Fingerpoke of Doom

[bigbootydaddyV]

wasn't sure where else to post this, but since it relates to wcw closing and WWE winning the monday night wars i figured its close enough...I just read somewhere how the fingerpoke of doom was one of the starting points of the end of WCW and I want to know why...what was the big deal with it? It furthered a storyline of the NWO coming back together, I had no problem with it when watching it. I was kind of surprised and wasn't feeling ripped off after. I don't get how the fans there can feel that ripped off when the match was announced that night, its not like they bought tickets bc of that match or expecting to see that match. If anything I would think the NWO backstage assault was a bigger rip off as all the action took place in the back and live fans had nothing to do or see. The fingerpoke at Bash at the Beach was a different story as that was a main event of a PPV and people did pay to see that one and it was a shame that backstage politics came out to the public then. But as for the Kevin Nash-Hollywood Hulk finger poke, I think that was a perfectly acceptable storyline for a Monday Nitro show, main event or not. Just because its the last thing on the show doesn't necessarily mean it has to be a match, many shows have ended with much less, as long as it furthers a storyline people should be interested and back to see what happens the next week. Any thoughts?

 

[Hacksaw Highway]

It degraded the prestige of the belt to have one guy lay down to give it to another guy. It was also a huge dissapointemnt, to heavily promote a huge title match main event on free, live TV and then not even really have a match. Also, if I remember correctly the nWo had gotten pretty stale and whatnot and people didn't really want to see it again per se.

 

[ThaRaph]

I Think it had something to do with Hogan and Nash being upset with how creative wanted their match to go....so they said a collective "fuck you" to management with the fingerpoke of doom

 

[bxbigshow]

I actually had no beef with it. And as far as degrading the belt or whatever, around that time the WCW title already changed hands too often. I just watched the Savage dvd where he and Flair traded it back and forth for 3 months.

Besides if it can advance a storyline, the quick switch can work. It has in the past (Hogan-Andre-Dibiase). I'm not saying that WCW creative put much forethought into it, but when it happened I wasn't shocked/dismayed.

 

[CH David]

The reason that the Fingerpoke of Doom is a cause was already stated. The match between Hogan and Nash was hyped to hell, the nWo was done for I think close to a year, and stale and boring when it ended the previous year. So to bring it back, took away from the title of World Champion, as Hall just laid down for so Hogan could regain the belt, and it was also the reformation of the nWo, which people were sick of.

But you have to also remember, this was the night that Tony Schiavone announced that Foley was going to win the title from the Rock. This was a factor, because people were able to see an entertaining finish from the Rock and Foley, with Austin providing the huge assist, something fresh and new with then WWF; compared to WCW, using old and stale material, with too much creative power given to Hall, Nash, and Hogan. In the end people were sick of seeing the same old shit on WCW, and by the time they tried to fix it, it was too late.

 

[ThaRaph]

But you have to also remember, this was the night that Tony Schiavone announced that Foley was going to win the title from the Rock. This was a factor, because people were able to see an entertaining finish from the Rock and Foley, with Austin providing the huge assist, something fresh and new with then WWF;

talk about a backfire

 

[FlairFan2003]

The whole finger poke of doom actuallyhad it's own topic postings last year, surprised to see it renewed. To understand the significance you have to remember where the wrestking war was at this time in jan 1999.

Hogan was mostly mia the last two months of 98 after his Halloween Havoc match vs Warrior. WCW used Kevin Nash's yr long undefeated streak as WWF Champ as part of the promotion heading into his Starrcade 98 title match vs Goldberg. GB's undefeated streak was the most talked about thing in wrestling and like him or not he was more popular at that time than any wrestler in either company not named Austin. The NWO had already split into two factions, a Nash lead WolfPac faction with a revolving door of WCW fan favs like Luger & Sting and the NWO Black & White, the Hogan Bischoff heel faction that mostly was filled with midcarders and enhancement talent other than Hogan & Scott Steiner. The whole NWO story was ridiculous at this point, the group not much of a factor although Bischoff maintained a strong heel presence on TV. During the Starrcade Main Event, Scott Hall, who longago had turned on Nash & sided with Black & White, interrferred and cost Goldberg the match. Lets not forget Goldberg won the title beating Hogan on Nitro before the whole NWO story went to crap.

Now you have potentially the biggets re-match since Hogan/Flair in Hogan & GB, not too mention Nash as champion being courted by the Black & White. Nash and Hogan has never taken place, the real battle for NWO control. Nash vs GB would have been huge since Nash was the only guy who actually beat him. Enter Ric Flair, red hot in his return from contract dispute and now not only wrestling but instilled as President of WCW. WCW fans were dying to see Flair finally go over Hogan. So much potential...

