An idea to make the brand extension work in the future.

[AegonTargaryen]

Hello Gentlemen, and Ladies.

Ever since the brand extension came into effect, I knew that the notion of trying to maintain two separate tag divisions, women's divisions, and/or world titles was sheer absurdity. Numerous threads were created. Many of you held that SDL has become more enjoyable than it ever was and far more entertaining to watch than Raw. Perhaps half of us didn't like the idea of the rosters being split into two.

Look at the newest thread "The Best vs The Rest: The Problem with WWE's Women's Division" on Women's wrestling and two women's titles not being sustainable, and the ideas floating around about how both the women's storylines and match-ups, as well as tag teams, are but dismally finite.

So I hadn't really revealed my idea since June, and at this stage I feel I should.

I know it won't ever come into existence and that the WWE will try its best for a few years to maintain two separate divisions including disparate women's, tag team, and world championships.

My reasons to doubt the long-term sustainability in two separate rosters with two corresponding divisions find their grounds nowhere else but the past:-

The arch of development of Smackdown's new tag titles in 2002 began with a bang, leading to atrocious and limited tag-team feuds on both brands, and ended dismally barely 7 yrs later when they unified the titles.

Not only that, a division which began with teams like Los Guerreros and Angle&Benoit, and Edge and Rey Mysterio, would within 2 yrs see teams like Basham Brothers competing, followed by pretty much the same in the future- limited teams, limited and repetitive match-ups.

A similar situation is evident when it comes to the secondary Women's title called the Divas championship featured on Smackdown in the late 2000s.

Conclusion:-No matter what, in the long run, two disparate women's and tag divisions won't be sustainable, from an entertainment point of view, and just as in the past, will lead to Unifications.

My idea for the brand extension to work is simple:-
1)Openly declare SDL as the SECOND show instead of trying to portray the two as equal, or assuming any sort of competition, kayfabe or not.
2)Give it its distinct identity- treat it like a BRAND instead of a competitor to Raw, just as NXT is a distinct entity.
3)You do that by giving it an exclusive division- the cruiserweights.
4)Raw would primarily feature The World Championship(THE only one, the main title), the women's championship, tag team wrestling, and either of the IC title or US title.
5)SDL would feature cruiserweights, a main title like the US or IC championship, and tournaments or number one contender's matches for the tag titles, sometimes 4 women showing up, and every week, a "main event" with featured wrestlers from Raw, Nxt, and so on.
6)The primary backbone of the show would be the Cruiserweights, and solid mid-card matches which would feature performers from Raw.
7)This same structure can also be implemented while maintaining two main event titles/scenes, as we have now, with Styles, Cena, Orton and Bray Wyatt being on SDL.

This would result in:-
1)More depth in the Raw or the WWE tag team division, women's division, and mid-card.

2)SDL having the cruiserweights as the primary attraction.

3)SDL having only to focus on maintaining its own Main event championship picture.

4)Novelty if you apply the idea of Featured mainevents where a Wrestler from Raw or NxT can fight any wrestler from SDL, with fresh matchups every week.

So instead of Miz vs Dolph Ziggler, Styles vs Ambrose, or Styles vs Ellsworth happening perpetually, you would see Roman Reigns show up to face Luke Harper, or Braun Strowman to face The Miz.

5)Tag Team wrestling involving wrestlers from both shows in concurrent feuds, such as Ambrose/Corbin and Roman/Strowman, where Roman Reigns can team up with Ambrose in SDL's mainevent to face Corbin and Strowman. With the brand extension in effect perpetually, you never get to see tag team combinations such as these.

An example of this is 2002 when Kane could've showed up Smackdown to team up with Taker, who would've faced HHH and Brock Lesnar, in weeks leading up to No Mercy.

I feel that unique mainevents like Reigns and Ambrose versus Corbin and Strowman, which would only happen once, if ever, and an exclusive cruiserweight division, and perhaps a Secondary world title- whether the WWE or the Universal title, would make SDL far more interesting in the long run, while also giving Raw the opportunity to have depth and meaning.

Look back in October. Had this idea been in effect, we could've had Seth Rollins from Raw teaming up with John Cena to take on AJ Styles and Kevin Owens, instead of those dismal Smackdown mainevents featuring James Ellsworth.

 

[shooter_mcgavin]

The roster is too thin it's not going to work. It worked back in 2002 to 2010 because the main event talent pool involved.

Back then you had Ric Flair, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Undertaker, Kurt Angle, and Chris Jericho all either working full time at one point or, at least, on a regular basis.

This made it easier for the newer main event talents like John Cena, Batista, Randy Orton, and Edge to hide any shortcomings that they may have early on their main event run.

