Hitler's Influence on The World

[Ferbian]

It is a bad thing because he forced a military rebuild on a country that was not ready for it and would have eventually recovered anyway.

Sure it would've eventually recovered. However to what extend? Who's to say that Germany would ever have recovered to the level that Hitler brought it, or that it wouldn't have surpassed Hitler's visions? We will never know. However it's obvious that while Hitler might have rushed it for a war, to recover the image that Germany lost during World War 1, it was still a successful recovery was it not? Bad or good concept, it was successful.

It was a bad thing because instead of gearing his people and industry for Total War, he should have been building long term industries and farming. Even Volkswagen produced more military machinery than actual civilian cars (and owes its continue existence after the war to a Brit). His social, economic and foreign policies were all the same - war

Sure, I can agree with that Barbosa. However just because he geared it for total war, except for a long time expansion and powerful rule, doesn't mean that it wasn't a good thing. However I won't discredit the potential for it to have been a bad thing. However the love for a country, to go so far to rebuild it in the glory it once was, I repeat, how could that possibly be bad?

It is also a bad thing because of why he did it. It was not to retake Germany's place as a powerhouse (a concept that was only 60 years old at the time) - it was to establish a Reich that was to last 1000 years.

Yeah I know. But he sure as hell ain't the first. If he had the vision to make Germany the 3rd Reich that was to rule like nobody else, sure it's a little power hungry, but the basic of it is a pure and good thing if you look at it the right way, is it not?

Considering the fact that obviously Hitler loved Germany, (Surprisingly enough seeing as he was from Austria, however German roots I believe, right?) he definitely had long time plans, for after the war.

Hitler is not the first, and sure as hell won't be the last one that will get power hungry to the extend of wanting to rule a whole continent, hell the whole world, and will try to do it. Hitler however is arguably one of, if not the one guy that had most success with it (Did he not conquer about the majority of Europe?)

 

[gd]

It's rather pointless to look at the positive things Hitler did. First of all, most of the good stuff that happened because of Hitler wasn't his intention in the first place, as has already been covered early. And secondly, he was, uhh, Hitler.

Looking at things in perspective, there any good Hitler might have done is clearly wiped out by the fact that he was responsible for the death of millions upon millions of innocent people, wouldn't you think. Interesting attempt at something here, but no dice, I'm afraid, young Ferbian.

 

[Барбоса]

Sure he was successful in not just rebuilding the German armed forces putting a country on a war footing for the sake of starting a war is not having a positive influence on your country - it is inherently negative.

Hitler rebuilt Germany on the belief not that she deserved to be a leading member of the global community but that she deserved to rule the world; a world purified of lesser races.

Hitler was a patriotic German that same way that white supremacist KKK members are patriotic Americans...

Want to see what happens to a country that exists on primarily a war footing but does not fight a major conflict? Look at the Soviet Union. An ultra-conservative totalitarian state that was at its height in 1942-1945 when it was at war. Once the war ended it slowly but surely declined until it collapsed 40 years later, leaving its constituent parts languishing with 19th century economies and mindsets. The backwardness of much of eastern Europe and central Asia is due solely to their domination by Soviet Russia.

Despite what you might think about the polar opposites of communism and nationalism, Nazism and Stalinism were side by side on the political spectrum and had Hitler not gone to war but continued in power for another decade, he would have left Germany in the same way - armed to the teeth by dying inside.

 

[LigerBomb]

It's interesting what is being attempting here. Not "thought provoking interesting" but rather much in the same way a person holds up a red sheet of paper, claims it to in fact be 'green', and then proceeds—in the most sincere of ways—to tell you why it's green, "interesting". As a listener you're simply interested in hearing the attempt. You allow yourself to indulge your curiosity for the sheer entertainment and nonsense value. But at no point in time however do you even begin to doubt that the paper is red.

I've read some stupid shit on this board, but honestly this thread quite possibly takes the cake (Not really, but man is there ignorant shit in here (and that last bit wasn't even directed at Ferbs)).

So really what I want to ask is: Is Hitler worth remembering for what he did for Germany as a nation, and the world as a whole, in a good manner. And not in the way that he impacted the world with another world war, and horrible acts against human beings.

No he is not. Not worth it in the least. The suffering, death, and destruction he brought to the world will always, and should always, far eclipse any debatable and negligible positives he may (or may not) have had a hand in. Simply in terms of the quantifiable his negatives far outweigh the positives and that should be the end of this discussion for all practical and realistic purposes. Speaking in the subjective it would first be very difficult to even prove many of the supposed positive you attribute to Hitler as Барбоса has shown. All I read is a want to cherry pick and keep in a vacuum, these supposed "positives", while not considering their far-reaching consequences, nature of origins, intents and motivations, and ultimate final outcomes and interactions within the scope of the rest of history. Because of this we are really arguing the unquantifiable, or perhaps "unprovable" subjective vs. the easily presentable objective. In that way there is really no argument at all. Theoretical apples and tangible oranges one could say. Hitler's negatives exceed his positives and that shall always be the case. 'X' theoretical "positive" will never trump the systematic murder of as many as 17 million civilians. Because of this fact I probably won't reply again as whatever is brought up I'll just reply to with all the murdering and such.
*As an aside his artwork was shit. Trite, uninspired, basic, talentless, boring shit (and that's three years of collegiate level Art History education telling me that).

**NOTE** I would appreciate that this is not going to turn into a thread about Hitlers bad influences on the world, but to keep it about Hitlers good influences on the world

To be able to argue your resolution one must be allowed to raise points that would prove your point contrary. Hence we will need to mention Hitler's atrocities. Sorry.

 

[goodlay]

Well Hitler shouldn't be remembered for the good things he did, seeing he basically wiped out an entire race of human beings.

But he did do a lot of good things. The way I explain it is basically Germany was in the same position America was in, in the 2009 election, except way worse. Rather than a recession, Germany was in a full blown depression. Hitler was built up like their Obama, he was their "last hope" so to speak. He promised people cars, shelter, and a job to get food on the table to support that person's family. And, he succeeded at all of that. Say hello to the Volkswagon (literally translated, the people's car or car of the people) and employment rates shot through the roof. Plus you had the Autobahn, which is still used in Germany today as the country's interstate system. He used this to quickly transport his military, which was brilliant. Not to mention, he was quietly re-building Germany's military even though the Treaty of Versailles said that Germany couldn't build up its military. No one enforced it, so why should Hitler have given a shit?

People always ask, well how the hell did the Holocaust get to that point? Well, with all the success Hitler had early on with supplying jobs to the people, maybe you can see how easily the people were willing to follow and listen to anything this man said or asked of them. Hitler was a damn smart man, and he knew that if he gave the people what they wanted, then he could get on to his bigger plan of taking over all of Europe and exterminating the Jews.

I could sit here and talk about all the negative things about Hitler, but this thread is about Hitler's influence and the good things he did.

But FUCK no, he should NOT be remembered for the good things he did, because the Holocaust and WW2 just speak way louder than anything good he did for Germany. The German people basically act like he didn't exist, and for good reason.