With the Finger Poke, WCW essentially re-estabaished Nash and Hogan as teammates, heels, and leaders of re-formed, leaner NWO purging most of the 2nd rate talent. Hogan again had the belt, Goldberg was hot on his trail, but WCW had a powerful ally in President Flair, finally a balance of power in the fued. WCW then burried Flair, coming up with a ridiculous story where is son is seduced by Torrie WIlson to cost him his PPV match vs Hogan (which has some great set up and drew the company's best buyrate all year). They also left Goldberg almost completely out of the main event scene, leaving him in midcard matches vs Scott Hall and other heels who didn't interest the fans. Goldberg Nash 2 eventually took place on the midcard of an off month spring PPV with no titles and little build up. Meanwhile, with the new lean mean NWO back and way over, WCW quickly split the group again for no reason, turning Hogan face and Flair heel almost out of nowhere to luke warm reaction from the fans, as it made almost no sense storyline wise.

Essentially the finger poke was a master stroke that reinvigorated the NWO as the lead heel force in the company and set up some terrific match and story potential. What WCW did afterwards actually made almost no sense. Nitro was topping 5.0 mark in ratings in Jan & Feb despite being in direct competition with RAW but by late April those numbers were dwindling fast. Even worse, the company was doing so well early in the year despite having Luger, Sting, and Brett Hart all on the shelve with various injuries. Imagine WWE topping 5.0 ratings in 1999 with The Rock, Foley, and Undertaker all out of action at the same time.

The Finger Poke didn't kill WCW but the what came afterwards, all the squandered potential, that was killed the company.

 

[FlairFan2003]

The reason that the Fingerpoke of Doom is a cause was already stated. The match between Hogan and Nash was hyped to hell, the nWo was done for I think close to a year, and stale and boring when it ended the previous year. So to bring it back, took away from the title of World Champion, as Hall just laid down for so Hogan could regain the belt, and it was also the reformation of the nWo, which people were sick of.

.

Actually Hogan & Nash was not hyped to hell, this match took place on just the second Nitro after Starrcade. The first Nitro the night after Starrcade dealt mainly with Bischoff trying to win Flair's personal fortune by beating him in the main event, which Flair wins in a wild finish that involves the Black & White, The Horsemen, DDP, Rey Misterio, Booker T, The Big Show (then known as The Giant) and the surprise return after more than 6 mths of Randy Savage. With the win Flair not only kept his $$ he won the presidency.

The second week Nash stated that he would give a re-match to Goldberg, he disavowed Scott Hall's Starrcade interference, and said before he handled GB he wanted to end the NWO problems once and for all by taking on Hogan one on one. Hogan hadn't wrestled since Oct and had rarely been on TV for nearly 3 months except in comedy skits involving the start of his preseidential campaign, but surprisingly he was there at Nitro and accepted. The match seemingly came out of nowhere but seemed to establish Nash as a clear fan favorite, plus there was interest in Hogan won would Goldberg get him again, remember GB beat Hogan on Nitro to win the title in the first place. So the Finger Poke Match didn't have much build up as big battle, still it had an impact.

 

[FlairFan2003]

I actually had no beef with it. And as far as degrading the belt or whatever, around that time the WCW title already changed hands too often. I just watched the Savage dvd where he and Flair traded it back and forth for 3 months.

The title wasn't changing hands much around the time of the Finger Poke. The title traded between Sting, Savage & Hogan during the early part of 98, then settled on Hogan who held it for 4-5 mths before losing to Goldberg in July. He holds it till the end of the year.

The Flair-Savage story you alluded to was nearly 4 yrs earlier, as Flair mostly dominates that title from Dec 95 (beating Savage at Starrcade)thru April 96 with Savage squeezing in one brief three week reign in between, whicg basically was done to hype Nitro (title change on Live Free TV was unheard of at that time) and set up the SuperBrawl PPV in Feb (where Flair wins it backin cage match), which was annually one of WCW's biggest shows, their euivalent in importance to WWE's Royal Rumble.

 

[onelove1386]

I thought it was amazing. never has any title defense ended with the fingerpoke of doom. i had no problem with it what so ever for the fact that i had never been that surprised in my life with a wrestling match. awesome way to do a match to tell you honestly i have been waiting a long time for it to happen again.

 

[SinCityBlitz]

Essentially the finger poke was a master stroke that reinvigorated the NWO as the lead heel force in the company and set up some terrific match and story potential. What WCW did afterwards actually made almost no sense. Nitro was topping 5.0 mark in ratings in Jan & Feb despite being in direct competition with RAW but by late April those numbers were dwindling fast. Even worse, the company was doing so well early in the year despite having Luger, Sting, and Brett Hart all on the shelve with various injuries. Imagine WWE topping 5.0 ratings in 1999 with The Rock, Foley, and Undertaker all out of action at the same time.

I disagree along with MANY others at that time. A lot of fans were livid because the nWo had pretty much ran it's course already. Plus they were taking shots at Foley winning the title while giving the fans a big middle finger with their main event. They were being ripped right and left and deserved every minute of it.