Right now you could argue the top guy in the roster is Brock Lesnar but he only works 5 or 6 televised matches a year.

As for the Brand Extension to work or, at least, make sure it has the highest probability of success WWE needs to do two things.

1. Bring RAW back to 2 hours. 3 hours of TV is just too much especially now that there's youtube and DVR, fans might just decide to skip most of RAW thinking they can catch it some other time. Also it fixed the imbalance of the number of people in each brand. I mean you could justify RAW needing more guys because it's a 3 hour show but both SDL and RAW exclusive PPV's and house shows?

2. Redo the Draft. SDL's roster is too thin it's hard for someone to become a star if their feuds start to become stale. Likewise RAW's roster is so stacked that guys like Sami Zayn ins't getting pushed the way he should because there isn't enough spots.

3. Make the titles different. Why are Championship belts so identical to each other with just a change in color and the name "RAW" or "Smackdown" attached to it. At this point i'd rather hold the US and IC titles because of how different. So two things to the titles (1) Change the belt designs and (2) change the names instead of "RAW" _____ champion why not call it Universal Tag Team Champion or Universal Women's Champion and likewise for Smackdown just call then "World" _____ Champion.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

This sounds great for me, the dude sitting on his ass watching TV. It sounds horrible for the WWE and all of the wrestlers who are trying to make money to feed their addictions and fetishes.

WWE is a touring product as well as a TV show. By creating an A and a B you are basically telling your fans that their money is best served being saved for A. It doesn't make fiscal sense. It also hurts the wrestlers who are going to either make less money being featured less or featured at all on A and the guys stuck on B who are on a show that isn't as popular and therefore worth less.

 

[Spencesc11]

Brand split will work fine just need to keep the draft every year to freshen up storylines to keep it going.

This year's draft
Raw - Styles, Ambrose, Asuka, Uso's, Tye Dillinger, American Alpha, & M. James
Smackdown - Balor, Cesaro, Zayn, Nakamura, Stroman, S. Banks, The Revival, and Enzo & Cass

With Cena's absence and losing Styles & Ambrose you would think Smackdown would suffer but adding Balor, Cesaro, & Zayn to go with Orton you have a nice solid main event face side. And heel side would have Wyatt, Miz, Corbin, Stroman, Harper. Have Bray, Stroman, Harper, and Bo Dallas reform a new Wyatt family. I also think Enzo & Cass could benefit from the switch being the premiere face tag team. Sasha Banks becomes the main woman on Smackdown where she can feud with B. Lynch, Natalyia, etc...

Raw gets some life with the chance to reform the Shield. Along with HHH's faction (HHH, Joe, & Owens) and New Day you have 4 solid groups. Asuka & M. James add depth to the women's division to offset the loss of Banks. American Alpha and the Uso's can help build a much better tag division on the main show. Styles needs a face turn, maybe have Anderson & Gallows turn on him and joing HHH's group. Plenty of solid contenders for Lesnar who should defend at every PPV. I would also bump Raw down to 2 hours and then remove the cruiserweights and just keep them on their own Network show. You could have a cruiserweight title match at the big PPV's every year but otherwise keep them off the 2 brands.

 

[justinept]

You NEVER tell your consumers or advertising partners that one show is the A show, and the other is the B show. Telling them this would cost the company ten of millions of dollars. And what exactly is the benefit? There really isn't one.

I do agree with a few points, though. I've never believed the women's division or the tag team division to be large enough to exist on both shows. Seriously - look at the women's division on Raw. It's basically just three people challenging each other for the title every month. And then look at the tag division on Smackdown. It's basically just American Alpha against The Usos. There's nothing else.

I've long preferred for the divisions to be exclusive to one brand. Imagine having a women's division on Raw that consisted of Bayley, Charlotte, Sasha Banks, Alexa Bliss, Becky Lynch, Natalya and Nikky Bella. Add in Asuka and maybe push Nia Jaxx a little harder, and you have a damn good Women's World Title picture. You could run multiple monthly programs from those 9 women, one for the world title and the other as a grudge feud. Hell, on a lesser scale, you still have Dana Brooke, Emma, Naomi, Tamina, and Carmella. Realistically, I could see a second title (perhaps a TV Title, where the champion has to defend the belt weekly on Raw) in this scenario. There are plenty of ways to use all these women, to keep them relevant, and to keep them involved.

You could do similar things with the tag teams. Realistically, there just aren't enough of them right now. On Raw, you have The Club, Cesaro/Sheamus, and Enzo/Cass. The New Day appears to be serving mainly as comic relief these days, and the Shining Stars are basically just enhancement talent. Meanwhile, the picture on Smackdown is even worse with American Alpha, The Usos, and pretty much nothing else of note. Why not unify the tag team division and make it exclusive to one show? If they make it a different show from the one the women are on, then they'll actually have time for more tag-team segments, which would allow them to showcase multiple teams each week. The division would get even stronger if NXT teams like The Arrival and The Authors of Pain transition well to the main roster.

