WWE & TNA Forum
Wrestling News
Loading...


Go Back   WrestleZone Forums > Wrestling - Non Spam Sections > Impact Wrestling
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Arcade vBookie

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-10-2015, 12:44 PM
It's Damn Real!'s Avatar
It's Damn Real! It's Damn Real! is offline
The undisputed, undefeated TNA &
WWE Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Age: 33
Posts: 4,931
It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...
Default What Do You Consider TNA's Identity to Be?

From a psychological and sociological (as well as anthropological) perspective, identity is effectively the collective conception and expression of a persons' own self, juxtaposed against (or with) group affiliations.

But in simpler terms, it's simply what you identify as. What you expect to be perceived as by others. Most people's identities encompass far more than one trait or group or characteristic, but in the sense of pro wrestling, what we often see is that the identify of the program or company is largely the same. They may have smaller, less important deviations and variations, but all of them adhere to an overall "theme" that is ultimately how that company is perceived.

Lucha Underground, for example, carries with it a saturated soap opera-style storyline that serves to feed the in-ring reasoning of why the men and women of LU are fighting in their ring. It's all shot in high definition with high contrast lighting in a "temple" that is designed to appear in a manner in which most would associate with an underground "Mexican" theme. You're made to feel like you are a spectator to an underground fight club of sorts, run by an untrustworthy promoter, where the action in the ring is also designed to come across as "real" as possible. There's little, if any, comedic relief, and they display the product itself in a very kayfabe-protective style. They also play to the anthropological aspects Mexico's ancestry, specifically it's cultural connections to the Aztecs, right down to their fascination with death. Many of their characters fall in line with this, including Mil Muertes, Pentagon Jr., Vampiro and more.

So what is LU's identity? If you are asking me, I'd say they are a high-pace, high-impact product that is designed to appeal to the historical record of luchadore wrestling and Aztec warrior culture. When you combine all the elements into one product they sell you, the target audience for them would hit as many of these targets as possible, if not all.

TNA, for years, I would have argued were also a high-impact, high-pace, high-contrast product. They effectively stole/borrowed/lifted from the independent scene, predominantly ROH, and took the same approach and style most of those federations and companies operated with but lit it and presented it like higher-priced theatre. The acronym TNA, after all, is supposed to stand for Total Nonstop Action. A play on words designed to attract an audience craving the kind of wall-to-wall action they were apparently presenting you. And for years they did. Then they moved away from it and shifted focus in the "IMPACT Wrestling" era during and post-Hogan, but have now, in a way, attempted to move back toward the identity of old.

But I have a hard time buying it. I don't know if it's the tainted history of that Hogan-era shift, the change in cable carrier, the wealth of associated talent that's left or some ominous combination of all of them, but I'm just having such a difficult time understanding the identity TNA/IW are trying to establish (or re-establish).

The product itself, the wrestling itself, have all been better than average for months in spite of the negative response from fans (mostly online), in spite of the rumors of cancellation and in spite of the cable carrier shift. Hell, even in spite of the wave of talent that's left and is being replaced by far lesser known faces. Yet I can't help but feel the company itself is still in the midst of a damaging identity crisis that they not only created themselves, but can't seem to get out from under.

I can't imagine I'm alone in thinking that, but I figured the best place to start would be to simply ask everyone outright what you consider TNA's identity to actually be?
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayne
The IWC aren't a real group, just an internal conglomoration of the people who say things you don't like.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-10-2015, 01:53 PM
johnbragg johnbragg is offline
Registered User
WWE Women's Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 916
johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...
Default

Recycling and reliving the Attitude Era, including a fascination with ECW and NWO revivals, and regular Vince Russo comebacks.

Complicated storylines that don't pay off. Inattention to detail, a lack of long-term planning.

A company that has looked like it was dying for most of its 13-years-and-counting run, which is now longer than WCW's run.
__________________
"Who will be at Wrestlemania in 2014?" That question should drive everything WWE does.

"Will there be a Bound For Glory in 2011, post-Hogan?" That is my question about TNA.

