rude, Randy Savage, Ted Dibiase and Vader, among many other legends. Each one of those guys is better than Zayn. If he can beat a cast of HOFers like that, he can beat Sami Zayn, no question.

Hey, I don't like voting for the Warrior....but it's the right thing to do.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

I'm no Warrior fan. He was a flash in the pan, as has been said, and thought way too highly of himself. Plus he was a total homophobe.

That said, Sami is early into his WWE career, and while he plays a great underdog, the only guys to really ever get over on Warrior had to use dirty tactics to do so, something Sami has been against as evidenced by his NXT Title chase.

I hate to vote Warrior over, but for now he wins.

 

[NSL]

I'll be voting for Sami Zayn in this match. As Sam correctly pointed out, Warrior was a flash in the pan that probably went a little bit further than he perhaps should have. But there is no denying the legacy that he has in the world of professional wrestling. But that's not enough to win him a match against someone who can actually wrestle. Zayn is a warrior, just like The Ultimate Warrior. He had a great knack of rising up against the very best and playing the ultimate underdog perfectly well. With his skill and his talent, he could go over The Ultimate Warrior.

And that's why I'll be voting for him.

Warrior beat Rude, didn't he? And Rude can wrestle.

I'm not denying that Sami Zayn/El Generico is fun to watch, or a great wrestler, but he has had little impact on the industry as a whole, and does not have nearly the number of moments or achievements that Warrior compiled in his life.

 

[nightmare]

Ugh. Decisions.

Warrior was a force. Regardless of his short time frame at the top, the rest of his career is sooooo terrible. His bigger moments are what people put him so high up the ladder for & they were great, but he has flaws.

Sami Zayn can take a vicious beating for more than 3 minutes. Those beatings have been comprised of far more than some clotheslines, tackles, a gorilla press & a splash. When pushed beyond that moveset and time frame Warrior is a clumsy fuck gasping for air. After a down and dirty assault, Sami has a Hogan like second gear. The guy is best after getting the shit kicked out of him.

Sami Zayn may be new to WWE, but he is a seasoned vet. I can honestly see him taking out Warrior. This becomes a question of legacy & era vs ability & resilience. Warrior has the legacy, but that came in a time that all you really needed was the look. Zayn is more than capable of beating this guy. If he can beat Cesaro (who is probably stronger & 10x the athlete/wrestler than Warrior) he can take this match.


Fuck the legacy of Warrior. I am throwing Sami a vote because in wrestling the underdogs have a tendency to win these things. Just ask that tiny hero Rey Mysterio.

 

[enviousdominous]

Sami Zayn is one of my favorite performers, and that's why this is the hardest vote I've ever had to make. I'm just thankful that he was allowed to be a part of the tournament.

I don't hate Warrior, but I don't think he ever gave as much as Sami Zayn. Warrior's gimmick was a mix of heavy metal and pure mayhem, that would last about three or four minutes because he would almost die of oxygen deprivation. Though; it wasn't difficult to believe that The Ultimate Warrior was every bit as badass as his gimmick made him out to be. He looked the part and he played it to a t.

Sami has a few close calls to tease the audience, but Warrior finds his second win and executes his doom spots for the win. Vote Warrior.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Warrior will almost certainly go over this round, but it won't be because of me voting for him. I was never a fan of the guy even as a kid and nothing about the guy, apart from his roided up physique, ever struck me as impressive; as far as athleticism, in-ring ability and promo skills go, he makes Ryback look like Kurt Angle.

Sami Zayn really hasn't proved a lot and Warrior is certainly one of the handful of guys in these tournaments that almost always goes over in the first round in a standard match against someone like Zayn, who hasn't accomplished remotely as much, who hasn't had the legendary feuds and who hasn't become remembered as such a huge star. It takes the passages of time for those things to happen. As much as I logically should, I just can't vote for Warrior as I think Zayn is someone that can overcome the odds of Warrior's legacy. Zayn is faster, infinitely more athletic, has more heart in his left nut than Warrior had in his entire 275 pound steroid enhanced frame; I think Zayn could outlast him, I think Zayn could wear him down as his energetic offense was something Warrior never really encountered.