Additionally, why are the 205Live guys on Raw? That never made sense to me past the point of Raw needing to 'fill time.' Put them on Smackdown. Cut down their travel. Why are the smallest guys on the roster the only ones that appear both nights of the week? It's dumb. Change that.

Lastly - the extension should not see talent swapped back and forth for weekly main events. What's the point of having unique brands if they aren't unique?

 

[MWRedskins]

honestly, there's nothing wrong with the championships except the looks (they look too similar)....but i think the amount of championships is fine. the issues are RAW is 3 hours long and isnt using the time right and Smackdown booked their tag team and women's division badly and hasnt had a great face to feud with the top heel. Ambrose is good, but it's clear he's best as a mid carder. a guy like Rollins, Nakamura or Zayn would change that issue. as for the tag team and women's division, the way to fix the tag division is change up the Ascension, Breezango and the Vaudevillians. have the Vaudevillans on tv more and have them win....give the Ascension more of an edge and not make them look like bad versions of the LOD and have Breezango more like two selfie taking prince pretties and not Fashion Police

for RAW, give the Crusierweights more storylines....enough of Stephanie having issues with face talent every 2 segments and please whenever Brock wins the title, have him hold it short term, lose it to Balor or Joe and build THEM up as champion....but even if Brock holds the title for a long time....at the very least, give more Crusierweights more/better storylines and timed matches.

 

[Vanilla Midget]

It would be such a mistake for everyone to make Smackdown a B show again. Smackdown has done nothing but climb in ratings since the live move to Tuesday, though a lot of that could be contributed to the marked climb in story.

A lot of the Op's suggestions are more based on opinion. I think the big question is should there be a brand extension at all?

I would say yes considering Smackdown is presently their most watchable show. That in of itself is reason enough to have a brand extension.

I agree that the Smackdown roster is too thin. Dolph's heel turn has been lame considering all he's had to feud with is Apollo and Kalisto. There have to be changes coming in 2017.

Something in the vein of a draft has to be in the pipe. Both shows feuds seem to have run their course. Maybe it's not a draft, maybe trades or free agency, but some kind of device that kayfabe refreshes.

Smackdown likely gets a bigger NXT debut the night after Mania. Raw just got Joe, so it seems fair that Smackdown get Shinsuke or Roode (whomever loses in Orlando).

So far as the tag, women's and cruiserweight divisions go, you have a situation where there isn't really a right answer.

The original brand extension saw the women on Raw and the tag on Smackdown. It didn't last. You have two options: either one show lacks a division or they're spread thin.

Raw's tag division has many stars, whereas Smackdown's feels like it's populated with jobbers. If you remove a division from a show, what does it say about the other show? For consistencies sake, you almost have to go with the spread thin option.

So far as the homogenization of the titles goes, I'm a bit torn. On the one hand, unique titles might make them seem more important, or do the similar titles seem lame because we're not completely satisfied with the product?

If every wrestling division was having a high quality output, wouldn't we be content with the titles?

Personally, I think they missed a huge opportunity on Smackdown by not reactivating the original WWF women's title and tag titles. That would have added the lineage of the past plus Smackdown could claim it has all the originals.

I don't think the brand extension is quite as busted as the OP, but a few things are true. Feuds look bleak post-Mania as everything is reaching the stale point. Raw still sucks, featuring too many people not being used. As good as Smackdown has been, it has failed to make it tag or women's new comers feel like stars.

 

[Navi]

You NEVER tell your consumers or advertising partners that one show is the A show, and the other is the B show. Telling them this would cost the company ten of millions of dollars. And what exactly is the benefit? There really isn't one.

I agree with this. For years Smackdown was seen as just a step above Main Event and Superstars. It featured a few matches, but was mostly a recap of RAW. In other words it wasn't that fantastic and fans didn't enjoy it.

Since going live and having their own roster, they have flourished. I don't care what anyone says but my personal opinion is that they put on a better show each week. Just look at this week for example, RAW was hard to sit through, Smackdown Live was great. The Miz and Maryse segments imitating Total Bella's were hilarious and worth a second watch. Even the matches were much better than we saw on RAW.

Smackdown Live has consistently put out the better show each week. Don't know if it's the creative writing, but for the first time in a long time I'm interested in Randy Orton. His feud with Wyatt is first rate and is like a mystery novel, you don't know where it is going to go next.

Wrestlers like Baron Corbin, who was totally boring in NXT and Alexa Bliss, one of the best heels on the roster now, have come into their own. That wouldn't have happened if they were stuck on RAW.

