Is Lesnar's title reign longer to snub CM Punk?

Discussion in '[Hidden] World Wrestling Entertainment' started by Vintage Punk, Jun 11, 2018.

  1. Vintage Punk

    Vintage Punk Pre-Show Stalwart

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    Maybe it's just conspiracy type thinking here but I'm wondering if all this time Lesnar continuing this long title reign is to go over Punk's long title reign so if anything in the future is brought up on long title reigns they can include Lesnar's and not have to mention Punk's? Because in reality Lesnar should've dropped that title a long time ago. Honestly back when Punk had it, they let him continue to have it so they could drop it to the Rock which they had planned since that summer of 2012. Anyways just some thought...
     
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  2. yourdamnluck

    yourdamnluck Pre-Show Stalwart

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    You know, I was thinking the exact same thing. They did it with AJ Lee and now Punk. I liked punk's reign till he was feuding with Jericho after that it was just horrible. Lesner's few appearances have been better than his reign post Jericho. But it ain't good enough to stretch it for over a year. WWE is definitely doing it to snub Punk and hurting themselves in the process.
    Lesner needs to be a regular on raw or drop the belt to RR.
    There's so much potential on raw and all of it is being wasted in absence of a regular champ.
     
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  3. shooter_mcgavin

    shooter_mcgavin Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    It wouldn't be the first time WWE did this (heck the most recent example is New Day breaking Demolition's record) so I wouldn't be surprised if that was a factor in WWE's decision to let Lesnar hold on to the strap much longer.
     
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  4. Issa Genesis

    Issa Genesis Actively evolving

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    Couldn't be, they're different titles. I think that's what a lot of people seem to forget. He can't technically break the record for longest WWE Championship reign in the last 30 years, because he hasn't held the WWE Titles since 2015. That title reign only lasted a few months.
     
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  5. Jack-Hammer

    Jack-Hammer YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!
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    If you want to bet 100% technical about it, then Punk still has the longest WWE Championship run of the last 30 years as the Universal Championship is a title with its own lineage and history. However, WWE's own technical perspective is that Lesnar's run is the longest of any World Championship in WWE during the last 30 years.

    I don't know if it's a snub or not but the timing is suspicious but, then again, you're going to have some who'll say it'd be suspicious no matter what. Let's face it, a lot of internet fans love to create conspiracy theories regarding WWE whether there's any justification for it or not, so it really doesn't matter to many of them one way or the other. At the same time, records are made to be broken and there doesn't have to be a sinister, ulterior motive behind it. For instance, if New Day was a team who was undeserving of having the longest single Tag Team Championship run in company history, then I'd be more inclined to believe conspiracy theories that it was all just a big middle finger to Demolition. In my opinion, however, New Day's a better team and a more entertaining team than Demolition ever was. As for Lesnar, I, like many, have not been a fan of Lesnar being a World Champion given the format of his WWE deals; he's lazy, he's completely uncommitted to the company and his lack of entertaining 1 on 1 matches as champion only reinforce any negative feelings I have about the whole situation. I'm not hating on Lesnar because he gets so much from WWE for so few appearances, Vince is the asshole dumb enough to pay because he loves any and all mainstream attention from the media and Lesnar does deliver that. I'm just tired of Lesnar, I'm tired of the formula for his booking, I'm tired of the lack of entertaining feuds, I'm not at all interested in Roman Reigns taking the title from him, etc.. It's just been one big mess overall and it's hard for me to care when a champion can't deliver entertaining 1 on 1 matches and defends the title once in a blue moon. If Lesnar's 1 on 1 matches were genuinely must see due to their high quality, I'd be okay with him only defending the title once every handful of months but that's not the case.I
     
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  6. d_henderson1810

    d_henderson1810 Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    You make an interesting point.

    If Brock gets the longest reign, to spite Punk, it is ironic, in that Randy Orton won his first WWE belt when he did, so that he would be younger than Brock, who was the previous youngest champion of all time, and Brock had left the company. So, Vince's pettiness might have stuck again.

    At least Punk defended it every month.
     
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  7. shooter_mcgavin

    shooter_mcgavin Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    i am usually suspicious of WWE breaking records only due to the circumstances surrounding it before and after.

    Both Nikki Bella and The New Day broke the Women's and Tag Team title records whose previous record holder had somewhat of a flimsy relationship. Only to drop the title less than a month after breaking it.