 

[NSL]

Sami Zayn really hasn't proved a lot and Warrior is certainly one of the handful of guys in these tournaments that almost always goes over in the first round in a standard match against someone like Zayn, who hasn't accomplished remotely as much, who hasn't had the legendary feuds and who hasn't become remembered as such a huge star. It takes the passages of time for those things to happen. Zayn is faster, infinitely more athletic, has more heart in his left nut than Warrior had in his entire 275 pound steroid enhanced frame; I think Zayn could outlast him, I think Zayn could wear him down as his energetic offense was something Warrior never really encountered.

You gave an awful lot of reasons to vote for Warrior there. And the argument about what Zayn will do is a copy of the argument on why Owens would go over Goldust. This tournament is based off what they have done, and on a stage where Warrior went over Hulk Hogan to become champion, Zayn will be competing in a 7-man ladder match with Zack Ryder and Sin Cara...

As for who had more heart...I think we both know it was Warrior. Too soon?

Warrior will almost certainly go over this round, but it won't be because of me voting for him. I was never a fan of the guy even as a kid and nothing about the guy, apart from his roided up physique, ever struck me as impressive; as far as athleticism, in-ring ability and promo skills go, he makes Ryback look like Kurt Angle.

Promo skills? You're telling me as a kid you weren't even mildly entertained by the wild ramblings? Would Sami Zayn take the wheel and crash the plane?!

 

[nightmare]

Sami would not only land the plane safely, he would also treat the orphans of a nearby village to ice cream. Now tell me, who is a better person? The one who kills hundreds recklessly or the guy that takes the time to chill with the less fortunate?

 

[NSL]

Sami would not only land the plane safely, he would also treat the orphans of a nearby village to ice cream. Now tell me, who is a better person? The one who kills hundreds recklessly or the guy that takes the time to chill with the less fortunate?

There was never a peep about destroying villages. It was about self-destruction. Would Zayn go to those lengths to beat someone like Warrior? Hard to imagine that, if he'd rather be off eating ice cream with orphans.

 

[nightmare]

All that self destruction of his also included doing cocaine and steroids. Sami Zayn is above such things. Now who is a better role model for youngsters? The coked up babbling freak? Surely not. Just one more reason Sami is better.

 

[SSJPhenom]

This debate has gotten ridiculous.

Look, I dislike Warrior as much as the next guy, but Zayn would not and should not go over a prime 88-91 Warrior. He beat everybody and was wildly popular. Idc how much you hate him, how much coke he did, or how many times he self destructed. Warrior would run to the ring, shake the ropes, pump his arms up and down, throw some punches, shoulder blocks, clothslines, a gorilla press slam, and big splash for the 1,2,3. I doubt Zayn would even get in any offense and if he did, Warrior would no sell it.

Vote Warrior

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

My god could you imagine Zayn selling his ass off to Warrior's rigid moves.

This might get a double turn if it ran over 15 minutes.

Anyway, it's Warrior. Really not all that close.

 

[Dave]

You gave an awful lot of reasons to vote for Warrior there. And the argument about what Zayn will do is a copy of the argument on why Owens would go over Goldust. This tournament is based off what they have done, and on a stage where Warrior went over Hulk Hogan to become champion, Zayn will be competing in a 7-man ladder match with Zack Ryder and Sin Cara...

As for who had more heart...I think we both know it was Warrior. Too soon?

Totally missed that joke. And yes, too soon...

Just on a couple of points that you have made here, I'd like to come back in on them. Firstly, what this tournament should be and what this tournament is are two completely different things. It should be about who was and is the better wrestler, but it always gets twisted to suit whatever criteria someone wants to meet so that they can vote which way they like.