Sure the woman's division could use a shakeup, but there are a lot of women on the roster out. Naomi, Tamina, Eva Marie, Emma, Summer Rae and Paige are all MIA. If some of them get back it's not going to light the division on fire but will give some much needed competition. The tag division is a work in progress on each show.

I can understand why the cruiserweights are on RAW. If they were on SD then you wouldn't need 205 Live. Not fair to make them wrestle two matches in one night. So put them on RAW and try to drive up the viewership for 205 Live, which isn't a bad show. It's only 45 minutes because there are no commercials, and Talking Smack comes on afterward.

Sure after Mania we'll see some kind of a draft and some call up's from NXT, so looking forward to fresh feuds and the next year. The roster is very deep, too much for one show.

 

[ShinChan]

Brand extension or split is already working in my opinion.

I am fully against keeping a particular division exclusive only for a single brand. That doesn't make sense. And making Smackdown a B show again? It was B before Brand extension. It's now an A and even better than the so-called flagship show Raw.

I rarely watched Smackdown earlier. Thanks to spoilers. Now? I never miss it. I rather miss Raw. That says a lot. Brand extension is a huge success. Wrestlers like Alexa Bliss and Baron Corbin are shining brightly on Smackdown. Both are exceptionally great heels.

Don't fix what ain't broken.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Declaring Smackdown openly as being inferior to Raw wouldn't make the brand extension work. It would make the exact opposite happen. At the end of the day the WWE's goal is to make money. If they have two brands that are advertised as being on par with each other then it generates more fan interest to attend these events. If the fans are told that Smackdown is not as big of a deal as Raw then why should fans go to a Smackdown show at all when they had just been told that it is better to go to a Raw show? That's stupid. Both shows need to have a complete structure. This includes a World Champion, a midcard champion, a Women's Champion, and Tag Team Champions. Both brands NEED all of the above in order to be complete. If only one brand offers a tag team division then that is half as many potential shows for the fans to go to who want to see tag team action, compared to how many shows there are if both brands have a tag division, for example. Having all the tag teams on one brand is a TERRIBLE idea from a business standpoint. The same can be said for having all the women on one brand. Awful idea that would cost the WWE money in attendance numbers dropping the moment Smackdown got openly acknowledged as inferior. They've made Smackdown matter and gave much deserved opportunities to many, they cannot risk undoing all of this momentum. It would be a big mistake.

You suggested the need to give both brands distinct identity. They basically already have that. Raw is more on the "sports entertainment" side of things. The booking is a bit more bizarre there but you want to watch to see just what will happen, despite it focusing sometimes too much on the authority figures. Then you have the red color scheme used for most of its titles and the red ring ropes (disregarding the purple for the cruiserweights). Smackdown is more of a true main roster counterpart to NXT where it is more simple in its storylines yet they make it work excellently, less emphasis on the authority figures, plus they have blue ring ropes and the blue color scheme used for multiple Smackdown exclusive titles. They already have brand identity. There's no need to fix what isn't broken. One thing I would change, however, is a removal of the Cruiserweight division. Raw's not benefiting from it and 205 Live's time-slot on the Network could go to the UK Championship's show when it launches. All the cruiserweight guys could be better off chasing the midcard belts or forming tag teams. That instantly solves multiple problems. Several new tag teams form plus it also gives many new feud opportunities for the US Champion and Intercontinental Champion.

As much as I like brand extension discussion threads, I find myself in complete disagreement with the ideas brought in from the opening post in this thread. WWE knows better than to destroy what they have going for them at the moment. The return of the brand extension has done wonders for Smackdown making it go from being pointless to being superior in quality to Raw. It made Survivor Series matter! Think about that last one for a moment in particular. It gave opportunities to wrestlers who might otherwise never get it from clogged up cluster messes in the previous title structure. I'd rather see WWE continue to do exactly what they HAVE been doing. With the exception of making part timers be in the Universal Championship scene, they've gotten it right. Presenting both brands as equal (kayfabe) is what will make the brand extension work and thus make the WWE more money, which is their ultimate goal whether people agree with that or not.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

I think you have a fairly good idea in general but I don't see how it would make things any "better" so to speak.

The reason for current incarnation of the brand split was because there was just too much talent to try to cram into both shows. By dividing up the talent amongst RAW and Smackdown, you're giving people opportunities that otherwise wouldn't have opportunities.

Take the women for example. You put them all on one show and what do you do with someone like Carmella? Even Alexa or Nattie? You're gonna have Charlotte, Sasha, Bayley, Nia Jax and probably Becky if we're talking all one division but then beyond that, how do you find the time for the other women? That was the problem in the first place.