January 4, 2010. Welcome to the TNApocalypse.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-10-2015, 02:33 PM
World Class Mark's Avatar
World Class Mark World Class Mark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 80
World Class Mark is looking to come up from OCW...
Default

I honestly think of TNA as a show that usually has good/great wrestling matches, and the internet community hates on them. Their story lines are often inconsistent, but I've always liked the in-ring product regardless.
__________________
World Class Mark

FAVES *Flair *Muta *Steamboat *Macho *HBK *Bret *Malenko *DB
*Angle *Rock *Funk *IV *Freebirds *DynamicDuo *Lita *AJ

NOW KO Ambrose Ricochet Seth Brock Sasha Paige
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-10-2015, 02:53 PM
klunderbunker's Avatar
klunderbunker klunderbunker is online now
More Comfortable with the Seesawing
Wrestlezone Hall of Famer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lexington, Kentucky
Posts: 17,759
klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...
Default

I had an answer ready, but the more I think about it, the less sure I am.

Like IDR said, at first TNA was the indies on a national platform. They had high flying as a featured attraction, some big names who could be the draws, and things moving so fast that you wanted to watch and spend most of the two hours jumping off your couch, freaking out over what they managed to pull off this time.

Then however, they started to lose their way, and I think it happened on one particular night. And no, it's not the day Hogan and Bischoff arrived.

It was Bound For Glory 2008, the night that Samoa Joe lost the World Title to Sting.

Though he got his start in ROH, Joe is perceived as a TNA guy. His three way feud with Daniels and Styles is probably the high point of the promotion and the one time that people felt TNA had a chance to really go somewhere. Joe FINALLY won the World Title (about a year after he should have but that's a different story). He then feuded with Booker T. in a watchable but ultimately not great feud over the summer, but his time was almost up.

Joe lost the title to the 49 year old Sting at Bound For Glory 2008. Here are the next few champions with their ages.

Mick Foley (43)
Kurt Angle (40)
AJ Styles (32)
Rob Van Dam (39)
Jeff Hardy (33)
Mr. Anderson (34)
Jeff Hardy (33)
Sting (51)
Mr. Anderson (34)
Sting (52)
Kurt Angle (42)

James Storm would take the title from Angle just after Bound For Glory 2011 and then lose it to Robert Roode eight days later. For the sake of simplicity, we'll say this is over the span of three years, from Bound For Glory 2008-Bound For Glory 2011.

Look at that list. Save for AJ Styles, every single one of them made their name in WWE or ECW. The one who came closest to making his name in TNA, Mr. Anderson, had two reigns of about a month each. Hardy won the title by turning heel, negating almost everything that had made him the star he was.

The key here though is the lack of TNA stars winning the title. This was the equivalent of the WWF rejects and signees carrying WCW for a few years. Yeah it worked for a time, but at some point the fans want something new. Sting, Angle and Foley are great, but there comes a point where their time has passed and the fans want (and need) something fresh. I can only watch Sting and Angle turn back the clock so many times before I start getting bored, but TNA never got that. Having Hogan, Bischoff and Flair as the focal points of the company made things even worse.

That's what I think TNA's identity is: trying to make success with other company's talent. They barely have their own identity because they've been so busy either trying to redo the NWO invasion, ECW, or whatever else the could come up with that had drawn money in the past. Instead of trying to make a future for themselves, they were stuck in the past, trying to squeeze whatever they could out of old, dead angles. As they were doing this, it seemed that they actually thought this could go up against WWE as a real threat, which proved to be one of the biggest disasters imaginable.

So the short version: TNA's identity is someone with a major inferiority complex. They tried to do their own thing, but as soon as something that had worked before came along, they gave up on the hope they had in themselves and tried to be like everyone else. To put it mildly, it really hasn't worked.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
Yes
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
I am
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
in fact
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
better than you.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-10-2015, 03:56 PM
It's Damn Real!'s Avatar
It's Damn Real! It's Damn Real! is offline
The undisputed, undefeated TNA &
WWE Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Age: 33
Posts: 4,931
It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...
Default

I tend to agree with you here, KB, same with you as well JB.