 

[bigbootydaddyV]

ok...i guess i did forget most of what was going on around that time because i thought it was a black and white vs wolfpac thing...forgot it was right after nash beat goldberg. One thing though...as far as degrading the title then what about when Andre sold it to Ted DiBiase back in the 80s. I vaguely remember that, it sucked because then andre was never really the champ and that sucked because would have been great to see.

 

[milenniumman8]

I had no problem with finger poke of doom either, because it did help further a storyline with the nwo getting back together. I don't think it was the death of wcw by any means though. If some remember WWF did something almost similar to this in 97 or 98 I believe. It happened on Raw around xmas time of which ever year it was. HBK was the European Champion and hadn't defended his belt in over 60 days b/c he was also WWF Champ. Sgt Slaughter made him defend against HHH(this is of course when they were at the height of their DX days) and HBK basically laid down for HHH giving him the belt and basically macking a mockery of Slaughter. I know the European Championship was nearly the same as the WCW title but it was the same type of incident happening.

 

[kingdirrtysouth1]

I had a MAJOR problem with the finger poke! Why not just let Hogan & Nash beat the hell out of each other! It could pulled a good rating, plus it could have further split the NWO & Goldberg could have gotten proper revenge against Nash as well as Scott Hall! We as WCW fans got fucked yet again by the Hogan machine!

 

[Y 2 Jake]

The Fingerpoke Of Doom was awesome. The fact that people still talk about it to this day proves that.

I don't see how it was the beginning of the end for the company. If I had to pick one thing that might've been the beginning of the end I'd pick them having Hogan vs. Goldberg on free TV. Just so they could get the better of WWE for one week.

 

[TheOneBigWill]

I flip flop on liking and disliking this. Currently, I don't mind it as much. I despise that Hulk Hogan was more or less given the Championship this way - and yet people still bitch and moan about how guy's like Edge, Orton, or even Punk have won their Championships. Come on, seriously?! Hogan had a guy flat-out lay down. None of the other names I've mentioned had that.

Anywho, as for this moment in time - how was it horrible? It grabbed ratings, and like Jake talked about - it still has people talking about it, so its clearly a memorable moment. I think the only true downside, is it shouldn't have been Hogan that was involved in the situation. Nash laying down is slightly believable - to Hogan, a man who's arguably one of the greatest Wrestlers of all time - is not.

Heel or not, I'm quite sure in his own mind, Hogan would've believed he could just beat Nash and win the title, instead of being handed the strap.

 

[AndarielHalo]

Oh no way, not at all! The Fingerpoke was just a way to show that Hogan was SOOO thuper macho and thuper Hulkamania, that he was so much better than his 80s self, that his finger could literally knock Kevin Nash out for the win. It was an epic display of power by Hogan, and I think the entire arena was electrocuted by the rays of power emanating from the Orange One. None survived. Well, all of them did, but why would they want to live after having witnessed the eighty billion star classic of that matchup!?


In case it's not obvious (because lots of people tend to negative rep me, completely clueless) I'm being facetious.

 

[bxbigshow]

The Flair-Savage story you alluded to was nearly 4 yrs earlier, as Flair mostly dominates that title from Dec 95 (beating Savage at Starrcade)thru April 96 with Savage squeezing in one brief three week reign in between, whicg basically was done to hype Nitro (title change on Live Free TV was unheard of at that time) and set up the SuperBrawl PPV in Feb (where Flair wins it backin cage match), which was annually one of WCW's biggest shows, their euivalent in importance to WWE's Royal Rumble.

The o.p eluded to the prestige of the title was lessened because of the qucik switch. I was bringing up the point that quick switches have been happening for some time before the F.o.D.

While I did say "around that time" I didn't mean the week before the F.o.D. I just don't have access/time to/for stats/dates and the like, so I generalized. But it still established that a quick switch to advance a story has been done.

 

[FlairFan2003]

You can debate wether or not the Finger Poke was Hogan's politics, etc, but in itself it was a surprising did not see it coming swerve that FINALLY after a year of the convaluted Wolf Pac vs Black & White fued created one single NWO force as lead heels with Goldberg and Flair clearly established as the top faces, with potential for a boat load of great matches/promos that never happened. The finger poke, regardless of the motivation on Hogan's part (was this even his idea or do we just assume this was one of his back stage pwer plays?) was near brilliant. It's the complete and utter cluster #@#@ afterwards that sucked.

How WCW never put Goldberg vs Hogan II together after he got the belt back, and back burnered Goldberg vs Nash II to a mid card match on a throw away PPV is beyond me. And whoever thought bringing Flair back after a 9 mth abscence just to make him job to Hogan again was a good idea should be shot. Even worse, all the build up and potential from finger poke goes out the window when the new and re-formed lean mean evil fighting machine NWO breaks up in April and Hogan turns good as Flair turns heel. WCW fans never bought any of this, and leaving Nash and Goldberg wasted on the sidelines didnt help.

The Finger Poke itself did not spell doom to WCW, but the utter mismanagement of what followed was emblematic of the problems that lead their 5.0 ratings down the toilet as the year progressed.