But you cannot write off the future. For me, Zayn is a lot like Chris Jericho. He has been all over the world and has worked very hard to fashion a style of wrestling that makes him instantly recognisable and immediately likeable. He is a great worker and has a lot of talent. If he goes half of the way that Jericho did, then he is doing well. The point being that we know that Jericho was a great wrestler, he just hadn't made it yet. Zayn is very capable of being one of the very best in recent memory. You just have to give him some time.

Regardless, his talent is clear to see and he has all of the abilities that Warrior does not. I think he has the advantage.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

So I'm supposed to vote for Zayn because he's a better wrestler? Well, I've seen Warrior pin better wrestlers than Zayn, I don't recall the guy ever losing clean and last I checked Zayn ain't a heel and often goes against taking shortcuts so how am I supposed to believe he can go over someone who never lost clean?

I don't care how much the IWC likes Zayn (I personally love the guy) but he's not beating Warrior, the whole notion that he holds an advantage in this match is beyond ludicrous because he has no advantage. The Warrior can wrestle an excess of 20+ minutes as the best matches he ever had weren't exactly short, at his height there was no one hotter than Warrior and the guy was just plain dominant. He's more charismatic, he is incredibly difficult to put down and I don't see him going down to anything Zayn throws at him whether it be a Koji Clutch or a Helluva Kick.

Warrior has no business losing this match and Zayn has no business winning it. Please don't let your bias towards Zayn cloud your better judgement.

 

[Sean Valjean]

While I was a Warrior fan as a kid, I far prefer Zayn as an overall performer. That said, Warrior wins this.

The "Sami can out-wrestle him" argument is dumb in my opinion. Wrestling technique and finesse means little when Warrior can just run him over and power out of whatever crazy hold Sami tries to lock on him. Warrior's matches basically consisted of him going Super Saiyan the whole time and appearing unbeatable while Sami's bouts are defined by him getting destroyed and eking out a win. Zayn can barely survive Kevin Owens and he's expected to conquer a monster face like the Ultimate Warrior? I don't see it.

I'd LOVE to see Sami advance, but I can't in good conscious vote for him over Warrior. And neither should you.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Super Saiyan? More like Legendary Super Saiyan because like Broly, the only thing Warrior sells is merchandise.

 

[Tastycles]

Ultimate Warrior is in the top 5 most charismatic wrestlers of all time. When he came back in 1996, despite doing virtually nothing, he was more over than every single face on the roster. It's funny, Vince McMahon set out to belittle the Ultimate Warrior and he achieved it to such an extent that people believe he was just a steroid powered wind up toy. Savage vs Warrior at WrestleMania VII stands up to anything that Zayn has done in the match. Zayn may be the best empathetic wrestler since Mick Foley, but I just don't forsee any situation in which he'd be booked over the Ultimate Warrior. His key is crowd interaction and investment, I'm sorry but Warrior pumping up and running on the spot has generated more crowd buzz than anything outside of Hulking up in the history of professional wrestling.

 

[Good Golly It's Ollie]

It's one of those matches where I feel kayfabe now versus kayfabe then would make a huge difference.

If it was the 80s or 90s I think Warrior takes it no question. If it was now, the nearest mainstream equivalent to Warrior is something like ... Ryback, I guess? I think Sami would be more likely to take it in the present climate. I also feel that fan reactions would match up to this temporal dichotomy in similar fashion.

I can't decide on a kayfabe combat basis so I'm going with my personal preference in Sami. The character and the man are just both more likeable to me and I feel that if push came to shove and you debuted these characters at the same time, with the same amount of mic exposure, Sami would be the one to win a crowd over.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

This was a no-brainer for me. Ultimate Warrior wins this extremely easily.

He defeated Hulk Hogan in the main event of WrestleMania 6. He defeated Randy Savage at WrestleMania 7 in one of the best matches I've ever seen.

Those two things trump anything Zayn has ever done.

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

Zayn would die. I know it's fun to vote against Warrior, but I can't. It wouldn't last three minutes. Warrior squashes him like a bug, like only Warrior can.