In hindsight, I don't think I'm asking the right question. Or maybe I'm thinking the better question (more productive, really) would be to ask — what should TNA's brand actually be? It's clear as shit they're re-branding, or attempting to reclaim the old brand in some way, and we've seen numerous interviews from ex-talent (Magnus, Shaw) talking about them not really having one, and being in an "identity crisis", as well as guys like Corgan talk about how TNA need to produce TNA content, and associate guys (again) as TNA guys, etc.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayne
The IWC aren't a real group, just an internal conglomoration of the people who say things you don't like.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-10-2015, 04:29 PM
johnbragg johnbragg is offline
Registered User
WWE Women's Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 916
johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by It's Damn Real! View Post
I tend to agree with you here, KB, same with you as well JB.

In hindsight, I don't think I'm asking the right question. Or maybe I'm thinking the better question (more productive, really) would be to ask — what should TNA's brand actually be?
Five years ago I would have had an answer (but it would have already meant dumping the TNA brand officially in favor of IMPACT). Be THE alternative to WWE, the Sam Adams to WWE's Budweiser. Cut the roster down to 20 regular talents--half dozen singles guys (Angle Styles Joe Daniels Wolfe Dinero), half dozen Knockouts, four or five tag teams on contract supplement with special-appearance guest stars. Focus focus focus--have 4 PPVs a year that ARE special events. "Less but better."

Now, if I won the company in a drunken poker game, I don't know what the hell I'd do with it.
__________________
"Who will be at Wrestlemania in 2014?" That question should drive everything WWE does.

"Will there be a Bound For Glory in 2011, post-Hogan?" That is my question about TNA.

January 4, 2010. Welcome to the TNApocalypse.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-10-2015, 04:40 PM
klunderbunker's Avatar
klunderbunker klunderbunker is online now
More Comfortable with the Seesawing
Wrestlezone Hall of Famer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Lexington, Kentucky
Posts: 17,759
klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...klunderbunker is a World Heavyweight Champion...and is being held down by Triple H...
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by It's Damn Real! View Post
I tend to agree with you here, KB, same with you as well JB.

In hindsight, I don't think I'm asking the right question. Or maybe I'm thinking the better question (more productive, really) would be to ask — what should TNA's brand actually be? It's clear as shit they're re-branding, or attempting to reclaim the old brand in some way, and we've seen numerous interviews from ex-talent (Magnus, Shaw) talking about them not really having one, and being in an "identity crisis", as well as guys like Corgan talk about how TNA need to produce TNA content, and associate guys (again) as TNA guys, etc.
Right now their identity isn't clear because they can't worry about having one. Right now they need to do whatever they can do to survive, because they don't have a guaranteed future after a few weeks from now.

As for the last few years, it's been WWE lite. They've been the same idea with Dixie as the Authority and half the roster stuck in that one story that people aren't interested in. However, WWE has more talent, better production and a far better track record and history. Anyone trying to play WWE's game is going to lose because WWE is the undisputed king of wrestling and has been for years. Yeah WCW pulled it off for a bit, but people tend to forget that it was at the rock bottom for the WWF. Things were AWFUL back then and WCW attacked when they could. TNA tried to attack with the same strategy when WWE was in a good place.

Ever since that mess, they've been trying to be WWE lite and it has still not worked, because they're fighting an uphill battle from behind with a good but not excellent talent pool, a bad reputation and horrible leadership.

Overall at the moment though, TNA's identity is that of Tito or Jermain Jackson. Yeah they might have good moments, but they're such a joke because of how lame they've been over the years that no one is going to care, barring a huge turnaround and one of the biggest hits of all time, which isn't likely under Dixie's watch and with cancellation looming.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
Yes
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
I am
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
in fact
Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker
better than you.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-10-2015, 04:45 PM
It's Damn Real!'s Avatar
It's Damn Real! It's Damn Real! is offline
The undisputed, undefeated TNA &
WWE Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Age: 33
Posts: 4,931
It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...
Default

I agree, though probably not down to the specific model. I'd have done iPPV for "lesser" PPV's and then had four massive supercards that were critical to the company, like Clash of the Champions style. Genesis, Lockdown, Slammiversary, Bound For Glory. Anything/everything in between could have been iPPV format.

