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  #11  
Old 01-29-2017, 08:30 AM
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I can tell Luna Vachon was a miscast mentor for Sable when they were in the WWF from 97-99. Vince should've found someone else who was willing to cater to Sable's in-ring game, and Jacqueline was the better choice. Luna had the same ambitions as Sable, in which the WWF Women's Championship Belt was elusive for her and she was seen as a veteran who needed to be threatened to make Sable look good and not mess up her looks, the same way Bret needed to be threatened to make Michaels look good at Montreal in 1997. What happened at WrestleMania 14 was that everyone else congratulated Sable for her match with Luna with roses and congratulations while Luna was ignored and in tears until Owen Hart consoled her and praised her for her in-ring game, speculating that Luna is just as difficult as Sable to work with and was the bigger locker room problem.

At the time, fans wanted WWF women who were valued for sillicone boobs and eye candy traits albeit those who kick ass. And to us, Sable was one of them, despite her locker room lawyer rep for refusing to learn how to take bumps. Luna sadly was neither favored by Vince McMahon, Vince Russo and the WWF nor did the Attitude Era crowd care about Luna Vachon. Plus, one of the 1990s themes was that sillicone boobs were the style back then, so Luna lacked sillicone boobs and got made to lay down like a dog by Sable for being threatened to play to Sable's strengths without messing up her face and looks or else Luna can go on food stamps, although Sunny also hated Sable. However, Sunny gets no love despite being the WWF's first downloadable female celebrity of some sorts because of her reputation as a ring-rat who slept with The Kliq, Shawn Michaels, Kevin Nash, British Bulldog and Bret Hart, and even Sandman and Sabu. It's laughable that Sunny is in the WWE Hall of Fame, yet Sable and Chyna aren't inducted, and it's likely Chyna never will go into the HOF before Sable does, and Sable is FAR overdue for a WWE HOF induction. Look at Sunny now, she's doing porn and she gets a free pass from Vince, Stephanie and HHH because of it, yet Chyna is forbidden from returning to the WWE for doing the same thing Sunny was doing now.

I understand you don't like the Attitude Era as much as I do, but you might like those juicy facts about the issues between Sable and Luna in the WWF, your input as to who deserved to be at fault more so than the other.
I have to say that after reading through a few of your threads two subjects always seem to make their way into them, porn and Bret Hart. You seem to have an unhealthy obsession with both of them.

As for Sunny being in the HOF and the fact that Chyna isn't, is due to one fact. That is that Sunny has been in the HOF for quite some time, and a lot of today's fans probably don't even know who she is. Chyna was never in the HOF but is probably much better known to today's audience.

They most likely left Sunny in there because it would have caused more controversy by taking her out, and the reason for it. The dirtsheets would have picked up on it and those that have never heard of her would now know who she is. In other words leaving her in there and staying quiet about it is a far better option for the WWE. Chyna will get her nod hopefully when DX goes in. That way she is part of the group and can be built up that way. It's unfair but I can see them doing it.
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  #12  
Old 01-31-2017, 11:13 AM
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When it comes to concerning Sable, Jim Cornette's not exactly reliable considering who she's married to in Brock Lesnar who Cornette has had a personal vendetta against since the OVW days. So, of course he'll say anything to make Lesnar's wife look bad. Also, she was a star who financially contributed to pro wrestling more than Jim did, so there's that. On top of that, I have Independent wrestler friends who worked dark matches during the Attitude era who personally knew and talked to Sable, and said she was a classy woman. A lot of people hated her, because of her position with the company which is stupid, because if she's putting money in your bank account then you should be thanking her. In closing, Sable has a family and Sunny's still doing probably every drug in existence and sucking every dick for cash. So, in the end of the day, is Sunny and Cornette's opinions really worth valuing? I don't think so.

So the ultimate verdict is that people like Sunny, Luna Vachon and Jim Cornette (rather than be UNGRATEFUL about blowing Sable's perceived attitude out of context) should all be grateful that Sable was actually putting money in the WWF bank account then everyone should be thanking her. So for that, I respect Sable and Chyna far more so than Sunny, Luna and Cornbread can all ever dream to be. If it weren't for a special person like Sable, everyone (especially Sunny, Luna and Cornette) would all be on food stamps. Sure, Cornette is okay but isn't he the guy who used to have Wendy's Burgers for his everyday meals back in the day? Sunny's still out there doing drugs and porn to the point that she's never gonna change her life and turn it around before its too late, and we already know what went down with Luna. She deserves to be blackballed for two reasons, one for talking smack about Sable which it's a big NO-NO especially if Sable's the moneymaker and Luna is behaving like a hater, and second for talking smack about The Fabulous Moolah. Luna thought Moolah was prostituting young women for the purposes of molestation and claiming that she was sent out to be barely clothed and photographed by older men. Sorry Luna, you made it up, so you're blackballed from pro wrestling forever, and off to Jelly School you went.

Moolah would never do those such things that Luna thought the former did, and my consensus is that Luna (out of all the women's wrestlers) has got to be the biggest liar I've ever seen.