    New Day was especially suspicious because they pretty much lost all their non-title PPV matches and lost title matches via DQ despite being babyfaces.


    Orton broke Lesnar's record to become the youngest World Champion only to drop the title a month later and only regained the World Title 3 years later.
     
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  8. Spencesc11

    Spencesc11 Getting Noticed By Management

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    Pretty obvious here....

    Nikki Bella breaks AJ Lee's record

    Brock Lesnar breaks CM Punk's record

    Do the math WWE wants there names nowhere near the top of record books.
     
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  9. strangephish

    strangephish Dark Match Winner

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    Based on what others have pointed out, now that Brock has surpassed Punk he can now drop the title shortly. Unfortunately it will be to Reigns.
     
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  10. Messiah

    Messiah WWE Champion

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    Can title reigns not be longer without snubbing somebody else?.. If Punk was the longest reigning champion ever then maybe.. His title reign doesn't mean shit, it's like the 4th or 5th of all time, who gives a fuck about that.
     
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  11. Stone Cold Tea

    Stone Cold Tea Getting Noticed By Management

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    The math is Nikki is about to get Brock smashed.
     
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  12. Vanilla Midget

    Vanilla Midget Registered Suplex Offender

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    I don't think surpassing Punk's record is or ever was part of the plan. It's a happy accident, that's undeniable. But it certainly is not now nor ever was it a driving force behind this title run.

    Brock Lesnar held the title for the year to make Reigns look strong. That was the reason, that was the angle. Lesnar's run was supposed to end at a year, but they never got Roman over with the crowd. If Dean Ambrose never got hurt, it might have been a different story and Shield Roman might have gone over.

    I have my doubts that the call for Brock to retain at Mania was meant to have Brock's days eclipse Punk's days. It may have come up in the discussion for all we know, or in the back of Vince's head, but it can't have been the deciding factor.

    Yes, Lesnar's run is with a different, albeit pallet swapped, main event WWE title. That belt is still a main event WWE, for better or for worse. Reigns, Strowman or Rollins seem poised to end Brock's run (in that particular order of likeliness). When it's done, Brock will have held a main event belt for more days than Punk.

    What does it matter though? The Universal title is not the belt held by Bruno, Hogan, and Austin. Lesnar wrestled less, defended the belt far less, and participated in far fewer notable matches. Punk wrestled some absolute classics with Cena. Nothing can underpin the importance of that run.

    Let Lesnar break the record. It's significance is subjective. Ultimately each individual fan will recognize which title run matters most to them. WWE will push which statistic matters most to them. In five or 10 years Punk might have come crawling back and Brock might be back in UFC, and WWE will flip the script again. The history books are written by the victors, but they are interpreted by the individual.
     
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  13. I_Like_All_Wrestling

    I_Like_All_Wrestling Championship Contender

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    Is it a "snub"? I guess you can view it that way. But if they could have someone beat that record, why wouldn't they?

    On the one hand, you have a guy who is now the longest reigning champion in WWE of the past 30 years or whatever, who will inevitably be dethroned by someone. Probably Roman. That's a story and an achievement.

    On the other hand, you have a guy who you don't like and who doesn't like you, who bad mouths your company and is in a lawsuit with you, and has said he will never wrestle again, let alone in WWE.

    I'm sure if they had a story they wanted to tell, they would have no problem having Brock drop the title. But certainly the opportunity to remove Punk as a top record holder was considered.
     
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  14. shafe_41

    shafe_41 DON'T HINDER JINDER

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    It's already been said... the Universal Championship isn't the WWE Championship. Different lineage all together. So Punk's title reign is still in tact as far as I'm concerned. Nobody is comparing the Miz and how many days he's held the IC Title to whoever has held the US Title for the most combined days just because they're both mid card titles.
     
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  15. SportsNation2K7

    SportsNation2K7 Dark Match Winner

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    As a lot of people have said before, the Universal Title isn't the WWE title but at the same time WWE is known to do this.

    Divas Title: Nikki Bella passed AJ Lee as the longest reigning champ

    US Title: MVP's first reign was for 343 days back in 07. Then in 2013 when MVP was in New Japan and becoming popular again, Dean Ambrose won it and held it for 351 days (when he was with the shield) and lost the title to Sheamus.
     
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  16. therockiswwf

    therockiswwf The voice of Michael Cole's headset

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    Calling complete bullshit on this one. I don't think WWE gave two shits about what MVP was doing nor were they probably even aiming for this. The title was just floating around anyways and didn't mean much by the time Dean got it.
     