Without knowing a lick about the financials behind what is or is not do-able, I'd argue that while a rebrand is still necessary, TNA could still carve out a unique identity from the ashes. Whether that's simply going back to their roots of being an independent product on national scale (with superior graphics and filming techniques to allow them to stand out) or otherwise.

Unfortunately, part of the problem—a large part, mind you—is that the entire re-brand to IMPACT Wrestling was so poorly handled to begin with. Dumping the TNA brand for IMPACT, or otherwise, would have been fine. Was fine, in principle, I should say. Except that it was a golden opportunity they flubbed hard on, where it's still being explained to this day (even though I don't buy it) that the show is called IMPACT Wrestling and the company is still called TNA. It was a total failure to launch. The plane didn't explode on the tarmac, but it sure as shit never cruised to the planned 30,000 feet either. If anything it sputtered, kind of took "flight", so long as we define flight as simply not being on the ground, and seems to be coming to a hard landing here soon.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayne
The IWC aren't a real group, just an internal conglomoration of the people who say things you don't like.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-10-2015, 04:48 PM
It's Damn Real!'s Avatar
It's Damn Real! It's Damn Real! is offline
The undisputed, undefeated TNA &
WWE Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Age: 33
Posts: 4,931
It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...It's Damn Real! is getting phone calls from TNA...
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by klunderbunker View Post
Right now their identity isn't clear because they can't worry about having one. Right now they need to do whatever they can do to survive, because they don't have a guaranteed future after a few weeks from now.

As for the last few years, it's been WWE lite. They've been the same idea with Dixie as the Authority and half the roster stuck in that one story that people aren't interested in. However, WWE has more talent, better production and a far better track record and history. Anyone trying to play WWE's game is going to lose because WWE is the undisputed king of wrestling and has been for years. Yeah WCW pulled it off for a bit, but people tend to forget that it was at the rock bottom for the WWF. Things were AWFUL back then and WCW attacked when they could. TNA tried to attack with the same strategy when WWE was in a good place.

Ever since that mess, they've been trying to be WWE lite and it has still not worked, because they're fighting an uphill battle from behind with a good but not excellent talent pool, a bad reputation and horrible leadership.

Overall at the moment though, TNA's identity is that of Tito or Jermain Jackson. Yeah they might have good moments, but they're such a joke because of how lame they've been over the years that no one is going to care, barring a huge turnaround and one of the biggest hits of all time, which isn't likely under Dixie's watch and with cancellation looming.
But couldn't it be argued that having one would actually help with guaranteeing their future? Part of the reason people aren't watching is because of the lack of direction, the shifting motives, the inconsistencies week-to-week or month-to-month. Having the rebrand and focus of the company all locked in place, I would argue, might be too little too late, but would still give them a better shot at securing their future than continuing this ad hoc version in the hopes that enough of the core audience don't just bail.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayne
The IWC aren't a real group, just an internal conglomoration of the people who say things you don't like.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-10-2015, 04:55 PM
johnbragg johnbragg is offline
Registered User
WWE Women's Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 916
johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...johnbragg is looking to come up from OCW...
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by It's Damn Real! View Post
Unfortunately, part of the problem—a large part, mind you—is that the entire re-brand to IMPACT Wrestling was so poorly handled to begin with. Dumping the TNA brand for IMPACT, or otherwise, would have been fine.
The problem there (one problem anyway) is that they didn't rebrand from "TNA." It's not Impact Wrestling Presents Slammiversary, it's TNA Slammiversary. Tits-N-Ass Wrestling is still a millstone around their necks in the English-speaking world. There are no Impact house shows, you have TNA house shows.

Changing the name kinda-sorta was a flubbed opportunity because it wasn't part of a re-brand and re-launch. Hogan taking over was more of a rebrand than "TNA Impact" becoming "Impact Wrestling."
__________________
"Who will be at Wrestlemania in 2014?" That question should drive everything WWE does.

"Will there be a Bound For Glory in 2011, post-Hogan?" That is my question about TNA.

January 4, 2010. Welcome to the TNApocalypse.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:38 PM.

monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"
Contact Us - Clear Cookies - Lost Password - WrestleZone Forums - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Top - AdChoices