Last edited by TEIWCSCSAATBHPHASP : 01-31-2017 at 11:33 AM.
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  #13  
Old 01-31-2017, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by The Eternal Champion View Post
When it comes to concerning Sable, Jim Cornette's not exactly reliable considering who she's married to in Brock Lesnar who Cornette has had a personal vendetta against since the OVW days. So, of course he'll say anything to make Lesnar's wife look bad. Also, she was a star who financially contributed to pro wrestling more than Jim did, so there's that. On top of that, I have Independent wrestler friends who worked dark matches during the Attitude era who personally knew and talked to Sable, and said she was a classy woman. A lot of people hated her, because of her position with the company which is stupid, because if she's putting money in your bank account then you should be thanking her. In closing, Sable has a family and Sunny's still doing probably every drug in existence and sucking every dick for cash. So, in the end of the day, is Sunny and Cornette's opinions really worth valuing? I don't think so.

So the ultimate verdict is that people like Sunny, Luna Vachon and Jim Cornette (rather than be UNGRATEFUL about blowing Sable's perceived attitude out of context) should all be grateful that Sable was actually putting money in the WWF bank account then everyone should be thanking her. So for that, I respect Sable and Chyna far more so than Sunny, Luna and Cornbread can all ever dream to be. If it weren't for a special person like Sable, everyone (especially Sunny, Luna and Cornette) would all be on food stamps. Sure, Cornette is okay but isn't he the guy who used to have Wendy's Burgers for his everyday meals back in the day? Sunny's still out there doing drugs and porn to the point that she's never gonna change her life and turn it around before its too late, and we already know what went down with Luna. She deserves to be blackballed for two reasons, one for talking smack about Sable which it's a big NO-NO especially if Sable's the moneymaker and Luna is behaving like a hater, and second for talking smack about The Fabulous Moolah. Luna thought Moolah was prostituting young women for the purposes of molestation and claiming that she was sent out to be barely clothed and photographed by older men. Sorry Luna, you made it up, so you're blackballed from pro wrestling forever, and off to Jelly School you went.

Moolah would never do those such things that Luna thought the former did, and my consensus is that Luna (out of all the women's wrestlers) has got to be the biggest liar I've ever seen.
You can't remotely say Moolah would never do that or that Luna lied...

In today's world where Bill FUCKING Cosby is a suspected predator, where a kids presenter like Rolf Harris is serving 5 years for raping a teenage friend of his daughter and where there were serious sexual allegations in the WWF at several points - including from Sable herself. You can't accuse Luna of lying.

More likely is that by talking, she was putting things at risk. Vince was somewhat "old school" and protected people like Moolah, Pat Patterson and to an extent other "name" families like The Vachon's, the Harts etc. People who basically had a good relationship with his dad.

Those who competed tended to get the short end, but those who had been loyal got protected when dodgy stuff came calling. Luna speaking "out of turn" perhaps SHOULD have led to more scrutiny, after all how many of Cosby's alleged victims would have been told "Bill would never do that" or how many of Jimmy Saville's victims were told "it didn't happen, you're lying" when it was found later - it did.

Whatever the reason, Luna was VERY damaged when she passed (you do know she died right, she's not blackballed anymore) and had been through more than her own share of personal problems. The fire at her home alone was cruel...without ostrasization from the business.

But one thing is VERY clear... you DO NOT know what went down with Luna... few if any do...
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  #14  
Old 01-31-2017, 06:53 PM
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Whatever the reason, Luna was VERY damaged when she passed (you do know she died right, she's not blackballed anymore) and had been through more than her own share of personal problems. The fire at her home alone was cruel...without ostrasization from the business.
Luna was on STRONG anti-psychotic medication. Sunny tells a story where Luna (stirred up by rumors from Sable ironically) physically attacked Sunny in the dressing room and was pounding her head into the ground bloodied Sunny up then acted all sweet again like nothing happend.

I also remember a story (told by Sean Waltman) where Kevin Nash took a pill from Luna's stash (her medication) and literally passed out on his feet, his head resting against a loud speaker in a club while it was blasting music. His head reverberating against the speaker. It just goes to show you how strong her anti-psychotic medication was.
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  #15  
Old 01-31-2017, 07:02 PM
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Luna was on STRONG anti-psychotic medication. Sunny tells a story where Luna (stirred up by rumors from Sable ironically) physically attacked Sunny in the dressing room and was pounding her head into the ground bloodied Sunny up then acted all sweet again like nothing happend.

I also remember a story (told by Sean Waltman) where Kevin Nash took a pill from Luna's stash (her medication) and literally passed out on his feet, his head resting against a loud speaker in a club while it was blasting music. His head reverberating against the speaker. It just goes to show you how strong her anti-psychotic medication was.
@Makaveli31 : Well then, I guess Luna can be blamed for the whole incident where she assaulted Sunny just by disgracefully beating her to the point of rendering her unconscious, and I don't care if Sunny is a notorious druggie and also I don't care if Sable had a habit of stirring up rumors. At the end of the day, Sunny and Sable took the higher roads than Luna. It's not Sunny's fault nor Sable's fault that Luna just can't control her anger. Neither can Meng/Haku. Both Luna and Meng are tough to a degree, but look where it got both of em? Difference? Meng can't be fired because if anyone even had the guts to fire him, it becomes worrisome when you can't get out of fighting him. Luna is replaceable far more so than Meng.