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  17. SportsNation2K7

    SportsNation2K7 Dark Match Winner

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    Nah, MVP was in the upper card of TNA. That was around the same time when he was teaming up with Kenny King and TNA World Champion Bobby Lashley. WWE's longest reigning US champion is now working for the enemy.

    Dean Ambrose won the Championship on May 18, 2013 at that year’s edition of Extreme Rules, defeating Kofi Kingston. From that date until the end of the 2013, Dean Ambrose defended the title a total of 10 times. In 2014, including the title loss to Sheamus on Raw, Ambrose defended just four times. That means that in the span of close to a full calendar year, Ambrose had just 14 title defenses, equaling out to a decimal more than one defense per month. The longest time spent between matches involving the US Championship was from October 28, 2013 when he defeated Big E Langston to February 10th, 2014, a victory over Mark Henry – a near four month period.

    Ever notice Ambrose with the Gold backstage? That’s because for the most part, Ambrose never carried it with him during promos or vignettes. When he did, he held it below camera view. On the rare occasion that he did, it was just to spark a snide remark from one of his Shield teammates about the lack of defending the Title. A comment usually shrugged off or let go with an eye roll. On another note, whenever Ambrose was involved in a match, he’d usually toss his belt to the ground before jumping over the barricade during his entrance or toss it into the ring like any other object. At Extreme Rules, Ambrose even kicked his Championship to the side, showing that the belt meant nothing compared to what was at stake in his match with Evolution.

    Look at numbers 3 and 4 on this list and tell me that I'm wrong:

    https://www.wwe.com/inside/dean-ambrose-longest-reigning-united-states-champions
     
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  18. Strife3

    Strife3 Pre-Show Stalwart

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    WWE has done it again.

    With AJ Lee and Nikki Bella, Nikki held the Diva's championship and went longer.

    The deal with Brock Lesner breaking CM Punks Record to WWE means WWE has their way. What WWE Fails to see is Broke Lesner is the UNIVERSAL champion where AJ Styles holds the WWE Championship, the title of WWE, the one CM Punk walked off with With Brock going over punks record means he held /A/ title not the WWE Championship for that long so in most cases CM Punks record is not broken Despite what WWE Will want you to think

    Of course this is also to snub him but you also have to look at CM Punk was there week in and week out where Part time Brock only defended a handful of times. To me a Champion does not pick and chose when he will show up. this is why as long as Brock holds the Red brands title things like MitB contract is useless. How to you cash in anytime on someone who hardly shows up?

    Think what you want of Punk. he wasted his time going to UFC IMO but he defended the WWE Championship the whole time. If WWE really wants to snub CM Punk let AJ Styles hold onto the title for another 16 months. The WWE Universe does like him as Champ.
     
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  19. @smarkmouth

    @smarkmouth Friendly Neighborhood

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    Give me a break. A few short years ago we complained that titles were treated as hot potatoes and reigns were too short. Now we have long reigns, which are apparently only done to spite past talents.

    Enough.

    While we're at it, Honky Tonk isn't exactly in high favour with WWE, yet I haven't seen effort to break the 64-week Intercontinental championship reign. In fact, Cody Rhodes brought back the classic Intercontinental title design. We should be SHOCKED they haven't reintroduced the egg-shaped belt to spite that ingrate.

    I guarantee when Miz gets his 9th and 10th reign someone's going to say it's because Chris Jericho went to New Japan.
     
    #19
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  20. therockiswwf

    therockiswwf The voice of Michael Cole's headset

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    Oh yes, rival TNA. That company that was a huge threat to WWE. The one that nearly took them down when they moved to Monday nights. They knew they had to do something, especially since MVP was lighting TNA on fire. That something was give Dean Ambrose a title that had essentially become meaningless and let him break a record no one cared about nor noticed. They didn't give two fucks what MVP was doing. They probably gave even less fucks what TNA was doing.

    I have no idea how your post was a rebuttal to mine at all.

    Stone Cold treated the title like shit as well.
     
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  21. Ceen

    Ceen Occasional Pre-Show

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    The WWE title is THE championship
    The Universal championship is the remake of the World Heavyweight Championship, as we know, in one year they are changing brands (WWE x Universal), so they can push the top stars in RAW with the true title. No matter how you push the “other” world title, the WWE championship will always remain as the top. Even if Jinder wins it.
     
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  22. shooter_mcgavin

    shooter_mcgavin Mid-Card Championship Winner

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    I also do like long title reigns but, as I said before, the background surrounding the circumstances of previous "title records" being broken is quite dubious.

    I do feel that Lesnar breaking Punk's record (which is still a modern day record) could just be a happy accident but I also feel that the possibility of breaking Punk's record was partly a reason for Lesnar holding on to for as long as he did.

    I always go with the Diva's Title and New Day Example because they seem to the most obvious.
     
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  23. King Patrick Star

    King Patrick Star K. O. T. R. 2007 -€“ Team Undisputed

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    The WWE has said, is saying, and will say whatever they want to say, in any circumstance that benefits the WWE. They will bend any stat into any fact they see fit.

    Let’s take the WWWF / WWF / WWE / Unified / Raw / Smackdown / World Tag Team Championship Titles for example. Demolition’s record is for the WWWF / WWF / World (Raw) Tag Team Championship Titles (active from 1971 – 2010). The New Day’s record is for the WWE (Smackdown) / Raw Tag Team Championship Titles (active from 2002 – present). The Usos’ record is for the Smackdown Tag Team Championship Titles (active from 2016 – present). There are three different Championship Titles with three different linages, yet they are all Tag Team Championship Titles in WWE history. You can interoperate this any way you want, but the WWE is basically saying that although they are different, at the end of the day, they are the all the same.

    Let’s take the WWWF / WWF / Undisputed / WWE / World / Universal / Heavyweight Championship Titles for example. Bruno Sammartino’s record is for the WWWF / WWF / Undisputed / WWE / World Heavyweight Championship Title (active from 1971 – present). Batista’s record is for the World Heavyweight (WWE’s version of the Big Gold Belt) Championship Title (active from 2002 – 2013). Brock Lesnar’s record is for the Universal Championship Title (active from 2016 – present). There are three different Championship Titles with three different linages, yet they are all World Heavyweight Championship Titles in WWE history. You can interoperate this any way you want, but the WWE is basically saying that although they are different, at the end of the day, they are the all the same.

    The WWE views the Universal Championship Title as a World Heavyweight Championship Title, as it should, because it’s the top Championship Title on one of their two brands. Just like the Tag Team Championship Titles, they view the Universal and World Championship Titles as being on the same level. With Brock Lesnar’s reign surpassing CM Punk’s reign, the Beast is now the longest reigning WWE Heavyweight Champion in the last 32 years, regardless if it’s the Universal or World Championship Title Belt he’s holding.

    I don’t believe the WWE would recognize the Intercontinental and United States Championship Titles as being, for a lack of a better work, “interchangeable”, but “Anything Can Happen In The WWE”.

    As far as spite goes, who cares!?
     
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  24. Fire Marshall Bill

    Fire Marshall Bill Let me show ya somethin!!!

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    I think the WWE's own graphic, which I can only assume came from their website (I saw it on the main page here), pretty much makes this thread look stupid.

    As others have stated, now to include WWE themselves, they're two entirely different titles. The end.
     
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  25. Radical

    Radical Championship Contender

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    Without being in the backstage of WWE, I'm still pretty confident saying that Lesnar's longer-than-Punk's World Title reign has something to do with WWE not wanting Punk as the #1 on that list.

    And if you look at other situations like Nikki Bella's longer Diva's Title reign than AJ Lee (who, surprise, surprise, is with CM Punk) and previously Orton's youngest ever World Champion achievement after Lesnar left the company with some bad blood and they never knew he would ever come back at that point are pretty obvious indicators something was planned.


    That said, there are some problems with that anyway, which makes it harder for WWE going forward. The main one is that CM Punk is still the longest WWE Championship reign of the last 30 years. Now, if we see someone like AJ Styles continue to hold onto the WWE title and get within 100 days of CM Punk's reign and WWE keeps the title on AJ Styles then you can be all-but-100% sure it has to do with taking CM Punk's name of the #1 list on any World Title Longest Reign list.

    Remaining problems with that is Punk would still make the top 5 and even top 3 spot on those lists if they ever had to mention it. And it would be pretty much company suicide to try and have 2 more wrestlers be #2 and 3 on the list and go on 400+ day title reigns JUST TO screw with Punk. But WWE will probably settle with Punk just not being #1.
     
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