One thing I can give Luna Vachon credit for is by soldiering on with her bipolar disorder as a valet and a wrestler, basic achievements. Even if Luna didn't win the WWF Women's Championship Belt and wasn't over with the wrestling fans, at least she was lucky enough that she didn't end up like Elliot Rodger in the end. She achieved more than this Isla Vista killer ever could. I honestly don't think there was any hope for Elliot Rodger. He was born an all-around whiny sore loser, whereas at least Luna wasn't a total loser and a complete plague to society.

As for Nash, I guess Waltman is the more trustworthy Kliq guy to explain the unexplainable 300+ days on the road events from back then. Waltman should've warned Nash about Luna's powerful anti-psychotic medication (it was probably for her bipolar disorder) that way, Nash could avoid accidentally ingesting Luna's medication pills that led to the future Big Sexy Kev passing out in a club laying head first next to the loud speakers. Even a drugged up Shawn Michaels would be too smart to be fooled into ingesting Luna's pills.

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  #16  
Old 01-31-2017, 07:21 PM
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As for Nash, I guess Waltman is the more trustworthy Kliq guy to explain the unexplainable 300+ days on the road events from back then. Waltman should've warned Nash about Luna's powerful anti-psychotic medication (it was probably for her bipolar disorder) that way, Nash could avoid accidentally ingesting Luna's medication pills that led to the future Big Sexy Kev passing out in a club laying head first next to the loud speakers. Even a drugged up Shawn Michaels would be too smart to be fooled into ingesting Luna's pills.
I have a feeling Nash knew what he was taking. He has admitted to at times not knowing what what drug he was ingesting during his WWE run. Nash tells a story of Kid bring a jig of phenobarbital into the dressing room and the wrestlers wondering what it did. Nash says "Oh well, they have 325 mg of caffeine so we need at least 4 or 5 of them to pick you up." There was also the story of Nash Shawn and Scott taking 30 Soma's each so I don't think he "accidentally" ingested anything and neither did Shawn for that matter LOL. Off topic but fun story regardless.
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Old 01-31-2017, 07:27 PM
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I have a feeling Nash knew what he was taking. He has admitted to at times not knowing what what drug he was ingesting during his WWE run. Nash tells a story of Kid bring a jig of phenobarbital into the dressing room and the wrestlers wondering what it did. Nash says "Oh well, they have 325 mg of caffeine so we need at least 4 or 5 of them to pick you up." There was also the story of Nash Shawn and Scott taking 30 Soma's each so I don't think he "accidentally" ingested anything and neither did Shawn for that matter LOL. Off topic but fun story regardless.
@Makaveli31 : And by the time the late-'90s rolled around, Kevin Nash was the first of the Kliq guys to successfully escape from the life of drugs while HBK continued to remain hooked on Somas and painkillers, Hall's alcoholism got worse and Waltman delved himself into the realm of crystal meth and his brief fling in doing pornography years later.

HBK eventually became a Born Again Christian to the point that he was now off drugs since 2002, and Waltman eventually cleaned himself away from crystal meth, alcohol and pain pills after his fight with Alicia Webb that led to Waltman's near-suicide attempt in Mexico while working for AAA. Nash found him and with the help of the always sober HHH, they placed Waltman in a Houston psych ward where Waltman shared a room with his opponent from his original WWF debut named Matt Borne, the former Doink. Hall would be the last one to clean himself away from a life of drugs and alcohol, with the help of DDP Yoga spearheaded by Diamond Dallas Page and Jake Roberts.

Last edited by TEIWCSCSAATBHPHASP : 01-31-2017 at 07:36 PM.
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  #18  
Old 01-31-2017, 09:34 PM
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And by the time the late-'90s rolled around, Kevin Nash was the first of the Kliq guys to successfully escape from the life of drugs while HBK continued to remain hooked on Somas and painkillers, Hall's alcoholism got worse and Waltman delved himself into the realm of crystal meth and his brief fling in doing pornography years later.
Nash also wasn't as bad as the others. He credits that too being close to 300 pounds so the pills and booze didn't affect as much whereas Hall Michaels and Waltman would often be passed out. Nash also says when HHH joined the group in 1995 the "Kliq" split even further and it often was Nash and HHH traveling together (because they wanted more time in the gym) and Hall traveling with HBK and Kid. I think this is where Nash is able to glean information from HHH on how to position himself not only as a top wrestler in the company but a top executive as we all know what HHH's ambition from the momeny he joined WWE. We didn't hear much about Nash's drug use during his WCW days but Nash does talk about his wife almost divorcing him in I believe 1998 or 99 due to excessive partying and infidelity.

Hall's substance abuse caused him to lose his family in 1998 which began a long spiral downward that took over a decade, We also know Hall was dealing with PTSD due to a murder he was involved with. What's interesting to note is Nash, Hall, Kid, Justin Credible, and Sunny ALL say they never engaged in prescription pill consumption till they joined the WWF and met Shawn Micahels.
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